SOFTSYNTH Woes! -- Help much appreciated.

[lovesinger]

Greets, astart another blessed year!! Got a prob, fellowes and fellowettes. I've been away from much MIDI awhile and now am returning to some heavy MIDI pre-production for eventual inclusion on songs and as real-sounding guides for live players. But I can't get any softsynth I install to integrate with Cakewalk, Sonar, Cubase, or any other app to play the MIDI tracks, nor to even play a solo MIDI song when the MIDI file is launched from Windows Explorer or a MIDI link. In the latter thing I can only play such file by first opening the Softsynth app or helper-player associated app. Using the softsynth as a driver and setting Windows to play MIDI with it does nada (system restart and all). I'm now using Win 98 SE on a 1GHz Duron processor system resting on a K7S5A mobo (266MHz max front-side bus speed) with 384M of PC 133 ram. Last time I successfully used softsynths was on a 266 AMD K-6 chip & older board (like PCI plus ISA slots 'older') and they worked [b]wonderfully[/b]. I did have the MS GS softsynth native to Win98 working ok earlier this year, but that's gone too and I haven't tried to reinstall/reactivate it. (However it's so inferior to my beloved rich-sounding Yamaha S-YG20 that I really don't want to). I've installed Seer's Reality, the XG from Yammie, and Wingroove 9.0. All 'store bought' except Wingroove (downloaded from the author's website). No cracks nor warez. Only Wingroove integrates with my multitrack progs but it mutes about 5 seconds of audio after about 20 good seconds on playback. (Whasup?) Aside from "Get a Mac" (he he) what should I do? I'm a quasi-tech-support guy m'self sort of, ... well, more than sort of ... but I don't have the drive to go tweaking and repairing for hours on this thing. I'm just driven to make LOTS of MUSIC right now. In fact I'm behind schedule. All replies are GREATLY appreciated! I'm posting this here and on George M's place ... hope that's still ok.

[Anderton]

I'm not sure I get the problem. Is it that they won't work as stand-alone synths, or they won't work as plug-ins with a host?

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by Anderton: [b]I'm not sure I get the problem. Is it that they won't work as stand-alone synths, or they won't work as plug-ins with a host?[/b][/quote]Thanks for the quick reply, Craig! They won't work as plug-ins with a host is the core problem. Curiously, my ProTools Free that I used without problem for months on my PC at work for a year also does not record nor import wave audio nor midi files. Think that's related or parenthetical?

[Addix Metzatricity]

I know that Propellerhead's Reason will intigrate itself into Sonar, I'm not sure about Cubase and others though.

[Alndln]

If your going to use Cubase and Sonar it's a good Idea to create a shared folder for VST instruments and VST plugins.For Sonar you'll need either FXpansions VST/DX Adapter or the Directixer,there both around $60.00.Meanwhile you should install your instruments in Cubases VST folder and you should be able to call them up in the instrument rack.

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by Bastard Lugosi's night Children: [b]If your going to use Cubase and Sonar it's a good Idea to create a shared folder for VST instruments and VST plugins.For Sonar you'll need either FXpansions VST/DX Adapter or the Directixer,there both around $60.00.Meanwhile you should install your instruments in Cubases VST folder and you should be able to call them up in the instrument rack.[/b][/quote]Thanks Lugosi. I've used Cubase sparingly although I like its audio track recording algorithm best (sounds more smoothly analog-like to my ears), simply because it's not as quick to jump in and "do" as the others so far [maybe because I haven't spent time getting closely acquainted with it -- duh! :) ]. I'll get right to that and apply your suggestions.

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by Addix Metzatricity: [b]I know that Propellerhead's Reason will intigrate itself into Sonar, I'm not sure about Cubase and others though.[/b][/quote]Stands to Reason [I couldn't resist it :D ]. Thanks, downloading the demo now. >> Hey! Lugosi changed to Alndln Hammer since my last reply! Sheesh! -- this spage age! :)

[Uh Clem]

For Cakewalk, you need DXI standard softsyths or something that shows up in Windows as a virtual midi port. That's for Sonar anyway - I don't know about PA9. Sonar includes a few DXIs to play around with. It (Sonar) also supports Rewire which you'll need for Reason. For Cubase, you need VSTi softsynths or the Windows virtual midi port. It supports Rewire/Reason as well. You can get VSTI to DXI adapters that may work OK. For PT Free on Windows, I suspect the only thing that will work is the virtual Midi port in Windows - not VTSI or DXI synths. When checking our Reason, make sure you download and read the getting started and tutorial docs or it will be pretty confusing.

[Anderton]

A lot of soft synths problems are due to not having them in a common folder, like the vstplugins folder that Cubase creates. That's where it looks for soft synths. The other problem is that people often forget you need two elements to make a soft synth fly: an audio track for the output, and a MIDI track with the data to drive it.

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by = stevepow =: [b]For Cakewalk, you need DXI standard softsyths or something that shows up in Windows as a virtual midi port. That's for Sonar anyway - I don't know about PA9. Sonar includes a few DXIs to play around with. It (Sonar) also supports Rewire which you'll need for Reason. For Cubase, you need VSTi softsynths or the Windows virtual midi port. It supports Rewire/Reason as well. You can get VSTI to DXI adapters that may work OK. For PT Free on Windows, I suspect the only thing that will work is the virtual Midi port in Windows - not VTSI or DXI synths. When checking our Reason, make sure you download and read the getting started and tutorial docs or it will be pretty confusing.[/b][/quote]Thanks loads Steve. Rewire [the erstwhile talented electronic patchbay?] came to my attention just last night, and 1 thing I've yet to understand .. is it a separately downloadable and usable module, or a standard that's integrated into DAW apps at the programmer-creator level. And I got that caution when I installed Reason then passed the chance to get that up front education with a misplaced kb spacebar tap [poweruser heavyhanded quick flick] so i'll uninstall, reinstall and make sure I get that right this time.

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by Anderton: [b]A lot of soft synths problems are due to not having them in a common folder, like the vstplugins folder that Cubase creates. That's where it looks for soft synths. The other problem is that people often forget you need two elements to make a soft synth fly: an audio track for the output, and a MIDI track with the data to drive it.[/b][/quote]Craig, that all-encompassing summation might put me SOLIDLY back in business! And I'm surprised I didn't know that last part -- It just seemed that when I used these DAWS before (at least Cakewalk 8 & 9 and n-tracks) with Wingroove and the yamaha DX softsynth family the programs seemed to just pull in the driver ad do the job without specially locating the softsynth engine or asking me to. I'll take those steps and report back. Thanks to you and all!

[lovesinger]

Found the problem about Reality - from SONAR's own readme document: (bummer) [quote][b]SONAR Will Not Recognize the Reality Software Synthesizer Wave Driver[/b] The Seer Systems Reality software synthesizer exposes a virtual waveOut driver, so that host applications can play audio and synthesized MIDI at the same time. By design, SONAR will not recognize this driver, since all audio hardware must support full duplex. SONAR will not recognize any output driver that does not have a matching input driver, or vice-versa. Since Reality is such an “output only” driver, it is not available in SONAR. [/quote]Lots of other Softsynth issues it seems with SONAR. Any word on what DAW has the LEAST issues with softsynths for MIDI integration?

[Anderton]

> ReWire is built into the app. The Reason/Sonar combination is simply delicious! I've had few problems with soft synths and Sonar. I use the VST-DX Adapter from fxpansion to run VST synths, so I use those as well as DXi types.

[Alndln]

[quote]Originally posted by lovesinger: [b]Lots of other Softsynth issues it seems with SONAR. Any word on what DAW has the LEAST issues with softsynths for MIDI integration?[/b][/quote]Actually I have less problems with Sonar and FXPansion's adapter than Nuendo even,but there both pretty solid.The reason your having problems with Unity is that it only supports older .wav drivers and not Asio or WDM,but an update is coming. [url=http://www.harmony-central.com/Newp/2003/Unity-30-Line-PC.html]www.harmony-central.com/Newp/2003/Unity-30-Line-PC.html[/url]