Can you live without bass solos in jazz?

[MIDIdiot]

Can anyone else carry on living if they never heard another jazz bass solo? No offense to players, I can truly appreciate it in it's own right, and I know these are accomplished musicians, and I'm no connaisseur, I'm really ignorent when it comes to jazz. BUT, over the many years that I've been tuning in, my reaction is always the same when I hear a great tune movin along, I'm zoning in on the piano, or the sax or whatever and then there it is, STOPPED DEAD, and you here the bass thump along, doing what. Just doesn't work for me.

[Botch.]

Great Topic!!!

 

Yes, I could do without 95% of the bass solos played in jazz, I think most of them are there only to pacify the poor bassist enough to keep him in the band.

 

The other 5%? Well, when Tony Levin or Victor Wooten (both admittedly not really, pure "jazz") take a solo, I have to sit up and take notice. My favorite all-time bassist, Mr. Mark King, only plays solos live, I can't think of a solo by him on a studio album.

 

Bass is meant to support the music. Flame suit, on!

[Prague]

Well, I am a bass player first. I hate bass solos. I mean, why not a tuba solo? Bass just never grabbed me as a solo instrument.

 

I much prefer to have a killer bass line in a great piece of music than to stand there and wank like a guitar player.

[MIDIdiot]

Phew! I thought I would be reading my first flame. After I posted that, I thought, what have I done! I thought of asking dB to delete it lest I insult anyone. Clearly, I'm not the only one then. You hit the nail on the head. the bass is so integral to music, but spare us the solos please That said, the guys you mention must be worth checking out.

[BP3]

I never had a problem with a Jeff Berlin solo on the Bruford recordings.

[MusicaL]

It depends.

 

As a keyboard player, I love the bass. If I had to pick up another instrument it'd be the bass, hands down.

 

What I don't like to hear generally are acoustic bass solos. I just can't get myself to enjoy them. Although Pattitucci has a tune on one of his CD's that is played entirely and exclusively on the upright bass, and he does a great job on it...

 

If you're a yellow jackets fan, as I am, I don't think you'd ever get tired of Jimmy Haslip's tasteful work on melody lines (I hope we're not including those also in the dreaded bass solo dept.) and his solos are the most musical I have ever heard from a bass player.

 

Now, give me a fretless Jaco Pastorius solo any day of the year.... I am good with that. How about Teen Town? To me that's one of the greatest displays of Jaco's writing, playing soloing, etc.... And it's a beautiful tune to boot..

 

My 2 cents

 

aL

[mate stubb]

Ever hear Jaco Pastorius?

 

[Jeebus]

Yes, Jaco was great, but I think the quesetion was geared towards traditional acoustic jazz. could certainly do without bass solos in jazz, and the upright player I work with agrees.

 

OT:Tony Levin is a great bassist, but I find Wooten to be a bit of a wanker, more flash than substance. Getting into funk/fusion territory, Marcus Miller is a GREAT bass player to watch... I never get tired of seeing him play.

[cnegrad]

Ironically, I'm fairly certain that most of Jaco's better known solos were pre-planned and not spontaneous. As evidence of this, check out any of the tons of "bootleg-style" cd's that are just called something like, "Jaco Live In NY." (You can recognize them because the graphics are definitely amature looking.) The solos dont even come close to anything he recorded with Weather Report or on his solo albums. That is not to take away from the quality of his musicianship; even the pre-planned solos were absolutely gorgeous. The man could make a bass sing like no one else, and I miss him terribly. He was definitely a major influence.

[David Loving]

Try listening to Scott LaFaro on Bill Evans' 'Waltz for Debbie' album. Try Eddie Gomez on anything.

 

There are lots of solos - not just bass solos - that I'd give up 5 years off the end of my life not to have to listen to again. Those two bassists didn't play any of those, however.

[Jonathan Hughes]

I'm a bass player, and I could definitely live without the vast majority of bass solos.

 

My least favortie solos are these two types:

 

1. everyone in the rest of band completely drops out except maybe the drummer playing a really minimal part and the piano player hits a chord once every eight bars or so -- the energy level drops below zero, and the bass solo ends up being the most boring section of the song. This isn't necessarily the bassist's fault, though, as the other people should keep the enrgy up. Still, it's up to the bass player to do something interesting.

 

2. The song is so fast that the bass "solo" is really just the same walking bass line that the bass player has been playing the rest of the song because he can't play anything any faster (how about playing something slower and melodic???). If you can't play something other than what you've been playing for the entire rest of the song, then don't solo.

 

I gotta say -- I could do without most drum solos, too.

 

Unless it's by Omar Hakim wearing his Terminator sunglasses in "Bring on the Night" (the movie, not the song -- his solo is on "I Burn for You")

 

And while we're at it, trading fours is about the smallest trade I like to hear. Once they get into trading twos, hardly anyone is making any kind of melodic statement, and to me, it just sounds stupid.

 

"my favorite all-time bassist, Mr. Mark King, only plays solos live, I can't think of a solo by him on a studio album."

 

Check out the track "People" on "Standing in the light." It's got a killer bass solo, and totally appropriate for the song -- no wanking whatsoever.

 

Mark King's first solo album, "Influences" also has some great solos on it, although they're a bit more flashy.

 

Jonathan

[...]

You're not listening to the right bass players solo. I'm a bass player. Some bassists get on my nerves really quickly when they solo, some of them I could listen to for days.

 

Originally posted by cnegrad:

Ironically, I'm fairly certain that most of Jaco's better known solos were pre-planned and not spontaneous. As evidence of this, check out any of the tons of "bootleg-style" cd's that are just called something like, "Jaco Live In NY." (You can recognize them because the graphics are definitely amature looking.) The solos dont even come close to anything he recorded with Weather Report or on his solo albums. That is not to take away from the quality of his musicianship; even the pre-planned solos were absolutely gorgeous. The man could make a bass sing like no one else, and I miss him terribly. He was definitely a major influence.

Of course you also have to take into consideration how completely fucked up he was when those recordings were made. For the most part he was living on the street, was strung out on drugs and alcohol, and was but a shadow of his former self.

[Tusker]

I like to think of what bass solos can be, not what they have been. And when I think of that, I wanna hear the bass solo. Bring it on!

 

Jerry

[EricG]

For me it tends to be like this:

*I find a lot of electric bass solo's to be interesting. Often using various technics, such as slap hand, harmonics, standard fingered play,... These solos are often in the style of funk /jazz /rock fusion style.

*I am sorry to say that the standard upright bass solos never get my attention. Get's to boring, or am I missing something... Although I love the acoustic upright bass as an support instrument.

[Analogaddict]

IMO, a good musical statement is a good musical statement, (almost) regardless of what instrument it´s played on. Listen to the late '70:s Jarret albums or anything with Marc Johnson (be sure to check out the late Bill Evans recordings) for tasty bass playing, I don´t think I´ve ever heard him play a bad solo.

 

The one thing I usually don´t like in music is when a solo consists of displys of technique alone; pointless slap solos or - even worse - tap solos tend to bore me. A lot of the mediate jazz bassists seem to get a little too introspective sometimes, but the best of them always intrigue me.

[Dave Horne]

I think the question should be, can you live without drum solos in jazz.

 

I always applaud at the end of a drum solo if only to acknowledge that it is, in fact, over.

[yannis D]

I saw MMW (twice), and Brad Melhdau trio - never heard of a bass solo during the concerts. Instead, the bass playin' was superb in both groups, full of groove and fantasy. Great players do not need to play solo. They just interplay. Do I need to say more?

Regards

Yannis

[Chaso DeChaso]

My biggest problem is guitar solos. There are probably 100 times more of them than any other instrument, for starters. Also, for whatever cultural reasons (probably mainly the influence of simplistic rock during the formative years of many current musicians), the guitar seems to have such a legacy of inherited limitations.

 

On the other hand I enjoy bass solos quite a bit in jazz. Recently I heard some Reginald Veal and Charnette Moffett solos live that were just wonderful. And some of the over-the-top fusion stuff like Hellborg is fun as well. Some of the older, more traditional jazz bass solos can get a little boring I think because it is such a new instrument (played exclusively pizzicato anyway) that it has only very recently become developed to the point of being a legitimate solo instrument.

 

I enjoy simultaneous group interplay as well but never mind forms that invite solos.

 

Chaso

[NYKeys]

I agree you to a point. Most of them ain't saying nothing. This is also true with a lot of musicians.

 

What makes a good solo for any instrument are clear lines. When you talk say something worth listening to. Ain't nothing worst than hearing someone try to solo and not having any idea where they are going.

 

Just like with any form of music if they are not bringing something to the table that's fresh Then I'll pass. Right now I am diggin the following cats:

 

John Pattituci - Upright and Electric

Marcus Miller - Just nasty and multi-talented

Christian McBride

[BP3]

For acoustic bass, I am always blown away by Alex Blake and his work with Randy Weston. His bass solos are often the high point of the set.

[coyote]

Ray Brown was always capable of killer bass solos.

 

I love good solos. On any instrument. And while I agree that there are many crappy solos on record, there are also many great solos. Here's the thing: When you play a solo you are taking a chance!! And the result in a live environment can often be different than what gets recorded - in fact, a recording of a given live show might indicate (as Bob Fripp once said) "a real turkey was happening", yet the energy between audience and performer was amazing and the solo worked in that context.

[marino]

It depends on who's doing the solo, methinks. On those Bill Evans/Eddie Gomez duo recordings, there's no energy drop in the bass solos, even with no drums behind. Of course the bass is the most difficult instrument to solo on, for timbre, register and intonation - it takes a master to really handle the stuff. That said, I could listen to Ray Brown or Orsted Pedersen soloing all night!

 

I also like when bassists know how to melodize a little bit behind the soloists and harmonic instruments. I think a good balance of this with the more usual role of harmonic/rhythmic foundation makes a bass player I would like.

[guestuserguestuser.com]

I can live without bad bass solos.

 

And I can live without soloists who who play in an obtuse style, and never give a clue about where they are. There seem to be a lot of these types around. They think that laying down normal changes, or playing some kind of recognizable melody, will make them 'un-cool'. I can do without these guys. But I've found that really good players don't play that way. Jazz is a conversation, so like a normal conversation, if you want other people to understand you, you have to speak clearly and articulately. Mumbling and non sequitors don't cut it.

 

But I love a good bass solo. Not too crazy about bowed bass solos, but that's just personal taste.

[Magpel]

So, A Christian Missionary visits an African tribal vilage. As soon as he crosses into the valley, he hears omninous drums coming from the hill above the village. The drums do not stop. That night, at a celebration at the tribal leader's abode, he asks, "what are those drums and why don't they stop?" Everyone falls silent. After a while, the tribal leader intones, "If Drums stop, very bad thing happen." An no more is said on the matter.

 

A week later, as he prepares to leave, the missionary is back a the tribal eader's home for diiner. The drums suddenly stop. Everyone at the table falls silent. The Missionary asks tremulously, "What happens now?" The leader looks at him and says...

 

..

 

..

 

..

 

..

 

..

 

..

 

..

 

"Bass solo."

[Calumet]

What's really funny is that there seems to be a "bassist playbook" when it comes to electric bass solos. Say, for instance, you are seeing a good blues or fusion band. The bass player gets one or two rides a set.

 

He starts with some sparse low notes...

 

Then he starts to play a little faster...

 

Then, naturally, he starts to play really high on the fret board...(God forbid if he has a 6 or (gulp) a 7 string bass!)...

 

Maybe he taps a bit...

 

Then...of course...BRING IN THE SLAP!

 

By the end he is beating the crap out of the bass in a supposed flurry of creativity.

 

I can certainly live without those.

[kad]

Being both a keyboard player and a bass player, I'm not a big fan of acoustic bass solos. For the most part they remind me of an elephant trying to ballet dance! The one exception would be the solos of Scott Laffaro, who died tragically at the age of 25.

 

Now a good electric bass solo by someone like Jaco or Dominique DiPiazza can be a thing of beauty!!

 

Kirk

[Tusker]

Originally posted by Magpel:

"Bass solo."

[Mark Zeger]

Originally posted by Magpel:

"Bass solo."

For those of you keeping score at home, the official time was 13hr.57min. for someone to deliver one of my favorite musician jokes, on topic no less.

 

Thanks, John.

[RABid]

Originally posted by Music*aL:

... What I don't like to hear generally are acoustic bass solos. ...

I enjoy a lot of the electric bass solos, but I do not enjoy acoustic bass solos. This may be a result of straining my ears to hear the bass on old jazz recordings. Especially live recordings. But hey, if a bass player is good then he or she should get a chance to shine. We do put up with drum solos, don't we?

 

Robert

[coyote]

The worst bass solo I've heard recently came courtesy of... Stanley Clarke. First off, the guy seems to be suffering from the delusion that he's Stanley Clarke or something...

 

Anyway, to end his gig one evening a few months ago he said "OK, I'm gonna play a bass solo." With that the band walks offstage, and Clarke gets his acoustic bass and proceeds to play. There is no definable melodic touchstone, no rhythmic context, no discernible meter, just Clarke doing stuff on the bass. My wife nailed it: "It sounds like he's warming up or something".