phestic Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 Hey all, The more and more I listen to music the more and more I think.....boy they need a keyboard player! I hear the cd's and they have keyboard/piano/synth/organ parts played on the albums but they dont have them live! And if they do they are Old pro's...no young people. Maybe its because the older guys can afford the nice keyboards but I dont know I wish I could see more young modern keyboard players! I'm 17 and the only keyboard player of my quality that I know of in my area. I'm the modern type, I use a midi controler and a laptop with virtual samplers and synths. Bands are playing live with pre recorded tracks rather then playing it all live and I think thats wrong while keyboard players can play it! I look up to all of you Seasoned vets and I hope to think one day someone will do the same to me. But I think we need to inspire younger people to not take up piano but to take up Piano, synths, organ and the digital side of it as well. Because each one of them takes a different set of skills to play, you cants take a mozart piano type player and ask him to play some billy joel organs and the same with a classic rock organ player may not know what a oscilator is. I taught myself everything that I know about piano and computers and I think it would have been great to have someone to ask questions to but I didnt until I found this message board and I would like to thank everyone for the help! So keep up the good work Thanks -Jesiah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksoper Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 Phestic: From one of the old guys, welcome. I was thinking about some of my early auditions for bands. I was maybe 19, and was more a classic guy than a pop/jazz guy. My auditions were probably really awful. I mean, I had some chops, but I had no clue as to the role of a keyboardist in a bar band. Fortunately for me, some young jazz school guys took pity on me and hired me for a new Top 40 band. We weren't that good, and disbanded in a year. But, hey--everybody's gotta start somewhere. Although debated in another thread, I'm not convinced that my ability to read/write music has been all that crucial to what has earned my living for the past 25 years. Most of what I'm asked to do is pure ear work. Self-taught may not be a bad thing as long as your teacher isn't an idiot. Learn as much as you can, listen to everything, and keep your mind open. k. 9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odyssian Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Hi phestic, I'm also one of the more "seasoned vets". That's mainly just in age though, not in experience. As far as I can recall, keyboard players have always been in relatively short supply. Same with decent bass players and also drummers. It seems that in recent years, possibly in part due to the resurgence in progressive rock, that there are more keyboard guys around than there were just a few years ago. I hope the trend continues. Good luck to ya in your own musical path, whatever it may lead... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phestic Posted September 5, 2003 Author Share Posted September 5, 2003 ksoper thanks for the advice. I also meant "old guys" in the most respectful way I cant read music myself "yet" But I play by ear very well. I believe playing by ear is a must especialy when you are playing with rock bands that love to jam lol. Odyssian... I think you are right that there is more keyboard guys around but I think they all need to get recongized more. When is the last time we heard a big hit with a nice piano solo in it? I think we just rely to much on the mold that we have been shoved into! I mean the electronica made a huge impact for keyboard players but I'm kind of tired of everyone split up "why cant we all just get along" lol It seems like we always take one style and squeeze the living day lights out of it. For instance..the CREED sound, the Backstreet boys sound the whole dance electronica thing. I personaly think that we need more creativness in the music industry. I'm a cashier in a supermarket and all day I hear old songs (I hear many of them over and over lol) and I realize how much songs that I hear playing on the radio steal from these old hits...they still melodies and lyrics exactly in some cases but I wish that it would stop. Ok stepping off my soap box I love music and I just want it to grow into something new and refreshing. So if you love it to I think you do also! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan South Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 I would venture that keyboard instruments are used to produce more music than ever before. Just the other day some guy on the Bass forum was complaining that he felt that synth bass lines were stealing work from bass players. I'm sure that there are a few string section players who feel the same way. Where is the truth? Too many keyboards? Too few? There are musical styles that are almost completely done on synths and samplers: techno, jungle, hip hop. There aren't any guitars on those albums, no live drums, no horn sections, no string sections - only synths and samplers and looping software. Film scores? Lots of keyboards. Pop albums? Keyboards galore? Pop music today is created by "producers," and these guys use keyboards to control as much of the production process as possible. Maybe alternative and metal are avoiding keys these days, but everyone else is using them by the truckload. Today you can buy a Motif for about $1500 US. It has 64 voices, can play sixteen parts at the same time, etc. We "old guys" remember when a good five voice, one part (non-multi-timbral) synth would set you back four grand. Sorry, but I have to disagree with the sentiments of the original post. It's a good topic to discuss, though. The Black Knight always triumphs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odyssian Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Hi Dan, I think phestic was talking about a lack of keyboard players playing synths/keyboards in a performance context. It's very true though that overall there are a lot of electronically generated sounds in today's popular music (and film music). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan South Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Is it not fashionable to play keys? As I stated, you can buy good equipment for a low price these days. That was not always the case. I don't think that money is the issue. Not enough keyboard players out there? Hey, that means more work for YOU guys. The Black Knight always triumphs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MellowD Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Check out Brian Culbertson. He's a successful young smooth jazz keyboardists. www.brianculbertson.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phestic Posted September 5, 2003 Author Share Posted September 5, 2003 Dan, thats is a good point! There is a lack of balance between keyboard players and the rest of musicians these days. Either the keyboard players do it all or you dont see them at all, but when they do it all they end up playing along with pre sequenced stuff and thats where the live perofrmance gets put in the same category as bands playing along with pre recorded keyboard tracks. And like I said before I want everyone to get along. Personaly when I play with a band I stay out of the bass a bit because I know how it feels to get my toes stepped on and in mellow parts the bass player may back off and let me throw some bass in there and its a give an take issue. If you have keyboards on your cd and a keyboard player on stage while you play your songs thumbs up to you! If you cant have a keyboard player on stage thats ok as long as your try to, thats good also. But dont disapoint the listeners with less of a performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddtopps89 Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 Originally posted by phestic: Hey all, The more and more I listen to music the more and more I think.....boy they need a keyboard player! I hear the cd's and they have keyboard/piano/synth/organ parts played on the albums but they dont have them live! And if they do they are Old pro's...no young people. Maybe its because the older guys can afford the nice keyboards but I dont know I wish I could see more young modern keyboard players! I'm 17 and the only keyboard player of my quality that I know of in my area. I'm the modern type, I use a midi controler and a laptop with virtual samplers and synths. Bands are playing live with pre recorded tracks rather then playing it all live and I think thats wrong while keyboard players can play it! I look up to all of you Seasoned vets and I hope to think one day someone will do the same to me. But I think we need to inspire younger people to not take up piano but to take up Piano, synths, organ and the digital side of it as well. Because each one of them takes a different set of skills to play, you cants take a mozart piano type player and ask him to play some billy joel organs and the same with a classic rock organ player may not know what a oscilator is. I taught myself everything that I know about piano and computers and I think it would have been great to have someone to ask questions to but I didnt until I found this message board and I would like to thank everyone for the help! So keep up the good work Thanks -JesiahJesiah, not to worry. AUSTIN IS HERE!! You have a young (14) and very serious musician here. I do mostly gospel/jazz. I was also thinking the same thing when listening to some music. GET SOME MUSICIANS AND USE THEM!! The oh, so popular studio recordings are starting to get a little annoying. I agree with everything. You will definitely see me in the future. I'll make you proud! Keep the music flowing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phestic Posted September 7, 2003 Author Share Posted September 7, 2003 Alright Austin! Maybe sometime we can get together and Jam...I'm only a state over in NJ I love that old gospel piano (I'm not good at jazz) but I think I favor to the Larry norman / rock piano. Though I was jamming gospel style at youth group last friday. Now that I'm stepping out of my band I will have time to finish my Album project, so maybe in awhile I will let you know about my cd! BTW I'm 17 here. ________________________________ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ Freedom is Always one step away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddtopps89 Posted September 8, 2003 Share Posted September 8, 2003 Originally posted by phestic: Alright Austin! Maybe sometime we can get together and Jam...I'm only a state over in NJ I love that old gospel piano (I'm not good at jazz) but I think I favor to the Larry norman / rock piano. Though I was jamming gospel style at youth group last friday. Now that I'm stepping out of my band I will have time to finish my Album project, so maybe in awhile I will let you know about my cd! BTW I'm 17 here. ________________________________ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ Freedom is Always one step away.Alright! Keep in touch. Keep the music flowing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregg Seibert Posted September 8, 2003 Share Posted September 8, 2003 In our little neck of the woods, I think there is a problem. Most of the live sound engineers learned their craft mixing guitar rock. All guitar,bass and drums. To get the most our of the usually inadequate PA's in most clubs, they learned to EQ the whole PA to maximize drums and guitars. Then end result of all this is usually a HORRIBLE keyboard sound. Piano's with funny peaky sounds. Certain notes will blast out while others are almost missing. Georgous synth sounds will sound tinny or mushy throught the PA. I guess my point in all this rambling is that there is not a 'culture' of live keyboard around here. The sound tech usually can't deal with it properly. Just my opinion. Gregg Without music, life would be a mistake - Nietzche QSC K10, Kurz PC3, K2500x, K2000R, Korg Z1, Roland A80, Roland S-750, 1970 MiniMoog, Synthi AKS, bunch of old rack modules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP3 Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Just like there aren't as many younger performance keyboardists out these days, young soundmen of quality and knowledge seem to be a bit rarer as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudeep Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 could i suggest that there is just not enough in POPULAR mainstream music for a young kid to say "oh man i wanna do that". when i was 12...guns and roses were getting serious airplay...pink floyd too plus dire straights...lez zep tapes were still being played everywhere...it was at that time that i though WOW i really wanna play the guitar. much later on...i started listening to some awesome keyboardists and started to think that i wanna do that too...while im nowhere near playing like Mccoy (and probably never will)...i was still inspired enough. as a 12 yr old kid...i guess all you have is to listen to the mainstream radio and i just dont hear much in their which i think would inspire them to play. Billy and Elton are relegated to the oldies radio stations...even Ben Folds really awesome playing werent really released as singles (not in Australia anyway). well that my $0.03 (AUD) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cezar20 Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Ben Folds got huge airplay in Australia with Brick and that album. Rockin the suburbs also got massive airplay. I notice when he dropped the Five, he got less recognition and airplay (ie changed from Ben Folds Five to just simply Ben Folds). Australia seemed to really recognise John Smith's Band, John Smith's Trio etc. Eg John Butler Trio, would he be so revered in our live scene if he toured as John Butler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byrdman Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Originally posted by Buddtopps89: Originally posted by phestic: [qb] And if they do they are Old pro's...no young people. Maybe its because the older guys can afford the nice keyboards but I dont know I wish I could see more young modern keyboard players! I know when I was young I could not afford keyboards, so in my case the only part of "old seasoned pro" that applies is the old part. What's really sad is you never see a real piano anymore hardly anywhere (except in church, of course). Or if you do its typically not working. To be able to play keyboard at all these days you need a bunch of gear and someway to move it round. The only people who get real pianos are those who have reached the top of the profession. This makes it even harder for young piano players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prague Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Well, another aspect is that many of the experienced players won't go on stages for you to see! It was great as I was first learning in that almost all bands had guitar, bass, KEYBOARDS, and drums. Odd, that was when keyboards were expensive and heavy. Now keyboards are relatively cheap and light. All 140lbs of me can move our heaviest 88 weighted by myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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