Kudos to Yamaha Biz Practices

[zeronyne]

This is a long, roundabout story...

 

Somehow this year, I ended up (after a frenzy of buying and selling) not owning any Yamaha gear except for an RX-5. The DX7IId and TX816 left a long time ago, and I just gave my VL1m to an extremely worthy (and extremely needy) acquaintance indefinitely. This got me thinking about the new Motif...

 

As I've mentioned before, I own a Triton ProX. I have a weird philosophy concerning the MIDI part of my personal studio. There are certain essential things I feel that i have to have as hardware: a dedicated drum module, a sampler, an analog engine, some sort of module with loops in it, a dedicated B3 engine, a VA module, an unweighted controller, a weighted controller, and a ROMpler.

 

I actually have this stuff in duplicate or triplicate, but when I was an up and coming GASaholic, this was my category list for MIDI gear.

 

Ever since I became financially comfortable, which wasn't that long ago, I started to buy synths that were obviously long-term keepers...not that any gear really goes obsolete, but i was looking for best-in-class type stuff - the most obvious example of which is my DMPro.

 

The one item that keeps being replaced, however, is the ROMpler. By the very nature of how I use it (to emulate "real" instruments and to play modern pop sounds) and my dissatisfaction with it in terms of those needs, a ROMpler rarely makes it three years in my studio. M1, ESQ-1,T2, SY99, D-70, JV-90, XP80, K2600, Triton...all have been there, all sounded phenomenal, all got replaced except for the Triton.

 

So I have been reading, with a great deal of interest, the threads about the ES. A gazillion megs of waves and half a gig of sampling with an mLan option? Awesome! But I'm not exactly tired of the Triton...but I wouldn't mind having a fresh new board.

 

I was really on the fence until I saw this on the Motifator site.

 

I have NEVER seen a synth line that had any sort of upgrade path like this. I could not believe it.

 

Do the coupons make more money for Yamaha? Of course. Is the bonus CD a relatively cheap way for Yamaha to do a value-add? Yes, I should hope so.

 

But the kicker is the extended warranty...FOR BOTH THE PERSON WHO BUYS YOUR MOTIF AND YOUR SHINY NEW ES. Even though it may never be used, it is a HUGE symbolic gesture on the part of Yamaha.

 

Even though I cannot take advantage of the offer, I am going to put my money where my mouth is. I think a company, whether it's a one man shareware outfit or a juggernaut like Yamaha should be rewarded for pioneering good business practices.

 

I am placing an order for a Motif ES tomorrow, and the Triton will go on the market.

 

Wow, this is ridiculously long and rambling. What I'm trying to say is that Yamaha has again created a milestone in the MI industry by even CALLING it an upgrade path, and I think it's commendable.

 

You know I just realized that I also no longer have any Kurzweil in the house...I have a Young Chang grand piano...does that count?

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by zeronyne:

I was really on the fence until I saw this on the Motifator site.

 

I have NEVER seen a synth line that had any sort of upgrade path like this. I could not believe it.

 

Do the coupons make more money for Yamaha? Of course. Is the bonus CD a relatively cheap way for Yamaha to do a value-add? Yes, I should hope so.

 

But the kicker is the extended warranty...FOR BOTH THE PERSON WHO BUYS YOUR MOTIF AND YOUR SHINY NEW ES. Even though it may never be used, it is a HUGE symbolic gesture on the part of Yamaha.

 

Even though I cannot take advantage of the offer, I am going to put my money where my mouth is. I think a company, whether it's a one man shareware outfit or a juggernaut like Yamaha should be rewarded for pioneering good business practices.

 

I am placing an order for a Motif ES tomorrow, and the Triton will go on the market.

 

Wow, this is ridiculously long and rambling. What I'm trying to say is that Yamaha has again created a milestone in the MI industry by even CALLING it an upgrade path, and I think it's commendable.

Commendable?

 

I'd say that's an understatement. I think it's amazingly cool and savvy of them to do this, not to mention unprecedented in our industry, if I'm not mistaken.

 

Combined with the incredible quality of the MOTIF ES series, I think it's gonna pay off for Yamaha in spades.

 

dB

[Ouizel]

I'm a Yamaha fan anyway, & I think that's way cool. I'll probably not do that, but that's because I've got my eye on an S90. But that's still awesome.

[Mike Martin]

Thank you very much. We've been working hard on this program and I think the final details are almost in place.

 

I think all of us have been in the position where we have recently purchased something and the next new model comes out shortly after. We are confident that this program will help keep the resale value of used Motif's high, plus reward those people who have been using Yamaha products.

 

Though its explained pretty well at www.motifator.com I want to be clear that this is a Yamaha Loyalty program, and that there is no way to retrofit a Motif to be a Motif ES.

 

The final details of the program will be going up early next week.

[Ski 1642606170]

"Unprecedented" you say, Dave??? Sorry to disagree, but it most certainly HAS been done before!

 

Oh... wait... that was Yamaha too, with their rebate program for EX5 owners who wanted to purchase the original Motif!

[Jeff Klopmeyer]

I think Yamaha's willingness to do this is based on two points: their longevity and their experience in markets beyond the relatively small pro audio/musical instrument world.

 

As the oldest tech company in our industry, Yamaha's been around the block a few times. While other companies are hitting certain marketing challenges for the first time and either succeeding or failing, Yamaha has seen it all. When you've come out the other side of the Great Depression as a company, a couple little econimic bumps don't phase you as much as others.

 

Second, being in industries such as their motor corporation helps a company like Yamaha be more amenable to consumer-focused programs and promotions like this. The expectations of the consumer in those markets demands innovative sales programs, so it's nice they can cross over to our zany little world.

 

Good going, YCA!

 

- Jeff

[humannoyed]

I think it is great business practice for Mike M. to be hanging out here with us trying to make sense of our requests for product improvements. I think that is what is unprecedented in this business. This can really take things to the next level.

Thanks Mike

 

dB play a chord with your left hand on the ES and change patches with your right hand while still holding the chord.

What happens? Did they get it right?

 

Day

[synthdogg]

Originally posted by zeronyne:

I have a weird philosophy concerning the MIDI part of my personal studio. There are certain essential things I feel that i have to have as hardware: a dedicated drum module, a sampler, an analog engine, some sort of module with loops in it, a dedicated B3 engine, a VA module,

.....

and don't forget to mention your need for them to all be single rack space modules! :wink:

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by humannoyed:

dB play a chord with your left hand on the ES and change patches with your right hand while still holding the chord.

What happens? Did they get it right?

Sadly, no. The program cuts off. This, of course, is my number one beef with the MOTIF.

 

As many of you know, this is a pet peeve of mine. There have been companies doing what I call "program remain" for almost 20 years (the first synth that I played which did it was the K250 back in 1985). If Kurzweil, Alesis and Emu can do it, I don't see any reason at all why every synth manufacturer doesn't implement this.

 

dB

[Phil B]

I'm pretty sure the Fantom S lets you set this how you want to - either notes cut off or they hold. But, if you have them hold, the effects change so the sound may change too. Is that how it is on Kurzweil too, or do the effects on the sound hold as well?

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by Phil B:

I'm pretty sure the Fantom S lets you set this how you want to - either notes cut off or they hold.

Really? Please do check - I'd love to know if that's the case.

 

But, if you have them hold, the effects change so the sound may change too. Is that how it is on Kurzweil too, or do the effects on the sound hold as well?

The effects change. I'm not sure if there's any way around that without multiple effects processors/effects buffers.

 

I'd much rather have the effects change on the sound rather than have it just cut off...

 

dB

[Mike Martin]

There is a way around this.

You use MIX mode. Though this mode is primarily designed for sequencing purposes, there aren't any rules.

 

So within a Mix you can setup your own splits and layers (even copy them from Performance mode). Then using the part buttons you can switch between 16 voices at once. Your first 8 parts will have full effects and you can switch between them without any transition problem. For you Dave, this may be the answer for you in a live situation.

[marino]

Originally posted by Phil B:

I'm pretty sure the Fantom S lets you set this how you want to - either notes cut off or they hold. But, if you have them hold, the effects change so the sound may change too. Is that how it is on Kurzweil too, or do the effects on the sound hold as well?

Yeah, even my old XP-80 have this option. Only, the effects will do very nasty noises if you enable notes to hold. On the Kurzweil, the change of effects is MUCH smoother, even with switching beetween different effect types.

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by marino:

On the Kurzweil, the change of effects is MUCH smoother, even with switching beetween different effect types.

As I understand it, the Kurz stuff ramps the effects send volume down and then back up very, very quickly when you change programs, so it's not so abrupt.

 

dB

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by Mike Martin:

within a Mix you can setup your own splits and layers (even copy them from Performance mode). Then using the part buttons you can switch between 16 voices at once. Your first 8 parts will have full effects and you can switch between them without any transition problem. For you Dave, this may be the answer for you in a live situation.

If you can hold the current program (with either pedal or fingers) when switching to a new one, then that will, in fact solve my problem.

 

I'll check it out over the weekend.

 

Thanks, Mike!

 

dB

[Calumet]

So how does one find someone who wants to sell their Motif to upgrade? Any suggestions?

[Mike Martin]

I believe the guys at Motifator.com are going to start a for sale section. In the meantime, you could also check with your local dealer. There are other options such as ebay too.

[Tusker]

Hey Mike Martin works for YCA and they are doing a lot of cool things.

 

No coincidence IMHO.

 

Hoping to hear some sweet breath controlled VL sounds in one of these Keyboard compilations Mr. Martin.

 

Jerry

[burningbusch]

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

Originally posted by Mike Martin:

within a Mix you can setup your own splits and layers (even copy them from Performance mode). Then using the part buttons you can switch between 16 voices at once. Your first 8 parts will have full effects and you can switch between them without any transition problem. For you Dave, this may be the answer for you in a live situation.

If you can hold the current program (with either pedal or fingers) when switching to a new one, then that will, in fact solve my problem.

 

I'll check it out over the weekend.

 

Thanks, Mike!

 

dB

This trick works fine on the S90, I'm sure it will on the Motifs as well. Again, use Master mode to get instant access to you song list. Switching between Voice, Perfoamce and Mix is seemless. You might find that the Yamaha OS is actually quicker than other more "intuitive" OSes.

 

Busch.

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by burningbusch:

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

Originally posted by Mike Martin:

within a Mix you can setup your own splits and layers (even copy them from Performance mode). Then using the part buttons you can switch between 16 voices at once. Your first 8 parts will have full effects and you can switch between them without any transition problem. For you Dave, this may be the answer for you in a live situation.

If you can hold the current program (with either pedal or fingers) when switching to a new one, then that will, in fact solve my problem.

 

I'll check it out over the weekend.

 

Thanks, Mike!

 

dB

This trick works fine on the S90, I'm sure it will on the Motifs as well.

Indeed it does! Excellent!!

 

Problem solved!

 

dB

[Mike Martin]

For more on the subject. A Tutorial

[dementia13]

This is a small thing, but small things count. I recently got an FS1R, and called Yamaha to ask for a CD of the Sound Diver editor. I half expected a hassle, but the first words out of the rep's mouth were, "what's your address?" That's great customer service, even toward the purchaser of what they have to know at this point is a secondhand product. Quality shows in details.

[Markyboard]

Speaking of the FS1R last year soon after I bought one of my FS1Rs I had a problem with it where it locked up. The service tech(can't remember his name - initials on return auth are F.A.) was fantastic. We got into troubleshooting over the phone and he was not only courteous but treated me as if I knew something about this stuff (which I do). Together over several days we figured out how to clear up the problem (removing battery AND AC cord) for a couple of minutes. Seems simple now but I was about to pack it up and send it in when one last phone call resolved the problem. I've always had good experiences dealing with Yamaha service techs and parts. AND THEY SELL SERVICE MANUALS WITH SCHEMATICS.

[Superbobus]

Whoopeeee, finally! Is this possible on a CS6x too? Don't see a "mix mode" button. If it doesn't work, maybe Yamaha has some cool switch program from CS6x to S90...

Some things are weird with Yamahas, but the way they're dealing with customer service is a win-win situation.

[Markyboard]

maybe Yamaha has some cool switch program from CS6x to S90...

Or CP-80

[Addix Metzatricity]

But.... can we trade up Yamaha basses and guitars?!