God Awful Parenting

[Bunny Knutson]

Tedster, it seems that the home schoolers in Missouri are a pretty pathetic lot, according to your assessment. That's NOT how we are at all. There are some very broad generalizations being portrayed here, and it makes me feel uneasy about some of the unfounded negative statements being thrown around in this thread. You want to know what one of the WORST forms of God-Awful parenting is? Anyone who divorces their spouse before the kids have left the home. Frankly, that does more damage to children than most of the silly complaints I've read in this thread. I agree wholeheartedly about not letting your kids play violent video games. Those games are just destructive trash. There are much more positive and educational ways for children to learn hand-eye coordination. I agree that the V-Chip technology is for lazy, irresponsible parents. If you can't monitor what your children are watching, then they shouldn't be watching TV at all. And, by the way, I feel that anyone who doesn't even know their parents' ages has a serious problem with their parental relationships. That's pretty obvious. OK, rant finished. ;)

[Salyphus]

Right on Bunny :thu: My wife and I are expecting our first child in February and we're definitely considering home schooling. I'll have to talk to you about this subject in much greater detail sometime.

[mark_dog]

Take it first hand from me. I am the second of 3. My parents let my brother "try" stuff out to see if it works. like going to a movie without a chaperone for example. this was 3 years ago. he got in trouble and I couldn't go for a while say a year or so. He got in trouble and it's almost like I got punished for it. I can go places with my friends now but for a while if there was no adult there neither was I and I was 12 or 13 years old. I'm a freshman in high school now and my brothers friends are starting to drive. I'm afraid if one of them gets in an accident and he's in the car I won't be in the car with my friends driving next year or maybe even me not get a lisence(sp?). Is that right? Opinions, suggestions?

[Magpel]

Hmmm. Homeschooling. To me, it's an issue much like those surrounding college radio. Should a college DJ or engineer's experience be a realistic rehearsal for the corrupt world of commercial radio or rather a utopian interlude in which kids experience what it *could* be like, not what it *is* like. Should college radio perpetuate of challenge the prevailing professional model? Either way, you learn how to operate the board, you know? In some ways, homeschooled kids see more of the "real world" because they are not detainees of an overburdened, understaffed public system.

[Veracohr]

[quote]Originally posted by whitefang: [b]I've had it up to "here" with these clowns. I look for tell-tale signs, like any peabrain that whines about wanting to "protect" their children from essentially harmless things. Take my niece, for example. She put V-chips and blockers and almost any other useless device on her TV, cable box and VCR in order to "protect" her son from the ravages of not pornography, but rather "harmful, sexually explicit material"![/b][/quote]Better yet, just throw the whole fucking TV out. Too many people plop their kids down in front of the TV so they don't have to actually do anything with them, like talk or play or have contact of any sort. Kid's running around the house screaming? Just turn on the TV, sit them in front of it, and say "Watch!" Then you can go back to whatever it was you were doing. I'm a "New Age" kind of person, but I certainly wouldn't dream of doing such stupid things as you describe with my kids (when and if they come.)

[Salyphus]

My kids certainly won't be watching any TV. Hell, I don't even watch it. I can't even stand to be in the same room with it. :freak: It amazes me what people will subject themselves to in the name of 'entertainment'. And I don't want to hear any token BS about the discovery channel :rolleyes:

[Tedster]

For all of you homeschoolers I've offended...well, sorry. Sorta. I have friends who homeschool. I disagree with it. They know it. But, I respect their decisions, and if they don't respect mine, I could personally give a shiznit. I don't think homeschoolers are "bad parents", but my opinions stand in that I believe many of them to be overprotective. And, I have known of certain situations where parents that weren't qualified to homeschool were doing so.

[Bunny Knutson]

Yeah, like I said, Ted, it sounds like the home schooling parents that you've met are just crappy parents. I'm sure you've met crappy parents who didn't home school, too. BTW, you haven't offended me, because I'm not like those crappy parents you have described! ;)

[Tedster]

Cool :D :thu:

[G. Ratte]

I don't think homeschooling should be allowed unless the parents have education degrees and teacher's certificates in the state they're in. Homeschooling is usually an excuse to raise your own personal little in-house freakshow. And why are people so damn scared of exposure to violence? Violence is the nature of the universe. Black holes engulf suns, amoebas lurch about consuming single-cell organisms, nations have rolled over each other since beings could make a fist. Violence should be understood, feared, and respected. Otherwise you end up with delusional naivete that makes for really bad decision-making. Evidence abounds.

[Bunny Knutson]

Are you just trying to be provocative, Gratte? Because it's working. :evil: You wanna see some violence first hand? :D

[G. Ratte]

[quote] Are you just trying to be provocative, Gratte? Because it's working. [Evil] [/quote]Ha, no. Think about this then: is education a real profession, or is any yahoo who manages to get pregnant qualified to teach?

[Bunny Knutson]

Is any yahoo who manages to get pregnant qualified to [b]BE A PARENT[/b]??!!??!! :freak:

[Franknputer]

I agree that education is a real profession - so how about throwing some REAL tax $$ towards having GOOD schools with highly qualified teachers, instead of cutting them to the bone over and over again, and then wondering why the world is filling up with illiterates?

[whitefang]

I'm gonna jump back in with some responses to some responses. Sorry if I don't have everybody's name! First off, I'M a "boomer", dammit! "Me" generation, my ASS! THAT came later. But I will agree that several boomers make the rest of us look dopey. The biggest bitch I have about some of my fellow boomers is their inability to deal with aging. As I PMed to Gabe, the only advice I got about raising kids from my Mother was one sentence. "Never put ANYTHING past your kids!" How many times have you heard some pinheaded parent make the claim, "MY little johnny would NEVER do______!" You fill in the blank. And any of you out there living in that kind of denial might be interested in a couple of BRIDGES I have for sale. I only know one family that tried home schooling. Took it only so far, given the limits of their own education. But I fail to see any ill effects of the endeavor. Like an earlier post stated, the kids from that family are polite, easy to talk to, responsible enough for all the other neighbors to trust them to watch over their houses while out of town, and have an immense sense of responsibility. Kudos to the parents. I have no personal use for their Dad. He's a boorish loudmouth. But, I can't knock success! The explanation of the "time out" doesn't add any validity to the practice. Sit the kid down to "reflect" on his/her behavior? Gather his "thoughts" and settle down? HOGWASH! No kid young enough to be given a "time out" is gonna think of anything else but how unfair he/she is being treated. And watch the clock. "Reason" with a seven year old? Rare priviledge indeed. But, there is some merit to the "talking out" method. In my day, they were called "lectures." My Dad was the Master! He'd sit me down and start "lecturing" to me, and after a short while I found myself wishing he would just beat my ass and get it over with! It would have been less painful! I never had objections to my kids watching TV. At the time, children's programming was dominated by "Sesame Street." Both kids knew a bit how to read, and count quite high by the time they started school partly from the content and delivery of this program. I often used the time they watched to sit and watch with them. And watch what they preferred. Made them feel important, and Dad liking what they liked brought on some kind of closeness. But, it was NEVER a "baby-sitter." PBBPaul, I would rather my kids become gang members, rather than counselors. During my divorce, my older daughter's "acting out" was dealt with by her crack-head Mother by being sent to these clowns. That girl had them doing anything she wanted them to, mostly by preying on their sympathy. Useless buncha slugs. In my family, the kids that are the type you just want to slap are the ones raised to believe they are the center of the universe. I see nothing wrong with filling a child with some sense of self importance, but you gotta let them know that no matter how special Mom, Dad, Grandma and Grandpa think they are, the rest of the "real world" doesn't give a shit! Expecting the rest of society to treat you like the prince or princess Mom and Dad does will cause more trouble then it's worth. Too many parents lately don't seem to follow up on this, and it's a pain in the ass to the rest of us. And for the record, I agree you shouldn't threaten your kids. Make them bona-fide PREDICTIONS, instead! Whitefang

[Wow]

[quote] I don't think homeschooling should be allowed unless the parents have education degrees and teacher's certificates in the state they're in. [/quote]You must be in the union. By the way, union's have to much power now-a-days and need to be delt with. :freak: , oops thats what the homeland security act did. Teachers are next. 14% of American high school grads cant find the U.S. on a globe. The idea that only the Gov. can run schools is straight out of Marx's manifesto.

[whitefang]

More like the Marx BROTHERS, if you ask me! Whitefang

[Magpel]

[quote]Originally posted by whitefang: [b] In my family, the kids that are the type you just want to slap are the ones raised to believe they are the center of the universe. I see nothing wrong with filling a child with some sense of self importance, but you gotta let them know that no matter how special Mom, Dad, Grandma and Grandpa think they are, the rest of the "real world" doesn't give a shit! Whitefang[/b][/quote]First response: every kid thinks he/she is the center of the universe. It's how their brains work. It doesn't matter if they're coddled or ignored. And the comeuppance, the realization that they are not, takes a lifetime regardless of how they were raised. Finally, I have a tough time abiding the vitriol expressed in this thread, the judgment of parenting styles, and all the foolhardy certainty. As if anyone really knows that parenting action A produces child development result B. I'll save my invective for parenting that is abusive or neglectful. Outisde of those extremes, wield your judgments carefully and follow the golden rule. I don't see the point in getting so pissed over semantic differences in the parenting lexicon: "time out" or "go to your room." The vast majority want the best for the kids whatever their social affiliations, and every parent has to learn that he/she can't engineer a perfect child, whether in the name of new age utopian values or traditional morality and discipline. It's the same experience in superficially different garb. Timeless, painful, wizening, circle of life, parental obsolescence, that whole deal. Enjoy your kids, goddamnit, and recognize that others do too regardless of what language or "parenting methodologies" they might favor.

[The Thrashole]

I don't really agree with home scool or public school. I personally think it really depends on the kid. My brother was home schooled due to an inner ear problem that kept the kid off balance most of the time. He was fidgety and the school wanted him on ADD drugs. He wound up being home schooled until high school. He turned out to be a normal kid in my opinion. My own son goes to public schools. He is in first grade and the school is trying to pressure me into the third grade. He is just like any other seven year old. There is no way i'm going to bump him up. The school work isn't the issue but socially I think it would hurt him. I considered home school until He played football this year. The comment on kids listening to a seperate authority figure is right on the money in this case. He behaved differently with his football coach than with me or the wife. That is the reason he is still in school. He does extra work at home to keep his mind busy but goes to school to learn how to deal with others. I would love to get him in a private school but can't afford the tuition right now but I'm looking for scolarship info because the school doesn't want to deal with him. He reads on a sisxth grade level and is very advanced in math as well at other subjects( damn kid can add fractions ). The school is doing some things just for him right now but they are only doing it because My wife and I have been on their back to make sure he gets an education.

[SFOracle]

[quote] And why are people so damn scared of exposure to violence? Violence is the nature of the universe. Black holes engulf suns, amoebas lurch about consuming single-cell organisms, nations have rolled over each other since beings could make a fist. Violence should be understood, feared, and respected. Otherwise you end up with delusional naivete that makes for really bad decision-making. Evidence abounds. [/quote]If you really believe this, please don't have children. If you do have children, keep them away from me and mine. Children learn in many different ways, but one of the most powerful ways children learn is by modeling (copying) observered behavior. If you expose them to a lot of violence you are going to have violent children.

[whitefang]

Magpel, there's certainly some truth in that! But I don't think the comeuppance should take a lifetime. What I'm seeing more and more of are parents who either support, or turn a blind eye at their kid's self-centered attitudes, and insist that the rest of us accept it, or keep quiet. And I can't abide by it. That it goes hand in hand with the denial I mentioned earlier makes it even more nerve-wracking. For example, a grandniece, nine at the time, was running through my sister-in law's house with a cousin. The cousin's hair was falling out of place. Both the nine year old and my wife gasped when it happened. The nine year old looked at my wife and with a sneer, said "Oh, shut up!" My wife looked over at her and asked, "What did you say to me?" and the girl said "I said, shut UP, bitch!" Well, my wife raised her hand and lightly popped the girl in the mouth. Now, before any of you namby-pamby's start wringing your hands over the practice of child abuse, or how it's wrong to EVER lay your hands on somebody elses little angel, lemme tell you. None of this brat's parents were present, and wouldn't be for hours. And my wife and I were raised in a time when it was acceptable for any adult in the family to handle these things as seen fit. Certainly, had I done this sort of thing, and my Aunt busted my ass for it, I surely wouldn't go crying to my Mom about it. I'd just wind up getting my ass busted again! I was never THAT dumb! Anyway, my wife apologized for the pop, explained why it was done and how wrong it is to talk to ANY adult in that manner. And in turn, the girl apologized for what she said, they both hugged and said "I love you" to each other. This was at one o'clock in the afternoon. Long about midnight, while at home, my wife gets a call from her nephew, the girl's Dad. He called her every name in the book! Claimed his daughter told him she smacked her so hard that it hurt for a solid hour, and if she laid a hand on any of her kids again, he'd beat her ass, "You fuckin' BITCH!", then hung up. The kid also claimed my wife hit her "For no reason." He never DID ask what it was all about, what really happened, what was my wife's side of the whole thing, or even why the brat waited NINE HOURS to tell him about it! She told HER story, and that's all that counted. And, THAT'S the kind of shit I'm talking about! There's no 100% sure-fire way to raise kids, that's true. What worked for me with my oldest was dismally inneffective with the youngest. And I'm not claiming to be the world's best parent either. I've SURELY made my share, if not more, of missteps and blunders. But, there ARE things being practiced that are so obviously stupid that it's hard to keep quiet for very long. And that's why the rant. That neither of my kids wound up in jail, pregnant at 13, joined cults or gangs and in adulthood pull their weight as contributers to society in some legitimate fashion, well, I couldn't have done TOO badly. Besides, I usually atribute their turnout to THEM as well. I just figure I was lucky, somewhat. Whitefang