Got my new VK8!

[Superbobus]

After one week of impatient waiting finally she has arrived, my new VK8! And boy, does that thing kick ass, unfuckingbelievable! Now, there were some posts about the Leslie that sounded way artificial but B3_guy was right. If you do some editing and tweaking - major PITA on this unit - you can get a Leslie sound that comes very, I mean VERY close. Let's see if I'm still gonna need a real Leslie cabinet. Since I edited this part of the unit I can say:

forget about the CX3, this is the real shit!

Of course, when you have a CX3 you still have a damn cool organ.

[Slowly]

Congrates on your VK8. It was a toss-up for me between the Roland or the Hammond-Suzuki. The only reason I didn't take the Roland was because I wanted a dedicated board with no other sounds. The keyboard action I liked a lot. And heck no, I don't see what people hear in the CX3. It sounds awful. Kcbass

[SurrealMcCoyJazz]

Originally posted by Kcbass:

Congrates on your VK8. It was a toss-up for me between the Roland or the Hammond-Suzuki. The only reason I didn't take the Roland was because I wanted a dedicated board with no other sounds. The keyboard action I liked a lot. And heck no, I don't see what people hear in the CX3. It sounds awful. Kcbass

In all fairness to the CX3........

 

All given digital pianos, sample players, B3 clones aren't "one size fits all."

 

So many players tend to associate their "ideal" instrument sound with studio proccessing.

I find this especially true with piano sounds. Alot of players need to EQ the hell out of their original sound........so it will sound more like the "dialed-in" version of the recording.

 

As a former Hammond A100 series owner, I found the Korg CX3 to be more faithful to the original sound than the VK8 (IMHO). The digital "tube" emulation on the Roland seemed to be truer than the "artificial" one on the Korg however.

 

Thankgoodness for a wide variety of players with the same wide variety of sound opinions/priorities.......otherwise........there would only be ONE keyboard!

Then this forum would become rather boring! LOL

 

Surreal

[Slowly]

Originally posted by SurrealMcCoyJazz:

Originally posted by Kcbass:

Congrates on your VK8. It was a toss-up for me between the Roland or the Hammond-Suzuki. The only reason I didn't take the Roland was because I wanted a dedicated board with no other sounds. The keyboard action I liked a lot. And heck no, I don't see what people hear in the CX3. It sounds awful. Kcbass

In all fairness to the CX3........

 

All given digital pianos, sample players, B3 clones aren't "one size fits all."

 

So many players tend to associate their "ideal" instrument sound with studio proccessing.

I find this especially true with piano sounds. Alot of players need to EQ the hell out of their original sound........so it will sound more like the "dialed-in" version of the recording.

 

As a former Hammond A100 series owner, I found the Korg CX3 to be more faithful to the original sound than the VK8 (IMHO). The digital "tube" emulation on the Roland seemed to be truer than the "artificial" one on the Korg however.

 

Thankgoodness for a wide variety of players with the same wide variety of sound opinions/priorities.......otherwise........there would only be ONE keyboard!

Then this forum would become rather boring! LOL

 

Surreal

The Hammond and the Roland sound ok when compared to a real B. The Korg is too too digital sounding, akin to a robotic voice. Now, put a couple tubes in the Korg signal path, WOW. Thats when I say I jumped too soon and bought the Hammond. But of course, just seeing the word Hammond also adds player confidence value. Kcbass

[Rick K.]

Superbobus----

 

You are quite fortunate! Enjoy your new board! Keep us posted on your ongoing likes/dislikes. I'm probably gonna spring for something like that in the next couple of months....

 

Rick

[Byrdman]

Originally posted by Kcbass:

Originally posted by SurrealMcCoyJazz:

[qb]

Originally posted by Kcbass:

[qb]

I had the opportunity to compare the three units almost head to head (they were in differing parts of a Guitar Centre's keyboard room; plus there was some kid messing with a brain dead sampling/sequencing machine playing elevator music selections on the presets but I digress.

 

I liked the Hammond keyboard best.

 

The CX3 would be real nice for Jazz but lacks the growl I need for R&B. The VK8 seems the best bet for that. The Hammond is acceptable. Overall it probably would be my choice because of the action.

 

So its a tough choice. The trouble with putting a valve pre-amp behind any of these units is that surely you then need an external Leslie as well. Has anyone tried using the internal simulator with an external tube pre-amp - does it work ok or does it sound weird?

 

I would also love to have the sysex for those presets you have rolled Super.

[SurrealMcCoyJazz]

Hey Byrdman,

 

I believe we had the topic of the internal simulator working/not working w/external preamp awhile back. Anyway, I am happy to say that by plugging my CX3 into my Presonus Blue Tube......things have definitely "warmed up".

Actually, I plan to replace the 12AX7 tubes with higher quality tubes. My CX3 GROWLS! I didn't care for the "digital overdrive" at all.

 

Surreal

[b_3guy]

Congratulations on gettin the new board! I've used a ART Tube MP to warm up my Hammond XK-2. It's cheap only $100 US & does the job.

[Superbobus]

So far here's what I have done.

Chose vintage 2 tonewheel, overdrive type 1 and adjusted leakage, tone and overdrive to my taste.

Speeded up the Leslie fast tempo, both woofer and tweeter section.

Gave more value to the tweeter section.

Put the percussion soft and normal volume down.

Put the key click volume up.

EQ-ed maximum bass in.

Checked reverb and checked amp settings again.

Made some drawbar adjustments and saved four presets.

Now I should be ready to gig with it, the rest is gonna be small adjustments. This thing sounds WILD now!

[b3keys]

Congrats on the VK8. I have a VK7, which I think is FAB. I got the VK7 when it was being discontinued and have no regrets. It was $600+ cheaper than the 8 and I think more programmable (easier to edit. The lack of waterfall keys doesn't bother me.

 

Enjoy your new 'board!

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by Superbobus:

After one week of impatient waiting finally she has arrived, my new VK8! And boy, does that thing kick ass, unfuckingbelievable! Now, there were some posts about the Leslie that sounded way artificial but B3_guy was right. If you do some editing and tweaking - major PITA on this unit - you can get a Leslie sound that comes very, I mean VERY close. Let's see if I'm still gonna need a real Leslie cabinet. Since I edited this part of the unit I can say:

forget about the CX3, this is the real shit!

Of course, when you have a CX3 you still have a damn cool organ.

Congrats!

 

I like my vintage CX-3 OK, but I'm very aware of the fact that's it's NOT a B3. Maybe sometime I'll upgrade.... who knows?

 

--Dave

[Superbobus]

Vintage CX3? You mean the old one? Cool! I never heard one though but it's funny to see that a unit that was there to solve portability problems is vintage nowadays. Let's see which B3 wannabe's are going to be a classic in twenty years.

[Stephen Fortner]

I still love my VK-7, although Leslie simulation has certainly gotten better in the four years I've owned it.

 

I tried the VK-8, and I like the layout and especially the keybed, but the VK-7 still comes off to me as a more professional instrument. AFAIK, Roland still hasn't addressed the issue of separate vib/chorus toggles for the different virtual manuals and pedals. This is how the real thing works (pedals are tied to lower manual) and is essential for jazzers who want chorus on their lead sound but a "straight" bass and comping sound.

[Superbobus]

Well, 1900 is a lot of money for a non professional instrument. I wanted to look for this issue in the manual but I can't find the damn thing anymore! And the problem is, I really need that manual for editing. Is there something on the net?

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by Superbobus:

Vintage CX3? You mean the old one? Cool! I never heard one though but it's funny to see that a unit that was there to solve portability problems is vintage nowadays. Let's see which B3 wannabe's are going to be a classic in twenty years.

Yeah, the old one. I have no idea why Korg kept the same name for a new model, seems a little strange, but there are now *new* CX3s and *vintage* CX3s.

 

--Dave

[Calumet]

I have recently made the switch from the Vk-7 to the Native Instruments B4.

 

I will never, ever go back. The B4 blows the Vk-8, CX-3, Xk-2, Vk-7, etc. away.

 

I take my laptop out on gigs. People freak out about the sound.

 

It's really the next wave. I have had the Vk-7 for years now and always loved it...but the B4 kills it. The Vk-8 is better than the 7, but they didn't fix the things I didn't like about the 7, so it really didn't satisfy me.

 

But, oh...the B4!!

 

Check it out.

 

Mitch

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by Calumet:

I take my laptop out on gigs. People freak out about the sound.

Mitch

Man, that scares me so bad! I just can't see relying on a desktop OS system on stage. Not that I'm afraid of technology, far from it. I've been a techno-geek since DOS 2.x, and I've had direct budgetary and operational responsibility for multi-million dollar data centers.

 

But I've never had a Windows or Mac system that gave me that UNIX-server sense of rock-solid stability.

 

So.....how do you do it? How do you keep that laptop stable and reliable enough to feel comfortable using it on stage? Enquiring minds want to know...

 

--Dave

[Calumet]

My laptop is used for 1 thing - the B4. I don't have anything else on it. No e-mail. No internet. Nothing.

 

I basically turn on the computer and forget it. I just got it recently and have used it on three gigs. I have had one glitch in what is about 8 hours of time on stage. I think that's pretty good.

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by Calumet:

My laptop is used for 1 thing - the B4. I don't have anything else on it. No e-mail. No internet. Nothing.

 

I basically turn on the computer and forget it. I just got it recently and have used it on three gigs. I have had one glitch in what is about 8 hours of time on stage. I think that's pretty good.

Hmmm. I think you are braver than me. But maybe I'll try it one day.

 

--Dave

[Calumet]

For me, the sound I get from the B4 is worth any risk.

 

I use a MidiMan Quattro USB port with ASIO drivers...so I am not using the soundcard in my PC. I get virtually 0 latency with this set up.

[ELP71]

Calumet -

 

Out of curiousity, what kind of laptop (+specs) you running live? How does the B4 work in terms of real-time tone changing/Leslie activation?

[Superbobus]

But I've never had a Windows or Mac system that gave me that UNIX-server sense of rock-solid stability.

How about Mac OS X? That's UNIX based. Finally there's coming out some serious software but we still need more. Calumet, I'm very curious how you use your drawbars realtime with your MIDI controller. B4 is very good, but I don't hear that big difference. Oh, maybe that's because of the dip in my hearing!

[Calumet]

Originally posted by ELP71:

Calumet -

 

Out of curiousity, what kind of laptop (+specs) you running live? How does the B4 work in terms of real-time tone changing/Leslie activation?

600mhz lap top

Pentuim III

128 Ram

 

Midiman Quattro USB interface with ASIO drivers

 

I use the VK-7 as the controller, so the drawbars and such are Midi controlled, so I have total control over the drawbars. I'm not much of a drawbar grabber (I play jazz, mostly, so I stick to presets like I do on a real B-3 - when you're playing left hand bass you don't have much time to grab drawbars), so I set one of the drawbars to kick on the leslie.

 

Mitch

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by Superbobus:

But I've never had a Windows or Mac system that gave me that UNIX-server sense of rock-solid stability.

How about Mac OS X? That's UNIX based. Finally there's coming out some serious software but we still need more. Calumet, I'm very curious how you use your drawbars realtime with your MIDI controller. B4 is very good, but I don't hear that big difference. Oh, maybe that's because of the dip in my hearing!

Right. I haven't used Mac OS X yet. I'm in the process of putting together a systemm to run ProTools, and I came really close to purchasing a Mac. It's probably a better environment for ProTools, , but I also would really like to mess with OS X. The irony of the system that used to be infamous for having no CLI whatsoever having a shell out to pure UNIX.... delicious!

 

However, a couple of reasons led me to stick with a PC:

 

* I already own enough odds and ends to put a PC-based ProTools system together for just a couple hundred bucks

 

* Pro Tools doesn't run on OS X anyway.

 

But, to the original point -- if I was trying to put together a stable system for stage use, Mac OS X would probably give me a higher confidence level than any Windows system. Although I'd have a steep learning curve -- I've never done much with Macs, and my sysadmin skills are rusty as hell, I've been playing the management game for five years now. These days the way I build a stable UNIX system is like this:

 

To: sysadmin mailing list

From: Dave Pierce

Subject: new box

 

Guys, please build me a stable UNIX box by next Wednesday.

 

 

--Dave

[rod76]

i hauled a L-111 yesterday

 

I couldnt believe how light that thing was compared to a M3

[konaboy]

Originally posted by Calumet:

 

I use the VK-7 as the controller, so the drawbars and such are Midi controlled, so I have total control over the drawbars. I'm not much of a drawbar grabber (I play jazz, mostly, so I stick to presets like I do on a real B-3 - when you're playing left hand bass you don't have much time to grab drawbars), so I set one of the drawbars to kick on the leslie.

 

Mitch[/QB]

I've noticed that the B4 doesn't have any balls whatsoever on the lower manual, no matter which drawbars I pull out. Isn't this a problem for your left hand basslines?

[Superbobus]

Big problem on the VK8 too. I noticed that yesterday on my first gig with it. Jon Lord type bass with '70s amp simulation amp lots of distortion kick major butts but, like Calumet, I play mostly jazz on it and the 838000000 (and later 858000000) lower manual setting (for left hand bass, I still have to learn the pedal board) didn't cut it at all.

But I solved it today. By putting EQ bass to the max and set the drawbars to 858530000 my left hand bass is swinging by itself. Real phat and with that jazzy octave and a nice little overtone.

[b_3guy]

Originally posted by Calumet:

I use the VK-7 as the controller, so the drawbars and such are Midi controlled, so I have total control over the drawbars. I'm not much of a drawbar grabber (I play jazz, mostly, so I stick to presets like I do on a real B-3 - when you're playing left hand bass you don't have much time to grab drawbars), so I set one of the drawbars to kick on the leslie.

 

Mitch[/QB]

To change speeds of the Leslie on the B4 using the VK-7 as a controller, use an on/off footswitch set to midi controller 007. Not hard to set up.