I want to get "organized"

[Superbobus]

So, back from holidays and that's where I saw this organ trio (organ, guitar and drums). The organ player had this Korg CX3 which sounded really good and is compact. Size and weight were always reasons not to go the organ way but there are possibilities now. So... which way should I go for maximum sound - minimum size?

a) an old compact Hammond, don't know the series but there used to be one at the early '70s

b) Korg CX3

c) Roland VK-series, don't know which one

d) B4

e) Hammond XB-series

f) something else

How does the B4 work live? Do I need a sampler for live situations? My knowledge about samplers is close to zero so you tell me...

BTW, I do have a great active monitor speaker but it doesn't have a Leslie.

[Postman]

Don't forget the Voce products. They've gotten consistently good reviews.

[b_3guy]

I'm thinking about changing my live rig. I currently use a Alesis QS-8, Hammond XK-2/Leslie 147. I have a B-3 for my studio stuff & also have the B4. I have gigged with the old CX-3 & have done a couple of gigs with the new CX-3 & the Roland VK-7. I have A/B'd all these different emulators with the B-3. The old CX-3 is too thin & shrill, old technolgy. The new CX-3 sounds very close, but not robust enough. The B4 is too bassy, you can EQ almost all of it out. The VK-7 wouldn't scream, was kind of flat. The XK-2 has a funny beating sound with fast Leslie, I have to watch which note combinations I use. I took out the new Roland VK-8 & used it at home for the last couple of days. I can make it sound just like my B. I think its the best emulator on the market, the best action, it's light to carry, & to boot it has some usable other sounds. The VK-7 had the other sounds but they were terrible, GM quality. These are improved. I'm going to try it out at a gig this weekend & use the piano sound in the VK-8.I think in the end I'm going to get it & sell my XK-2.

[Tusker]

B3 Guy:

 

Can you get good overdrive pre-leslie on the Roland? I haven't played the new one. The old one always had a glassy tone, no matter what you did.

 

Thx,

 

Jerry

[John_dup4]

Well....like the 'b-3 guy' I've been trying all the combo's too, but I've decided to keep my XK-2 with the Leslie 122. Just nothin' else sounded as good. My Pro3-T and extra gear now sits on a shelf collecting dust....it is so worth hauling the 122 for 'that' sound......on the other hand, maybe it's the dry air out west?

[Dave Pierce]

I currently gig with an old model Korg CX-3, and a Motion-Sound Pro3. I'm quite pleased with the sound. When I play the blues thing at JJ's on Sundays, I get lots of compliments on my B3-like sound. My only real complaint is the "lipped" synth-style keys instead of waterfall keys.

 

I did play the VK8 at GC the other day, and loved it. I suppose if I was buying something new I'd consider that.

 

--Dave

[b_3guy]

Originally posted by Tusker:

B3 Guy:

 

Can you get good overdrive pre-leslie on the Roland? I haven't played the new one. The old one always had a glassy tone, no matter what you did.

 

Thx,

 

Jerry

There's an overdrive knob right on top. Also on top is switching for 3 different "types" of Leslie amplification. So you different OD's with them that you boost up with the knob. It truly is the best. I can't exactly dup the B-3 with all the others, even when I use a Leslie, but I can with it.

[b_3guy]

Originally posted by John:

Well....like the 'b-3 guy' I've been trying all the combo's too, but I've decided to keep my XK-2 with the Leslie 122. Just nothin' else sounded as good. My Pro3-T and extra gear now sits on a shelf collecting dust....it is so worth hauling the 122 for 'that' sound......on the other hand, maybe it's the dry air out west?

Nothing replaces the sound like a real Leslie. It sounds so big because of the big box, like an acoustic guitar compared to an unplugged electric. Onstage the Leslie sounds like it's coming from everywhere. I'm really replacing my XK-2 & QS-8 for live usage. I'll use the acoustic piano sound in the VK-8 & take out my Korg MS2000 (15lbs). What I'm really doing is downsizing.

[Superbobus]

Nothing replaces the sound like a real Leslie. It sounds so big because of the big box, like an acoustic guitar compared to an unplugged electric.

That means I need a new speaker right, with a propeller built in, right? Where do I get these in Europe?

Also, how do I use the B4 in a live situation?

[Synthguy]

I think I'll leave the B4 questions alone, some people here have actually tried it and can answer that properly.

 

I actually have an old portable Hammond, leaning against the wall in my music room because sadly the tubes in my Leslie finally bought it. Now I have to see about getting that beast going again because I can't afford a Hammond clone with all the things I really need first. Plus, a real Leslie is just... well, real. You can play with miking, and each set up gives you a different character. And playing with the Hammond is a blast, those drawbars are so essential in playing organ and I miss them. It's a weird beast with four percussion tabs. Not very authentic, but it sure gets some interesting sounds.

[Gus Lozada]

Originally posted by Superbobus:

Also, how do I use the B4 in a live situation?

If you trust in your computer... go for the B4 live. I have NOT a laptop so I carry my desktop everywhere I go. I run an audio app to trigger my audio -no midi involved- and I run B4 / Reaktor as stand alone apps.

 

It works perfectly.

 

Combine B4 with a TASCAM US428 or an EZBus and you have a winner Drawbar controller...

[sevush]

If you want to haul and maintain an old porta-B, which sounds more like a spinet than a B/C console, go ahead.

 

I've used the (new) Korg CX3 for a year and I love it. I plug it straight in to house boards, sometimes use one or two Mackie SRM450s and it sounds great. I get a lot of complements on the sound.

 

Minimal schlepp, setup/teardown and maintainence.

[EricG]

In my ears the both Native Instrument B4 and the new Korg CX3 sounds great. The B4 is not that easy to use live if you want drawbar control like on a real Hammond. The new CX3 has more of the hammond feeling. (Drawbars, very nice keybed.) I bought the new Korg CX3 about a month ago and I am very happy with it

[Superbobus]

Minimal schlepp, setup/teardown and maintainence.

Considering that and the fact that I don't feel like taking my desktop to the gig, I have three options:

a) Korg CX3

b) Roland VK8

c) Hammond XK2

Which one sounds best? I know there were threads about this but stil...

Sevush, what is that spinet sound? Is that something like a harpsichord? Weird...

[johnnie red]

Make sure you look at the Nord Electro!!!

 

http://www.clavia.com/nordelectro/index.htm

[SurrealMcCoyJazz]

a) XK2 sounds okay

b) VK8 sounds better

c) CX3 sounds GREAT !!!

 

Surreal

[Tedly Nightshade]

Tough one. I have a great sounding system including a hammond simulator (XM1), sequencer (to randomly shift the drawbars constantly, never repeating), Leslie 122, and Ampeg V4 for a power amp, and I can't shed any of it without losing the fantastic sound that makes any of it worth toting.

It's not so very big, but there are so many things to plug into things... most nervewracking to set up, but very simple to play. I decided simple to play was the paramount value.

[Superbobus]

Make sure you look at the Nord Electro!!!

Does it have realtime drawbar controllers like the CX3 and VK8 have? More questions:

Does the CX3 feature waterfall keys?

Can I split drawbars in the VK8 so I can play a left handed bass line and different settings in my right hand?

[Gus Lozada]

Originally posted by Superbobus:

Make sure you look at the Nord Electro!!!

Does it have realtime drawbar controllers like the CX3 and VK8 have?

Nord Electro features something cool/weird as drawbars: buttons. An UP and a DOWN button for each drawbar.

 

With a little practice you will be able to move the virtual drawbars as if they were real.

 

Check them :

 

http://www.clavia.se/pictures/nordelectro/NEdrawabarsLarge.jpg

 

( Sorry for the BIG Picture )

[EricG]

Go for the CX3, IMHO it's the best of them

And yes it has waterfall keys.

[Dave Pierce]

Originally posted by EricG:

Go for the CX3, IMHO it's the best of them

And yes it has waterfall keys.

You probably got the idea that it didn't from my post bitching about the lipped keys. I have a *vintage* CX3, which has lipped keys. (yuch)

 

The new CX3's do have waterfall keys.

--Dave

[Superbobus]

Thanx guys. Considering the minimum schlepp&maintenance/maximum sound thing I'm doubting between VK8 and CX3 now.

- How do both "Leslies" behave?

- How do VK8 and CX3 drawbars behave?

- Are there differences in warmth between VK8 and CX3?

- How do both of them feel? (keys)

I'm asking all of this because it's hard to A/B these models because most shops don't have demo models over here.

[Superbobus]

BUMP!!!

Just saw this ad: Hammond X5 with Leslie 760 solid state for 650. Don't know the X5. It should be "portable" (yeah right, like the Rhodes 54!) but is it suitable for Jimmy Smith stuff?

[B3Nut]

X5's a solid-state Hammond combo organ...it's set up like a spinet. Not really suitable for Jimmy Smith-type organ playing, though with the left-hand bass tab engaged you get usable LH bass tones. Better for funk, though. Really glassy in the top end, too, not as sweet as a tonewheeler.

 

I sold my old VK7 to a local organist who used it to replace his aging, tempermental X5. He's happy with it. He uses that for various gigs leaving his B-3 parked at a club he hosts sunday night jam sessions at.

 

I haven't run into a new VK8 yet, interested in hearing one. I like the new CX-3, though something about the tone still doesn't seem quite "there"...I'd have to hear it through a Leslie...

 

TP

[b_3guy]

Originally posted by B3Nut:

I haven't run into a new VK8 yet, interested in hearing one. I like the new CX-3, though something about the tone still doesn't seem quite "there"...I'd have to hear it through a Leslie...

TP

Hey Todd, I took out a VK-8 on a test drive to a gig Thurs. nite. I'm used to doing these type of gigs with my XK-2/Leslie 145. I didn't miss the Leslie!!! I played it thru my Yorkville Block 100. It has a 15" with a Piezo tweeter. It was wicked. Thick sound with screaming highs that aren't thin & brittle. I was even able to quickly dial up a sudo Steppenwolf sound at the end of the nite to do Born to be Wild. C-3 vibrato is bang on. Leakage dial is kind of neat. OD dial is OK. This one is it. Thurs afternoon I was able to fool with it in my studio & it sound exactly like my B. I can't get the B4 to sound exactly like the B without some EQ work. I've got an ad starting next week to sell my XK-2.

[B3Nut]

Oh man, now you've got me drooling and I'm broke.

 

Hehehehee

 

TP

[b_3guy]

I took it out for another gig last nite. Confirms my Thurs nite test drive. It's the real deal!!! I got an ad to sell my XK-2 starting next week.

[Stephen Fortner]

Still playing away on my once-prestigious but now dated VK-7. Anyone who's used both have much of an opinion on how much better the VK-8 is? I've tried it in the music store, and I like how it feels. The leslie simulation still needs work, though.

 

The new Voce "Key 5" looks interesting. It's a full-size, two-manual version of their popular V5 sound module. Probably still vaporware at this point, but I'd check things out if they made a single-manual version.

[b_3guy]

Originally posted by SteveFortner:

Still playing away on my once-prestigious but now dated VK-7. Anyone who's used both have much of an opinion on how much better the VK-8 is? I've tried it in the music store, and I like how it feels. The leslie simulation still needs work, though.

I passed on the VK-7 to get my XK-2 because of the flatness, no scream, crappy vibrato/chorus, lame percussion, synth action. But the new VK-8 is very good. Good key click, good leakage, good vibrato, great action. DIDN'T MISS MY LESLIE AT BOTH GIGS!!! & if I don't have my Leslie with me I always miss it. This is as good as it gets.

[guestuserguestuser.com]

Originally posted by b_3guy:

I took out the new Roland VK-8 & used it at home for the last couple of days. I can make it sound just like my B. I think its the best emulator on the market

I A/B'd the VK8 next to a (new) CX3, and I thought the CX3 blew it away. The VK8 sounded very cheap and fake to me. But since you're a B3 owner, and you think it comes closer to a real B than anything else, I'm going to have to listen again.