my organ playing sucks :(

[jimbyjoe]

hi all,

 

well at church today, i got quite disheartened about my ability or lack thereof to play b3 sort of stuff. i mean i've done it for years in church, but something is missing. maybe it's because all i can hear is my keyboard and i wasn't getting a decent foldback mix, or maybe my voicings are wrong. i think my voicings could be better. does anyone ever find playing your stand 1-3-5 triad in various inversions just doesn't always cut it? a lot of the time i'll just play 2-5, or 1-3, or 1-5, and after that just your standard inversions, depending on the chord. but what can i do to improve my voicings??? come on you guys - you are pro's!!!!! help me out here! TIA.

 

pray for peace,

kendall

[cg1155]

I have this same problem. I have found that with B3 less-is-more is usually a rule that works well, that and playing notes that aren't really in the chord. The real problem with B3 is that there isn't a good resource for building chops. I have yet to find a good book that gets you started into good B3 technique. The only way I know of pulling it together is to listen to the greats and learn their riffs. Too time consuming for me because there's so much great material out there.

 

-Casey

[Steve LeBlanc]

I never do this but here's some inspiration for you. My recent Hammond Organ acrobatics...One thing to remember with organ is the two keyboards need to be voicing different parts of the chord to get a full sound.

 

JAMFREE 2002

http://www.artistlaunch.com/jamfree

[Slowly]

Originally posted by jimbyjoe:

hi all,

 

well at church today, i got quite disheartened about my ability or lack thereof to play b3 sort of stuff. i mean i've done it for years in church, but something is missing. maybe it's because all i can hear is my keyboard and i wasn't getting a decent foldback mix, or maybe my voicings are wrong. i think my voicings could be better. does anyone ever find playing your stand 1-3-5 triad in various inversions just doesn't always cut it? a lot of the time i'll just play 2-5, or 1-3, or 1-5, and after that just your standard inversions, depending on the chord. but what can i do to improve my voicings??? come on you guys - you are pro's!!!!! help me out here! TIA.

 

pray for peace,

kendall

Just take your letter and cut your name and put in mine, so don`t feel along. for some help, try here . I plan on buying some tapes but its not yet in my budget. If you order some, please let me know how they turn out.

And also as Casey said, in a lot of gospel, you don`t have to be there during the entire song. Just lead the vocalist into the line of the song and catch them at the end of the line. Say with "What a Friend We Have in Jesus". Play a chord to lead into "What". Another chord for "Have", And then "Jesus". Do a fill-in, then a lead-in chord for "All". Kcbass

[Blues Disciple]

Here'a link that may be helpful too:

 

http://www.abcgospelmusic.com/hammond_man.htm

 

I learned keyboard on an old Hammond E-300. Its been years since I played one though. The key is to use the two keyboards to complement each other. The bottom manual I always used for the straight basic chording. The top manual was for solo and ornamentation---use chord inversions, different drawbar settings, fills, and "icing on the cake" type of things. Use the volume pedal to accentuate chord changes and such.

 

Its been a long time, so I hope this little bit helps.

 

BD

[jimbyjoe]

cheer fellas, although i need to clarify it a bit further. i only use my xp-50 with organ patches on it, not a double manual organ. i do use the leslie sim HEAPS, which is something i think i'm good at. i made this little footswitch for turning the rotary slow/fast out of a little shoe polish tin. everyone loves it.

 

cheers, pray,

k

[Slowly]

Originally posted by Blues Disciple:

Here'a link that may be helpful too:

 

http://www.abcgospelmusic.com/hammond_man.htm

 

I learned keyboard on an old Hammond E-300. Its been years since I played one though. The key is to use the two keyboards to complement each other. The bottom manual I always used for the straight basic chording. The top manual was for solo and ornamentation---use chord inversions, different drawbar settings, fills, and "icing on the cake" type of things. Use the volume pedal to accentuate chord changes and such.

 

Its been a long time, so I hope this little bit helps.

 

BD

Ain`t Hammondman something else!?! Kcbass

[Tusker]

I'm still learning....

 

I started playing in our community church a couple of years ago. I've got adequate chops from playing rock and classical, but this was an adjustment for me. It's been on my mind. Here are some (random) thoughts:

 

- I listened to a bunch of organists and that helped me....(there's a cd called Organized that has a bunch or organ styles on it). It made me realize there were several ways of playing the B3.

 

- I hardly ever play triads. Single lines with accidentals (black notes) for grace notes a lot of the time.

 

- I hardly play without changing the sound while I play. I use an XP30 in the church and build sounds for it on the XP50 at home. I often have at least two different sounds in the patch. They are cross faded by a swell pedal that also increases the volume. So with one control, I can go from glisten to scream and a few things in-between.

 

- Practising glissandi. There's so many ways to do this. I started by overusing them, probably still do, but at least my tricks are more varied now.

 

- Using attacks. It's really hard to get authentic attacks on a rompler. Contrary to what one might think, a certain amount of velocity sensitiveness is actually useful on an organ patch. I use all kinds of stuff (filtered handrum etc.) for attacks, not just the key click waveforms.

 

- For voicing and entire chors, I sometimes use legato (three part) harnony styles where the left hand is playing a line and the right hand is playing 2. Kinda churchy in a more traditional way but it really supports the slower numbers. If you make the chordal stuff into lines they blend better.

 

- bottom and top - sometimes i'm playing in the stratosphere so you can hardly hear me . Just a shimmer above the others. It catches the overtones off the singers. I usually find notes that can stay the same... like c, d and g for a C, F, G, chord progression. By contrast on a really grooving song, I might play a mellow sine wavy voice just above the bass, no rhythm, just single sustained notes. I am between the rhythm guitarist and the bass. And the bass player likes it cause it allows him to funk it up without losing the bottom. The rhythm guitarist likes the control of the rhythm and harmony. Oh and the notes I play would be 7ths, like the note D for an EM7 chord. This is crazy fun for a deeeeep gospel groove.

 

- No pitch bend - its ok, just squash those black notes.

 

The leslie is key. I like your idea of a pedal. I have it programmed to one of the sliders. I hate the Roland programming on the bender because it resets to SLOW when you take you hand off.

 

Sound design on the Roland: I try to get a little pre-leslie tubey distortion or hiss off the wave form, or using the booster mildly. (structures 3 & 4)

 

Fill up space. The guitars have a pretty fixed range, the horns have a pretty fixed range, the vocals have a narrow range. The piano can go any where, but can't sustain. So the organist can greatly influence if it should be wall of sound or, thick in the middle, or sparse or....Ever since we added horns, I've taken the rasp off a lot of my sounds, I play higher and add glisten on top of the horns rather than fighting with them for the middle of the wall.

 

- When and how you come in and go out, is as important as what you play. Glissandi, key click and a good volume pedal are important for this.

 

I've got some XP50 B3 patches for you to use here if you like.

 

Best,

 

Jerry

[sevush]

While piano usually sounds sweeter when you pour more notes on, a tonewheel organ gets pretty mushy.

 

I think the reason for that is the nature of the sound itself - layers of overtones. One single note on a hammond can be 9 notes at once.

 

So "less is more" really applies on the B3, or whatever you're using to imitate it.

 

I picked something many years ago that I use all the time from an very seasoned B3 player. He taught me to break EVERY chord down to the two most important tones.

 

We're talking right hand here, so either you or the bass player will cover the fundamental. So you can always toss the fundamental and since the fifth is a perfect interval, you can toss that. IOW, you don't lose much "color" by tossing the perfect intervals, they're probably already being played or implied.

 

so a Cminor7 would be played using the third (Eb) and the 7th (Bb). I found that by using this "shorthand" and memorizing them, my playing became much more colorful and interesting.

 

There's much more to this approach than I'm describing, but just breaking down chords to the two most important notes can be dramatic on organ parts.

[Slowly]

Also, Listen to some Al Green stuff, especially "Love and Happiness" and "How can you mend a broken heart". It`s not gospel but the B3 rips. Kcbass

[Graham English]

Search the Keyboard mag archives for those Joey DeFrancesco's mp3s. Then slow them down in a audio editor and listen to the subtleties of his playing. He learned from the master, Jimmy Smith.

And you'll have a very difficult time playing good organ on anything other than a Hammond and Leslie. Even the digital ones and "some" of the leslie simulators are pretty good. That's because the instrument almost plays itself. It's kinda like a Clav.

I use an XB2 with a Leslie 147 and the thing just screams

I rock it out on this tune:

Captain

Dig

[Slowly]

And you'll have a very difficult time playing good organ on anything other than a Hammond and Leslie. Even the digital ones and "some" of the leslie simulators are pretty good. That's because the instrument almost plays itself. It's kinda like a Clav.

I use an XB2 with a Leslie 147 and the thing just screams

I rock it out on this tune:

Captain

Dig [/QB]

 

Enjoyed the tune. So true what you said above. Good to meet another Hammond nut. Kcbass