Jump to content


Please note: You can easily log in to MPN using your Facebook account!

Gibson to buy Baldwin


dansouth

Recommended Posts



  • Replies 26
  • Created
  • Last Reply

This is interesting ......Baldwin uses GEM electronics for their digital pianos . If Gibson buys baldwin ....maybe we'll see GEM guitars ????

Or maybe peavey will distribute Baldwin and General Music ? Dano

www.esnips.com/web/SongsfromDanO
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you're buying a top quality piano, you're not buying Baldwin. If you're buying a value priced piano, you're not buying Baldwin. So who the hell has been buying Baldwin pianos for the past 10 years? Apparently, very few people. The only 2 Baldwin endorsers that come to mind are Dave Brubeck and Ben Folds (the piano on the Letterman set might be a Baldwin also). Billy Joel did for years, but I've seen him playing Steinway lately.

 

The Baldwin brand has been stuck between this rock and hard place for years. Gibson buying any brand is the kiss of death. Opcode was the most tragic example. Chalk up another write off for the company.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by mzeger:

The only 2 Baldwin endorsers that come to mind are Dave Brubeck and Ben Folds (the piano on the Letterman set might be a Baldwin also).

 

Bruce Hornsby has also been a Baldwin artist, but now that may change, too.

 

Gibson buying any brand is the kiss of death. Opcode was the most tragic example. Chalk up another write off for the company.

 

Don't forget Oberheim. Gibson also bought them out back in the late `80's, and they never designed anything worth buying after that. Oh sure, they re-released the Matrix-12 at such a high price noone bought it. And they also re-released the Matrix 1000 with a DIFFERENT COLOR FACEPLATE! (ooooh, how daring! :rolleyes: ) But other than that, it was just a couple of MIDI processors. Then they quietly disappeared.

 

First Oberheim, then Opcode, now Baldwin. I wonder if it's a conspiracy to rid the world of keyboards so guitarists can once again rule the Earth?

 

;):D

 

Peace all,

Steve

><>

Steve

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by SWBuck1074@aol.com:

 

 

First Oberheim, then Opcode, now Baldwin. I wonder if it's a conspiracy to rid the world of keyboards so guitarists can once again rule the Earth?

 

Maybe, but first they'd have to also rid the world of sheet music.

 

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: steadyb ]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

According to the Associated Press there are two investment groups interested in Baldwin that G.E. Capital would not disclose. Gibson is also interested and it turns out they made a bid on Oct 15th that was declined. There is hope Gibson won't get it.

Michael

Q:What do you call a truck with nothing in the bed,nothing on the hitch, and room for more than three people in the cab? A:"A car"....
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only 2 Baldwin endorsers that come to mind are Dave Brubeck and Ben Folds

 

Hmmm, those are some pretty prominent endorsers, maybe not, what do I know ;)

 

I guess what I'm saying is, if either of those guys told me I should play Baldwin pianos...I would definitly be checking that brand out.

 

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: Steve LeBlanc ]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by SWBuck1074@aol.com:

Don't forget Oberheim. Gibson also bought them out back in the late `80's, and they never designed anything worth buying after that. Oh sure, they re-released the Matrix-12 at such a high price noone bought it. And they also re-released the Matrix 1000 with a DIFFERENT COLOR FACEPLATE! (ooooh, how daring! :rolleyes: ) But other than that, it was just a couple of MIDI processors. Then they quietly disappeared.

 

Don't forget that brilliant work of engineering, the OB-Mx! Somewhere on the web is a great story by one of the engineers on the project about how Gibson tried to screw over Don Buchla (and the rest of the design staff) and wound up screwing themselves because they had NO IDEA how to get a Buchla design into actual production (hint: when Don says, "no parts substitutions", you DON'T substitute parts!). And they also re-package/re-brand cheap organs made in Italy by Viscount.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Steve LeBlanc:

 

Hmmm, those are some pretty prominent endorsers, maybe not, what do I know ;)

 

I guess what I'm saying is, if either of those guys told me I should play Baldwin pianos...I would definitly be checking that brand out.

 

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: Steve LeBlanc ]

 

Compared to Steinway's roster, 4-5 notable endorsers is a pretty insignificant number. That certainly can't diminish the stature of these Baldwin artists. If a Baldwin piano withstood the 2 hour set I heard Ben Folds deliver a couple years ago, then perhaps Baldwin builds the Sherman tank of pianos.

 

I played plenty of new and rebuilt Baldwins before I bought a rebuilt 1927 Steinway 10 years ago. The SD-10 is a competitive concert grand, but in the 5'-7' range, Baldwin is not a happening piano for the money.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, someone with extra cash should buy Baldwin grands NOW so that in ten years their warm, vintage sound can be resold for big bucks. You heard it here first!

 

What awful news that the Blob which utterly destroyed Oberheim, Steinberger, and Opcode is now sucking in another great music-gear manufacturer. (Do a web search for the articles by the principals involved in each of these rotten deals about the appaling way they got screwed over.) The only thing positive about Gibson is the idea behind GMICS, but after a year where are the products using it from them, let alone industry-wide adoption of the standard?

 

I really like the larger Baldwin grands for their somewhat heavier touch and much darker sound than the competition. Eventually the pendulum of public taste will swing away from the bright top end of the Steinway sound, but by then Gibson will have replaced the Baldwin company with an email auto-responder saying "we have no plans to make any pianos at any time".

 

In the extremely unlikely event that someone from Gibson is reading, how about posting your side of the story? How about a defense of how three strikes in a row is bad luck rather than the results of arrogance, incompetence and hostility?

 

Dismayed,

Chris

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"..... And they also re-package/re-brand cheap organs made in Italy by Viscount."

I bought one of thoes "cheap" organs 3 years ago. It was the OB-3 squared and one thing it is NOT is cheap. It has held up great, being used on many gigs, and though it's sound quality is slightly under the CX-3, the difference is not worth the price. (It sounds much better playing through my motion sound KBR-3D). For live playing, it is so much easier to take around than a B-3(did that for years)and 99% of the people I play for can't tell the difference anyway. :D

Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK-1 + Ventilator, Korg Triton. 2 JBL Eon 510's.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by keyoctave:

"..... And they also re-package/re-brand cheap organs made in Italy by Viscount."

I bought one of thoes "cheap" organs 3 years ago. It was the OB-3 squared and one thing it is NOT is cheap. It has held up great, being used on many gigs, and though it's sound quality is slightly under the CX-3, the difference is not worth the price. (It sounds much better playing through my motion sound KBR-3D). For live playing, it is so much easier to take around than a B-3(did that for years)and 99% of the people I play for can't tell the difference anyway. :D

 

I agree with keyoctave, the OB-3 squared is a great sounding and compact unit. But I get the point, its a Viscount unit really and Oberheim are not the company they used to be.

 

Ian

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by mzeger:

If you're buying a top quality piano, you're not buying Baldwin. If you're buying a value priced piano, you're not buying Baldwin. So who the hell has been buying Baldwin pianos for the past 10 years? Apparently, very few people. The only 2 Baldwin endorsers that come to mind are Dave Brubeck and Ben Folds (the piano on the Letterman set might be a Baldwin also). Billy Joel did for years, but I've seen him playing Steinway lately.

 

The Baldwin brand has been stuck between this rock and hard place for years. Gibson buying any brand is the kiss of death. Opcode was the most tragic example. Chalk up another write off for the company.

 

I've done a fair amount of research as I consider buying a grand piano. Baldwin had some bad years but according to most sources, including The Piano Book, they are back on their game again.

 

Endorsements are not all that important to me. Since Billy Joel plays a hollowed out grand that holds a Kurzweil digital piano and says "Kurzweil" on the side, I guess he's actually endorsing Kurzweil these days.

 

Much of that endorsement has to do with the support the manufacturer will put in place, providing a tuned instrument at their various locations. It's not always easy to provide service in remote locations, so the exact details of someone's tour schedule might have more to do with the endorsement than the supposed quality of the instrument.

 

There are few quality grand pianos made in America these days and Baldwin is definitely one of them. I've played a number of Baldwin grands (and folks, anything under 6' is really not worth getting into quality comparisons!) and they never "jump" out at me like a Steinway might, but the action and response are always consistent and rewarding. Compare their price point and quality to a comparable Steinway or even Yamaha (C series) and they're an excellent buy, new or used.

 

I don't own one, nor any grand now, but given the right price and piano, I'd be proud to own one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I personally have a Baldwin SD10 concert grand in the studio. I like the sound of this piano as well as any other concert grand piano on the market. I also like good Steinway Model D's, Bosendorfer Imperials, and Becksteins. All of these pianos have their own distinctive sound, and all of them sound wonderful in their own right. I have played some Steinway Model D's that I do not like as well as the Baldwin SD10. Baldwin does make great nine foot concert grand pianos, which are hand made to a great extent and are equipped with a Renner action, which is considered to be the very best action.

 

Kip

Bardstown Audio

www.bardstownaudio.com

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by DougP:

Don't forget that brilliant work of engineering, the OB-Mx! Somewhere on the web is a great story by one of the engineers on the project about how Gibson tried to screw over Don Buchla (and the rest of the design staff) and wound up screwing themselves because they had NO IDEA how to get a Buchla design into actual production (hint: when Don says, "no parts substitutions", you DON'T substitute parts!). And they also re-package/re-brand cheap organs made in Italy by Viscount.

 

I searched around for this article and couldn't find it. If anyone can find the URL please post it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The saga of the OBMx, Don Buchla, and Gibson can be found here:

A SETTLEMENT HAS BEEN REACHED in the case of GIBSON GUITAR CORPORATION vs. D.N. CROWE

 

The full story is pretty long, and fairly technical, but I found it a compelling and eye-opening read. Pity any remaining Baldwin employees ...

 

(P.S. Apologies for characterizing Viscount organs as "cheap"; fortunately, IanD correctly interpreted the intent of my statement. I'll add that I've always thought that Italian keyboard manufacturers did two things better than most: organs and string machines.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the link Doug, I read that report and learned a lot. I knew, for example, that Gibson held the rights to the name "FAR", but I had no idea that they tried to include in that ALL Fourier-based resynthesis technologies. That's ridiculous! But mmm, thinking about it, Yamaha patented FM... But they had at least the good sense of USING it! Also, I had no idea that Don Buchla was involved in FAR... AFAIK, it was developed at Paris' IRCAM. Anyway, now I understand a little better why on IRCAM's site, reference to the name FAR suddendly disappeared a few years ago.

 

marino

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After following the link DougP put up about Gibson's sorted past in relation to Buchla and the others; my question is what can we do to hasten the demise of the company. With the business practices practiced by the CEO it would seem they will be eventually sunk by their legal costs. That and they will lose their dealers. It seems they have lost Guitar Center already.

Michael

Q:What do you call a truck with nothing in the bed,nothing on the hitch, and room for more than three people in the cab? A:"A car"....
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by tenthplanet:

After following the link DougP put up about Gibson's sorted past in relation to Buchla and the others; my question is what can we do to hasten the demise of the company. With the business practices practiced by the CEO it would seem they will be eventually sunk by their legal costs. That and they will lose their dealers. It seems they have lost Guitar Center already.

Michael

 

I think you mean "sordid past."

 

I don't know. As long as they make Les Paul's, people are going to buy their products. Gibson needs to learn how to make better acquisition decisions. All of these deals have cost them money. How could they have profitted from buying Opcode and shelving the staff and the products? Impossible. Maybe Gibson should just stick with what it does best and skip the expansion route.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guitars can't keep them afloat forever. What has me wrangled is the business practices of the head of the company. As it has been stated before, if the company was publicly traded there would be a lot more scrutiny of the company. Companies don't stay private forever and when this one some day goes public expect a management purge on the top level.
Q:What do you call a truck with nothing in the bed,nothing on the hitch, and room for more than three people in the cab? A:"A car"....
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems they have lost Guitar Center already

 

It was Gibson's decision to stop selling Guitar Center (not Guitar Center's decision to drop Gibson) a while back. Today, however, Guitar Center is a Gibson dealer again, as Gibson has now reversed it's previous position in regards to GC.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am glad Gibson did not decide to "rescue" Alesis.

Me too. Unfortunately, it looks like Alesis is still in the process of being rescued. I hope it's not too long before they're REALLY back in the game.

 

And as successful as Gibson is, ever wonder just how successful they COULD be if things were managed differently? Food for thought...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...