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Best Orchestral/String/Solo Samples-UnityDS-1/Miroslav/Virtuoso2000/Kurzweil Orch.ROM


dturner

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Hello All,

 

I really need your advice and opinions. I am a guitarist and have put together my first "real" project studio consisting of a new mac G4 running DIGI001 with various Korg, Emu, and Roland modules and keyboards. http://www.geocities.com/turnerresearch/guitar is a little site I created to share [ok... show off] the first output from my studio - a few mellow, romantic guitar performances in a Johnny Smith vein.

 

I would like to invest about a grand, and end up with some really outstanding string ensemble, orchestral, piano, and solo instrument timbres. From what I've learned so far, the best routes are in the subject line. I am leaning toward a K2000R [i have extra SCSI CD ROM and hard drives] with Orchestral ROM and appropriate memory upgrades. I have downloaded samples from various sites, and the Miroslav demos floored me. So I could start with the Orchestral ROM and later add a Miroslav CD. The demos from EMU and Bitzhead are "very nice", but just did not make my jaw drop like the Miroslav demos.

 

I should also mention that I am a preset guy [real keyboard players converging on my location - SHIELDS UP!] Truly, I would like to be able to fire up my system, and be ready to go in a few minutes - when I have a few minutes. Music for me is an avocation and form of therapy, so the high end, high maintenance gear is not for me.

 

So... for all you "real" composers and keyboard artists out there.... what can teach me about what I've envisioned so far? Am I on the right track [K2000R] or do the EMU and DS-1 demos not represent the real quality of the gadgets they.... um... represent [sorry.... Austin Powers moment there]

 

Any advice will be welcomed.

 

Best Regards,

 

Dennis Turner

Cedarville, Ohio

 

PS I will be selling off a Roland GR09 with GK2a pickup and JL Cooper MSB+ midi router to help fund [or trade for] this stringquest. dturner@gemair.com

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Hello Dennis,

 

The ultimate setup for strings would be Giga Sampler/Studio format of "Dan Dean" Solo Strings at www.dandeanpro.com and the "Garritan Orchestral Strings" at www.gigastrings.com

 

You can layer Dan Dean's Solo Strings with the Garritan Orchestral strings for the best sampled orchestral strings ever.

 

There are MP3 demos on both of these web sites.

 

Kip

Bardstown Audio

www.bardstownaudio.com

 

 

 

This message has been edited by Bardstown Audio on 10-04-2001 at 01:16 PM

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Hi Kip,

 

Thanks for responding. I went to the DanDean site and downloaded the demos, and IMHO, the Miroslav demo absolutely smokes the Dean demo. Links for each are below. To compare apples to apples, I converted the Miroslav demo to mp3 format and uploaded it to my site. But check out these demos and see if you don't agree....

 

http://www.dandeanpro.com/mp3/DDSSDemo.mp3 [516K] Dean

 

http://www.gemair.com/~dturner/soloviolin314K.mp3 [314K] Miroslav

 

I could not get the gigastrings link to work... are you sure this is a valid URL. Lastly, I don't think GigaSampler will run on a mac, at least not that I can see at the Tascam/Gigastudio site. Do you know if this is correct? I really do like the idea of as software based system, but I have heard the Unity DS-1 just does not hold a candle to a hardware system. Again.... please tell me if I have been ill advised here.

 

Best Regards,

 

Dennis

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Hi Dennis,

 

Yes, the www.gigastrings.com is a valid URL. Perhaps the server was down when you were trying to log on.

 

The best current solution for a Macintosh based software sampler is Steinberg's HALion. HALion version 1.1 imports and translates uncompressed Giga samples perfectly. Many Giga sample libraries are uncompressed, but I would verify this with the developer of any particular Giga Studio/Sampler instrument library, which you may be interested in, if you are wanting to import those particular Giga format instruments into HALion.

 

HALion is not a stand alone sampler at this time, and needs a VST program such as Cubase to operate in. Perhaps Steinberg will release a stand alone version of HALion in the future.

 

HALion is a very powerful software sampler in both Mac and PC formats. Version 1.1 has the "Mega Trig" feature, which has many useful programming functions. As with Giga Studio/Sampler, HALion is also a disk streaming sampler and has no limitations in terms of instrument sample size.

 

Kip

Bardstown Audio

www.bardstownaudio.com

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Kurz is a nice sounding sampler with a lot of programming and control options, but since you don't want to get under the hood, those may be lost on you. A used or refurbished K2000R would be cheap, but it only holds 64M or RAM, not enough for a bunch of good orchestral samples.

 

I tried the Virtuoso 2000 and didn't care for it. I have a couple of sample libraries that don't exactly float my boat either.

 

The easiest thing for me has been to use a Roland JV-1080 with the Orchestral expansion board for composing. It's up and ready to go in three seconds, and it sounds pretty good. You can check out some examples at http://www.mp3.com/DanSouth if you have a few minutes.

 

Virtual instruments are the wave of the future. I have not checked out the HALion - I'm waiting for the next release of the Emagic EXS24, which is also expected to do streaming audio - but I'm sure it's awesome. You'll just have to learn how to set it up to run with your audio hardware and your host program (sequencer). But consider the JV-1080, 2080, XV-3080 or 5080 from Roland with one or more expansion cards if you want a "fire it up quick" system for composing or arranging.

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Quote:

 

<<<<<<

Thanks for responding. I went to the DanDean site and downloaded the demos, and IMHO, the Miroslav demo absolutely smokes the Dean demo. Links for each are below. To compare apples to apples, I converted the Miroslav demo to mp3 format and uploaded it to my site. But check out these demos and see if you don't agree....>>>>>>>

 

Hi Dennis,

 

I listened to both of those MP3 examples, which you have marked on your previous posting on this thread. Both of these MP3's sound wonderful. The Vitous Miroslav Orchestral library instruments were sample recorded in a concert hall. The Dan Dean Solo Strings were sample recorded in a studio. With the Vitous Miroslav library, the live concert hall sound will always be there. With the Dan Dean Solo Strings, Solo Woodwinds, and Solo Brass, you have the option of adding whatever desired concert hall effect you desire, depending on the effect and sound you want to achieve, and also the degree of what ever ambient effect you desire in any given situation.

 

In the past, high quality room and reverb effect units were out of the affordable price range of most musicians, in order to achieve these wonderful concert hall simulations. Today, high quality room and concert hall simulation is very well within the affordable means of most musicians, who want to produce quality music recordings, using various room simulation and reverb pluggins with their favorite DAW's.

 

One of the more affordable quality solutions is "Acoustic Mirror," which is included with Sound Forge 5.0. Sonic Foundry has additional room simulations for "Acoustic Mirror", which can be downloaded for free from their web site for registered Sound Forge users.

 

Jim Roseberry of www.studiocat.com has also developed some high quality room simulations for Acoustic Mirror, which are simulations of professional high quality reverb units.

 

Things just keep getting better for "us" musicians all the time. :-)

 

Kip

Bardstown Audio

www.bardstownaudio.com

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Hi Kip,

 

You've made a good point about the accoustic space component. It would be interesting to hear the Dean demo in a proper orchestral space. But have you heard any of the Dean [or any other] samples that even come close to that exquisite solo violin on the Miroslav demo? Of course it is only a matter of opinion, but the violin in the Miroslav demo is so very, very soulful. Certaily, part of it is the arrangement, and the placement of these lovely notes within that arrangement... but still.... talk about some serious creative potential... even for a lowly guitar player like me....jeez!

 

Speaking of reverb, I have been pleased thus far with the RTAS plugs in ProTools LE, but I also have a Lexicon MPX100 that I've been meaning to integrate into the system... perhaps using the digital I/O on the hardware. What is your opinion regarding hardware versus software based reverb units.... are we there yet?

 

Best Regards,

 

Dennis

PS Thanks so much for the dialog... this type of discourse is exactly what I need. If you have a moment, check out a tune or two at the URL listed at the top of this forum and feel free to let me know what I need to work on.

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Hi Dan,

 

I went to you site and listened to a few pieces.... wow! Lovely work my friend! Are you a classically trained composer? The instruments sounded convincing even thru my little computer speakers, and I cannot wait to download and hear the full mp3 versions thru my Event monitors in my mix room. NICE!

 

Have you heard the Miroslav demos at ilio.com? The timbres you used are gorgeous. But take a moment and check out at least the piano, full orchestra and solo instrument demos at ilio.

 

Also, please feel free to listen to a few tunes at my site listed at the top of this forum. The tune "Baroque Waltz" might appeal to you. I am currently working out a guitar arrangement for Mussorgsky's "The Old Castle" from "Pictures At An Exhibition". It is tough to play smoothly, but should be very nice with enough woodshedding.

 

Best Regards,

 

Dennis Turner

dturner@gemair.com

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Dennis,

 

Thanks for your most kind and generous comments! I'll try to check out your stuff this weekend. I have no training in composition, just some experience banging out easy classical piano pieces as a kid, listening to CD's, and attending concerts. It's amazing how much you can pick up by osmosis.

 

I have heard AMAZING things about the Vitous samples, but they've always been rather expensive. I'll check out the demos, though. Sounds like they would be amazing in combination with Halion or the new EXS24.

 

I have the Siedlaczek (sp??) library and Virtuoso Strings, but neither excites me. A couple of years ago, I decided to compose with the most convenient setup possible (the Roland), Eventually, I want to have my work recorded by live ensembles, maybe student ensembles if no one else is interested. I haven't gotten to phase two, yet. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif But I no longer obsess about the quality of the sounds that I have at my disposal.

 

Thanks again for your encouraging remarks; I'll check out your stuff soon!

Dan

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Hello Dan,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'll look forward to your comments and any advice you can offer about the recording at the site. First efforts, but nice I think.

 

Osmosis....YES! I have played guitar since my early teens [three decades ago..yikes] on and off, and recently started working thru Johnny Smith chord/melody arrangements - many of the tunes on the site are based on JS arrangements. This past week, I found a beautiful chord chart for "Danny Boy" and I was amazed that I was coming up with even more beautiful chords on my own... no doubt as a result of learning Johnny's absolutely brutal guitar arrangements over the past six months. Still... there were those "ooh, that's really nice... damn, where did that come from?" moments... know what I mean? It feels like my sense of harmony, voice leading and just overall musical vocabulary has been greatly enhanced without my being conscious of it. Age and experience do have their rewards, eh?

 

Best Regards,

 

Dennis

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