aliengroover Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 I really don't care what they say about saving other lives, they effed up. This is beyond a "mistake". Reports are that the gas "may" have been of the "banned" variety. Investigations abound, it's supposedly something that was to be gotten rid of by all countries, but the US and Russia (among others) haven't gotten around to all stores of it. The President has been apologizing nonstop. If this happened here, the outcry would be 20 times worse. This is ridiculous. And they're talking about joining the US in ridding the world of terroism? Peace If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking 'til you do suck seed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick_dont_fret Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Yes, the Russians made a very large mistake by storming the theater. They [b]will[/b] pay dearly for this, and you know this, man. They not only defied the terms set by the rebels, they were responsible for the deaths of all those people. Don't give me that crap about who pulled the trigger, the Russkies made them by storming the building. Just give them their fucking independence and this sort of thing wouldn't be happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianT Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Totally disagree. If I had been sitting next to a terrorist with plastic explosives strapped to them, for 58 hours, and knew their only purpose in sitting there was to blow both of us to kingdom come whenever they felt like it.....well. If somebody said to me, "Look, we can end this. But likely 1 out of 7 hostages will die. It might be you." I'd say, "What are you waiting for? Do it. These people are nuts, they've already said martyrdom is looking really good to them, they've already killed 3 unarmed hostages and we're all likely to die if we screw around here much longer. Plus, I despise what they're doing here and I'd rather buy it than give in to this crap, since that will only encourage it in the future." Yup, that's what I would say. No doubt about it. I'd rather have the wife collect the insurance than let the weasels win. Man, it's so easy to criticise people who put their ass on the line and run into a theatre with 50 crazed, suicidal bomb wearing terrorists. I don't suppose you critics would be up for the job, would you? You know, so you could do it "[b]right[/b]"? Regards, Brian T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ernest828 Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Brain, I`m with you on this. Its impossible to say how I would react in a situation but I think I`d rather take a chance biting the bullet than not having a choice. This sort of thing, I`m sad to say, may become commonplace here and abroad. There are no winners here, just lots of death and fear. The only thing we can do is stand up to those who want to force their ignorance and hatred with love and openmindedness. End religion, end labeling and lets use solar energy. Ernest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Hepworth Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Post a link! I don't know what happened! I haven't had tv today and i was gone yesterday. All the hostages are KILLED? No matter how good something is, there will always be someone blasting away on a forum somewhere about how much they hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eh steve Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=578&e=1&cid=578&u=/nm/20021027/ts_nm/russia_siege_dc http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail36.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 One man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter. The Russians have been particulary brutal in the past towards the rebels and this is no different except that this time they gassed their own too. "That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." - Banky Edwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 One man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter. The Russians have been particulary brutal in the past towards the rebels and this is no different except that this time they gassed their own too. "That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." - Banky Edwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sign Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 It's a little too short through the corner, is a Dutch saying. I hope you get the meaning of it. Those "terrorists" where desperate IMHO and also young people. Although the where uncounscious because of the gas, they were all shot through the head =killed or murdered by the russians, which is extremely brutal IMO. And our newspaper says no hostage was executed by them. They could have been sent to justice, killing them was unnecessary violence and an act of terror. The alchemy of the masters moving molecules of air, we capture by moving particles of iron, so that the poetry of the ancients will echo into the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Only 3 (three) hostages were "executed" by terrorists during all those days. All 3 cases happened as results of some kind of panic and chaos. The rest were killed by the ... gas. Some still are dying. PUTIN MUST RETIRE! :mad: I am back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Cobelas Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Just remember 9/11, when fighters were prepared to shoot down any suspect airliner. I´m with Brian, too. Use gas, and shoot the human bombs. I also understand that putting a whole audience to sleep instantly requires some hard stuff (what should they have used? muzak?) Jose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliengroover Posted October 28, 2002 Author Share Posted October 28, 2002 Just on CNN: The US now believes that, due to doctor's reports, it was possibly a narcotics based gas (either morphine or heroin, or a hallucinogen). The doctor's weren't told, and the Bosses aren't saying. Reason is they don't want to "tip off" future terrorist attacks. Also, lives would have been saved had the doctors known what the gas was. You can't want to use this gas again. To think that just going in there and killing everybody solves anything, then you just do not understand terrorism and the thought behind it. My problem is the gas they used, not that they stormed the place. These were amateurs, not really ready to sacrifice themselves. And do you think that because you saved the lives of 800 others that they still didn't win? It's easy to say, as an US citizen, "oh, kill me and let my wife and kids collect the insurance", when in reality most over there don't have any life insurance. That husband in that theater's last thought was "who's going to provide for my family". Plus, it's easy to be all big and bad when you don't have to fight for your freedom. If this was the colonies of days past and the Brits stormed a playhouse or church and did the same thing, then the response would be different. I'm not saying my view is right either, but it's alot more complicated, on both sides of the discussion, than many are making it out to be. Peace If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking 'til you do suck seed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sign Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Can someone explain why the Russians are in Chechenya? Is it oil? The alchemy of the masters moving molecules of air, we capture by moving particles of iron, so that the poetry of the ancients will echo into the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Oil... Good point, Sign. This may be one of the reasons why Russian government don't want to hear anything about independent Chechna. ... We (Estonians) are very, very lucky that our land is relatively poor on minerals. If it had oil (or gold :eek: ) in its bowels... I don't think I would be visiting these pages as I do this now! And our "Singing Revolution" from 1988 (which finally led us to independence in 1991) could evolve into something completely different, with much darker name. I am back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick_dont_fret Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 Big props to Gulliver. These Russians are all a bunch of byatches that need to lay off the crack pipe. They have always been against freedom of others, and always will be. Sure, they fight for their own freedom, but when someone in their face tries to fight for theirs, it's all over for them. The damn drunk Russians just run in there and try to take hold. Eventually, those bastards will have to pull out because eventually they will all die. Something will happen, and the Chechnyans will get support from somewhere else, and take down the communist bastards (they are still communist, right, cause if not, I can't tell). Anywho, more power the to the Chechnyans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by patrick_dont_fret: [b]Big props to Gulliver. These Russians are all a bunch of byatches that need to lay off the crack pipe. They have always been against freedom of others, and always will be. Sure, they fight for their own freedom, but when someone in their face tries to fight for theirs, it's all over for them. The damn drunk Russians just run in there and try to take hold. Eventually, those bastards will have to pull out because eventually they will all die. Something will happen, and the Chechnyans will get support from somewhere else, and take down the communist bastards (they are still communist, right, cause if not, I can't tell). Anywho, more power the to the Chechnyans.[/b][/quote]I'm sorry but you don't have the first fucking single clue about what you are talking about. I could start setting you straight but I'd be here all night, read your history. Jesus ... "That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." - Banky Edwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP3 Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by patrick_dont_fret: [b]Anywho, more power the to the Chechnyans.[/b][/quote]I assume that you're for the AlQaeda component of the Chechnyans as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunny Knutson Posted October 28, 2002 Share Posted October 28, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by Rog The Impaler: [b]I'm sorry but you don't have the first fucking single clue about what you are talking about. I could start setting you straight but I'd be here all night, read your history. Jesus ...[/b][/quote]Don't worry about it, Rog. Just ignore it. https://bunny.bandcamp.com/ https://theystolemycrayon.bandcamp.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sign Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Latest news: triggerhappy Tony Blair is supporting butcher Poetin who says he will not negotiate with blackmailers and terrorists. Tony is hoping his dear friend Poetin will help him and his other friends to fight terrorism. In the mean time people die from a gas that seem to be a big secret, many already died. Yes my friends, this world has great leaders! The alchemy of the masters moving molecules of air, we capture by moving particles of iron, so that the poetry of the ancients will echo into the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Carey Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 how horrible of those russians to save so many innocent lives. Im sooo SURE that the terrorists werent going to kill anyone. Just because they SAID they would kill everyone, and did kill a few is no reason to think that they actually would do it right? Those guns they had were just walking sticks right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlahib.no Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 of course they are wrong, they are russians! whatever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFOracle Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Let's see, the Russians, fighting Terrorists kill 100+ hostages and execute 50+ terrorists free some 700+ hostages. This is bad. While we plan a unprovoked premptive strike on a soverign nation to prevent them from (we think) potentially developing weapons that we already have and have used in the past. Civilian casualties in this (future but almost certain) action are sure to run into the 1000s. And just because the average American can't distinguish a Persian from an Arab or a secular despot from a fundamentalist zeolot we feel this is justified. Oh - and both scenarios come down to oil. This is good? Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong: James Bryce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbrock1san.rr.com Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by SFOracle: [b] This is good?[/b][/quote]Yes, as a matter of fact it is. :thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Flier Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 I don't think I take issue so much with the Russians storming the theater and using gas. It was probably the most effective way to end the situation without the rebels blowing the whole place to smithereens. What I DO take issue with, is that they won't say what this gas was that they used, AND they didn't alert the medical community to their plan or give them an antidote for it. The doctors there think that many more lives could have been saved if they'd either 1) known what the hell they were dealing with or 2) been given an antidote prior to the time the gas was used. That's where they fucked up IMO. Putin is way too hung up on national pride and secrecy. The Kursk sailors might have been saved too, if he'd accepted help sooner from other nations who offered it, and been more forthcoming with information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by Lee Flier: [b] ......... Putin is way too hung up on national pride and secrecy. The Kursk sailors might have been saved too, if he'd accepted help sooner from other nations who offered it, and been more forthcoming with information.[/b][/quote]That's exactly what I think of him as well. Thanks for saving my time, Lee. ;) I am back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wow Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Can we get one thread on this topic , we have two and its confusing. :freak: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
progfusion74 Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Kinda agree with Lee on this. If they used a legal gas it was OK, and probably the most efficient way to do it. Somewhere, the implementation got screwed up and the post-gassing scenario was a disaster. If it was not a legal gas, then Putin does need to answer. Chechnya might have a valid case for independence, but there is no excuse for this sort of terrorism. Too bad so many innocent people lost their lives http://www.indiegrooves.com/dnm/images/dnm_small.gif My Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick_dont_fret Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Hey Rog, I'm a history major. I know my stuff. Thanks for your concern, though. Too bad... Anyway, Russia does need to answer for their deeds. They killed what, 2-300 people with this 'gas' that no one knows for sure what it is. And if it is opium-based, these people will be addicted to opiates for quite a while. Same principle as crack babies, only no genetic predisposition. I'm all for peace, if you can't tell. Which is why I call on Putin, or Fartin, whichever, to bring peace. And no Rog, I don't support terrorism or Al Qaeda, and I can certainly tell the difference between Persians and Arabs, and whatever else y'all were ranting and raving about. I know my stuff. This is just going to be one of those things that our children will (God help us all) learn from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franknputer Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 [quote]Originally posted by patrick_dont_fret: [b] Anyway, Russia does need to answer for their deeds. They killed what, 2-300 people with this 'gas' that no one knows for sure what it is. And if it is opium-based, these people will be addicted to opiates for quite a while. Same principle as crack babies, only no genetic predisposition. [/b][/quote]Uhhh...how do you figure this, exactly? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick_dont_fret Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 [quote] Originally posted by Chris Kemp: [b]Uhhh...how do you figure this, exactly?[/b] [/quote]What's the question? You're not too clear. I think the transmission may be breaking up. What? You don't understand that? Too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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