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Studio monitors (a little off topic ?)


EricG

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Hello !

I need a little advice from you fellow keybordplayers. I know a lot of you do recording mixing at home so I need your addvice. I am looking for some active studio monitors for my home studio. I am going to use them for recording and mixing. (but also when practising & programming sounds at home.)

I do alot of different music, both electronic and with acoustic instruments. I have tried some speakers, but i have found some of them a little bass shy.(like the small MSP5, tannoy reveal active, genelec 1029.) We keyboard do like to use some very low sounds some times http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif (I know bass players smack our fingers, but at home I am the boss/bass making my music. (When mixing I want to hear whats going on down there.)

Well, and they should not cost to much.

I have listened to the KRK V8, and liked them very much, but it on them limit of what I can afford. Anyone had any experience with the Alesis M1 active ?

 

Do you have any sugestions regarding this topic ?

Thank you,...

 

 

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Eric,

i don't particularly like the sound of the Mackies if you ask me, but my general advice is to avoid anything smaller than 8' for a woofer. Other than that, listen to as many brands as you can, and *bring some well-know CD with you*.

 

marino

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Originally posted by marino:

Other than that, listen to as many brands as you can, and *bring some well-know CD with you*.

 

Couldn't agree more. I've seen people buy monitors based on the demo the salesperson gave them, only to take them home and find out they had to much low end, or not enough volume, etc. Listen to them straight from cd player to monitors, if possible. No eq'ing or enhancement. And get them from a place with a return policy! You might love them in the store, but not in your studio.

Bill Murphy

www.murphonics.com

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If you buy something for the home studio that has too much bass, you will have to compensate when it comes time to mix. A good solution is to buy some well-balanced monitors that have the right amount of bass and then add a subwoofer when you can afford one.

 

I practice keyboards and bass guitar with a 350 watt PA and a Peavey SP-3 cabinet. That's the ONLY way to hear a Moog bass and the bottom from a digital piano. I don't turn it up loud though. I use Event PS-6 monitors to record with.

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One thing you will get from the Mackie 824s that no one else comes close to matching is the accuracy. These monitors are extremely flat. Almost to a fault. Try this. Take your best mix...you know...the one that your are really satisfied with and listen to it through the 824s. Guaranteed you will hear things in the Mackies that you won't hear through Events, Gens, or anything else.

 

The real acid test is to take a CD and listen to it through the Mackies. I guarantee you will hear things you did not here before. And if you have a CD in your possession that you know what kind of speakers they were mixed on you can make good quality judgement.

 

Keep in mind these are nearfields. And also bear in mind you will always without fail be required to do some acoustical treatment to your studio to accomodate whatever brand and model of speaker you purchase.

 

Any set of speakers are going to sound different in the showroom as opposed to your studio. Taking a CD to the showroom and listening to a variety of speakers is only part of the equation. Check the specs, research what others have to say about them, and most of all buy what satisfies your needs.

 

If your monitors are cheap --- so goes your mix!

 

MiDi MiKe

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If you're at Messe this year, go see the ADAM monitors in (most likely Hall 6). DB and I have pairs of these monitors and we love them. Conventional drivers cannot produce this level of detail, clarity, transient response and low distortion. Expensive yes, but note that the Deutschmark is about 2.12 per US Dollar. http://www.adam-audio.de/english/prices.html Pull down the menu on the left and click for information on each speaker. (Neither DB nor I are affiliated with ADAM.. I just love their gear!)
Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT
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Originally posted by peake@pacificnet.net:

If you're at Messe this year, go see the ADAM monitors in (most likely Hall 6). DB and I have pairs of these monitors and we love them. Conventional drivers cannot produce this level of detail, clarity, transient response and low distortion. Expensive yes, but note that the Deutschmark is about 2.12 per US Dollar. http://www.adam-audio.de/english/prices.html Pull down the menu on the left and click for information on each speaker. (Neither DB nor I are affiliated with ADAM.. I just love their gear!)

 

Dr. Peake is correct - I adore these speakers, and have never heard their equal. They are pricey, but definitely worth it.

 

While I was waiting for my ADAMs to be delivered, Mr. Baldini lent me a pair of his Mackie 824s to mix on. I did not find them to be what I was looking for at all, and I had to redo both mixes that I did on them, particularly because I found that they did not translate to other speakers well at all.

 

Also, MiKe, unless I am really missing something, the 824 is not a front ported speaker - they have what I believe is called a bass reflex port under the control panel in the back of the speaker. The Genelec speakers that they are modeled after (1031) are the ones with the front port...and IMO, are much flatter than the 824.

 

Your mileage may vary...

 

dB

:snax:

 

:keys:==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <==:rawk:

 

Professional Affiliations: Royer LabsMusic Player Network

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The Whackies have a passive 10" (or so) radiator at the back, tuned to a specific frequency.

 

And they're not flat, nor accurate. They're average monitors at the best. Like the smaller Genelecs.. The bigger ones are even worse. Refined PA speakers are what they are.

 

The only way to achive a correct bottom end, and impulse reponse (Q=0,707) is with a closed design. Don't see many of those around..

 

The more bottom end you can get from a small monitor, the worse the impulse response will be. It'll sound mighty impressive, but it will NOT translate very well to other systems.

 

I like Tannoys (pretty much every model), due to their coaxial design. But they're not flat, neutral or anything. Like every other loudspeaker out there.

 

Their 'System Series', is worth looking at. They go from 6" to 12".

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Dr. Peake is correct - I adore these speakers, and have never heard their equal. They are pricey, but definitely worth it.

 

While I was waiting for my ADAMs to be delivered, Mr. Baldini lent me a pair of his Mackie 824s to mix on. I did not find them to be what I was looking for at all, and I had to redo both mixes that I did on them, particularly because I found that they did not translate to other speakers well at all.

 

Also, MiKe, unless I am really missing something, the 824 is not a front ported speaker - they have what I believe is called a bass reflex port under the control panel in the back of the speaker. The Genelec speakers that they are modeled after (1031) are the ones with the front port...and IMO, are much flatter than the 824.

 

Your mileage may vary...

 

 

dB

 

 

I STAND CORRECTED, David...Thank you!!!

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

This message has been edited by MiDi MiKe on 03-05-2001 at 04:51 PM

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I don't doubt that if you spend considerably more money you'll get a better speaker than the HR824s, nevertheless I think they are good speakers in their price range.

 

Mix magazine tested the HR824 speakers and complimented the speakers on their flat response and ability to handle bass. I bought them for that reason. After adjusting the EQ switches on the back of the speakers to suit my room, I've been making mixes that are much more portable than my mixes on NS10s. (please save the flames against the NS10s) I get unsolicited compliments on the quality of my mixes even though I have a modest project studio. They could still be better, no doubt.

 

If the back EQ switches aren't adjusted for flat response you won't get a flat response. Since the speakers interact with the room, and much instruction is given on placing your speakers and adjusting the EQ to compensate for their placement, they may seem to not give as flat a response as some other speakers might, if the Mackies are not adjusted properly. I suspect that just as a microphone fits some voices better than others, some speakers might be better suited to some rooms than others.

 

The best result I've had with the Mackies is in getting a bass sound and balance that is not overpowering on home speakers. I have a Tannoy subwoofer that I bought to help reveal the low end of my mixes. They don't work for me. The Tannoy gives a more visceral feel for the bass, but they haven't helped me at all in shaping the bass sound and making mixes that are portable. Mostly I use the Tannoy to provide a hyped up bass during playback in the studio for someone who likes that sound.

 

I'm pleased with the result I get with the HR824s and when I have substantially more money to invest in better monitors I'll move on.

 

Do I hear things that I don't hear on my NS10s with the Mackies? Absolutely! People have brought in their commercial CDs of recordings that they've enjoyed at home and have remarked that they've heard things on the Mackie's that they haven't heard on their home audiophile speakers.

 

I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better pair of monitors for the same money as the Mackie HR824s.

 

Joe

 

This message has been edited by jtegan@tiac.net on 03-05-2001 at 09:04 PM

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please save the flames against the NS10s

 

Poor NS10s...talk about the most misunderstood monitor on the planet.

 

They're not meant to be flat...they're meant to be a representation of the average pair of bookshelf speakers...sort of a bigger version of the way producers use Auratone cubes to hear what their mixes will sound like on speakers the size of the average car radio.

 

According to song and story sung by wandering minstrels, some big producer in the '80s (I usually hear Nile Rodgers associated with this tale) walked into a stereo store and asked what the college kids were buying, because he wanted to mix on them. He commented on how much he liked mixing on them, and the rest is history.

 

It's not a bad idea at all to use them - just keep them in perspective.

 

Besides that...mix on whatever your ear likes - there is no right or wrong...

 

dB

:snax:

 

:keys:==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <==:rawk:

 

Professional Affiliations: Royer LabsMusic Player Network

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I don't understand... I'm putting my monitors flat both on their backs and on the face and there's no way they sound better than with the speakers facing me! Do you mean one on it's face and one on it's back?

 

You know I'm joking, right? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

Bill Murphy

www.murphonics.com

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>I don't understand... I'm putting my monitors flat both on their backs and >on the face and there's no way they sound better than with the speakers

>facing me! Do you mean one on it's face and one on it's back?

 

Obviously this is the consequence of methodically prepared room surfaces, designed to give your room optimum listening conditions no matter where you sit. Good work!

 

Joe

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You mentioned you weren't happy with the bass response of the smaller speakers, have you tried using a separate subwoofer? I use the Tannoy Reveal passives with Tannoy's subwoofer, which I picked up on sale for $299. I'm not a bass player but it woofs nicely with my Nord Lead!

 

Additional note, according to Sweetwater's newsletter last week the Yamaha NS10s are going out of production, they mentioned something about non-availability of the wood pulp used in the woofers. Is the Nasal tree on the endangered species list?

Botch

"Eccentric language often is symptomatic of peculiar thinking" - George Will

www.puddlestone.net

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I was thinking about the Mackie 824's or the Event 20/20bas monitors for just general playing on a Yamaha S80. I don't see professional mixing in my future but would like to get realistic sound. This is just for home use only. I must confess I have not heard either one, just a pair of Roland DS-90A monitors. So if one is not doing any critical mixing, would the Mackie or Event be a good choice? Or does one need to go the PA route to get that low end. I do have a sub woofer on my stereo but did not want to be tied to it.

 

This message has been edited by MikeG on 03-09-2001 at 12:39 PM

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I'm actually using a pair of KRK M6000's. I bought them because the stereo imaging is unlike any other monitor I've used. When I listened to them the first time, I was able to hear things in my favorite CDs that I'd never heard before. I suspect the spectacular imaging is from its inverted dome tweeter. Its interesting that their popular V8's don't use this tweeter, and I sure can hear the difference...though I'd like to have that extra low end.

 

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Mike Martin

Kurzrep@aol.com

Kurzweil Music Systems

www.kurzweilconnection.com

-Mike Martin

 

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The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for.

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botch,

 

I used the subwoofer with the NS 10s hoping that it would reveal the bass better. It made the bass stronger but really added nothing in exposing how the bass sounded. I was no better off using the NS10s with the subwoofer than without it, IMO.

 

Joe

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Has anyone heard the Truth audio TA-1P? I've read from several seemingly reliable sources that they are contenders. I like the format. You can find info at http://www.truthaudio.com/specs.html

 

If anyone's heard them up close and personal, I'd like to hear impressions, because I'm looking for near/mid-fields, too. These are not powered, though.

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