PC DAW's...

[Philip OKeefe]

Okay, since Sonar has been out for a while now, and some other new products / upgrades have either been announced or are shipping, I thought this might be a good time to bring this up again.

 

What are you currently using for your PC DAW software?

 

Are you happy with it?

 

How well does it perform? Any annoying bugs?

 

Is there anything that's new or announced that might make you consider "switching"?

 

 

I don't want to leave our Mac users out of the fun, so if you use a Mac, feel free to tell us about what works for you. And so this doesn't turn into a Mac vs. PC war zone, I'll ask very politely that everyone please respect each other's opinions and right to use whatever in the heck POC they want to! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif (POC being defined by the individual reader...)

 

I'm using Vegas Audio 2.0 and Logic Platinum 4.7 (WIN)

 

Yes, I'm pretty happy with it.

 

Logic crashes a bit more than I'd like, and Vegas has a tendency to drop out of MTC sync ready mode if it's been sitting there for a while, but otherwise both are fairly trouble free.

 

I might have to consider getting a Mac and PT just to have it available for those who will not consider using anything else, and I did D/L the 30 day trial of Sonar last night (but have not had much time to try it yet), but otherwise, I'll probably stick with what i have. I am looking forward to getting my hands on Logic 5.0, and hopefully Sonic Foundry will do a new version of Vegas RSN. Seems like they've already done Acid and Sound Forge, so it should be Vegas getting upgraded next, right?

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[Alndln]

No crashes here,only in the beggining.Been using Cake 9 for 3 years,then upgraded to Sonar which is still to work out all the quirks so I run both.I have 2 machines,1 Athlon based,and 1 K6-3+ mobile(600mhz)workhorse machine which I couldn't crash if I threw it off a building.On that machine I have Sonar/Cakewalk/Wavelab/Gigasampler/Acid/Fruity Loops which are all on the task bar all at once.I have yet to find a software environment that offers offers this flexibility and power(Iv'e tried everything,both platforms),and I have Giga running on a seperate Card to avoid buffer setting conflicts.In Fruity Loops I can trigger drum samples/drum machines/and keyboard drums(Korg x-3)all in one massive drum layout,and copy and paste the midipattern in a grid much like Acid,then paste the results right in Sonar or Cake.Then I can Choose between my hardware or Giga or VSTi for everything else,then my Guitar(analog).On my Athlon machine I run the superb Nuendo and nothing else,for either a new project,film based work or mastering.I mainly use this program for it's superb internal audio engine.These are the reasons I use Windows(98se),because of this software precicely.

[Guest]

Originally posted by pokeefe777@msn.com:

Okay, since Sonar has been out for a while now, and some other new products / upgrades have either been announced or are shipping, I thought this might be a good time to bring this up again.

 

What are you currently using for your PC DAW software?

 

Are you happy with it?

 

How well does it perform? Any annoying bugs?

 

Is there anything that's new or announced that might make you consider "switching"?

 

 

I don't want to leave our Mac users out of the fun, so if you use a Mac, feel free to tell us about what works for you. And so this doesn't turn into a Mac vs. PC war zone, I'll ask very politely that everyone please respect each other's opinions and right to use whatever in the heck POC they want to! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif (POC being defined by the individual reader...)

 

I'm using Vegas Audio 2.0 and Logic Platinum 4.7 (WIN)

 

Yes, I'm pretty happy with it.

 

Logic crashes a bit more than I'd like, and Vegas has a tendency to drop out of MTC sync ready mode if it's been sitting there for a while, but otherwise both are fairly trouble free.

 

I might have to consider getting a Mac and PT just to have it available for those who will not consider using anything else, and I did D/L the 30 day trial of Sonar last night (but have not had much time to try it yet), but otherwise, I'll probably stick with what i have. I am looking forward to getting my hands on Logic 5.0, and hopefully Sonic Foundry will do a new version of Vegas RSN. Seems like they've already done Acid and Sound Forge, so it should be Vegas getting upgraded next, right?

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

 

 

Phil -

We have used Cooledit, CWPA and ACID for tracking. Mostly Cakewalk.

Cakewalk drives me crazy by:

-not allowing cut/copy/paste operations on midi controller data

-not allowing you to adjust the start time of an audio clip from the track menu

-extensive use of context sensitive (modal) tools - one example out of hundreds: you can't change metronome settings while in playback. The whole interface philosophy needs to be rethought. Maybe SONAR holds promise for improvements?

 

We use Cooledit, Wavelab and Soundforge for tweaking tracks (destructive edits) and for mastering final stereo tracks. Mostly Cooledit.

Cooledit drives (drove) me crazy when I tried to use it for multitrack work - it's just not ready for primetime.

- It won't let you apply non-destructive (realtime) plugins.

- It won't let you hear how changes to one track will sound in the mix before doing the destructive change.

- It has no mixer console, only volume and pan controls for each track.

- Its built-in processing (FX, verbs, EQ, etc) are S-L-O-W, though to my ears the fidelity is superior to that of Soundforge. And the noise reduction blows Sonic Foundrys out of the water - - it's much much better.

So we use it for what it's really good at - stereo wav editing - and forgot about trying to do multitracking with it.

 

I've tried Cubase, and found the 600+ page manual to be pretty daunting - I just want to record music, not memorize strange interface rules... I don't want to put YATY (yet another two years) into learning it.

 

Haven't tried Emagic yet, though I suspect it may have similar complexity issues.

 

I know I sound awfully picky; maybe I am. I have written operator interfaces for some pretty complex software (avionics equipment automated testing), and nothing I've seen yet comes close to my standards for ease of use and of learning. On the other hand, I've seen and used engineering software that is far worse than any music/audio software out there. So I guess it's all relative.

 

Given the speed of evolution of software and audio technology, it doesn't make economic sense to come up with a standardized ergonomic human interface unless you will be able to re-use it in a dozen generations of your product - - I believe this is a big reason ProTools is so successful.

And I believe if a company commits to this path, they need to look at cash flow for at least 5 years to make sure they can pull it off without sinking.

 

However, I continue looking for the magic 'killer application' for audio that will make it simple enough to use that I don't have to spend 200 of more hours learning to operate it.

 

Peace.

- Philbo

www.mp3.com/tangent

[Hippie]

I'm using Cakewalk 9.03, with a PC/Win98se, using a MOTU 2408, serving as an I/O to 2 ADATS. This is the far and above the MOST stable combination of hardware/software I've hooked up yet.

I've never had much success being the 1st on my block with whatever new software/hardware comes out. I usually wait 'til the reviews hit before I go jumping into the next big thing...that will be obsolete in 3 months!

 

It would take one heck of a product to get me to switch off of Cakewalk, because I've been using it since the beginning of time, when using a mouse was optional; I've learned to get around Cakewalk using mostly keystrokes, and they've never dropped the original keyboard commands throughout the revisions, and I can just FLY on it. I'm far too lazy to relearn all that crap again!

 

Sonar is looking good and I probably will get the upgrade, but I really hate to change my "working" rig onto Win2000 to take advantage of the WMA driver benefits; ..and thus start my term in "computer hell" again.

 

so many choices, so freaking lazy!

 

-Hippie

[KenElevenShadows]

I'm using SAW+ on an old PC that I still have. I've always been really happy with SAW+, but one should bear in mind that this is a 1994 program, and doesn't support plug-ins. I found SAW+ to be very stable. Lately, I have been having problems with my AdB Multi!Wav Digital I/O soundcard, which has been putting glitches in the audio during transfers between the DAT and the computer and occasionally letting loose with huge sheets of white noise. Not fun.

 

I just bought a G4, and haven't used Digi001/Pro Tools LE a whole lot yet, so my opinion is still out on this. The program is infinitely more powerful than SAW+, but right now, I am still staring up at the Huge Learning Curve of both switching to a Mac and learning Pro Tools. It'll take a while. I thought that the SAW+ interface looked slightly cluttered, but that's nothing compared with Pro Tools (and yes, I realize that you can customize the interface somewhat). I wish that Digi001/Pro Tools LE came with a more colorful interface, but according to the rep, this is supposed to be easier on the eyes. To make Pro Tools run properly on a G4, one appears to need much more than 128 MG of RAM. I now have 640. Sheeesh!

 

One thing that I really miss on my PC is this Cirque TouchPad, which really saved me from MouseWrist. I know of no such replacement on the Mac, and I've been looking. Other than that, i have been thoroughly enjoying getting into the G4, and really enjoy the extra speed when compared to my old creaky PC.

 

 

 

------------------

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/nectar

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

music*travel photos*tibet*lots of stuff

"Sangsara" "Irian Jaya" & d i t h er CDs available!

http://www.elevenshadows.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Philip OKeefe]

Thanks for all the informative replies! Anyone else?

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[clintbennettyahoo.com]

I use SAW Studio on a dual 1ghz/pIII and it absolutely screams (the app is threaded for multi-processor use). Stability for days. Instant screen redraws. Loads of plugins (VST/DX/SAW Native). Large track count off IDE drives (without RAID). I use my rig on everything from album recording/mixing projects to film/vid post projects. If my personal studio were set up for surround, SAW could handle that as well. Sound quality is top notch. No complaints here. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

I also use ACID on occasion for additional loop/arrangement stuff. Lately been playing with the Reason demo. fun stuff.

 

clint

[Guest]

Been and still am using Vision VDSP 4.5.1. I have Logic 4.6, and I've read the first section after six months. I use Pro Tools LE 5.0. I've been waiting for them to send me the upgrade for months now.

 

I'm on a Beige Mac with a Newtertech 500 mgh upgrade. I split my audio between an AMIII card and a MPX-500. I have a RME digi96 card that would do me fine with Logic, if I ever learn Logic. I use the MPX-500 for voices with MIDI control, but I'm not really happy with the quality. I spoke to someone at Guitar Center and asked about the Lexicon PCM 90 or PCM 91. He told me I'd probably be happy with the sound of the Lexicon M-1. I use MCDSP for EQ for masteringin Pro Tools which I think is excellent. I use the Waves Ultramaximizer one for limiting. I bought the MCDSP M-2000 which I've used once for chillig out some vocal tracks and results were excellent. I haven't had enough time to really check it out.

 

Running plug-ins naitivle is a drag. I'm wondering if I should buy an external digital mixing board or a Pro Tools TDM system.

 

I really like the Vision Audio and Midi flexibility. I like Pro Tools, but it's MIDI usage is primitive. I understand that Logic is supposed to be cool, but it isn't as intuitively laid out as Pro Tools and Vision. The limit to 24 tracks audio in Pro tools is a pain. I have the most stable set up with Pro Tools LE compared to Vision. With VDSP I get clicks using SP/DIF to the Lexicn MPX-500, but not with Pr Toools LE. With VDSP I need to disable my backside cache t cancel ut the clicks, but that limits the amount of plug-ins I can use. I don't use any reverb plug,inns, just EQ, delay, and compression. Reverb effect are all sent out via Sp?DIF or rerecorded.

 

Joe

[KenElevenShadows]

Warning: Somewhat Off-Topic

 

Just to follow up a little on the post I left this morning...I finally got around to using Pro Tools LE (G4) just a little while ago. It took a little bit to figure out how to get the audio happening through the optical I/O (it was really easy to do it through the Digi001 soundcard's A/D converters, though), but after that, it was pretty easy and glitch-free. I'm still pretty clumsy with it -- I mean, it's my first time using Pro Tools or a Mac! -- but it was fairly intuitive once I got past that sorta busy interface. I was able to record the audio, highlight regions, compress the audio, save the playlist (I think it's called), and then transfer the aiff files to a CD-R without dipping into the manual very much. The only reading of the manual I had to do was to initially get the audio into Pro Tools. Not bad...

 

This was the first audio project i did on my new G4. I did a very short little bit of music for the upcoming "George Washington" documentary DVD, about the making of the independent film "George Washington".

 

------------------

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/nectar

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

music*travel photos*tibet*lots of stuff

"Sangsara" "Irian Jaya" & d i t h er CDs available!

http://www.elevenshadows.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[AudioMaverick]

I'm still an ameture hobyist at multi-tracking. But, CoolEditPro is working for me. I've been using it since it came out. Loading the patches and bringing it up to v1.2a really helps.

 

When I multi-track, I use it to capture live performaces, mostly. Since it is all I have used, I have developed a sense and practice that none of the processes are realtime. I go back and work on the tracks, later.

 

I am in the process of putting up a web site. It is very basic, but information is there. Feel free to check it and tear it apart. What a better way to get something right... www.audiomaverick.com

 

This message has been edited by AudioMaverick on 05-21-2001 at 12:31 AM

[fantasticsound]

HP Pavillion with a 600MHz Celeron. Boy I wish I had a Pentium!

 

Tracking with N-track studio. Fantastic program, and if you check out the FASoft website, you won't believe what this program does at the price. The FA in FASoft is the programmer. He just keeps rewriting and has NOT CHARGED FOR AN UPDATE YET. Check it out.

 

Stereo editing in SoundForge 4.5

 

Neil

[DC]

I've switched from ADAT with sympte locking an Atari 1040ST for midi to Cake 9.03 this past year. My machine is a 900 MHz Cele with DAL Card Deluxe and ADAT/EDIT cards. The more I learn the happier I am with this set up. Adding a 30 gig DiamondMax dedicated to just audio gives me plenty of room to have way more than an album length project in progress going with room to spare. The mouse mixing is a bit odd to get used to, but I'm way more of a musician than an engineer, so my mixing usually consisted of marking a piece of masking tape for where the guitar fit in the mix and then needed to be raised up for the solo. The Cake snapshots take care of this beautifully.

 

I still have occational glitches. Last Friday I spent hours on a sax part and it just dissappeared. I still don't know where it went. At least by that time I'd played the part long enough to re-do it rather swiftly the next day. Knowing me, it was prolly user error, but still unnerving.

 

Overall this set up has been very stable tho. My music computer has no internet and (don't tell anyone) only one game on it. I've got a Yammy CD burner on a SCSI buss and a Midiman BiPort on a Serial buss but not even a printer so life's been pretty good, just occational weirdities.

[ADWilson]

Originally posted by clintbennett@yahoo.com:

I use SAW Studio on a dual 1ghz/pIII and it absolutely screams (the app is threaded for multi-processor use). Stability for days. Instant screen redraws. Loads of plugins (VST/DX/SAW Native). Large track count off IDE drives (without RAID). I use my rig on everything from album recording/mixing projects to film/vid post projects. If my personal studio were set up for surround, SAW could handle that as well. Sound quality is top notch. No complaints here. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

clint

 

DITTO !!!! SAW Studio is incredible!

 

Angie

[ADWilson]

Originally posted by Ken/Eleven Shadows:

I'm using SAW+ on an old PC that I still have. I've always been really happy with SAW+, but one should bear in mind that this is a 1994 program, and doesn't support plug-ins. I found SAW+ to be very stable.

 

Ken,

 

The IQS upgrade path is so great, I can't understand why you wouldn't have upgraded. They've made it even sweeter for you. You can now upgrade to SAWPlus32 for $100 and SAWPro for $300 and all the native plugs are included.

 

Angie Dickinson Wilson

Avocado Productions

[KenElevenShadows]

The upgrade thing is a really great idea. I probably would have one now, but honestly, I was so happy with SAW+ that it honestly met my needs adequately. Now, that's really saying something with 1994 technology!

 

To explain, I prefer to do my multi-tracking on the Akai MG1214 (analog 12-track). I feel really comfortable with it. It's just a comfort thing, I suppose. I'd do primarily editing on SAW+, add a few little things here and there, and then call it good. Honestly, I was thrilled with the thing. Intuitive, easy to use, stable, nice to look at -- heck, it was about the only thing that worked consistently on my PC after a while besides the printer.

 

I now got a G4. It's a new thing. Obviously, IQS makes stuff only for PCs, which is a shame, but I'm going to get to know Pro Tools. It seems like another really good, powerful tool, and I wanted to try a Mac for a change and see how it went. So far, so good.

 

Part of it -- and I don't want to get in a pissing match over platforms -- is because I am really soured on Win95 "A". I had more ridiculous problems than you could possibly ever imagine. If someone had written my computer problems into a script, it would have been stopped -- "Sorry, that's far too unrealistic -- all this stuff could never happen to one person within the span of a year."

 

Now, I realize that Win98, 2000, whatever are far more stable, but I just got burnt on it. Just really sick and tired of it. I was tired of things screwing up, tired of constant crashing, tired of constant fixes from people and web sites and technicians that never worked properly, and tired of peripherals that junked themselves after a year (scanners, Ditto drives, etc.). I had always wanted a Mac, and inherited this computer because of a really long ugly story which I won't go into, so I just used what I had.

 

Bless PCs -- you know, maybe in a different world, I woulda gotten a new shiny, beefy PC, upgraded to SAW Pro or whatever, and be perfectly happy with it, but it was just time to start off on a clean slate, even though it means getting to know an entirely new way of thinking and operating system. I dunno.

 

Sorry this is so long...I never really thought of why I wanted a Mac instead of another PC until I started writing this. Gee. Therapy in a public forum.

 

Anyway, the G4 is cool so far. Fast. Shiny. New. Friendly. So far, fairly intuitive. I don't think I made a bad choice. And for those people who have good experiences with PCs -- and I know that there are many of you -- give IQS stuff a try. They have their own newsgroup, believe it or not, and they make really great stuff. I love SAW+ and miss it. The new SAW stuff looks amazing. Has plug-ins up the whazooo, and that same intuitive architecture and cool looks. It has a certain je ne se quoi (rebelliousness or attitude perhaps?) that I don't quite get from Pro Tools. Yet.

 

 

 

 

------------------

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/nectar

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

music*travel photos*tibet*lots of stuff

"Sangsara" "Irian Jaya" & d i t h er CDs available!

http://www.elevenshadows.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Philip OKeefe]

I'm also a SAW owner, and it's good software... certainly fast software, and fairly crash resistant. I wish they had a MIDI + DA version.

 

I am thinking about adding a Mac to my PC setup, and am always interested in new software and whatever is going to work efficiently and reliably. Even though I am a longtime Logic user, I'd consider adding other software if it will make my life more productive.

 

I am still hoping Digidesign will come up with a native version of Pro Tools, but I'm not holding my breath or anything... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

 

Thanks for all the opinions and posts - anyone else?

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

pokeefe777@msn.com

[Dylan]

Originally posted by pokeefe777@msn.com:

I am still hoping Digidesign will come up with a native version of Pro Tools, but I'm not holding my breath or anything... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

Hi Phil,

 

I dunno, personally I wouldn't imagine that they would ever do this since they are also in the market to sell hardware. If you want a good native app that works like ProTools, then look at Vegas. Personally, I work much more efficiently in Vegas than I do in ProTools. The best thing that ProTools has going for it is TDM support, so without this I really don't see any reason to use it. I've also heard good things about SAW and Samplitude Studio being very solid products, but the interfaces in these apps always leave me running for the door. If I could get past this then I'm sure that I could be productive with either app.

 

-Dylan

[gchildpblutah.com]

You might want to look up the Adesso Tru Form USB keyboard with built in Cirque Touch Pad. I've used a touchpad at home for years and have never missed using a mouse.

 

"One thing that I really miss on my PC is this Cirque TouchPad, which really saved me from MouseWrist. I know of no such replacement on the Mac, and I've been looking. Other than that, i have been thoroughly enjoying getting into the G4, and really enjoy the extra speed when compared to my old creaky PC."

 

[/b]

[rebonn]

Basicly, I have a Lexicon Core 32 with Samplitude, WaveLab, Waves NPPII, and Dynasone which pretty much covers all the bases.

Simple, rock solid, and sounds killer.

[KenElevenShadows]

>> I've also heard good things about SAW and Samplitude Studio being very solid products, but the interfaces in these apps always leave me running for the door. If I could get past this then I'm sure that I could be productive with either app.

>>

 

That's what is always interesting about a lot of these programs. A number of people made a comment about how they found SAW+ to NOT be intuitive to them. Many of these people noted that many of the keystrokes on SAW+ do not correspond to "convention". Since I *suck* on a computer, this was not an issue. For whatever reason, I took to SAW+ like a fish to water. It seemed intuitive to me.

 

This is not so with Pro Tools so far. I've gotten around on some of it -- the plug-ins are really easy for me to use, for instance -- but the editing so far is a bit of a head-scratcher. I feel like I'm either not using it properly, or it is more difficult, or sumpin'...not sure yet. I'm just having problems editing properly. But Pro Tools is much more complicated and involved than SAW+ (not the other SAW products, necessarily, but SAW+).

 

If anyone knows of a forum, support group, etc. for Pro Tools LE for a Mac G4, please lemme know! Thanks! That way I can ask all my dopey questions on a forum geared towards that kind of thing.

 

------------------

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/nectar

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

music*travel photos*tibet*lots of stuff

"Sangsara" "Irian Jaya" & d i t h er CDs available!

http://www.elevenshadows.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Philip OKeefe]

Dylan:

 

I already use Vegas Audio 2.0 and I actually like it quite a bit. I wish it had MIDI capabilities though. (not just MIDI sync). I also own a older version of SAW (it was actually the very first DAW program I owned, although I'd used others at various studios) and I find it fairly easy to use and understand. I also run Logic Platinum, which is definitely NOT easy for most newbies, but since I have had it since day one, I'm pretty fluent with it.

 

Ken:

 

I'd suggest checking out the Digidesign site for more assistance. They have users forums for their products over there. I'm actually considering adding PT to our studio since so many people want / request it. It's about as common nowdays as ADATs were back in the mid-90's.

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

pokeefe777@msn.com

[KenElevenShadows]

Phil, thanks! I found it. It seems pretty useful so far. I cannot bookmark the specific site on my browser since no matter where one navigates on the site, it still says: http://www.digidesign.com

 

Thanks for the tip, though. And I agree, it seems like everyone has Pro Tools. I could have gotten just about any software, but I thought that this one might be compatible with other people's systems and maybe enable me to get a bit of editing work somewhere down the line.

 

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/Nectar

[-]

I use Cubase 3.7 for the PC -- it's an older version of Cubase, but I bought it because I had read about problems users were having with the newer version (version 5). However, from what I've read, the newer version seems to have most of the bugs ironed out now. v3.7 is pretty darn stable program on my system.

 

As far as audio tracking and editing goes, Cubase is definitely on the quirky side -- you need to make *a lot* of mistakes before you know what *not* to do. I wish that it operated a bit more simply, like a regular tape deck, but I'm now used to the way it works.

 

Its MIDI capabilities are excellent. I used to use MIDI stuff a lot in my productions several years ago, but lately I'm shying away from it. I would venture to say the MIDI editing available with Cubase is a very strong reason to use this program.

 

Audio editing is, well, um... it works. It definitely feels like a tacked-on feature (which it was). Also, the lack of a multi level undo may turn some users off.

 

However, the best part of Cubase is the mixing and internal signal routing possibilities... It's *extremely* flexible. I can do pretty much anything with the internal mixer that I used to do with a real console and patchbay. I didn't see comprable signal routing capabilities with Cakewalk when I had evaluated it.

 

Although I really liked what I saw with Cakewalk, I also couldn't believe anyone would be able to mix on it without individual playback meters for each channel. (I understand Sonar has this feature, though...?) It's such an obvious feature, but I can't tell you how many times it's come in handy. It's very good for quickly solving a "what track did that noise come from?" problem.

 

So all in all, I'm pretty content with Cubase for my home studio needs. I may eventually end up going with another program (with multiple level undo, a more tape-like interface, and better audio editing features) -- *if* it has the signal routing and mixing capabilities of Cubase... But Cubase does what I need it to do now, and it does it pretty darn well.

[miroslav]

Have also been a SAW-SAW Classic-SAW Plus user from back in 1994.

 

Just purchased a Dual 933 Pentium III with a Gig of RAM and I am looking to upgrade my software as well. The upgrade path to SAWPro is a no-brainer($300), but I am looking at the SAW Studio Lite...hmmmmmm. The full-blown Studio is a bit too much $$$, especially after my PC upgrade.

 

Can't think of anything else I would want to waste my time with...checked out Nuendo...but I think not, and then the PT stuff...well let's not go there.

 

All you SAW xxxx users...what converters/cards are you using? I was looking at a Layla24 or maybe a Tango24/Hammerfall combo, but now I'm thinking of all-Hammerfall hardware...but again, $$$ for the ADI-8 Pro and a 96/8 card. They have that new Multiface box coming out soon, but no prices yet.

[Alndln]

Miroslav,the 96/8 goes for a little over $300.00 and is expandable.Personally I wouldn't write Nuendo off so fast as I personally think it outclasses anything on either platform,especially when you hear it and use it.

[demtation]

At work we primarily use Cakewalk 9.03 for archiving two ADATs (dumping digitally via MOTU 2408) We'll mix to Soundforge 4.5, and occasionally use Acid Music and Cooledit Pro (for Radio ID tags and Noise Reduction). I was very enthusiastic about Vegas Pro (1.0) when it came out, but proved FAR too buggy and crash prone. Probably just some configuration it doesn't agree with, but after dozens of hours of working with it, I just decided to stick with what worked... I would be interested in seeing Vegas Audio 2.0

 

At home, I just put together a PIII 1ghz and purchased Sonar and SoundForge 5. Everything seems to be functioning and I am soooo pumped to start working on stuff and exploring Sonar, but frankly after doing it at work for 12 hours, sometimes I just don't feel like recording when I get home. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

Demtation

[KenElevenShadows]

With SAW+, I am using AdB Multi!Wav Digital. I was using Turtle Beach Monterey, but the thing died a slow, ugly death.

 

Ken/Eleven Shadows/d i t h er/Nectar

[miroslav]

Originally posted by Alndln@hotmail.com:

Originally posted by Alndln@hotmail.com:

Miroslav, the 96/8 goes for a little over $300.00 and is expandable. Personally I wouldn't write Nuendo off so fast as I personally think it outclasses anything on either platform, especially when you hear it and use it.

 

Are you actually using it(Nuendo)?

 

I have been a Stienberg (Cubase/Atari) user since the late 80's...still love that program, and still run it on an Atari...until it dies...which may not happen for a very long time.

 

So that is why I have looked at Nuendo with some interest, but I've heard that there are bugs/issues, and some of the brochure promises...are just that. Can't seem to find many folks that are really using it without some problems. I think the interface LOOKS fabulous, but...do I want to take a chance for $1K or would I be better off going for the SAW Studio Lite???

 

The earlier SAW programs are fast and solid, and I am very comfortable using them...so do I really want to learn a new DAW and at what cost? Those are my considerations.

 

That is why I still use the Cubase/ATARI sequencer combo...rock solid MIDI, gets me where/what I want...no, I don't need a gazillion MIDI tracks...who really does. Same thing with DAWs...128+ tracks...I don't want to get that anal about any piece of music...unless I REALLY have something to put down on each and every one of those tracks.

 

But go ahead...please give me some reasons why I SHOULD consider Nuendo...I still haven't made a final decision.

 

OhI know the Hammerfall 96/8 goes for a little over $300, but I also want/need an 8 channel analog input/converter box like the Hammerfall ADI-8 which is going for about $1300that, plus the DAW softwarePLUS my new computerOUCH!!!$$$

 

 

 

 

This message has been edited by miroslav on 05-24-2001 at 09:04 AM

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Originally posted by miroslav:

But go ahead...please give me some reasons why I SHOULD consider Nuendo...I still haven't made a final decision.

 

 

I don't have an opinion on Nuendo (never tried it, never gonna buy it anyway), but you may want to check out the forums at http://www.nuendo.com ...

 

If you go to "Support" and then "Public Forums" you'll probably read some helpful opinions from those in the trenches...

[Alndln]

Ever since 5.01 it's been solid,much more than Cubase.Also the addition of VSTi has been more than welcome.My brother started using this prog a couple months ago and after hearing his projects(same hardware)I'm convinced the audio engine(bottom line) is superior than P.T. or anything that I've personnaly heard so far,the built in EQ for each track is like having high end hardware.Audio editing just kills everything else,plugins seem to sound better,multiple project windows(32 bit float editing/5.1 surround/audio midi ect.)are like having multiple programs in one.Iv'e breifly tried SAW a long time ago and seem to remember it being more of an Audio multitrack prog than a midi one,although I could be wrong.These day's you can snag it for about $700.00 minus their hardware,although a little stiff for software you do get your moneys worth,a solid investment for the future and now.Yes go to the forums and you'll see some people bitching and moaning about this or that,but ask any one of them what they would use instead.