Rumour: Alesis filed Chapter 11 - can anyone confirm?

[soapbox]

Originally posted by Jeff, TASCAM Guy:

I wouldn't be at all surprised if you folks saw a high-end Robert Morin tube mic pre one day a few years down the line.

 

I understand that Event Electronics distributes microphones. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

(Sorry, but I couldn't resist!)

 

Jeff, thanks for answering my question about Event with such candor. BTW, my Alesis QS8 sounds great through my Event 20/20 bas monitors!

[Moronix]

Originally posted by Jeff, TASCAM Guy:

Robert "tube king" Morin...good to see you around here, and glad to see you're still employed there! You can never have enough guys like Robert around at an audio company...people who are totally passionate about audio, and would eat, sleep, drink and eat sound if that were possible.

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised if you folks saw a high-end Robert Morin tube mic pre one day a few years down the line. Remember, you heard it here first!

- Jeff

 

OOPS! sorry on that last post forgot to write something

 

Jeff, your making me blush! I'm working on a compressor now to keep the promise I made to Doug G.

 

As for some professional release of my designs - Who Knows!

 

Robert Morin

[Laurie Z.]

Originally posted by valkyriesound:

Jeff is the best!!!! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

As for Alesis, I think they've made a significant,

positive contribution to our industry and

I hope they can get back on their feet.

 

Chapter 11 is a second chance...not the end.

 

My best wishes to everyone at Alesis! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

Valky

www.vsoundinc.com

 

Amen, sister! Alesis has always had some of the most talented, coolest people in the industry that I've ever had the pleasure to know and work with, both past and present. That includes Jeff that Tascam Guy, Robert, the Andromeda group including steadyb, our own Mr. Bryce, and heck, the rest of the crew.

 

I'm sure that those who are there working hard to keep it going appreciate all of your support and positive thoughts. Thanks to Craig too for this forum to keep folks informed...

 

Laurie Z.

[swpdndbcity.net]

Jeff glad to see you are doing well at Tascam. I agree with your opinion and history account of Alesis. I worked there until early '95. I was in charge of production for what was then called building 4. At that time it appeared to me that the company was dealing with issues that needed to be resolved. Some time after my departure I learned that Russell had left to form Event. I've always believed that Keith was the imagination behind the products but that Russell was the organization that made the whole machine work. The Marketing and Sales Departments were equally as important as the R&D/Eng departments.

Too bad to hear about their problems. I think people are missing the point concerning Alesis' biggest contribution. Not only did they make equipment affordable to those of us who couldn't buy a Lexicon in those days but because of their releases all the other gear came down too. I remember after the Quadraverb came out, SPX 90s came down. Like the ADAT or not, until it came out digital recording was out of the reach of the common man. It's all part of the current revolution that we all enjoy now. I myself have never been an ADAT fan especially since I was Production Supervisor for them up until V2.0. When I was into digi tape here at my studio I used DA38s but I still take my hat off to Alesis..

I would also like to say hi to Rob Morin. Glad you're doing well. Thanks for the help on the Q2. Good to see there are some origs still in place. P.D.

[fantasticsound]

As a consumer and former MI salesman, I've had quite mixed feelings about Alesis. The products I liked, I absolutely loved! The products and service I disliked, I absolutely hated!

 

The SR-16 and MMT-8 have served me well. How long have I had the SR-16? In the first 6 months of production, Alesis implemented only one set of 10 drum sets as 120 midi note numbers. (Ever since, every set of 10 could be chosen to become midi notes.) This box is so easy to use it still sells a decade later. (I have to admit I'd wished they followed Roland's example of employing effects as a bus instead of offerring samples with prerecorded verb. Small beef, though.)

 

About 12 years ago my co-writer's girlfriend bought him a Microverb II for his birthday. How many pieces of gear, not accessories, would your girlfriend shell out the green for? Your $500 - $1500 guitar? Maybe a mic in the same price range? A /$2000 keyboard, maybe? That reverb was not only cheap (<$150) but it sounded wonderful! Laugh all you want Lee, but nobody could touch Alesis digital reverb back then for 3x the price. By comparison, you could buy the REV-7. Go check with Yamaha for the price on THAT! Lexicon? They were a few years away from the LXP1 & LXP5, and the price was almost 3x the Microverb's. (Which by that time was the full rack Microverb III.) I, for one, was glad they brought back the third rack format for the beginners-with-4-tracks market. Would I rather have an MPX-100, at 2-2 1/2x the price? Sure. But the product is good.

 

Now for the downside. I'm not an engineer or a management type, but when I worked MI in late 1991 to early 1992, we had heard the ADAT's would be released for about 1 1/2 years. That was totally unacceptable. The revoloution was waiting, with baited breath and deep pockets. For at least the first 6 months after they DID hit the market, no one was allowed by Alesis to sell them for less than full pop. They knew what they had, and they weren't going to let GC devalue the thing with discounts. (Back then, there was only GC as a large chain, with some expansion by Sam Ash.) Unfortunately for salespeople, we were left in the dark, as usual. Customers didn't want to buy anything but the hyped ADAT, which was not available. It was a bad time to be a pro-sumer audio salesman, prior to the release. And although I think you're being unfair to the company overall, Lee, I have to agree with you that the ADAT conquering low cost digital audio was a not necessarily a good thing, sonically. You're right, DAW support has made them virtually obsolete.

 

How about the 1622? Most mixers you protect from Coke spills and the like. This mixer you couldn't protect. It was a defect waiting to happen. And before someone pipes up about how they've had a 1622 since the beginning and it runs great, let me tell you you are just about alone. We sent back almost as many 1622's as we received. My buddy went through 3 before he bought a used Fostex mixer to replace it.

 

The HR-16's were fun, unless you actually used the buttons. Then, they too were going to fail, although not nearly as quickly as the 1622. I'd have thought Alesis would have learned by the time they released monitors. We found virtually all of those little plastic corners on the floor at my last MI job. At least they were cosmetic, but in a pro studio, cosmetic can make the difference between $40/hr and $75.

 

In the end though, Alesis has made far more successful audio devices than dogs. The D4 made it possible for anyone with a rudimentary knowledge of Radio Shack doorbell buzzers to make a respectable electronic kit. My aforementioned co-writer sold several of his own design. It took the V-drums to move him off that, and he still uses the D4, DM5, and QSR sound modules. Those product lines they improved over the years.

 

Now Alesis has a fine, diverse line of products. With some outside help, perhaps, they can rebuild their business strategy and continue innovating low cost pro audio gear.

 

I wish all the employees of Alesis future success.

 

Neil

 

(P.S. Kudos to Jeff, TASCAM guy. Very classy response.)

[lrbreez]

Actually Chapter 11 isn't any big deal. Several major corporations have done it. The success of the HD24 could actually pull them out of Chapter 11 early.

Buddy

[Philip OKeefe]

Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com:

The ADAT, despite its flaws, changed recording forever - home AND pro. How many home studios owners would be buying high-end mic preamps and compressors if it hadn't been for the advent of affordable digital audio? You couldn't hear that stuff through the hiss of 1/2" 8-track decks. Who would be mastering tracks at home if we still had to record to analog tape? Fletcher should get down on his knees and kiss the ground in front of the Alesis factory. Because of their ADAT, his market for high end gear grew exponentially.

 

 

This message has been edited by dansouth@yahoo.com on 05-02-2001 at 03:53 AM

 

LOL! I never thought of it that way before as it pertains to Fletcher, but there's a lot of truth in that statement Dan. I'm not so sure that Fletcher would see it that way though. I'm sure he'd rather the ADAT never came along and everyone just bought old Neves, Pultecs and Neumanns from him because they're good and if you wanted good stuff you really had no other choice.

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[Jim Tavegia]

Originally posted by valkyriesound:

Of course revenues don't tell the whole story.

A company not only has to make good products

(with increasingly short life spans)...they

have to make sure they keep making enough sucessful

products to overlap each other so there are no

down turns or gaps in overall sales. That's Alesis's big problem...

they didn't get into computer/DAW recording soon enough.

Now, they're trying to catch up.....

I hope they do....

 

As far as costs/profit numbers... I don't

have those... they're a little harder to find! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

Here are the top 5 companies:

1. Yamaha 822 million Employees: 978

2. Harman Pro (JBL,DBX,CROWN etc.) 476.3 million Employees: 3000

3. Steinway 331.7 million Employees: 3060

4. Fender 281.1 million Employees: 2500

5. Peavey 275 million Employees: 2000

 

Valky

www.vsoundinc.com

 

 

You are so right. Go Midiman/MAudio. These guys have it right because they do their thing (digital) well and did not try to be all things to all people. I use their DIO24/48 with a 24 bit Calf ADC and the 24/96 SuperDAC. The sound is supurb, probably the most MPG of anything out there. Once they get the calfs and cow to 24/96 they will be flying. No Mad Cow Disease at this outfit. Great tech support to.

[Anderton]

>>Very few people ACTUALLY got decent results from ADAT's and those people would've gotten equally good results from a Tascam machine, I'm quite sure. <<

 

Well, I had a Tascam Model 58 prior to switching over to ADAT. It sounded fine, but as I was doing a lot of audio for video at the time, the hiss became a major issue - it didn't get masked by snare drums and guitar amps. The sound of noise reduction bothered me FAR more than the sound of the converters in the ADAT. I still think Dolby SR was FABULOUS, but it was totally unaffordable. So when faced with a choice between noise reduction and converters, converters won out.

 

But where ADAT really saved my butt was the sync capabilities. SMPTE sync with MIDI sequencers was totally painless, and the machine could act as a slave, not just a master! This was a big deal back then.

 

I always had good reliability with my ADATs, but I did several things that were crucial: didn't transport them, NEVER mounted them at an angle, and used only second-hand S-VHS cassettes from a video company. Why? Any oxide that was going to flake off had already done so, meaning no sync loss problems; also my heads lasted FOREVER because the tape had already been "polished" by some big-bucks editing machine . I maintain that the single most important mechanical part of an ADAT was the tape itself, and Alesis made a horrible tactical error by including those Ampex cassettes with the machine...they were BY FAR the most unreliable tapes for ADAT on the planet. What a bonehead move!

 

I have a friend who had three ADATs in his studio, and he was just about to throw them out when I told him the three rules of ADAT tape: Never use Ampex, rewind and fast forward at least a half dozen times before using a tape, and ALWAYS take up the slack from a tape, like they do at some video stores before they hand the tape over to you. From that day on, his ADATs became as reliable as, well, anything with too many moving parts .

 

So let's not be too harsh on the state of the art in 1991. Hard disk systems were pretty finicky at that point, too. And the point about ADAT causing people to have to buy a whole bunch of new gear was also true...with that noise floor removed, nuances became much more noticeable.

 

Anyone want to buy a Tascam model 58 in great condition?!? But lest anyone misunderstand, let me make one thing clear: Digital tape has outlived its usefulness. At this point, it's only saving grace - extremely low media cost - is no longer an issue with the plummeting prices of hard drives. But for a few years there, ADATs really saved my studio.

[AlGoRhythm]

Originally posted by valkyriesound:

Phil: I think you could take Daniel Keller....

Heck... I could beat the crap out of Daniel! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/tongue.gif

 

Valky

www.vsoundinc.com

 

 

Valky, darling.....you and what militia? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/tongue.gif Of course, as you know, I'm a lover, not a fighter.... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Valkyrie Sound]

Originally posted by AlGoRhythm:

Valky, darling.....you and what militia? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/tongue.gif Of course, as you know, I'm a lover, not a fighter.... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

Daniel Keller....!!! Is that you????? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gif

I KNOW that's you! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

Valky

[JohnBartus]

Lee Flier sure don't like them ADATs...

 

As someone who has spent hundreds and thousands of hours recording on both ADAT and narrow-format Tascam multitracks, there isn't any real comparison. The Tascam 38 that I used from 1986-1994 was far from the most reliable machine I ever owned. It sucked in a big way without dbx NR, and it sucked (to a lesser extent) with it. It colored whatever audio I sent into it, and not always in a pleasant way. Frequency response left loads to be desired, and the way it handled the extreme lows and highs repulsed me. Wow and flutter could rear their ugly heads at a moment's notice, and aligning/maintaining those machines blew. Outside of the narrower-format Fostex, however, there was nothing else at the time. Tascam narrow-format, although analog, should never be mentioned in the same breath with 2" analog tape -- especially 2" 16-track. It's nowhere close.

 

It's also nowhere close to ADAT, either. People can ream the convertors and bitch all day about the ADAT sound, but it always gave me a hell of a lot better reproduction of my original audio source than narrow-format analog ever did. There was no more wow, flutter, hiss, or frequency anomalies. The machine offered sync and expansion capabilities, and was way more reliable than my Tascam 38. The original ADAT I bought close to eight years ago has never once had to go to the repair shop and has never eaten a tape. (My 2nd ADAT is currently in the shop for eating a tape -- but the tape still played back successfully on my other machine!) And if you had to have the analog sound, there were/are ways to color that sound going to tape.

 

Yeah, analog tape is likely far more reliable and long-lasting than ADAT tape. Or hard disk. Or MO. Or perhaps anything. So? Should we abandon other newer formats, or perhaps simply archive on formats that'll likely last? BTW, I spent too many hours with bad Ampex 456 in the old days, watching the reels come to a screeching halt from the shedding oxide. Cleaning that stuff off of the tape guides, capstan, pinch roller, and heads was just swell.

 

Let's not mention dropouts, or stretching, or loss of highs as the tape wore across the heads. And duplicate or clone your analog multitrack master? Not bloody likely!

 

I wonder how the actual amount of data lost from audio HD crashes compares to data lost from ADAT malfunctions. My guess is that it's not that far off, on a per capita basis. Besides, how many people are now complaining about that godawful "Pro Tools sound?" Alesis' approach to HD recording is one of the first to make sense in that audio data is recorded to a "time-specific" location on the HD. The timing issue is one that exists with many HD recording systems, but not with ADATs. Plus, "computers" and "accurate timing" are not usually heard in the same breath.

 

Sorry for the novel, but as someone who has "been there, done that," for hundreds of hours on both formats, I couldn't let it just slide by.

 

 

 

------------------

John Bartus

Radio Active Productions

We Make Great Radio Happen - Guaranteed.

1-888-93-RADIO

www.radioactivedigital.com

[soapbox]

John, as someone who also migrated from a Tascam 38 to Adats, I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

I never got a sound that I considered to be professional with from my Tascam 38. The choice between using my DX-4Ds, the dbx units which colored my sound in an unpleasant way, and not using any noise reduction, which gave me a considerable amount of hiss, was a poor one. The sound of my Adats was dramatically better.

[Bob1]

Valky, what's this about a Distribution of Musical Products class at USC?

 

I've never run across anything like that in Marshall School of Business. Do you know what department administers it or who knows about it over there? I have to file a preliminary class plan for my post-MBA MSBA in May, so it might help me personally to know about this although I already have many more candidate classes than there are available units in that program.

 

I know a few people in the MBA programs who gaze longingly at MI, wishing there were jobs that paid enough to make the payments on their school loans, and I'd like to pass the information on to them in case they think they could make it work.

 

Please drop me an e-mail at elswick@marshall.usc.edu, if you will.

[ChrisJ]

Originally posted by Anderton:

I always had good reliability with my ADATs, but I did several things that were crucial...I maintain that the single most important mechanical part of an ADAT was the tape itself...

 

the three rules of ADAT tape: Never use Ampex, rewind and fast forward at least a half dozen times before using a tape, and ALWAYS take up the slack from a tape,

 

Craig,

 

We had a related experience with 1" video tape. As best I recall the theory was that since tapes are made from polymers they have "elastic" memory. If a tape is subjected to varying conditions of temperature and humidity, the tape "pack" builds up strain. It want to go back tosome previous shape. Our solution was to allow a tape to re-acclimate to a new room (after shipping/transport) then "pre-pass" it, that is run it back and forth the full length of the tape as you suggest (although we only did it once back & forth). This seemed to keep the heads to track alignment more constant and minimize dropouts.

 

I would think that this technique would be of some benefit to any tape system although I have not done anything quantitave with audio format tapes.

 

-Chris

[Marvster]

The official press release, FWIW:

 

Alesis Announces Chapter 11 Reorganization

 

May 11, 2001 -- Alesis Studio Electronics announced it filed for Chapter 11-bankruptcy protection on Friday April 27, 2001. The filing was made in conjunction with an agreement in principle to be acquired by Jack ODonnell, President of Numark Corporation. As part of this agreement Mr. ODonnell has provided financial support for the company. An auction for the company will be held on May 23, 2001 in United States Bankruptcy Court, Courtroom 1475, 255 East Temple Street, Los Angeles, CA, 90012. For further information concerning this auction, interested parties should contact Alesis attorney Bennett Spiegel at Wynne, Spiegel, Itkin, 310-551-1015.

 

Alesis plans to continue normal operations at the company during this protection period. Jim Mack, V.P. of sales and marketing, said, Were very excited about the agreement with Mr. ODonnell and what it means for the future of Alesis and our newly introduced product line. While weve had to make certain reductions in our operation, were confident that in a very short time we will be back to doing what we do best supplying the market with innovative, high-quality audio products that improve the way people make and record music.

 

The company announced that all customer service functions would remain operational during the short protection period. This includes tech support, service, sales, shipping and receiving, and parts. Jim Mack added, We have maintained the core integrity of the company including the majority of the engineering staff, our manufacturing and sourcing team and our key sales and marketing staff. This will allow us to support most normal operations during this period and to ramp back up to full speed quickly once were through this transition. We are working to continue the supply of Alesis products and services and we are poised to begin shipping the remainder of the new products introduced at AES and NAMM.

 

On the heels of a bold new marketing campaign dubbed, "The Re-Evolution of Music," Alesis recently introduced fourteen new products within a six-month period. Among the new innovations is the groundbreaking trio of the A6 Andromeda 16 voice real analog synthesizer, the ADAT HD24 hard disk recorder and the ProLinear 820 Customizable DSP studio monitors.

 

For more information, visit their web site at www.alesis.com.

[dansouth]

Let's just hope the Gibson doesn't show up at that "auction."

[soapbox]

Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com:

Let's just hope the Gibson doesn't show up at that "auction."

 

Amen, brotha!

 

Gibson has killed off enough companies for a lifetime. I'd just as soon not see Yamaha there either. (Remembering Sequential Circuits...)

[lrbreez]

I also would not like to see Tascam, Mackie or iZ at the auction either.

Buddy

I wish I had the $$$$$$$ I would be there.

[D. Gauss]

so i saw Alesis kisted on Ebay for $189.00...

 

-d. gauss

[fantasticsound]

Originally posted by d gauss:

so i saw Alesis kisted on Ebay for $189.00...

 

-d. gauss

 

 

Yeah.. how long 'til the end of auction? They always gain a few hundred dollars in the last few seconds!

 

Neil

[Jeff Klopmeyer]

Originally posted by lrbreez:

I also would not like to see Tascam, Mackie or iZ at the auction either.

Buddy

I wish I had the $$$$$$$ I would be there.

 

Why don't you want to see TASCAM at the auction (or Mackie or iZ, for that matter)? If you ever want to see any of the products that Alesis has announced lately, you'd better hope that some company comes in with some cash to allow for the manufacturing and distribution of the product. If this goes as these things usually do, there will be several companies vying for the various technologies and brands that Alesis has created. It would be odd if a single company was able to take on recorders, synths, effects, speakers and so on since the more types of product lines a manufacturer handles, the harder it is to support each section. So, it could easily be split among a bunch of other companies. Or, the auction might not happen at all, if they resolve some thing between now and May 23.

 

By the way...if it does happen, I plan on being there...not necessarily representing TASCAM, but to see what happens.

 

- Jeff

[lrbreez]

<<

posted 05-15-2001 11:03 AM            

------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

quote:

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by lrbreez:

I also would not like to see Tascam, Mackie or iZ at the auction either.

Buddy

I wish I had the $$$$$$$ I would be there.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Why don't you want to see TASCAM at the auction (or Mackie or iZ, for

that matter)? >>

 

The only reason I feel this way is that I think if any of these

companies bought Alesis I don't think that the HD24 would see

the light of day. I don't think any of these companies would

want to support 2 formats (I also don't think that there is

any love loss between Tascam and Alesis).

 

Also I'm going to try to be at the auction too.

Buddy

[Nawor]

Originally posted by soapbox:

Amen, brotha!

 

Gibson has killed off enough companies for a lifetime. I'd just as soon not see Yamaha there either. (Remembering Sequential Circuits...)

 

Er.... you forgot Opcode!

 

I purchased an Opcode Sonicport to get digital audio in and out of my laptop. Two months before the warranty expired so did my Sonicport. When I went back to the dealer I discovered that Opcode had been bought out and wound up by Gibson... and guess what? No more warranty support. I argued with the dealer that as I had purchased it from them it was their problem not mine. They took me out back of the store and showed me a pile of Opcode stuff that had warranty claims going back months before Opcode was even wound up even though they were still officially trading, albeit owned by Gibson.

 

"If we couldn't get this stuff fixed then, what hope do we have now?"

 

Gibson sucks... BIG TIME!!!

[soapbox]

Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com:

Let's just hope the Gibson doesn't show up at that "auction."

 

Originally posted by soapbox:

Amen, brotha!

 

Gibson has killed off enough companies for a lifetime. I'd just as soon not see Yamaha there either. (Remembering Sequential Circuits...)

 

Originally posted by Rowan:

Er.... you forgot Opcode!

 

Actually, I felt Opcode was already implied by dansouth, since I know he was a Studio Vision Pro user back in the day. When I mentioned that Gibson had killed off enough companies for a lifetime, I was thinking about Oberheim too. My Sequential Circuits reference had to do with Yamaha buying and burying that company.

 

Sorry, Rowan, to hear about your frustrations with Gibson. A lot of us got our support yanked!

 

 

BTW, yes I know that there are new "Oberheim" products out there, but thats just a name Viscount stamps on their products. We may yet see the Opcode name similarly sold off by Gibson.

 

This message has been edited by soapbox on 05-16-2001 at 04:24 AM

[Felix_dup1]

Numark will own Alesis by the end of the month.

[Curve Dominant]

Is that a prediction, or a statement of fact, Felix? Just curious.

[Yuri T.]

Hmmm, what about Hartley Peavey? Imagine an ADAT or HD recorder that can fall off of your pickup truck and still work. Of course you might have to remove the logo.

 

This message has been edited by Yuri T. on 05-18-2001 at 02:29 PM

[Moronix]

Curve and Yuri,

All signs point to Numark.

 

Robert Morin

Still at Alesis

[Felix_dup1]

Just a prediction. But I think it's a good one.

 

A better discussion may be just what the Nu Alesis has in store. Certainly, I can imagine DJ mixers with airFX technology built in, but I'm curious as to the future of the HD24 (it must be happening, as its release is ultimately a sales windfall) and the Andromeda.

 

I'm also very interested to see the next generation of synths from Alesis, as the QS series is aging and is a sharp contrast to all of the new, industrial-designed gear that Alesis introduced last year.

 

I sincerely hope that there aren't any lasting effects of the reorganization on Alesis' reputation. It's a shame that their impressive R&D efforts and notable product announcements and launches would result in such unfortunate circumstances. I for one am eager to see them back in business as usual (albeit under new ownership), proving the naysayers wrong.