the sweetwater difference?

[ricongacharter.net]

Man i just had to share this with someone. I recieved sweetwaters sale flyer (sweet notes) in the mail a few weeks ago. On page 7 in big bold headline type it says "DRAMATIC PRICE DROP ON ALESIS LX 20" this caught my interest so i read on till i came to "Alesis has actually dropped the suggested list price to an unbelievable $995! But it gets even better, since yor sweetwater price will be even lower ---so low in fact that we cant print it!" holy shit i said to myself, i just paid $995 for one recently when list was $1395. Figuring a standard discount i reasoned that it must now be selling for around $750 or $800 which is why sweetwater is making such a big deal. So i called them up, not to my surprise my "sales engineer" nika aldrich is busy and i get an associate or whatever they call it. First of all this person doesnt know what an lx20 is and im put on hold while they investigate, after several explanations they finally figure it out at which time i mention the flyer and ask the current price.

$995 im told. wait a minute i say everyone and their brother has been selling this thing for that price for months and you just advertised that this is now the current list price. tough noogies im told, thats the price. my conversation with the junior engineer was actually longer but theres the jist. so i guess they ran that ad so i would call up, be put on hold,wait for the junior engineer to consult with a real (right) engineer and have smoke blown up my ass. i have to admit that i thought sweetwater sucked before this happened but this is blatently missleading advertising and i had to see if anyone else has had this experience

[alphajerk]

i got a card in the mail once that i could get any item i wanted at COST. i call up my ASSIGNED "engineer salesdick" and asked how much for so and so, i got this card saying for cost. well it was STILL more expensive than could be had normally anywhere else, i even told him i could get them where and at what price. "well they are selling them below what we even get them for..." BULLSHIT! its just the tip of the iceberg... SWEETWATER SUCKS!

[Philip OKeefe]

Please see my reponse to your post on Roger's forum.

 

Crossposting, tisk, tisk! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

 

Alpha:

 

I got a similar card over Christmastime, and they said "you won't believe the incredible deals we have waiting for you". Special, one time only, blah blah crud. I called them up and they said they were offering cables for a "good price". I couldn't believe it. From reading the card you would have assumed they were giving you your choice of gear. VERY misleading!

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[Guest]

Sweetwater has the highest prices around; how do you think they pay for their fancy catalog and monthly ads in the various magazines?

[DC]

The thing that drives me nuts about Sweetwater is their 'used car salesman' attitude. You call to get a price on an item and they yabber on for half an hour about how they were just hanging out with; (insert your famous producer, rock star etc here) the other day and yadda yadda yadda...

 

"Listen, I don't care if you blew Elton John the last time he was in town, HOW MUCH?!!!'

 

Then there's the famous 'You really need to start your recording system from scratch' line. I call about a digital recorder and this guy is hard selling me a full blown MAC and Pro Tools outfit.

 

"WTF?!!! I'm trying to get your price on a piece of gear unrelated to spending ten times as much by switching platforms..."

 

And how 'bout those special sales? I got a bunch of accessories one time from a sales flyer, negotiated a good price and waited for my package. When it showed up, the charge on my credit card was way out of whack. I added things up and they charged me like $48.00 for a small (definately not oversized or heavy) box for shipping and handling.

 

Of course I rang em up and got the sniveling assistant who didn't know jack and had to keep going back and forth with some supervisor I assume. His final whiney comment was "But you got some free items..."

 

And I'm like; "Well the flyer said first come first serve and some items were free if you bought others, it doesn't say anything about 'you're gonna have to pay for the free stuff anyway cos we're gonna stick you on handling charges..."

 

Needless to say, I have a real problem with ever dealing with them again. It's a shame too cause they carry some high end stuff that a lot of stores don't, but dealing with them is just a nightmare unless you're one of the folks they name drop all the time.

[dansouth]

I've been a Sweetwater customer for ten years, and I've never experienced ANY of the aforementioned problems. I've always gotten better prices from Sweetwater than any other mail order place or any of the myriad music stores in the NJ/NYC area. - I HAVE noticed that you never get a good quote from the sales associate. I politely explain what I want and ask them to have the main guy get back to me with his best price. It's even more efficient to send and email. They call me back in the morning, say your price is XYZ, I say yay or nay, and it's a done deal. I don't even have to get my feet wet.

 

On the rare occasion when a unit hasn't worked properly, they fixed it or replaced it quickly. Other mail order places have sent me used stuff claiming that it was new, B-stock claiming that it was flawless, the wrong model, and in some cases, neglected to send anything until I had raised enough hell.

 

If I have a question about a unit, Sweetwater usually (80% of the time) has a tech who can straighten out the problem within 24 hours. Again, it helps to send an email to support@sweetwater.com clearly explaining the situation so time doesn't have to be wasted on the phone. I rarely ask for gear recommendations, because the research is my responsibility, but when I have, they've give me the staight scoop. I have even visited their facility, studio and all. The place is immaculate. They obviously care about their business and their customers - not a feeling that I get in very many music stores. Everyone was very nice, and the staff dresses for business. I've seen guys in local stores that look like they sleep in their clothes.

 

If you want to talk to a clueless flake, try one of the other "catalog" places. Do they have the support services that Sweetwater has? No way! If you want a used car salesman attitude, go to 48th street, where you have to bargain hard just to avoid paying MSRP (or higher!). I'm glad to hear that so many of you won't be calling Sweetwater again, because it means that the phone lines will be open when I call for my next order.

[Marvster]

<>

 

Well, you know what they say: "Never order the fish special." ;-)

 

Just wanted to pitch in with Dan and agree that my experience with Sweetwater has been universally good. They don't have the lowest prices around -- you won't get a 10-up deal every time -- but I've found that reasonable offers are usually accepted.

 

And the true test: Every time I've had a problem they've handled it without the slightest pushback. When my monitors arrived with a crushed corner, they *immediately* sent out a new pair, and paid for return shipping on the damaged goods. This is what you expect, but again, the point is they made it right without any nagging on my part.

 

And here's a little shipping tip: If you're going to order something you don't mind paying the published sales price on, buy it from their site. For an otherwise high-tech business, they have a long way to go on the Web, and their site can't currently calculate actual shipping. So, believe it or not, you have two *pre-priced* shipping options on your order: Either $10 for UPS 3-day or $20 for UPS 1-day. Take advantage while you can, because they're bound to fix it at some point.

 

Best,

 

Marv

 

This message has been edited by Marvster on 02-13-2001 at 03:03 PM

[BP3]

Frankly, I shop at WPS. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/cool.gif

[Uh Clem]

Marv and Dan - I agree. The long version of my response is on Roger's Board.

[alphajerk]

if you cant find a better deal than sweetwater than you either have your head up your ass or you havent looked. EVERY place i have ever looked has been cheaper, i might not be looking at the more expensive ones that you are...

 

and sweetwater doesnt REALLY sell high end gear, they just like to make you think they do...

 

steve, i can hook you up with several reputable out of state dealers, ones already been mentioned above, to avoid the sales taxes dealers who in every conceivable way will kill sweetwater. service AND price.

 

sweetwater is a joke!

[Punchmo]

I'll throw in with Dan and Marv. I have been buying shit from Sweetwater since 1988. I visited their "home studio" location as well as their new facility. The guy I deal with will make a good deal on the gear they offer. Their service department is good and I even had a senior ex call to make sure I was happy with their service. Excellent CRM!

 

When I get an assistant on the phone, I tell them to have my guy call...no more conversation. The biggest issue for me is that they are behind where I am going with the companies I want to purchase gear from. Mostly outboard stuff.

 

When I first started purchasing from them, they were a keyboard, MI store. They have come a long way. I would call and ask about Manley, Focusrite, Summit, Tubetech, Avalon and others. Didn't have 'em then and since, these lines have come on stream along with their success.

 

Now, when you call about Royer ribbon mics, you'll hear about Beyer's and how they are looking at the Royer. I guess it will happen in the end.

 

You know, it is no different then at any store...you build a relationship and you get good service. When I walk in to WPS, they don't know me from adam, and I get quoted ridiculous prices for shit. I have to tell them what the market price is to even get close to a deal. That does piss me off. You know what they will sell the piece for and, you are asking about a 4 figure piece of gear and you get f**ked around. This bullshit from any store would piss anybody off.

 

So, I've learned that MONEY TALKS. It gets you fair prices and good service http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif I budget new gear each year and ring a few companies to explain that. Service is important to me and I factor that into the deals I make. Gear re-sellers want these relationships. Wouldn't you give a better deal to someone who uses your studio and facilities often?

 

Some stores get it and some don't but, in the end it is the relationship you create and build on that will serve both parties.

 

IMHO, sp

[Philip OKeefe]

Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com:

I've been a Sweetwater customer for ten years, and I've never experienced ANY of the aforementioned problems. (SNIP) - I HAVE noticed that you never get a good quote from the sales associate. I politely explain what I want and ask them to have the main guy get back to me with his best price. It's even more efficient to send and email. They call me back in the morning, say your price is XYZ, I say yay or nay, and it's a done deal. I don't even have to get my feet wet.

 

(SNIP)

 

If I have a question about a unit, Sweetwater usually (80% of the time) has a tech who can straighten out the problem within 24 hours. Again, it helps to send an email to support@sweetwater.com clearly explaining the situation so time doesn't have to be wasted on the phone. I rarely ask for gear recommendations, because the research is my responsibility, but when I have, they've give me the staight scoop. I have even visited their facility, studio and all. The place is immaculate. They obviously care about their business and their customers - not a feeling that I get in very many music stores. Everyone was very nice, and the staff dresses for business. I've seen guys in local stores that look like they sleep in their clothes.

 

If you want to talk to a clueless flake, try one of the other "catalog" places. Do they have the support services that Sweetwater has? No way! If you want a used car salesman attitude, go to 48th street, where you have to bargain hard just to avoid paying MSRP (or higher!). I'm glad to hear that so many of you won't be calling Sweetwater again, because it means that the phone lines will be open when I call for my next order.

 

Dan:

 

Your comments and experiences are appreciated. I've posted a rather long set of experiences over on Roger's forum, and a Sweetwater Senior Sales Engineer dropped me an email suggesting I try to call him so he can "make things right" for me. That's pretty promising. I'll be calling him back today, so stay tuned for more info...

 

The "main guy" vs. sales associate thing is a good idea, and the email suggestion is an even better one. Every quote I have gotten from SW has been higher than I get locally (even considering tax vs. shipping). In most cases, only a few percent more, but in a couple of cases, drastically more. Your email suggestion is an even better idea. I don't have time to wait around for a "return phone call" because chances are, I'll be in a session and unable to take the call. This is one thing about Yamaha Tech support I don't really like - I've missed three or four of their return calls on AW4416 questions, and then I have to call them back, leave another message and start the whole process all over again.

 

I really consider myself to be above average in equipment knowledge. I read all the trades every month and try to stay current. I do my own research, and ask few questions, so I agree with you that this is my responsibility. However, having said that, I really have had a couple of the sales assistants (translation - wet behind the ears folks who are still learning) try to tell me I need X when I called for info on Y, and get a bit too pushy about it for my tastes. Cool, tell me about X, but if I say I don't want X because it lacks the SMPTE capabilities of Y, and I need that feature, don't try to argue with me about it. I know what I'm doing, I'm not a rookie, and that should be obvious from the conversation - I just gave the guy a detailed differentation between the two devices and how they pertain to my particular needs. if I make a bad choice, it's my fault. We're all grown ups here. Just show me a little respect is all I ask of them.

 

Well, I'm going to go call them and see what they have to say. I'll let you know how things go. I'm glad they've worked well for you.

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[miroslav]

Yes, I too have found Sweetwater's prices to be a bit high.

 

My favorite cheapest online is American Musical Supply, and if you happen to be in the NY Tri-State area, then you can also go in person to Victor's House of Music which is the owner of American Musical Supply.

 

http://www.americanmusical.com/

 

http://www.victors.com/

[Ola Lagarhus]

B&H Photo/Video/Audio in New York seems to have better prices than Sweetwater. I have asked around a bit for prices on some dynamic mics,

and B&H had the lowest prices.

Ola

[dansouth]

Originally posted by skp@cvns.net:

When I walk in to WPS, they don't know me from adam, and I get quoted ridiculous prices for shit. I have to tell them what the market price is to even get close to a deal. That does piss me off. You know what they will sell the piece for and, you are asking about a 4 figure piece of gear and you get f**ked around. This bullshit from any store would piss anybody off.

 

This is one of the reasons - one - that I won't even walk into a superstore anymore. Pompous attitude is another; you have to tackle a sales guy to get him to help you. If they don't give a shit about my business, why should I give them my money? Then there's the NOISE problem. And rotten service - it shouldn't take three MONTHS to fix a piece of gear, but somehow, it does. And don't even think about asking for a loaner or a replacement. Then there's the flaky sales staff - I'm sorry, but they should know more about the gear than someone who's never touched it. Sweetwater puts a lot of time into getting to know the gear. They bring factory reps in for demos of new products every week. They have an excellent service department, and they turn things around quickly.

 

Have I ALWAYS received flawless service? No, there've been a handful of disappointing moments over the years - gear that didn't work out of the box, etc. Nobody's perfect. To be fair, I've dropped the ball for my own customers a few times in the last ten years. But Sweetwater has never hesitated to pull out all the stops to rectify a bad situation when I bring it to their attention. Such incidents have been very infrequent, and I've always been satisfied with their efforts to "make it right".

[not Cereal]

ive bought about $5k from sweetwater, and had good experiences for the most part.

 

they did send me a broken compressor, which presonus took THREE WEEKS to fix. that DID piss me off, but hey sh*t happens.

 

they tried to talk me out of MLCD/burner combo and into a standalone peice of junk for $700 extra, i held my ground and got the combo.

 

thay sent me $300 worth of speaker stands for free, a free speaker cable, and gave me some $$$ off a couple of wireless mics.

 

so it's mixed IMHO.

[DBENNVAhotmail.com]

Peeps,

 

Sweetwater charges too much. We get all our stuff from Sam Ash.

www.samash.com Call 1800-472-6274, & ask for Gregg at Ext.2155, or Cory at Ext. 2224. They can handle things professionally, & they know what they're talking about. They also have a 60 day before, or after purchase low price guarantee. And they have a Pro Division that handles the really high-end stuff as well as the run of the mill purchase.

 

Quantum! C/O

DBENNVA@hotmail.com

[Guest]

Hi,

I find that savings depend on the item you want.But,on sweetwaters' site they tends to charge signifigantly higher then other retailers sometimes as much as %25.What i do is go here, Its a search engine for a bunch of retailers.

www.gearprice.com

Also, Sam Ash can be talked down LOW, but the prices listed on their site are not the lowest.

 

For instance, I am about to get a roland gr 33 with the g2 ka. Ive seen it going from $450 all the way to $799. Thats a signifigant difference to me.Theres just something inside of me that refuses to pay %25 percent more for something.

[Philip OKeefe]

Okay everyone, here's my update on the Sweetwater saga.

 

Clay Stahlka, a Sweetwater Sales Manager calls me (I missed it because I was in session) and email's me. He asks me to call him and discuss my posts from this thread. So I did. He said that he thought that my posts were well worded and fair, and that they wanted to "make things right for me" - he also offered his apologies and several suggestions that should improve my customer service experience in the future. Since the original problems have already been corrected by Frontier, I told him I didn't see what they could do, but that I appreciated that they'd care enough to call and hear me out and try to make things better. This is a sign of good customer service here! Any business can have snafus, but the good ones take care of things whenever they come up - but you've got to make the senior honchos aware of it. Suggestion: Don't scream and yell, just ask for a manager (or THEIR manager, if you're still not satisfied) and present your situation in a calm, professional manner, along with what it will take to retain you as a customer and solve your issues.

 

For starters, even though Sweetwater might "assign" a sales engineer to you, I'd suggest that you ask for a different one if you feel you have a personality clash or are just dissatisfied with the existing one. Make the management aware of your request, and they'll do it. They'd rather retain you as a customer. BTW, after these experiences, Clay would come highly recommended by me.

 

For those of us who are busy professionals I'd suggest (as someone else did here) that you email your request and get your quotes direct from the Senior Sales Engineer instead of the "assistants". This beats having to wait around by the phone for a response. Since the chances are that I'll be in a session when they call back anyway (Murphy was an optimist), this avoids "telephone tag".

 

Well, anyway, I was pleased with my conversation with Clay. My cynical side thought there *might* be an element of "get the guy back onboard with us, and get his business away from the other S/W sales rep", but I did find him to be polite and attentive to my concerns. No Blarney or baloney, no trying to impress me by saying he was "on the phone with George Martin" just before he called me, no "passing the blame game", etc. So after all of this, I decided I'd be willing to give them another try for equipment purchases in the future.

 

Then this morning he calls back again to say that he's discussed me in a meeting with the president of Sweetwater and they want to offer me a "special deal" on my next purchase. I can get whatever I want in

this deal, and at a VERY atractive price (I promised not to give the details, but trust me, it's a very good deal!) This was AFTER I'd already decided to give them another chance. They also promised to give me professional service and pricing on all future purchases.

 

There was NO strings attached to any of this. Those of you who know me know that honesty and integrety are too important to me, and I couldn't be bought off like that anyway. To quote Clay (from an email price request he answered today) "Of course, I would ask that you cover the actual shipping costs on either or both, but beyond that I'd like nothing more than to offer you that special pricing to apologize for the inconveniences caused by our failure to communicate on the Frontier Designs issue."

 

So obviously, my impression of Sweetwater's customer service just went through the roof.

 

Lessons learned:

 

1. Tell the boss when you feel you've been the victim of poor service. Be polite, be fair, and offer suggestions on how they can improve.

 

2. Use email for pricing requests and avoid the callback waits and "assistant sales engineers".

 

3. ASK FOR a different sales rep if you're dissatisfied with the one that has been "assigned" to you.

 

4. Feel free to voice your complaints about a company's service on line in forums like this, but be fair in doing so. And it's only fair that you respond back to the forum members if they DO take care of your concerns.

 

5. Frontier Designs customer service STIL rocks!

 

 

I hope that this post will serve as my response under item #4 above. BTW, Sweetwater did NOT request or suggest in any way that I do this, and their treatment of me was in no way conditional on me making such a response. I think it's important that I put that disclaimer in there for those of you who might tend to be cynical like I am!

 

Bottom line: There WAS problems with previous experiences I have had with Sweetwater, but they went out of thier way to be fair and resolve those issues, and I'll definitely be doing business with them again in the future. I will also refer others to them as well, giving the information about these experiences as "proof" of their commitment to quality service.

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[Philip OKeefe]

BTW, anyone who would like to see my posts regarfing my original problems and the steps I took in getting them solved can do so here:

 

 

http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/001370.html

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[alphajerk]

i still dont buy it. but i guess they are monitoring these threads. PR nightmare, phil gets to be their good deed. i dont buy it. their demo/closeout flyer i got in the mail i few weeks ago was a joke.

[Philip OKeefe]

Originally posted by alphajerk:

i still dont buy it. but i guess they are monitoring these threads. PR nightmare, phil gets to be their good deed. i dont buy it. their demo/closeout flyer i got in the mail i few weeks ago was a joke.

 

I'm pretty sure they DO monitor these threads, because from other posts it would appear that I'm not the only one who has been contacted. You're right - a thread like this can be a PR nightmare for a company, and taking care of the problem(s) is in their corporate best interests. I don't really mind being their "good deed". http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Having said that, you should know me pretty well by now - I'm NOT going to sell out my honesty and integrety over any deal, so I'll continue to type it as I see it. And if I hear from anyone that I refer to them that they were treated unfairly, I'll call S/W myself and address it, and give them a chance to make it better. If they don't then I won't recommend them anymore. Because *my* reputation is on the line with the recommendations I make. If I call some of my industry contacts and tell them about a band that I think they should check out and the band is utter garbage, and I do that a few times, then they won't take my calls anymore, and my rep would be shot. Same thing with these types of things. Sweetwater and I had some probelms, but they've made an honest attempt to fix them. That (to me) speaks well of the company, or at least some people within the company.

 

Hey Alpha, I can certainly understand your cynicism, but I do have to admit, they have tried very hard to make things better for me. And believe me, if the old ways return, I'll be the first to let everyone know about it.

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[dansouth]

Originally posted by DBENNVA@hotmail.com:

Peeps,

 

Sweetwater charges too much. We get all our stuff from Sam Ash.

www.samash.com Call 1800-472-6274, & ask for Gregg at Ext.2155, or Cory at Ext. 2224. They can handle things professionally, & they know what they're talking about. They also have a 60 day before, or after purchase low price guarantee. And they have a Pro Division that handles the really high-end stuff as well as the run of the mill purchase.

 

Quantum! C/O

DBENNVA@hotmail.com

 

Every retailer gets the stuff for the same price. The dealer can't sell it lower than cost, so nobody's rock bottom price is going to be any lower than anyone else's. Sometimes the manufacturer dictates the discount that a dealer can offer - remember the $3995 ADAT? - but this is a special case (unless you're buying a Macintosh).

 

Another price concept it the catalog/web price vs. the final price. No retailer is going to advertise rock bottom prices, because they leave themselves no bargaining room. Sweetwater has always given me better deals than any of the national catalog prices, and I don't ever have to haggle with the rep (as opposed to the assistant, who generally quotes the catalog price). So I don't get where you guys are coming up with this "Sweetwater has high prices" nonsense. They've saved me a ton of $$ over local and mail order places alike.

 

They've save me a ton of aggravation, as well. I know that gear is a commodity - a Triton from Sweetwater sounds the same as a Triton from Sam Ash or the Guitar Center - but service is not. I've been buying audio gear for twenty-five years. I've dealt with EVERYONE, from mom and pop stores to specialty retailers to the national chains. I know how they deal with the inevitible problems that arise. I know the places that will get it fixed or replaced in a hurry, the ones taht will let it sit on the bench for two months, and the ones who will wash their hands of the situation and send me directly to the manufacturer - do not pass "Go," do not collect $100. Sweetwater is the best. If you want to deal with downtime, buy somewhere else. These guys are SERIOUS about customer service. My relationship with Sweetwater has been a sunny day compared to the gloom and chaos of the rest of the music retail business. I don't get excuses, I get SERVICE, and I get it promptly. The only other place that's in the same category is the New Jersey Guitar and Bass Center. Those guys are also fair, considerate, and offer great prices and customer service.

[alphajerk]

my assigned sales guy is an idiot and wont budge on prices, even when i quote him prices other places for cheaper, he claims that its below his cost [which i dont buy] so i dont buy there, dont go there, dont want none. sweetwater SUCKS! they always will regardless of their few "good deeds" with the lashing they have taken here. i even requested a new guy but they wouldnt do that. SCREW SWEETWATER! and they really dont carry much crap i want anyways with their fake high end products. too many other places to buy from... if you want REAL SERVICE, go to mercenary.

[robotobonhome.com]

I think Sweetwater sales people spend to much time attempting to validate themselves to the customer. I really don't care at all about that junk like 'i know this guy yadda yadda'.

 

I first contacted them by email cos I was building a DAW and I had done MAJOR research, even learning the details of different A/D/A converters, power supplies, etc. I had to spend my money right cos who knows where the next will come? So I get contacted by a rep and he tells me I need a product that I know is totally inferior to the one I really want. In fact I wasn't even looking for his advice, just the price. Discount baby!

 

And what he quoted me for an audio interface was above anything I'd seen anywhere. He wouldn't even hear about what other stores could do. Just 'this is the price'.

 

So I went to guitar center which I hate passionately, since the sales people there totally hate customers... and it loud. It turns out I have the pro discount, which is utter elitist crap. None the less I saved a couple hundred off of what Sweetwater offered. But flagging down the sales ass for 1/2 an hour then waiting another hour for the guy to type up my order sucked. No interference on my purchase descisions though, just a quick send off. Next!

 

So go shoot the shit with a sales nerd at guitar center and get your pro discounts bah!

 

Glad I wasn't trying to buy ProTools at a snobby ass 'pro' store though... uhg!

 

-rob

[Philip OKeefe]

Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com:

Every retailer gets the stuff for the same price. The dealer can't sell it lower than cost, so nobody's rock bottom price is going to be any lower than anyone else's. Sometimes the manufacturer dictates the discount that a dealer can offer - remember the $3995 ADAT? - but this is a special case (unless you're buying a Macintosh).

 

 

I have to agree with you here in general Dan, but having worked in a couple of music stores many years ago, there are exceptions. First of all, no manufacturer that I have ever encountered stipulates to any dealer the minimum price that they can sell a device for. Now there *is* something you'll frequently see on dealer price lists called a MAP, which is the minimum advertised price. Many dealer agreements (that the dealers and manufacturers sign when the dealer picks up a product line) require that the dealer agree not to advertise below MAP, but nothing I've ever seen said that you couldn't sell below the MAP price.

 

As far as everyone getting everything at the same price, that only holds true up to a certain point. Let's use guitars for example. Many guitars are what's known as an A mark (100% markup - Boy, some dealers are gonna really "love" me for this!) http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif anyway, those guitars that list for $1,000 cost the dealer about $500. However, the manufacturers frequently offer deals to the dealers if they buy specific models, or packages of models, or if they buy in bulk. IOW, if they buy 50 guitars, they might get an A mark less 10% deal on those units. So on a $1,000 list price guitar at an A - 10% deal, the dealer would pay $450 per unit.

 

Buying in such volume is usually pretty tough for the "mom and pop" stores, and the bigger megastores have more money and resources (advertising, wharehousing) and can kill them on volume. They make less per unit, but they make it up on volume. That's probably one reason why they seem to sometimes care less about quality service and product knowledge and more about "moving the stuff out the doors".

 

 

Phil O'Keefe

Sound Sanctuary Recording

Riverside CA

http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html

email: pokeefe777@msn.com

[stratman_dup1]

I couldn't help but notice when I saw this thread that at the top of the page there is a banner that says " Dicover the Sweetwater difference. " HAHAHA kind of funny huh, especially with what appears to be the general consensus that Sweetwater Sucks. I personally have never ordered through them, I always thought the prices were too high, IMO anyways.

[DBENNVAhotmail.com]

Dansouth,& Peeps,

 

I too have been buying for quite some time. I remember as a teenager

buying a Fender Rhodes, & having to deal with the only Fender rep. in my area for miles. A take it or leave it sale. I've shopped 48th St.in the flesh,& negotiated with peeps on the west coast. Alot of what you say is true but today, right here, right now,& for the past 7 years I've found that Sam Ash always has the best prices, & has them first. I've talked to other retailers that say they'll match their(Sam Ash's)price. But to me that's not fair. I want to do business with the party that gives me their best right off the bat. And you can't beat a 60 day before, or after purchase low price guarantee. Who else has the guts to do this. Believe you me I've cashed in on that a few times in the past year. But it's not often that I have had to do that. Really this has only happened on some purchases of specialty items that Sam Ash does'nt normally carry like some

custom items that actually had to be manufactured just for us on special order. Stuff that Sweetwater, & other cat's might not even go to lengths to get for us. And that designated Sales Engineer(at "Sweetwater") really gets on my nerves too. Like it really makes a difference. Sweetwater needs to hire a sales consultant to fix some of the problems with their sales techniques. If I call you up for a price on something I want it right then, & without having to go through some interviewing process, & waiting period. I'm busy like most of us up here, & I don't have time to play ping pong with some sales team trying to make themselves out to be some musicians "Sales Dream Team". Somebody who you moderators know real well lost a sale from us because the sales staff was slack in getting us the info. we needed. And if I wanted to name drop I probably could name drop some of those sweetwater cats into a corner but I won't. The type of cat's they might talk to on the phone I either work with, or hang out with. Big whoopie. Give me a price, & tell me when you can get the item I need to me. And who hangs out in Fort Wayne, Indiana anyway.

Who "Indiana Jones"? I know for a fact that we(DBENNVA) have spent at least (20 to 30)K in the past 7 months at Sam Ash with no signs of stopping, & they have probably saved us at least 10% on average for every purchase. Case closed people. I've already given you my references at

Sam Ash, and they're not paying me for this. The only payback I need is

good pricing which we get anyway, & so can you.

 

Quantum! C/O

DBENNVA@hotmail.com

 

 

 

This message has been edited by DBENNVA@hotmail.com on 02-18-2001 at 04:55 AM

[Anderton]

Interesting thread, but it's what's BETWEEN the lines that carries the most weight.

 

"The prices are a little higher" and "I've always gotten good support" seem to be pretty general comments. I think this is a cause and effect situation - many people are willing to pay a little more (or sometimes a lot more in the case of some local dealers) to get good support. Sure, you can always get cheaper prices, or more support, or less support, or pay more...whatever. The job of the company is to balance the two for their intended clientele.

 

"I guess they're monitoring this board." Well, a lot of people monitor this board, but a lot don't. The fact that they do indicates that they apparently want to do what it takes to make satisfied customers.

 

Everyone's allowed to make a mistake from time to time. It's how people or companies FIX those mistakes that gives you a real clue as to what intentions are behind their actions.

 

Based on what I'm reading here, it seems Sweetwater has found themselves a definite niche in how they balance the service/pricing/inventory equation.

 

I would also invite anyone from Sweetwater to offer their comments here on the retailer's perspective of dealing with customers...maybe there's something customers can do to create a better experience. As you long as you don't hype yourselves , you're always welcome to join in.

[ombbellatlantic.net]

Everybody will probably hate for this but here it goes anyway; Why does everybody that buys gear think they deserve 10 up? Do you go into the grocery store and say, "I want to get some poultry along with my produce and dairy purchase so can you do cost on my steaks?" Of course you don't. Remeber this: the salesman on the other end of the line has a family to feed and a living to earn. His (and my) job is to sell gear and make money for himself and the company he works for. I am not saying you should get fucked. But buy from one salesman at one store. They get to know you and then you get that great deal and will eventually do things like call you with new and used gear that comes into inventory that you may be interested in. This is called a relationship. Thats the guy that will get 10 up. If the price in your local store is 2,000.00, the store down the street has it for 1950.00 and you salesman gets it to you for 1875.00, 125.00 is 125.00 be happy.

OneMan