Guest Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 I don't know many of your backgrounds, but how many of us here are balancing either working for someone/yourself, with the type of music you are producing/engineering? And what you enjoy and what is work? I mean, how many projects are you working on that are paying the bills that you loathe or are stellar? Do you ever really not like working on specific projects? I am a small studio owner/engineer/producer/graphic artist, producing local music/my own too, to learn more about the art. I find that my day gig allows me the luxury of working on projects that I can get behind artistically. I do know as I get more away from my day job, and lean more toward my studio/design business full time, I have to make the transition from being primarily a producer, to being a studio for hire. With that in mind, I won't be able to afford to turn anyone down, and wonder if that'll suck the life outta me or what? I do have some great support, I have help to handle the money side, and help with engineering duties, but I will have my hand in all those pies as I struggle to grow as a business. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 There was another pretty good thread that got into this territory a bit ago... "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicMan Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Ted, I am new here, any idea where that thread is? p.s. musicman is my new "nickname". was songbirdx@home.com My Music Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 It's on page two, about 14 or so down, called "Artistic Integrity vs. Commerciality". BTW, I used to have a MusicMan 4X10 amp... "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Oh, and by the way, welcome to the jungle http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphajerk Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 you're gonna die! [sorry couldnt resist some good ol GnR http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif] welcome to the jungle/ its gonna bring you dow ow own... ugh! seriously, why are there some many guys [me included] who do visual arts like graphics? is there some connectin here? personally i do graphic arts [of various sorts and filter in the aural side quite often with my multimedia projects, even video, ehich i love as well] to pay the bills and fund everything else. it pays extremely well [better than most Cheif Engineers make] and lets me purely do music for arts sake. i wouldnt have it any other way. i find i can compromise a LOT easier with commercial visual art than do commercial music [just shoot me if i have to do that and music was no longer fun, what would be the point of living then?] alphajerk FATcompilation "if god is truly just, i tremble for the fate of my country" -thomas jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curve Dominant Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Whoah. This IS a trend. Alpha: which of these do you NOT own: Photoshop, QuarkXpress, Illustrator, GoLive CyberStudio (or Dreamweaver), LiveMotion (or Flash 4), GifBuilder, RealProducer. You probably have Photoshop & most of the rest. If I'd spent as much time, money, and research on music as on computer graphics...the AGFA scanner, the 6-color printer, the blue-tower G3 w/ Rage Accelerator & 20-inch monitor...the upside is that I can produce dazzling promotional shtuff for my music projects. All the London guys like Jagger, Page, Clapton etc also went to art school. Then there's Bowie - my God, look at his "The Outside" CD art; there's art directors around the globe who WISH they had his talent. Something about graphic design - there's a similiarity to composing music. It's a brain-type thing, the vertical thought process. If you "see" music, rather than approach it as a linear "one note, then another" craft, you probably have some kind of corresponding visual-art dexterity. One of my art heroes, Vasily Kandinsky, wrote books on this subject, and his art was heavily influenced by music. Check out "Point And Line To Plane" on Dover Books. Originally published by Bauhaus in 1926 and edited by the architect Walter Gropius, it contains some very cool illustrations of Kandinsky's theories concerning the visually graphic nature of music. Then there's Palladio, and all the architectural theories of "composition" and parallels with music. One architect I know once insisted to me at a cocktail party that I could make big bucks as a composer lecturing to architecture students on this subject, just bullshitting away at a lecturn for 2 hours. I never took him up on that, though. Someday... [This message has been edited by Curve Dominant (edited 11-29-2000).] Eric Vincent (ASCAP) www.curvedominant.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curve Dominant Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 But anyway, back to Songbird/MusicMan's original point. >>I won't be able to afford to turn anyone down, and wonder if that'll suck the life outta me or what?<< I have been flamed out on other threads for my stance on this issue. I am building a recording studio exclusively for the purpose of developing original music, and I have no desire to do otherwise. I would rather wash dishes - seriously! I won't play in cover bands, either, and I have had many lucrative offers, but I am very stubborn about maintaining a purely artistic approach to everything in life. If you have to wonder if being a studio-for-hire will "suck the life" outta you, you should trust your instincts that it will. Eric Vincent (ASCAP) www.curvedominant.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphajerk Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Check out "Point And Line To Plane" on Dover Books. i'll take you up on that, head out to barnes and noble tomorrow.. and to think we were about to kill each other not to long ago. more alike than either of us realized. i dont own gifbuilder, thats the only one on that list [excpet i use dreamweaver and Flash 4, now 5 in a few days after i get it in the mail] you wouldnt believe what i charge for Flash animation work. more than most studios do by the hour im sure with a mere $3k invested in equipment [well maybe a little more, but nowhere near what i have invested in audio equipment (easy $75k+)]. the web design is my mental break since i started doing it by hand coding and now with WYSIWYAG editors, its so meditative. although i have to finish 78 html pages with javascript + graphics throughout by friday before i leave town. ugh! man, i got a umax scanner with transparency scanning abilities for $249! thats inconceivable! they used to be several thousand for those. i have picked up quite a bit of work doing complete manufacturing/design in house for small runs of CD's of local bands using my trusty Epson 750photo inkjet, a cd burner, and lots of ink cartriges. they look so damn good, promoters and booking people have been freaking on the look of them. IN HOUSE! beat that offset litho. of course i wouldnt want to do more than 100 in a run. alphajerk FATcompilation "if god is truly just, i tremble for the fate of my country" -thomas jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Covers...now there's a topic... In my own opinion, there are many national acts that play mostly covers. For example, every time an established artist goes out on stage and plays one of his/her "hits", he's playing a cover of him/herself... Think I'm nuts? Watch any act on tour...take the couple years old Page/Plant tour. They play "Whole Lotta Love"...the crowd goes wild. They play something off their latest CD (the one they were touring to promote)...verrry tepid reaction. Not because it wasn't good. Because it was unfamiliar. To me, it doesn't matter that Page and Plant were in Zeppelin, they were playing covers of Zeppelin material. Now, on a more local level, a solo guitar player with some decent material plays all originals at a local coffee house. Very tepid reaction. Doesn't really matter how good the songs are, people respond to what they know. Same guy throws in an REM song, everyone responds. What's my point? Musicians need that audience response, and to me anyway, playing covers warms an audience up to hear your original stuff. In my opinion, anyway... "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curve Dominant Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 TEDSTER: PAY ATTENTION! Sorry, bro, no flames intended. I posted that I won't play in COVER BANDS. I often do covers live, most recently a sublime tune by Gil Scott Heron called "Spirits." Also, a somewhat cubist version of "Who Do Ya Love." One of the best concerts I ever saw was George Michael's Cover 2 Cover tour. I was up stomping my feet, clapping and singing everyone of those tunes throughout the entire show. Man, the hot women at that show, and all there with their daughters...I was like a rooster in a chicken coop! YEAH, BABY! PS: if you get a tepid reaction to your originals, that means you have to work on your songwriting skills. 'Nuff said. [This message has been edited by Curve Dominant (edited 11-29-2000).] Eric Vincent (ASCAP) www.curvedominant.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Okay, I gotcha covered...uh... I see whatchagettinat now... "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphajerk Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 "They play something off their latest CD (the one they were touring to promote)...verrry tepid reaction. Not because it wasn't good." um, yeah it is why. everything they have done since lead zep has blown chunks. i hate cover bands. i want to see something original [aside from a weird cover like ween covers "let me lick your pussy"] worst show i EVER saw was DogSHIT [keanu reeves band] but there were SO MANY hot chicks there in F'Me outfits. like a kid in a candy store. i was on the guest list, otherwise i would have never gone. alphajerk FATcompilation "if god is truly just, i tremble for the fate of my country" -thomas jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 "Everything since Zep has blown chunks"... Well, perhaps, but any band that goes on the road to promote new material, if the new stuff hasn't been played to death by the local radio stations, then the crowd would rather hear the band do their old stuff. "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Not saying necessarily I'd like to hear all old favorites, but the masses. And when the masses are fired up, it kicks... "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphajerk Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 i do know what you are saying. some friends of mine though when they do their older material, the crowd is in total sing along mode but when they play new stuff [which they do every show i have been to] the crowd goes NUTS, they feel special i think hearing new stuff thats unreleased. but one of the few that i can say that for. alphajerk FATcompilation "if god is truly just, i tremble for the fate of my country" -thomas jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicMan Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Curve, Alpha, I have a G4, PhotoSHop, Quark, Illustrator... Just started learning HTML. I think that there are a lot of similarities between graphic design and music production. Curve, I agree. My insitincts tell me that it might be a drag sometimes, but I just gotta do it. It is like a biological need to produce music. I really don't have any other way of making a name for myself locally,(and eventually nationally) if I don't start somewhere. Opening my studio to other musicians and projects, good or bad, is the only way I can think of to improve my ear and my skills. I think of it as my college. Tedster, Thanks for the warm welcome. -John My Music Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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