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Anyone familiar with Spock's Beard


lug

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and would like to suggest a first CD?

You can stop now -jeremyc

STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring

lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum

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Can't help you with any CDs, but I have to say that Spock's Beard is a cool band, I saw them open for Dream Theater a few years ago. I think the lineup has changed a bit since then (something about religion - wont touch that one with a 10 foot pole), so the newer stuff might be a bit different...
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Yeah, we played with them years ago.

 

They were a last-minute "headliner" on one of our shows... They didn't go over well.

 

They're proggy and sound kinda like Yes or some other band from 1973. As I recall, most of the material was filled with "look at me" moments, but not a lot for the non-musician listeners. I got a few of their discs when I was writing for a music magazine, and I must say.... it didn't vary much from track to track, album to album. I'd say it's safe to buy pretty much any disc.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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I love them and think they are among the finest of the current "prog" bands today. A couple good albums to start with would be "Kindness of Strangers" or "V" (that's the Roman numeral five, not the letter v). If you want a really proggy concept album, the 2-disc "Snow" is excellent but not for people with short attention spans. "Beware of Darkness" is great too.

 

The original singer and main writer, Neal Morse, has left the band and the drummer, Nick D'Virgilio is now the lead singer. I can't say I got as much into the new stuff since the writing is quite different, but there is much to appreciate nonetheless. Personally, I prefer Neal Morse's Beatle-esque songwriting, as well as his singing, to the drummer's. I think the melodic writing is what makes them such a wonderful band, that and the great musicianship. The bass work is most excellent, Dave Meros can be like Chris Squire one moment and Jaco the next.

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Thanks guys. I heard a short clip and swore someone had stolen Chris Squire's rig. :D

You can stop now -jeremyc

STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring

lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum

I'm not sure any argument can top lug's. - Sweet Willie

 

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As I recall, most of the material was filled with "look at me" moments, but not a lot for the non-musician listeners.
Well, I don't know about that. Not to start a fight here, but Why does Mike Portnoy play the way he does? Because he can. Why do I play the way I do? Because I can. I recently recorded a CD with Ryo Okumoto (of Spock's Beard) that will come out in 2005. Great musicians do what they do. You use as many colors as you want to paint a picture, and whether it's a simple charcoal drawing or a vivid oil on canvas, both are valid methods of creating art.

 

Spock's is a great band, flying the Prog flag high for all to see. If you don't like Prog rock, you won't get Spock's Beard. If you do, I would recommend "V" as a good introduction to them. I also like "Day for Night", and "Snow". Their 1st CD, "The Light" is also really interesting.

 

Neal Morse was the main guy in Spock's as lead vocalist, primary writer, and on guitar and keys. He is an astoundingly talented musician, as are all the guys in that band. Neal is also a devout Christian. He left the band after the release of Snow to pursue contemporary Christian music. His CD "Testimony" is brilliant, if you like Christian Prog Rock. Yes, there is a sub-genre of CCR with a number of bands doing just that.

 

Spock's released "Euphoria" after Neal's departure to mixed reviews. They are releasing a new CD called "Octane" in late February 2005.

 

If you like Prog rock, I would also recommend the "Transaltantic" CD, which is a collaboration between Neal Morse, Mike Portnoy, and some other top notch guys from various Prog bands. It's sort of a super group kind of record.

 

I like all kinds of music, Prog Rock, Modern Country, Metal, Blues, it doesn't matter. What does matter is whether the people making that music have their heart in it.

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Just imagine... once upon a time, prog bands were able to fill stadia. The ticket demand was so great that bands like ELP and Yes would sell out 60,000 seat venues.

 

Not all those attendees were musicians. The MUSIC once appealed to the masses - that it no longer does says far more about the masses than about the music, or about the musicians performing that music.

Originally posted by GTRBass:

As I recall, most of the material was filled with "look at me" moments, but not a lot for the non-musician listeners.
Well, I don't know about that. Not to start a fight here, but Why does Mike Portnoy play the way he does? Because he can. Why do I play the way I do? Because I can.

I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist.

 

This ain't no track meet; this is football.

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Well, I don't know about that. Not to start a fight here, but Why does Mike Portnoy play the way he does? Because he can. Why do I play the way I do? Because I can. I recently recorded a CD with Ryo Okumoto (of Spock's Beard) that will come out in 2005. Great musicians do what they do. You use as many colors as you want to paint a picture, and whether it's a simple charcoal drawing or a vivid oil on canvas, both are valid methods of creating art.

Spock's is a great band, flying the Prog flag high for all to see. If you don't like Prog rock, you won't get Spock's Beard. If you do, I would recommend "V" as a good introduction to them. I also like "Day for Night", and "Snow". Their 1st CD, "The Light" is also really interesting.

Neal Morse was the main guy in Spock's as lead vocalist, primary writer, and on guitar and keys. He is an astoundingly talented musician, as are all the guys in that band. Neal is also a devout Christian. He left the band after the release of Snow to pursue contemporary Christian music. His CD "Testimony" is brilliant, if you like Christian Prog Rock. Yes, there is a sub-genre of CCR with a number of bands doing just that.

Dude... No fight here.

 

I never said the band wasn't valid. I "get" prog. I just don't think Spock's Beard offers much innovation to the genre. For all of the band's progressive (and clearly advanced) musicianship, I don't feel that SB does much to improve on a sound created by bands like Yes or Rush. It still sounds like 1973 to me, but I think the original artists did it with better songs as their musical framework. Just my opinion.

 

And boy... Spock's Beard had a rough time the night they headlined with us... there were about 15 or so hardcore SB fans in front of the stage, but everyone else bugged out or stood around yelling at SB to stop playing. Hey, I think every band has nights like that. I remember being unimpressed with the band's tunes, but having a lot of respect for the musicians' abilities. After they played, I shook the singer's hand and apologized for the "unpleasant element" in the crowd. He seemed like a nice guy, and he seemed genuinely happy to be complimented by another musician.

 

I agree with you, though... musicians do what they do. My thing might not be your thing, etc, but it's what I do, and I don't make apologies for it.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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Originally posted by coyote:

Just imagine... once upon a time, prog bands were able to fill stadia. The ticket demand was so great that bands like ELP and Yes would sell out 60,000 seat venues.

 

Not all those attendees were musicians. The MUSIC once appealed to the masses - that it no longer does says far more about the masses than about the music, or about the musicians performing that music.

I believe I read that the median music purchasers today are 13 years old girls. I think this has more to do with the complexity of music today than anything else.

You can stop now -jeremyc

STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring

lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum

I'm not sure any argument can top lug's. - Sweet Willie

 

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I think a lot of social/cultural issues come to play as to why Prog Rock, Jazz, etc, is no longer in vogue. There was a time when the serious guys were treated with more interest by the public. Today, it's a very small audience that listens to progressive music of any kind.

 

Sorry, but I hardly consider Eminem progressive. I don't mean to knock anyone, but so much music today is made by talented guys who really aren't very educated musicians.

 

They rarely teach music appreciation in schools today. I was exposed to so much brilliance (Beethoven, Bach, Mozart, Charlie Parker, Weather Report) that my circle of friends would never have litsened to. Do kids have that opportunity anymore? For me that's where I learned that Beethoven, Bach and Mozart were as valid to me as Led Zeppelin, AC/DC and Rush.

 

It's a shame that so much beautiful music is going virtually unheard because of corporate policies pandering to the lowest common denominator.

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Thanks for your inputs. Just ordered Snow and Beware of Darkness. Haven't listened to anything in the vein in quite a while so this should be interesting.

You can stop now -jeremyc

STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring

lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum

I'm not sure any argument can top lug's. - Sweet Willie

 

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I gotta agree with Coyote overall. I first heard about SB due to the Transatlantic projects, as I'm a big Marillion fan and their bassist, Pete Trewavas, was in Transatlantic. (Check out the latest Marillion disc, Marbles!)

As far as SB goes, I think "Day For Night" is a great starting point. It has it's really proggy moments, but they're surrounded by "pleasant" easily accessable tunes like "Skin" and "Distance to the Sun". "Snow" is a wonderful album too. Their last one, "Feel Euphoria" is good and not as far removed as you might think with the loss of a principle member. Dave Merose knows when to pump and groove, and when to show off his chops.

"Am I enough of a freak to be worth paying to see?"- Separated Out (Marillion)

NEW band Old band

 

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Originally posted by GTRBass:

If you like Prog rock, I would also recommend the "Transaltantic" CD, which is a collaboration between Neal Morse, Mike Portnoy, and some other top notch guys from various Prog bands. It's sort of a super group kind of record.
There are two Transatlantic CDs, "SMPTe" and "Bridge Across Forever" and they are great. Very melodic and interesting writing. The fabulous Pete Trewavas on bass guitar :cool:
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Sorry, but I hardly consider Eminem progressive. I don't mean to knock anyone, but so much music today is made by talented guys who really aren't very educated musicians.

I don't think anyone would try to argue that Eminem is a progressive musician. He's not. He's rapper with an interesting approach and lots of controversial material that makes him stand out from the crowd. He was very lucky to hook up with Dr. Dre at the right time to launch his career.

 

I agree that a lot of music today is being made by talented people who aren't educated musicians... but I think that's a good thing rather than a bad thing. It really depends on your perspective. I can appreciate music created by people who went to spent ages learning theory, etc, and I can also appreciate the stuff that comes from kids who are just playing what they hear in their heads, but I don't make a judgement that one is better than another based on what I know about their musical educationI base my opinions on what I hear from them. If I think what they do is interesting, different or at least what I feel is a decent representation of their style, I'll probably like it.

 

I think the era when prog rock filled stadiums was a vastly different time. The music biz was different, and the average music consumer was only aware of a few available music options because it was more difficult to seek out alternatives to the music put out by the major labels. I don' t think the music was better or that people were smarter... it was just a different time.

 

Lastly.. beauty, like art, is very subjective.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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Actually, there was a vast array of music put out by major labels in those days. And in many cases, they allowed artists to mature through a series of albums instead of demanding an instant megahit & dropping those who don't produce such a hit.

 

As to the quality of the music, I beg to differ. There is indeed a qualitative difference between "Close To The Edge" and some bunch of maniacs shouting CookieMonster vocals & pounding the snot out of d-tuned guitars as they jump around the stage. Man, everything's happening on that stage but music.

Originally posted by CMDN:

I think the era when prog rock filled stadiums was a vastly different time. The music biz was different, and the average music consumer was only aware of a few available music options because it was more difficult to seek out alternatives to the music put out by the major labels. I don' t think the music was better or that people were smarter... it was just a different time.

 

Lastly.. beauty, like art, is very subjective.

I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist.

 

This ain't no track meet; this is football.

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Actually, there was a vast array of music put out by major labels in those days. And in many cases, they allowed artists to mature through a series of albums instead of demanding an instant megahit & dropping those who don't produce such a hit.

As to the quality of the music, I beg to differ. There is indeed a qualitative difference between "Close To The Edge" and some bunch of maniacs shouting CookieMonster vocals & pounding the snot out of d-tuned guitars as they jump around the stage. Man, everything's happening on that stage but music.

Well I do agree that the major labels don't give artists much of a chance to mature or grow without an immediate monster hit these days, but I don't necessarily agree about the "vastness" of musical options available to music fans back in the day compared to present times. While there were a lot of albums released by majors back then, there are certainly far more varied choices available now. That was my point.

 

Finding a qualitative difference between Yes and Death or Meshuggah is absolutely subject to personal taste. Let's not debase a whole genre of music while having this discussion, ok? It's one thing to not like something and say so... it's another to say it's not music. That's just unfair and kind of narrow-minded. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it invalid.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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I agree it was a great episode.

 

I've never heard the band.

 

You'd think after that, I'd be done, but nooooo.

Lug - hope you enjoy the CDs.

 

1973. Ah yes. I remember it like it was 31 years ago. For most of the younger folks here, you can't imagine how different the times were. The variety of music in those days was astounding. Not unlike today, there were trends and "cool bands". The bands that rode the trend-waves were more diverse, and people tried out lots of different stuff (music - I mean music). Many people went places they might not get to today. Still, there were times when artists went, and the crowd didn't go with them. Some recovered, some didn't. I liked Yes, but Topographic was not a big hit amongst my otherwise-progressive friends. Many of us couldn't keep up with other bands like King Crimson and ELP and Camel. These are bands that primarily appeal to musicians now, but Crimson sold an awful lot of "Court Of The Crimson King" to just about everybody.

 

It was a different time.

 

Tom

www.stoneflyrocks.com

Acoustic Color

 

Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt

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But I like Yes AND modern Metal!!! Is that OK???

 

That's why think Devin Townsend (DTB, Strapping Young Lad)is possibly one of the few truly progressive guys around today. To my ear, he combines elements of classic Yes and modern metal like Disturbed, or Slipknot. Check out Terria or Accelerated Evolution if you're curious about what I'm talking' bout. :thu:

 

For the curious, her's a link to I.O.A. the home of much of modern Prog Rock:

http://www.insideoutmusic.com/

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I think I'm with Tom on this. I have many old records (remember them?) , and the inner sleeves (remember those?) tell the story.

 

Yes, Bread, Johnny Cash, CCR, King Crimson, various Classical composers and artists, Johnny Mathis, Frank Sinatra, Black Sabbath... It goes on and on.

And all of this might be on the inner sleeve for a Carpenters or Dean Martin record.

 

Much variety, marketed broadly.

 

Peace,

 

wraub

 

I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here.

 

 

 

 

 

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I ain't knockin' all modern music. There's a fair amount of good stuff being released nowadays. As far as new metal I can dig some PerfectCircle, and even some Korn. But so much of the remainder is unlistenable, and seemingly all of that is the stuff you now find on the vidchannels such as Uranium & Headbanger's Ball.

I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist.

 

This ain't no track meet; this is football.

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But I like Yes AND modern Metal!!! Is that OK???

That's why think Devin Townsend (DTB, Strapping Young Lad)is possibly one of the few truly progressive guys around today. To my ear, he combines elements of classic Yes and modern metal like Disturbed, or Slipknot. Check out Terria or Accelerated Evolution if you're curious about what I'm talking' bout.

Yep. I wish more musicians liked more different kinds of music. There are quite a few artists mixing genres and feels in interesting ways. Ever hear Candiria? That band is nutsone minute they're jamming to a really loose jazz groove, the next they're playing math metal at warp speeds... and then over to a totally genuine hip-hop feel... with a righteous MC... all in one song.

 

While I completely respect bands like this, I can't say I really enjoy listening to them much. I get bored with all the craziness... it annoys me. I feel the same way about Yes' "Topographical Oceans" and Rush's "YYZ," etc.

 

I have SYL's last disc. Townsend has his moments for sure. I wish his songs hung from stronger hooks, though.

 

Coyote...

As always, there's a ton opf crap out there sitting right alongside the good stuff. I think one of the coolest thing we can do as musicians is be patient enough to sort through a bit of it in order to see if there's anything cool in it. Heck... I even snagged a chunk of "Heart Of The Sunrise" for one of my band's tunes... that riff sits right next to a Black Flag moment, which leads into a very Helmet-like thing... and I even added a Dick Dale guitar bit for fun.

 

But I'm probably the only guy who'd pick all of those elements out.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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My point wasn't that no good stuff exists anymore (some does exist). My point was that, as far as pop culture goes, today's good stuff might as well not exist - and that 30 years ago that statement was definitely not true, that in those days pop culture was much more prone to embrace music that required a bit of actual attention.

Originally posted by CMDN:

Coyote...

As always, there's a ton opf crap out there sitting right alongside the good stuff.

I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist.

 

This ain't no track meet; this is football.

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Originally posted by CMDN:

a Black Flag moment
I love those. Had one the other night when my wife told me Henry Rollins had a film review show.

Spock's Beard: I've only heard one of their songs on a compilation, I don't remember it.

"Start listening to music!".

-Jeremy C

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I just find these "culture was better in my era" arguments so predictable and depressing. I got it from my parents and their friends when I was a kid. Bands like The Beatles and Stones "couldn't play" and "couldn't sing". Not like Basie, Glenn Miller, Benny Goodman, Sinatra, Ella or Nat King Cole. You could not call that noise music. Just exploiting teenagers too dumb/credulous to know better.

 

I got it from music teachers. It was the end of culture when even kids with some musical ability were buying albums by Jimi Hendrix, Cream and Yes instead of listening to Bach and Beethoven. It was all about fashion and image nowadays, nothing to do with music or talent.

 

Now it seems it's my generation's turn. It's all image. The kids are dumb. Their heroes have no talent. It all sounds the same. Rapping is not music. The lyrics are offensive and encourage anti-social behaviour (cf Frank Zappa, The Rolling Stones). They don't play "real instruments" requiring a proper musical training and skill. For my parents generation, electric guitars into a distorting Marshall amplifier were not "real instruments". Electric basses were not "real instruments". And so the dreary cycle of narcissism goes on from generation to generation.

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I knew some young punk would say that ;)

Originally posted by bc:

I just find these "culture was better in my era" arguments so predictable and depressing. And so the dreary cycle of narcissism goes on from generation to generation.

I happen to agree. And BTW, so did Jimi Hendrix. When he was being turned into a star in England in 1966, they told him to sing. His reaction? "I'm not a singer." The reply? "You'll sing how you sing." He subsequently phoned home and told his folks "They don't want real singers anymore".

 

Point being that indeed, there's been a steady decline in the musicality of the material purchased by the public. The Stones riffing on I-IV-V Chuck Berry stuff were definitely inferior to Porter, Mingus and Hammerstein. As a fan of rock AND jazz, I have no trouble aknowledging that one is generally less musical than the other. The bands that influenced Spock's Beard tried to turn that trend around, and succeeded for awhile.

I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist.

 

This ain't no track meet; this is football.

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Originally posted by coyote:

Point being that indeed, there's been a steady decline in the musicality of the material purchased by the public.

 

...As a fan of rock AND jazz, I have no trouble aknowledging that one is generally less musical than the other.

As a fan of rock, jazz, classical, hip-hop, various world musics, etc., I would put forth that it may now be necessary for you to define "musicality" and "musical". What makes one genre or artist more "musical" than another genre or artist?

 

I think I know what you mean, but I really believe that you're probably using "musical" imprecisely and grossly as a generalization for more specific concepts that have to do with things like complexities of harmonizations, etc.

 

I will also refer everyone participating in this thread to my sig -- no, not the part about Bumpcity, but the quote from Jeremy Cohen.

 

Peace.

--SW

spreadluv

 

Fanboy? Why, yes! Nordstrand Pickups and Guitars.

Messiaen knew how to parlay the funk.

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My music teachers didn't distinguish between Hendrix's guitar playing and his singing. They would not have thought he merited that kind of attention. My parents and their friends didn't dislike The Rolling Stones because they used too few chords but because they made a noise that did not sound like music at all to their ears. They'd have thought exactly the same about King Crimson.
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bc, I don't know if your comments were directed at me (as well as others). There are three clarifications:

 

1. I think that the audience of listeners swings over time. It's the standard pendulum thing where we go from times of openness to times of limited listening. These swings sometimes coincide with other cultural forces, but sometimes it's not so clear. I think 1973 (to pick a year, but it was wider than that) was more of an open period.

 

2. I have found music that I like in all periods.

 

3. The 60s/early 70s are important to me because I was growing up in that time. I've come to recognize that music (as well as other events) during the "formative" years holds it's significance throughout many people's lives. This particular discussion is about a warmly remembered time.

 

Tom

www.stoneflyrocks.com

Acoustic Color

 

Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt

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I guess this whole thing basically comes down to individual perspectives.

 

I find something appealing in almost any kind of art, and I don't make big distinctions between the genres of the stuff I like.

A Ray Harryhousen Frankenstein Monster painting could stand in The Louvre right next to The Mona Lisa as far as I'm concerned, and I'd read Stephen King hot on the heels of Shakespeare. I don't see Porter or Beethoven as "better" than Biohazard or Nuclear Assault.

 

To me, they're just different, not better or worse.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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