pickup resistance vs sound quality / quantity

[cygnus4001]

Here's one for the electronics wizards in the audience.

 

I am shopping for pickup(s) for a custom fretless and I am curious about how the resistance of the pickup affects the sound I will get out of them.

 

In my searching through vendor sites I find references to pickup resistances ranging from 5k through 9k +/- but no explanation as to how the difference affects playability or sound quality

 

I understand the advantages of an active system but I would prefer to go with a passive package running just a volume control and let the EQ on my amp do the work or (later) invest in an outboard preamp or DI box, plus fewer knobs (cleaner look), less wiring, no battery box, etc.

 

Anyone know the answer or suggest an online resource?

 

Thanks,

D

[g.]

There's no total ONE-to-ONE corrspondence (though some of the makers would have you believe otherwise or are too unsophisticated to know better) between resistance and the way a pickup sounds. Too many ways to build a pickup, too many magnetic approaches, Eddie patterns, cancellations, and materials.

 

A better indicator is resonant peak stated in KHz, or milliHenries. This won't tell you everything but it does kind of show where brunt of the response curve might lay.

[g.]

Some of the best resources online are pickup manufactuers who share a little info. Unfortunately, some of the worst offenders in the "use junk science to tell lies with" category are also ...PICKUP MANUFACTURERS. But read enough of sites and google finds by guys like Bill Bartolini, Bill Lawrence, Chris Kinman, and you begin to get an idea.

[dcr]

Can't help with your question...but I wanted to mention that I've been to North Pole, AK! (My sister went to UAF.)

 

Welcome, Cygnus!

[g.]

Oh, yeah - if a pickup manufactuer uses descriptives like "buttery", "punchy", "throaty", "phat", well then - you don't need to even think about it or hear it to know IT's THE BEST!!! ; }

 

I just love it when they say things like crisp, articulate lows. Well, DUH - lows are LOW. Crispness and articulation come from upper mids and treble frequencies ... You could just assemble a database (databass?) of all the words a would-be muso might want to hear - and then use a Racter to write the ad copy... Come to think of it, an awful lot of those reviews in Bass Player seem like hey have one on the payroll ; }

 

Punchy, throaty, buttery goodness that comes from a crisply articulate sizzle and goes to a supersonic roar... Ahm, yessuh!

[Tom Capasso]

Much as I respect greenboy, I think he's way off the mark.

 

Please put Bill Lawrence or Lindy Fralin PUPs in my Christmas bass. I've been a good boy - I'm sure my file (databass - I like that) at the North Pole will show as much. I didn't realize cygnus was the replacement for Kris Kringle.

 

Tom

[way2fat]

Welcome Cygnus- are you stationed at Eilson? I was at Wainwright 77-78. Great duty, no?

[Fred TBP]

Speaking as an electronics dropout (think Grandpa Munster): EVERYTHING has resistance; each componet, as it ages, affects the final circuit. But there's been enough R&D and options out there telling me it works, and the only thing I need to know is if it sounds good, and I don't mind changing batteries every year as I have to change strings, spritz pots and adjust intonations more often than that. Go thou and do likewise.

 

As for passives, Dr. Z is as-always-on-target with his recommendations. I'd add Bartolinis, and skip the preamp, but be sure to get the right pickup for your string spacing.

[rumpelstiltskin.]

Originally posted by greenboy:

Some of the best resources online are pickup manufactuers who share a little info. Unfortunately, some of the worst offenders in the "use junk science to tell lies with" category are also ...PICKUP MANUFACTURERS. But read enough of sites and google finds by guys like Bill Bartolini, Bill Lawrence, Chris Kinman, and you begin to get an idea.

to be fair, i almost got a magnetics design job by stating that magnetics design is almost sort a black art. because it is. like you've said, there are so many things going on inside a coil that we know exist and can measure, but we can't really predict very well. much of magnetics design is done by experience and iteration.

 

in other words, sometimes they have to use pretty words to describe what they do and make it understandable.

 

add kent armstrong to the list. every bass i've played with kent armstrong pickups sounded incredible. apparently, kent or his son also made the original reverend rumblefish pickups, which are pretty sweet. kent learned the craft from bill lawrence, and now kent's son does the work.

 

robb.

[g.]

hey robb,

 

You might of missed what I've said about Kent and his son (and their deseased pop, Dan, who also studied with Bill Lawrence). They are indeed some of the best at custom work. I think I mentioned this maybe a few weeks ago when pulling up Q-Tuner pickups.

 

The Q-Tuner pickup site is an adventure in mystic technobabble. Laced with it actually. But beneath the jungle of junky wierd science, the site presents a couple of valid ideas for those with patience and background. I'm convinced that there is a new pickup design here well worth the expense, one that can sort of fill Lane Poor's spot.

 

Bill Bartolini is also a real technical resource, but some of his best stuff isn't even linked in his site map. Maybe he just put it up for me, and sent me the links in email, so I won't hsare these somewhat unfinished comparative charts here... But he is as methodical as time allows, much in keeping with his research on scale length with Novax.

 

If only Chris Kinman would join the fray for noiseless single coils I think the pickin's would be sweet indeed.

[rumpelstiltskin.]

there's a guy i know who is, hopefully, still selling his schecter deleo which has replacement pickups by bill lawrence. he says it sounds really incredible.

 

i caught what you said about armstrong in the other thread, but not everyone has the exhaustive memory that i have. it's always nice to update every so often.

 

robb.

[cygnus4001]

Thanks ya'll, 'specially greenboy, for passing on enough info to get the question answered without making me break out some arcane physics book to decipher the solution.

 

Sounds like I'm back to picking out pickups based on how purty they look, don't worry I'll stick with a brand name, Barts etc, and we'll just see what happens from there.

 

I've seen reference to something called a Lace Sensor. Is that just a brand name or a variation on the concept of wire wrapped magnets or... ?

 

Winter arrived here at North Pole just after I wrote the original post, only 8 more months til breakup, yee haw.

 

Nope, not a military fella as queried, just a transplanted Canuck enjoying the good life in The Great White North.