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Pro Tools LE for WIN XP now available!


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[quote]Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe: [b]Biggest news: 32 Tracks![/b][/quote]Wow, now Digi is *almost* as competitive as the rest of the world :p . Just think what a man could do with 32 tracks....Just yankin' yer chain, Phil :D .
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Phil - thanks for the heads up. Are there any advantages you see over using Sonar or Logic? I use Nuendo and Sonar. Do you have to use a specific sound card/interface? What about plug-ins? Seems like you have to have RTAS? Do you have this yet? How is it working? Thanks.

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If I may- Yes, the Digi systems use propriatory hardware and require one of their interfaces whether it's the M-box, 001, TDM/Mix or HD. The only exception is Pro Tools Free and that's a POS in my experience.

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[b]Alndln[/b], the new .WAV drivers are available for the Digi 001 / AM III cards, but they give you only 2in / 2 out. As far as I can tell, the PT LE software still addresses the Digi 001 directly. [b]Steve[/b], I've always said it really depends on what your needs are and how you prefer working. I own Vegas, PT LE, Logic Platinum, Sonar and Acid, and IMO, when it comes to working with audio files, I prefer the PT interface. It is pretty darn fast... and that's coming from someone who flying on Logic since it came out. PT's MIDI is marginal at best. I miss the score display from Logic (since I read, I prefer that as a MIDI editor over the "piano roll" editor in PT). But I think overall, it's a pretty good program. I am glad to see Digidesign adding to its capabilities with more tracks... but as Stone said, the hardware still can't be expanded insofar as I/O is concerned. So I'd say if you're heavily into MIDI, get Logic / Sonar and if you're into more of the audio end, PT may be a worthy contender if you can deal with the I/O and track count limitations. At least that last one is up from the 24 it was yesterday. [b]Stone[/b] Of course you may :) Yeah, we were talking about that "POS" a couple of months ago... and although I worded it a bit more "PC" than you did, I said pretty much the same thing. A buddy of mine over at Yamaha saw it in the "On The Boards" section of EQ magazine this month and told me about it... I hadn't even noticed it... But overall, I gave Digidesign a nice little review for the Digi 001 stuff and a major thumbs down on that "POS". My buddy suggested I should be getting kickbacks from Digidesign. :eek: :) BTW, In case I have to say this for anyone, no I am NOT getting kickbacks from anyone. :)
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Hi everyone, I'm desperately holding back on getting my system (hard fight between Sonar, Logic and Pro Tools – though since I do mostly audio instead of midi, PT looks the most attractive) on the basis that with the digi001 rather long in the tooth, digidesign must be thinking of getting a new type of 001 on the market (sort of like an 18 input M-box!). Has anyone heard any rumours in that direction? I'd rather not spend the money on a 001 if it means dig will release a new I/O box of that type later in the year! Thanks all. Len
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[quote]Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe: [b][b]Stone[/b] Of course you may :) Yeah, we were talking about that "POS" a couple of months ago... and although I worded it a bit more "PC" than you did, I said pretty much the same thing. [/b][/quote]Awwww man -- I gotta jump in here and simply disagree. :D Yes, Pro Tools Free is not perfect (I originally put it on Craig's "Gear that sucks" thread because PTF would never boot up on two different hardware configurations I had), but now that I got it to work with my current setup, it's now favorite piece of audio software. If you can live with the limitations and you're willing to come up with some creative solutions to the limitations (i.e. you need to monitor the signal you're recording via a hardware mixer -- *not* via PTF because of the latency, use playlists to get "virtual" tracks, etc.), I think it's a great tool [i]under the right circumstances.[/i] It's certainly not an all-in-one solution for everybody, and I'd never use it for mixing or for doing a session in a commercial studio, but after spending last weekend evaluating other DAW programs, PTF turned out to be the best one for tracking overdubs. That's important to me, as... tracking overdubs is where I spend most of my time when recording. :) (I'm going to use Cubase for tracking drums, since PTF can't handle more than 2 inputs at a time. Likewise, I'll be using Cubase for mixing because of the track count and signal routing options available in that program.) If Digi released a Pro Tools LE version for the PC that worked with ASIO or other faster drivers (i.e. non-Digi hardware), at least 8 simultaneous recordable tracks, and still had the limitation of 32 (or maybe even 24) tracks, I'd gladly pay $300-$500 for it, even though Cubase/Sonar/Logic would technically allow me to do more. I dig Pro Tools' user interface that much. I don't wanna buy Digi's hardware -- I want to use the hardware I already have, but with Digi's software. So if anyone from Digi is reading this, you've got at least one customer who is interested... :)
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Hey Phil, What would you say are the major advantages to processing audio in Pro Tools LE as opposed to Sonar 2.0? I'm getting along pretty well w/ Sonar; when I work at places that have Pro Tools I'm not at a loss, but I haven't had the chance to really push the program like I have w/ Sonar and Logic, so I'm not really sure what I'm missing out on. And what exactly is the plug in scene for LE- which types can you use, and which can you not?

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[quote]Originally posted by GT3: [b]Hey Phil, What would you say are the major advantages to processing audio in Pro Tools LE as opposed to Sonar 2.0? I'm getting along pretty well w/ Sonar; when I work at places that have Pro Tools I'm not at a loss, but I haven't had the chance to really push the program like I have w/ Sonar and Logic, so I'm not really sure what I'm missing out on. And what exactly is the plug in scene for LE- which types can you use, and which can you not?[/b][/quote]I'm not Phil, but I might be able to answer your questions, being that Pro Tools Free is essentially the same program as Pro Tools LE... The biggest advantage to Pro Tools processing is probably the editing features themselves, not the effect processing. I didn't get far enough into Sonar to really check out the editing features (I was turned off by Sonar for not having standard rewind or fast forward buttons) so I can't say how it compares, but I can say the audio editing in PTF is miles above the version of Cubase I'm using (3.7r2, which I think is pretty similar to version 5). To my way of thinking, the program is laid out very logically, the keyboard shortcuts make a lot of sense, and editing is extremely flexible and intuitive. That's why I dig it so much. If you're already comfortable editing or recording in another program, you may not have a lot of reason to use PT, IMO. The plugins are the Digidesign RTAS type, which would mean repurchasing any plugins you use in a RTAS format (assuming a RTAS version exists). Phil told me on another thread there's no VST/DX->RTAS converter plugin out there; I don't see a technical reason why not, but I have a feeling all RTAS plugins released to the market might have to get Digi's approval first...? (Ahhh -- marketing! :D )
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Posterchild, I am glad you're able to get PT Free to do what you need it to do. Unfortunately you're in the minority here. When it was first released, I D/L it. And it promptly TRASHED my C drive. I wasn't alone in that either... Digi fixed the problem, and I did a re- D/L, and had problems with it. The only machine (and I installed it into SEVERAL) that I was able to get it running half way reliably on was Dryden Mitchell's Sony Vaio laptop. Everything else that I tried either wouldn't run it, or ran it at unacceptably slow speeds, or it was buggy and crashed a lot. I have heard from others who were, like you, able to get it up and running and were able to get it functioning well enough to be productive with it for things like VO or basic editing. But again, they're far outnumbered by people who have had problems... at least from the people I've discussed it with. Unfortunately, because of those problems, a lot of people have come to the conclusion that PT software doesn't work well on the PC platform. IMO, this is just not the case on DIGI 001 (and higher) systems. They work much more reliably than PT Free does. As much as it pains me to admit it, it's been more "rock solid" than even Logic Platinum... and I've been using that program since it was first released. It certainly would be nice if Digidesign allowed us to use 3rd party I/O cards with their software. I really like the software (with some MIDI reservations), but I'm only "so-so" on their hardware. But it does work rock solid with their software, which is the nice upside to having hardware / software that was designed / built by one company to work well together. As far as PT Free, you have to remember that it has another potentially serious limitation: Only 2 channels of I/O, and it only does 16 bit recording. But I've heard some very nice 16 bit recordings, so it really all comes down to what you're using for I/O and how well you can put that to use at its maximum potential. I guess the bottom line is that PT Free is potentially a nice way to get into PT for no cost, and if you can get it to work reliably, then it can be a good way to get a idea of how the PT experience "feels"... but if you CAN'T get it working well, or it feels slow or clunky, then don't feel bad because that's happened to a lot of people. As I've said before, the quality and reliability of the "PT Experience" definitely improves as you move up the ladder from PT Free. So in that respect, I think that PT Free as a "advertisement" for PT in general was a misguided effort on Digi's part insofar as it has given many potential PT users a inaccurate idea of PT's performance and stability. Again, I'm glad it's working well for you. Go buy a lottery ticket! ;)
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[quote]Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe: [b]The only machine (and I installed it into SEVERAL) that I was able to get it running half way reliably on was Dryden Mitchell's Sony Vaio laptop. Everything else that I tried either wouldn't run it, or ran it at unacceptably slow speeds, or it was buggy and crashed a lot.[/b][/quote]I totally understand. Like I mentioned above, I tried it out on two different hardware configurations a couple years ago and couldn't get the dang thing to start up. I saved the install on a CD-R and, just for the heck of it, tried it out with my current configuration last week and it worked. So IMO it's definitely a crapshoot whether PTF works on someone's system... I must've gotten lucky this time out. (Perhaps I *should* buy a lottery ticket...? :D ) [quote]Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe: [b]As far as PT Free, you have to remember that it has another potentially serious limitation: Only 2 channels of I/O, and it only does 16 bit recording.[/b][/quote]Like I said above, I'd be using Cubase for tracking the stuff that requires more than two tracks (drums) and using PTF for overdubs. Being that I'm not working with a band (I'm playing all the instruments), I usually don't need more than one or two inputs at a time when doing overdubs. (Did I mention I mix in mono? :eek: ) Between doing some creative temp bouncing to get rough mono drum mixes into PTF, using PTF for overdubs and editing, then exporting the new overdubs back to Cubase (which only does 16 bit files anyway) for final mixing, I think this setup will work great in my situation. It may be totally inappropriate for someone else. I've been messing around with PTF for a week, trying out different features and seeing if I could wreck the thing... Only got it to crash once, and it was from doing something stupid that, in retrospect, I shouldn't have tried. Given my previous experiences trying to get the thing to run, I totally understand how someone could write off PTF as a POS. I did, anyway, in Craig's "Gear that sucks" thread. But it appears like it's now going to work for what I need it to do. Go figure!
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Taken from Digidesign's website: "The WaveDriver for third-party applications is not included in this download as it is no longer required to use Pro Tools LE with Digidesign hardware." Does this mean we can ue this new XP version with any interface now?

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Wow. That's sure the way it seems to read. About the ProTools editing... man, once you've got the hang of their Mix and Plug-in automation, that's it- If there is anything better, then it'd have to be a lot better to overcome the ability to interchange PT sessions from the 'big guys' studio to your at-home 001 or whatever else you might be running, then take it back to the main studio for final mixdown, etc... the interchangability makes it a major asset.... The MIDI is minimal, no arguement- an outboard sequencer or second computer running Logic or MOTU Digital Performer then connected to a PT system for mix/edit is a powerful setup. Lots of us are waiting for some heavy support from software makers now that the XP version of 'Tools LE supports Direct Connect, which allows integration of synths/sequencers right inside the PT platform.

"We are the Federales... You know, the Mounted Police..."

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Sure. Right here: http://www.digidesign.com/download/531winle/ Look under "Compatibility Information & System Requirements" The only drawback to this is that Digidesign doesnt sell the software by itself, do they?

"Meat is the only thing you need beside beer! Big hunks of meat and BEER!!...Lots of freakin' BEER."

"Hey, I'm not Jesus Christ, I can't turn water into wine. The best I can do is turn beer into urine." Zakk Wylde

 

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It also looks like the Bomb Factory plug-ins arent supported. Bummer! http://www.digidesign.com/compato/maindigi001win.html

"Meat is the only thing you need beside beer! Big hunks of meat and BEER!!...Lots of freakin' BEER."

"Hey, I'm not Jesus Christ, I can't turn water into wine. The best I can do is turn beer into urine." Zakk Wylde

 

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I think they used some fuzzy wording... the meaning I take from it is that the separate Digi Wave driver is not required to run Digi Hardware, since it's built in to the 5.3.1 package. In the Addendum for the manual they state it a different way: "The Digidesign WaveDriver is a two-channel, multimedia sound driver that allows third-party audio applications to record and play back through channels 1–2 of your Pro Tools|24 MIX, Pro Tools|24, Digi 001, or AudioMedia III system on Windows 2000 or Windows XP. The Digidesign WaveDriver is not required to use Pro Tools or Pro Tools LE." I think they're sticking to the propriatory hardware thing, too bad. The LE software is $50 if you don't already have 5.1, for all the good that'd be, w/o the hardware. :rolleyes: I agree it'd be way smart to release some x-compatable drivers.

"We are the Federales... You know, the Mounted Police..."

---"If you're the police, where are your badges?"

"Bodges?..."

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OK, now dwelling on this too much- You can run other audio programs through the Digi hardware without LE by virtue of the separate driver download... or the reverse, you can use the hardware without LE but you can't use lE without the hardware. "Let's see... you go the way we came, and we'll go the way you came..." -Sid Caesar in It's A Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, World

"We are the Federales... You know, the Mounted Police..."

---"If you're the police, where are your badges?"

"Bodges?..."

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[quote][i]Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe:[/i] Well, PT LE 5.3.1 is now available for Windows XP... Biggest news: 32 Tracks![/quote][b]Phil[/b], I agree. That's pretty big news. However, it's also big news in my book that Digidesign gave PC users this feature first. AFAIK, Digidesign went from being a Mac only company to a Mac first company. This sort of thing has never happened before! (Or did I miss something?) I wonder if the hold up on the Mac end is because Digidesign is waiting for OS X compatibility. Word on the street is that OS X support won't happen until Apple releases the next OS X version. I'm guessing that this will happen at next month's MacWorld. We'll see... Also, it's big news, IMO, that this new version includes support for the Digidesign/Focusrite Control|24 control surface and DigiTranslator 2.0 support. If this had happened a year ago, I might well have bought a Control|24. Instead, I spent a similar amount of money on a Speck Electronics XTRAMIX, two Speck Electronics ASC EQs, a Grace Design 101 mic pre, a FMR Really Nice Compressor, and a CM Labs Motor Mix. [b]Digidesign lost out on thousands of my dollars![/b] In many ways, I'm better off with what I bought, but there's a lot to be said for the all-in-one solution of the Control|24.

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[quote]Originally posted by Duhduh: [b]Taken from Digidesign's website: "The WaveDriver for third-party applications is not included in this download as it is no longer required to use Pro Tools LE with Digidesign hardware." Does this mean we can ue this new XP version with any interface now?[/b][/quote]Since the Digi-001 now uses WDM drivers that's the way I took it.And not just with an alternate 2 ch card either.They can put a tag in the driver code to identify wether it's their's or not(001),but thats about it.If this is true it's good news for people who have more prefereble hardware.RME with LE? Has a nice ring to it. ;)
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hey Phil how you doin? when you say you preffer pro-tools audio editing, do you mean that as a personal opinion you just enjoy the interface more or that pro-tools actually has audio editing features that rival the features in Sonar, i'm speaking of audio only. for me just the acid like sync abilities of Sonar make it a hard one to beat and I don't know pro tools so i can't compare but i've never heard anyone mention that it has features like that. you others using pro-tools, like to know your opinion too.
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hey Phil how you doin? when you say you preffer pro-tools audio editing, do you mean that as a personal opinion you just enjoy the interface more or that pro-tools actually has audio editing features that rival the features in Sonar, i'm speaking of audio only. for me just the acid like sync abilities of Sonar make it a hard one to beat and I don't know pro tools so i can't compare but i've never heard anyone mention that it has features like that. you others using pro-tools, like to know your opinion too.
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[quote]Originally posted by posterchild: [b][QUOTE]The plugins are the Digidesign RTAS type, which would mean repurchasing any plugins you use in a RTAS format (assuming a RTAS version exists). Phil told me on another thread there's no VST/DX->RTAS converter plugin out there; I don't see a technical reason why not, but I have a feeling all RTAS plugins released to the market might have to get Digi's approval first...? (Ahhh -- marketing! :D )[/b][/quote]I have read on these forums (if not these, than the DUC or Prosoundweb, you'd have to do a search) that there is a DirectConnect plug-in that will allow you to use VST plugins in PTLE (not sure if Mac only). It's a free application called "Ugly VST" or something like that - I have downloaded it but haven't tried it yet. art
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[quote]Originally posted by Alndln@hotmail.com: [b]Since the Digi-001 now uses WDM drivers that's the way I took it.And not just with an alternate 2 ch card either.They can put a tag in the driver code to identify wether it's their's or not(001),but thats about it.If this is true it's good news for people who have more prefereble hardware.RME with LE? Has a nice ring to it. ;) [/b][/quote]Has anyone tried the XP update yet? The Win2000 download [url=http://www.digidesign.com/download/winup.html]will be available on Monday[/url] . I'd be [i]*very*[/i] curious if you really can run PT LE via WDM with non-Digi hardware and low latency... Seems too good to be true... But five years ago you also would've never expected Digi to release a "free" Pro Tools either...
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"It's not necessary to use LE to run digidesign hardware." =You can use the separate driver download to run digidesign hardware.

"We are the Federales... You know, the Mounted Police..."

---"If you're the police, where are your badges?"

"Bodges?..."

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