Geting in the groove of things!

[PETE_COMBS]

I want to see the forum's suggestions on how they get in the groove of things when there playing and what agreat work out while in the "GROOVE"

[cruzbass]

I have read a book wich in part of it describes the 3 main kinds of strugle in playing music.

 

1) overstated passion: going overboard in expressing passion. unable to leave a musical passage alone, we soup it up, make a big deal of every up and down, and squeze out every litle expresive detail until the music can hardley breathe.

 

2)avoidance: "hey its no big deal", playing it too cool. we say to ourselves "i will just sit back and play the notes"-and thats about all that comes out is notes.

 

3)aggression: unable to take the heat of passion or the cool of avoidence, we somtimes use a macho aproach. "im just going to DO it", "im going to REALLY do it", this is ME playing and i know what im doing" BANG, CRASH! except that it starts to feel unpleasant after awhile. your body tightens up and the music ends up sounding rather harsh.

 

...so back to grooving. alot of the time we notice when a groove is happening rather than produce it ourselves. but the trick is letting that groove happen and not getting in its way.

[orphan wells]

after a few songs I'm usually warmed up. I've got my meter warm, my agression set, my dexterity working, and most importantly my ears are open. After that it's just a matter of knowing when to groove and when to shine. I think it's instinct really, but if you feel like playing the pocket, do it you can go wrong. If you feel like playing out do it but at the appropriate time. When the first set gets going i feel a little more agressive and try to play a litle to much but after a few groovin tunes then i get a better feel for things. Then it's groove time but watch out for my solos, ater playing the pocket for 5 minutes it's time to blow some people away.

[fig]

What keeps me from getting a groove is not having the tone set right. If the sound of my bass isn't sitting correctly with the other instruments, I kinda struggle. Not bad enough to be noticed, I think, but my groove just isn't to my satisfaction. I wonder how many other players tone affects their playing.

 

When that tone is there, though, that's when the zones come in. When the appropriate parts of the each song gets that hypnotic, repetitive quality to it. When you know you can throw in some fills or musical interludes at the most perfect times. Hard to describe, but once the tone's right for me, then it's like a good radio playing in my head, and I just drop it all in. That, for me, is when the groove happens.

[BenLoy]

You can't hold no groove if you ain't got no pocket.

[_Sweet Willie_]

Originally posted by BenLoy:

You can't hold no groove if you ain't got no pocket.

Preach, brutha, preach!

 

Personally, I use the mental imagery of lint -- the piece of lint that's so deep it doesn't come out when you reach in to dig for those last couple of pennies way at the bottom of your pocket -- you know, those pennies that have started to get sticky on the outside from the decomposition of that piece of gum you forgot about that is moving onto its next bizarre stage of life after hardening...well, you get the point.

 

Sorry, Pete, that probably wasn't the most useful post on this thread. Maybe it at least gave you a smile?

 

Peace.

[BenLoy]

When Pete plays with a good drummer, the concept of the groove and the pocket will fall right in his lap.

[fig]

Yeah, what Ben says. When you got a good drummer, it does kinda fall into place by itself.

 

There are times when the drummer is not so good. That's when I listen to that radio in my head and play from that. If the 'not so good' drummer is listening, he'll fall in with what you're doing. Great power in that. I've been able to correct a few drummers like that over the years. They like it, you like it, the groove is on and life is good. Pretty good reason to practice with a metronome or drum machine to really get your own timing down. Woohoo!

[...]

Originally posted by BenLoy:

When Pete plays with a good drummer, the concept of the groove and the pocket will fall right in his lap.

Most definately. Unless of course, if he suffers from the dreaded Lack of Groove. It pains me greatly to listen to a band where the drummer is layin' it down like a mofo and the bassist is just clueless. Sad really.

 

You can take this simple 3 question test to find out if you're super white-bread without the crust or if you're funky. Dig?

 

1. Do you find an overwhelming urge to clap on 1 & 3 (like my mother... jesus she's white)? If so, there is no hope for you.

 

2. When you think of James Brown, what's the first song that pops in your head? If it's "I Feel Good", you're white bread.

 

3. Do you equate slap/pop style playing with funk? I.E.- when talk about 'getting funky' does that mean you're going to play a slap/pop line? If so, burn your bass.

[Father Gino]

When I think of James Brown, I want to slap my mother on the 2 & 4. Is that right?

[Iceman Irwin]

One thing i hate that gets me off-groove is when my strings go cold. Literally.

I can't explain why but my hands has a problem communicating with cold steel...

Another is my tone... if i don't get a real cutting and phat tone to my likes, i lose my momentum to groove...

[jeremy c]

I'm shocked and disappointed by those of you who say you can't groove if you can't dial in "your sound".

 

C'mon, we're talking about a rhythmic feeling, a musical connection with other players. Your instrument is only a tool to do this with.

 

Forget your bass, play a tambourine or a cowbell, clap your hands. Lock your rhythm into the other players' parts.

 

Then go back to your bass. Forget all your riffs and techniques. Just play on the one. Find the exact space where your note truly belongs.

 

Everything else you play is just gravy. Hitting the one is the meat.

[fig]

No, Jeremy, when I don't have my tone, the rythym doesn't go out in left field. That was a joke, right?

 

You gotta admit, when you get your 'sound', things just seem a little more right with the world, wouldn't you agree?

 

....I knew you would....

[dcr]

For me, when the groove suffers it's for psychological reasons 99% of the time--just not having my head in the game, distracted, not concentrating on the feel. It's frustrating when that happens, but I usually catch myself early & things settle in.

 

That, and when I can't hear!

 

I wouldn't say that tone affects whether or not I can groove, but it sometimes affects the way that I groove. A while back I played a set with a rag under the strings at the bridge, & without even meaning to I started playing differently--it still grooved, but without as much sustain I found myself automatically playing to capitalize on punch, & liked the results. (I also find that muting often brings out even more of the logic in Jamerson's lines.) Often I'll choose a tone based on the way I think the song should feel, rhythmically. But while it's nice to have everything working together, I definitely agree that YOU have to control the groove, & not the instrument.

[jeremy c]

Sorry, Fig.

 

It's hard to tell from reading someone's post whether they were smiling when they wrote it.

 

And of course, when you get your perfect tone, you can do no wrong! (graemlin grin added to show my tone of voice )

[coyote]

Often, we can't hear because there's no groove!

 

Groove ain't just the bassist & drummer. It's each band member individually, and collectively. If the players' main priority is actively listening to each other, groove is almost automatic. That ability to listen is dependent on a few things:

-comfort with your instrument

-comfort with the material you're playing

-ego.

 

Yeah, you read that right. You gotta be egotistical enough to want to play well. Then keep in mind that everyone in the band, including yourself, plays better when y'all support each other. Listening surpasses dexterity as an ensemble musical skill.

[fig]

Yeah Jeremy, sometimes these posts are a little hard to interpret for humor. I still get flubbed on reading these sometimes, and worse yet, my responses lack sometimes in intent.

 

I think dcr put it in better words for me. Without the tone I feel is needed (which happens on occasion if I can't eq a room), I groove differently. Have to, as a matter of survival for the song.

[Father Gino]

Originally posted by coyote:

You gotta be egotistical enough to want to play well. Then keep in mind that everyone in the band, including yourself, plays better when y'all support each other. Listening surpasses dexterity as an ensemble musical skill.

I agree with all of that but you gotta watch that ego thing too. Playing well does not necessarily mean fast, complicated or out front. This applys to everybody in the band. Generally a handy exercise is to figure out what you're going to play on a song and then take out half of the notes.

 

Meanwhile, I can think of multitudeness reasons for not finding the goove: State of mind/body, what I just ate, what I didn't eat, gas (having nothing to do with gear), too much orgone, not enough orgon, uncomfortable shoes, etc.

[Tom Capasso]

At a jam recently, the leader pushed us from "Shotgun" into some individual solos (while he did completely fictitious introductions), and into something with a funkier groove. I'm not white bread, but I can barely spell funk. My first inclination was to panic and run out the door. But I remembered what I learned in some of the past "funky" threads - I whacked the 1, and went spare on the rest. Eventually I had something going that worked OK (the leader kept taking us up and down and in and out). After we finished, the keys guy (who is at least semi-pro) said he was impressed with my bass work.

 

Now if I can only do that everytime....

 

Tom

[ibescotty]

I think our current CD has some pocket but not enough. (I didn't record it except for back up vocals)

 

I aspire to add pocket to all of the songs we play. Sometimes I simplify the bass parts to accomplish that. If I have the option I'll pick the lowest notes I can for the fills. Unfortunately the keyboardist in our band has a busy left hand that interferes and forces me to play higher. I'm working on him though.

 

Gotta get him some pocket lint!!!

[Iceman Irwin]

Yeah, it's supposed to be us controlling the instrument but hey, no one would say that they never got affected in their groove with any bass-related variables.

I've been into situations that the keyboardist's left hand eats up my frequency range, my tone control went shot and i couldn't hear the difference betweent an A and a B and recently, i played in a gig with the bass having the strings over an inch over the board. My fingerings suffered and i couldn't reach my next note on time. Still....Okay everyone listen up---I made it sound good.

Groove is about time. Physiologically, we all have it. But include something that contains tone, it's the same story but different place.

[PETE_COMBS]

I agree with BENLOY and JERMEY Playing with a drummer would come in greatly but there is none around here, It wouuld keep a could connection with a great groove because of the great rythimic

patterns.

[_Sweet Willie_]

Pete,

 

My groove was aided immeasurably by the purchase of a James Brown compilation CD. I learned the tunes on the CD by ear and then jammed along with the CD endlessly.

 

A lot of the basslines for James Brown tunes are relatively simple and repetitive. They are immensely groovalicious and funky, and if you don't have a drummer to jam with, jamming with some of JB's drummers on CD is a very pleasant substitute!

 

Peace,

--Willie