Jump to content
Please note: You can easily log in to MPN using your Facebook account!

Hello all lowers


Recommended Posts

Greetings! Here comes a swedish thingie new to your board! I´ve move here from Bass101 (does anyone know what happend to that site?) since it´s no longer there... :wave: ) And this is mainly for all rockers out there. Do you ever use those hard erned skills in your music? All jazz-guys shure does, but I think that rockbass is a bit underdeveloped. Well, don´t get me wrong, nothing bad about puping 8:ths all trough, if that what the tune needs, but sometimes one may wonder if they know anything anything else... Take U2's bassplayer for instace. It´s very seldom that he leaves the root and fifth! (I´m gonna get it for that huh? :evil: ) Well, for those who didn´t get what I was asking here it comes again:

Do you ever use your theoretical skills in rock music?

PEACE :thu:

Another time, pehaps. But we´ve got very nice pies though...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 19
  • Created
  • Last Reply

I have no answer to your question but I am the first to reply so....WELCOME TO THE LOWDOWN!!

 

JeremyC is the local theory guru so lets see what he has to say.

"Cliff Burton (the "Major rager of the 4-string mother f***er", from Metallica)" Direct quote from Wikipedia (censored out of respect for the forum)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, Welcome for starters. But, of course you use theoretical skills in rock music!

 

You have to know scales, which notes complement eachother, which notes make a good chord. Where to put that chord, if there should be a chord, etc.

 

Just because its not in "scale" form, doesn't mean it wasn't derived from a scale itself.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome to the board. I may have not answered your question but I've got a suggestion. Could you kindly fill in the slot 'where you are from' as Sweden? So in the future, it would be easy to identify you as a non-American, like me, and direct certain questions directly to you. For instance, I like to know more about Vail Johnson. What he does these days, how popular he's in Sweden etc. Who are the other famous bassists there and could you give me some web links.

Thanks :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I thought that Vail Johnson was an American living in Los Angeles. :confused:

 

He is a great bassist and a very nice and amusing guy.

 

In answer to the original question, I'm one of those people who knows all the theory that was mentioned. It certainly is used every day in jazz situations.

 

Do I use it in a rock situation? I would say that my ability to hear a rock song and instantly know what the chords are is a direct result of my knowledge of theory.

 

Of course there's more, but that answer will have to suffice for now.

 

Welcome to the Lowdown, Master. You've chosen one of my favorite notes to be your name. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome to the LowDown!

 

I'm playing rock right now, but I do like to throw in jazzier concepts sparingly. Just kinda twists the song for a moment and makes those listening go, "hmmmm". When I used to do studio work, I kinda backed off that stuff, kept it more straight.

 

Without that knowledge of those 'extended chords', I probably would have a hard time throwing in those cool notes and patterns.

 

Again, welcome aboard.

Bassplayers aren't paid to play fast, they're paid to listen fast.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I apply my knowledge of theory in any musical situation. Knowing what passing tones are going to sound good is just as important in rock, country, jazz, . It doesn't matter what style it is, theory is always going to be important.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Glad we could be your second choice. ;)

 

I'm not sure why anyone would say that rock bass is underdeveloped, or doesn't draw much on theory. I think if you digest the work of John Entwistle, Chris Squire, Geddy Lee, Pino Palladino, David Hungate, and, may I add, James Jamerson, Anthony Jackson, Chuck Rainey, & Abe Laboriel, & come out on the other side saying, "Is that all?" ... well, then I guess you & I set the bar in pretty different places with respect to what counts as "developed."

 

That said, it IS the case, I think, that boneheads can get farther in rock than in jazz, where boneheads simply don't move at all. But I'm not sure that says much about the level of musicianship that you can find in rock music. It probably says more about a market that is satisfied to buy shiny round discs that make noise to drown out the dismal stream of their thoughts (or fill in the voild left the lack of a stream of thoughts). Not that I'm cynical about people who buy most of the stuff.

 

By the way, I think that we really should be called "downers." :D

 

Welcome to the board.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanx to all of you! *feeling welcome* =)

Yeah, there are some amaizing (spelling?) rock-people, but I was thinking of the "modern" rock played at the radio and so forth... I´ve just got a felling that those bassplayers are "I don´t care as long as the chicks comes to me" guys... We´ve got some really horrifying examples over here in Sweden :(

Another time, pehaps. But we´ve got very nice pies though...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Then stay away from the radio. I turned on the radio for a few minutes about 20+ years ago; Loverboy, Journey, & Foreigner came out, so I've been simply too afraid to turn it back on since. :D

 

Actually, you've also got some GREAT players in Sweden, too! Progressive rock is very, very big right now (I understand) in northern Europe. In particular, there is a Swedish band called The Flower Kings who are absolutely amazing musicians & writers, fronted by Roine Stolt (sounds like John Wetton, only better); and in fact their current bassist--whose name escapes me at the moment--is an absolute MONSTER, I mean this guy can play & just blow your mind. Check them out (I esp. recommend "Alive on Planet Earth" (I think that's the title)), & it might lead you to some other players who are doing it right. :thu:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by dcr:

 

Actually, you've also got some GREAT players in Sweden, too! Progressive rock is very, very big right now (I understand) in northern Europe.

 

Don't forget bands like Pain of Salvation. Great epic (and shorter) numbers from this group. I like them, because they have such great vocal harmonies, and the singer's just perfect. That guy gives me the chills.

 

The bassplayer in that group plays his stuff just right, has awesome tones (especially when playing fretless) and doesn't sound overdone, considering the genre.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been studying jazz for the past year and a half or so, and I'll answer your question with a real-life example from last night.

 

A local band manager got to know me via a reference from my bass teacher and wanted me for a jazz-style lounge act. I showed up and we did a few rehearsals before the project was scrapped for various reasons. But the manager wanted to keep me on his call list, especially because he was losing the bass player for his flagship band very soon.

 

Long story short, he knew what I could do from my work with the lounge act, but I kind of had to "convince" the band, and they might have been a little apprehensive because they have played with something like 2 or 3 different sub bass players in the last month.

 

I showed up at practice last night and so did the current bass sub, who is scheduled for one or two gigs in the very near future, but couldn't provide a long-term committment so won't be the regular.

 

So they played the songs, all of them covers, most of songs that I had heard before but never played. Here's the part where I answer your question:

 

Because of my jazz training, I could combine "cheating off the other bass player" with my ear and my theoretical knowledge and picked up on all of the songs very quickly. Then, so as not to cloud up the low end, I went up above the 12th fret and started chording, since there is only one guitarist and the manager was doing some sparse keyboard subbing that night.

 

It blew their socks off. We played a fast country shuffle that I had never heard, with a pretty busy bass line. I nailed it, and by nailed I mean that I was playing it correctly as it came, because the chord progression was predictable and it was just 1-1-3-3-5-5-3-3, blues style.

 

They called "Black Velvet" by Pat Bennetar (which totally rocks!) and I immediately remarked how much I loved the bass riff. The bass sub then asked me how to play some of them, because he hadn't been able to figure them out. I transcribed them on the spot for him!

 

There's not a doubt in my mind or the band's mind that I'll step right in and handle whatever they can throw at me. That's what theoretical knowledge and jazz experience can do for a rocker. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by MasteroftheGfithfretDstring:

:cry: Please! Anyone? I´m totaly stuck!

Don't panic. You have the theory, but not the "hands". Is that right?

 

I'd think about lessons. Explain to the teacher that you have the theory part in pretty good shape. Explain that you would like ear training and work that will improve your technique. Some of that ear training might involve listening and telling what you hear. My son took a theory class in school that did a lot of this, and now he can hear a riff in a song and say "that's A diminished Dad - can't you tell?" (wise guy kid). This would help your ear training and test how complete your theory knowledge is.

 

As to knowing what to play (not sure if you are asking that question), I think that's more than a "theory" issue. I've done a number of blues jams where I play the right notes and the rhythm matches the drummer, but nobody seems to care, and other times when I've played the "style" they like, and they mention that I did a good job.

 

Hope this helps...

 

Tom

www.stoneflyrocks.com

Acoustic Color

 

Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In high school, I was playing saxophone and singing in different choirs, along with bass in the jazz band, and I could sight read.

But after a decade of rock and punk bands, I can barely read music, and I do not use alot of "theory" in my bass playing.

I've spent way too much time relying on tabs to figure things out, and I know it has hurt my general musical flexibility.

At the same time, I learned alot by playing with a variety of drummers, guitarist, and keyboardists, so I think I have a much better sense of songwriting and my role in a band than I ever did while I was focusing on theory.

That being said, it's depressing how much my technical skills have diminished. I used to think "YYZ" was easy!

"Tea & Cake, or Death!"
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been guilty of lapsing into becoming a root 5th player. Really it's very easy to fall into that while playing rock music. I had to force myself into learn mode and shake up my playing in order to move past that phase. Well we've added some jazzier tunes too. That has helped me stretch myself immensely. So while I'm not totally there yet I'm getting better.

Double Posting since March 2002

Random Post Generator #26797

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...