Fret Hand "Positions"

[g.]

Tell you the truth I'm hardly skimming here now. But meters like 3/4 and 4/4 do not differ as far as the value of an eighth note are concerned, only in the way the overlying pulse is felt and subdivided.

 

Was my skimming on the subject at all or should I read? ; }

[Rob E.Bass]

only in the way the overlying pulse is felt and subdivided.

Basically that is my problem

[Dan South]

Hey Rob E.

 

Yikes!! That so-called teacher you had was the pits! The guy should be banned from teaching as he did just about everything wrong according to your account - dismissing questions, hot dogging during the lessong, etc.

 

Here are some tips to help you get the feel of eighth notes in 3/4 time. This is not specific to the exercise that you cited from Simandl, but rather a general approach to 3/4 time.

 

First, without your bass in hand, just count out low slowly and evenly

 

ONE-two-three ONE-two-three ONE-two-three ONE-two three

 

This is the sound of quarter notes being played in 3/4 time, three notes per measure. Be sure to emphasize the "ONE".

 

If you like (optional) for added imagery, imagine that you have a fishing rod in your hand. On "ONE" you cast with a strong motion across your body. On "two" and "three" you're gently winding up for the next "cast" on ONE. This will give you a mental picture that shows the importance of emphasis on the fist beat.

 

Anyway, back to eighth notes. Once you're comfortable with ONE-two-three ONE-two-three, try splitting each beat in two.

 

ONE-and two-and three-and

ONE-and two-and three-and

...

 

Remember to keep the count slow and even. This is the sound of EIGHTH notes being play in 3/4 time, six notes per measure with the first of the six being emphasized more strongly than the rest. Generally, the "and" notes, also known as the upbeats should be played ever so slightly softer than the notes that are "on the beat".

 

Okay, bass time. This exercise will use three notes: C at the third fret of the A string, D at the fifth fret of the A string, and E at the second fret of the D string.

 

Very slowly, play in quarter notes:

 

C C C D D D E E E D D D C C C etc.

 

At the same time, count

 

ONE-two-three ONE-two-three etc.

 

Now let's try eight notes:

 

Count ONE-and two-and three-and ... and play

 

C C C C C C D D D D D D E E E E E E D D D D D D

 

Great! So much for even eighth notes. Now let's mix eighth notes and quarters. There are several possible patterns. Try them all at a slow tempo to make sure that you're splitting the beats accurately.

 

ONE-and two three ONE-and two three

 

ONE two-and three ONE two-and three

 

ONE two three-and ONE two three-and

 

ONE-and two-and three

 

ONE-and two three-and

 

ONE two-and three-and

 

Try some rests to eliminate a beat. Alternately you can sustain the previous note to stretch over the unplayed beat.

 

ONE-and two (rest)

 

ONE-and (rest) three

 

ONE two-and (rest)

 

ONE (rest) three-and

 

(rest) two-and three

 

(rest) two-and three-and

 

Syncopation is common in popular music. Syncopation is the act of emphasizing normally weak notes. There are two ways to accomplish this. The first is to play those notes louder than the other notes. The second is to place rests on the strong beats leaving the weak beats to stand out. Here are some examples of each approach.

 

ONE two-AND three

 

ONE two-AND three-AND

 

ONE (rest)-and three

 

ONE-and (rest)-and three

 

(rest)-and two-AND three

 

(rest)-and (rest)-and three

 

(rest)-and (rest)-and (rest)-and

 

What other combinations can you come up with? If you work through these exercises, I'm confident that you'll gain an intuitive feeling for how eighth notes work in 3/4 time very quickly. When you're READING, break each measure down into its components from the list of the six possible notes

 

ONE-and two-and three-and

 

and count the result out loud or two yourself as you play. This will help both your reading AND your time.

 

Good luck!!!!

[Dan South]

Originally posted by davebrownbass:

The electric bass can be fingered with 2 main strategies: using fingers 1-2-4, covering a major second and playing positions similiar to an URB or using fingers 1-2-3-4, covering a minor third and playing similiar to a guitar. Both of these strategies are useful, both are used interchangeably and both are used by virtually all players of the electric bass.

 

Care to comment on the stretched five-fret pattern that seems to be the darling of Bass Player columnists? For instance, a G major scale played

 

(E-str) 3 5 7 (A-str) 3 5 7 (D-str) 4 5

 

I developed the 1-2-4 and 1-2-3-4 techniques over the years, but I've tried to incorporate this technique into my playing in recent years. I'm not as confident in the stretched position, but it has its uses. My main question is how much should I stretch to the extreme notes and how much should I use shifting or wrist rotation to reach them? Stretching across five frets toward the head end of the neck is uncomfortable even for my large hands.

[davebrownbass]

Dan,

 

Good job of an counting workout...I was uncertain how to explain it with only words, no sounds, no examples.

 

I would just add that one of the best ways to develop any kind of sub-divided pulse would be to walk and count, one step per beat. Then, keep walking a steady beat, and begin the counting "one-and, two-and" etc.

 

BTW: Please note that I said: "one-te, two-te" and Dan said "one-and, two-and" They are exactly the same thing. The use of the plosive consonant "t" is a result of work at the Eastman school of music, and is known as the "Eastman system." The reason it exists is to give an exact starting point to the off beat, "t" instead of "aaaaaannnnn" I converted to this a few years ago and have really loved it.

 

As to the extension fingering concept...yes, I began using this a few years ago, and found it to be extremely useful. When I write it down, I refer to the first finger extended as "X", thus you get:

 

X-1-2-3-4.

 

The first exercise I practice to stretch the finger (and it's not really useful for me until about the 5-7th fret because of the stretch) by playing 4-3-2-1-x-1-2-3-4 and an even tempo on each string, perhaps starting on f on the g string.

 

It's first, really good uses are the dorian and mixolydian modes, where you get the advantage of an included ninth...can practice swing eighth notes pretty good.

 

Here's what I do:

 

Dorian Mode:

 

x--2-3

x--2--4

x--2--4

 

for the g dorian:

 

g--a-bflat

c--d--e

f--g--a

 

Mixolydian mode:

 

x--2--4

x--2--4

x--2--4

 

for the G mix:

 

g--a--b

c--d--e

f--g--a

 

You can really develop nice soloistic patterns in this manner...of course, I

never have...but I believe it can open things up for beginners by keeping the hand in place.

[jeremy c]

Pivot to reach those five fret positions.

 

put your thumb behind the 2nd finger. pivot back to play the 1st finger note and forward to play the 4th finger note. After a while you won't even notice that you are doing it...you will think that you are playing the whole thing in one hand position.

 

Watch Jaco's video...he gives a demonstration at one point.

[KikkyMonk]

or carol kaye's video

 

Dave

[Wally Malone]

Stretch modes were in Jaco's instructional video. It doesn't matter if you have a 4, 5 or 6 string you play three notes per string through the scale. On a 4 string start with an F major scale and then move up through the modes going to G minor then A minor, etc. staying in the key of F. Do this in every key. You will find it's a great way to learn the whole range of your bass.

 

Wally

[Rob E.Bass]

Dang boys,I live in the wrong part of the country to talk shop face to face.Thank God for cyberspace.

 

I think it's possible to understand the explanations despite the lack of sound.After this weekends gigs,when I have time to think this thread is going to be key to jumpstarting personal studies.

 

Right now I am swamped with umpteen tunes(roughly 60 as of tonights newly burned CD)to learn for 3 gigs and 4 bands total so all I can do is read and go WOW!OOH AAH and Thanks ofcourse.

 

This is so great I can't stop saying how excited and inspired I am by all of you guys!

[SideswipeRPG]

I just recently ordered a copy of the 1995 edition of Simandl off B&N. I am just starting to learn and it seems like learning to play positionally from the start will be a good thing. I read standard notation at a beginners level, but it should be enough to at least be able to delve into this book.

 

Originally posted by Dan South:

Hey Rob E.

Here are some tips to help you get the feel of eighth notes in 3/4 time. This is not specific to the exercise that you cited from Simandl, but rather a general approach to 3/4 time.

 

First, without your bass in hand, just count out low slowly and evenly

 

ONE-two-three ONE-two-three ONE-two-three ONE-two three

 

This is the sound of quarter notes being played in 3/4 time, three notes per measure. Be sure to emphasize the "ONE".

 

If you like (optional) for added imagery, imagine that you have a fishing rod in your hand. On "ONE" you cast with a strong motion across your body. On "two" and "three" you're gently winding up for the next "cast" on ONE. This will give you a mental picture that shows the importance of emphasis on the fist beat.

 

Anyway, back to eighth notes. Once you're comfortable with ONE-two-three ONE-two-three, try splitting each beat in two.

 

ONE-and two-and three-and

ONE-and two-and three-and

...

 

Remember to keep the count slow and even. This is the sound of EIGHTH notes being play in 3/4 time, six notes per measure with the first of the six being emphasized more strongly than the rest. Generally, the "and" notes, also known as the upbeats should be played ever so slightly softer than the notes that are "on the beat".

 

Okay, bass time. This exercise will use three notes: C at the third fret of the A string, D at the fifth fret of the A string, and E at the second fret of the D string.

 

Very slowly, play in quarter notes:

 

C C C D D D E E E D D D C C C etc.

 

At the same time, count

 

ONE-two-three ONE-two-three etc.

 

Now let's try eight notes:

 

Count ONE-and two-and three-and ... and play

 

C C C C C C D D D D D D E E E E E E D D D D D D

 

Great! So much for even eighth notes. Now let's mix eighth notes and quarters. There are several possible patterns. Try them all at a slow tempo to make sure that you're splitting the beats accurately.

 

ONE-and two three ONE-and two three

 

ONE two-and three ONE two-and three

 

ONE two three-and ONE two three-and

 

ONE-and two-and three

 

ONE-and two three-and

 

ONE two-and three-and

 

Try some rests to eliminate a beat. Alternately you can sustain the previous note to stretch over the unplayed beat.

 

ONE-and two (rest)

 

ONE-and (rest) three

 

ONE two-and (rest)

 

ONE (rest) three-and

 

(rest) two-and three

 

(rest) two-and three-and

 

Syncopation is common in popular music. Syncopation is the act of emphasizing normally weak notes. There are two ways to accomplish this. The first is to play those notes louder than the other notes. The second is to place rests on the strong beats leaving the weak beats to stand out. Here are some examples of each approach.

 

ONE two-AND three

 

ONE two-AND three-AND

 

ONE (rest)-and three

 

ONE-and (rest)-and three

 

(rest)-and two-AND three

 

(rest)-and (rest)-and three

 

(rest)-and (rest)-and (rest)-and

 

What other combinations can you come up with? If you work through these exercises, I'm confident that you'll gain an intuitive feeling for how eighth notes work in 3/4 time very quickly. When you're READING, break each measure down into its components from the list of the six possible notes

 

ONE-and two-and three-and

 

and count the result out loud or two yourself as you play. This will help both your reading AND your time.

 

Good luck!!!!

Thank you for the tutorial on 3/4 time. Basically the first note of a measure in 3/4 is emphasized, but does this extend to 4/4 time as well? Or do all notes need to be played evenly unless otherwise accented?