thinking about getting an acoustic bass

[Jay J.]

I have been thinking about getting an acoustic bass lately. my band is turning more emo rock now and we have a lot of acoustic songs and I think that it would add to the sound if I had an acoustic also. I was looking on ebay; I don't want to spend a lot. and saw some Michael Kelly ones that looked pretty cool for a decent price. anyone know anything about them or could you recomend something decent to look at.

 

thanks!

[jeremy c]

Do not attempt this alone.

 

See if you can get an experienced bassist to help you.

 

I would strongly recommend against buying something without an expert looking at it first.

 

Also you should talk to our esteemed moderator, Bob Gollihur. He is an expert on this kind of question.

[DarthPark]

Finding an acoustic bass is difficult. I haven´t seen(or played on) a good one yet. They just do not sound like a bass. I was thinkin´ about getting one myself but when I tried a couple I decided to wait. Now, they´re no good!

 

*Dance to the Music*

[surfjunkie]

i guessing you mean "acoustic bass guitar", not upright, right?

[jeremy c]

Oh are we talking about Acoustic Bass Guitars also known as ABG?

 

The Taylor is probably the best one.

They are all feedback machines and if you have to play at band volume (with a drummer), good luck!

 

Also if you have to play without electricity, there will be no bottom end and you will be barely heard over two guitars.

 

On the other hand, with a small amp and and other acoustic instruments an ABG can be just what the doctor ordered.

 

I thought you were talking about an upright, a doghouse, a bull fiddle, a string bass, whatever you want to call it.

[dcr]

Be sure to check out the Godin and Carvin AC acoustics. I was kicking the idea of an ABG around a while back, & these seemed to be good candidates, and neither costs a fortune.

 

Personally, I like to use a fretless for those "unplugged" sets. It has a very "woody" sound that goes nice with acoustic guitar, imo, and can be very expressive without having to play a lot of notes--you can get a little more out of the notes you play, I think--so it can fit nicely in songs that need a lot of space left open.

 

These aren't exclusive options, either: e.g. Carvin makes a thin hollow-bodied electric/acoustic, which is available fretless! (And listen to that baby in the Jam Room on their website--wow!)

[g.]

The Godin is nice too, as is the Renaissance.

[A.P. Non-Prod.]

Ohhhh! I played a Godin fretless acoustic once. Man I still remember how smooth and beautiful that thing sounded.

[Jay J.]

thanks for the advice, I was refering to a ABG. I know that uprights are kinda scary if you are shopping for one. but I'll definetly check out the ones you mentioned. do you think it is possible to get a ok one for $300 or less. or if I don't want to spend much would I be better off just waiting until I can spend more.

[g.]

If you want to sound acoustic when plugged in the Carvin AC40 is the cheapest instrument capable of putting you in the running. No acoustic bass guitar (one that can do the campfire thang without an amp) in that price range is worth a diddly probably -- and definitely won't be able to be heard in balance with even two guitars.

[Jay J.]

one more thing: I noticed on ebay that there are a few michael kelly ABG for sale for a decent price. here is the webiste: http://www.michaelkellyguitars.com

[turkish]

the thing to be careful about is that the brigdes are fixed so you have to make sure the intonation is set correctly

[g.]

Those fixed bridges are with few exceptions, the rule on acoustic diaphram instruments anyway.

[Zack]

I love the Guild accoustic bassses, they are affordable, and give you crisp sound for your buck. I would also warn you to check some accoustics out with a professional, as Jeremyc said. Buying one can be tricky, 7 you'll want some expert advice.

[Wickerman]

Originally posted by jeremyc:

They are all feedback machines and if you have to play at band volume (with a drummer), good luck!

 

Also if you have to play without electricity, there will be no bottom end and you will be barely heard over two guitars.

No no no my boy... First off, there are plenty of semi-acoustic basses that don't feedback as well as ways to cut feedback. Such as a feedback buster soundhole insert. Also, while I agree, many acoustic basses sound terrible unplugged, there are also quite a few that sound great. Epiphone's 4 string El Capitan, Martin's B-1, Taylor's and Guild's acoustic basses all sound great unplugged. The Martin B-1 is my favorite. GREAT tone, good feel and it sounds more natural than most when plugged in. It's pricey but it's worth it.

 

Then there are the Carvin and Godin routes. Both GREAT basses if you're only going to play plugged in. They aren't loud unplugged but still get a acoustic sounding tone with less chance of feedback plugged in and actually sound quite good. Both are hard to find used but you can usually find some Martins or Epiphone El Capitans used for about $450 or so... The Epiphone is VERY surprising. Most people see Epi and turn away (foolishly, the expensive stuff is very good quality, even Guitar Player agrees) but this bass especially is great. Brass nut for that piano like tone, versatile preamp and GREAT neck.

[g.]

still, one is constrained by the laws of physics. no free lunch yada yada. a bass instrument that depends on a diagaphram chamber needs a large one to magnify lower frequencies.

 

voila, guitarron! these things sound like a BASS and can hold their own with loud acoustic guitars. the action will also grow hair on the chest.

[smudger-roo]

check out jaydee guitars

http://www.jaydeeguitars.com

he makes an awesome custom acoustic bass - all hand made ... but i think a little expensive (but not sure of the exact prices! - sorry)

[5feetfromcool]

somewhere i heard thatthe guy from the violent femmes played an ernie ball earthwood bass (high quality shit). look for one of those, i know nothing about how much one would run you. i do know that it WILL be used because they were discontinued in the 80's i think, and itll be pricey cause they were all handmade and there werent too many made.

[davebrownbass]

Originally posted by greenboy:

.

 

voila, guitarron! these things sound like a BASS and can hold their own with loud acoustic guitars. the action will also grow hair on the chest.

Ha! have you ever played a guitarron? Not something I would do twice in my life.

 

Not only is the body so unweildy that it's near impossible to wrap around.

 

The construction quality of every sample I've seen could best be described as "balsa wood and thick paint"

 

Not only that, the tuning is weird (to a conventional bass player) and you play everything in octaves across 2 strings. (Check out this site: http://www.stanford.edu/~geparra/guitarron/gindex.html

 

Of course, it is loud and sounds pretty good.

 

Now GB, I know you were kidding, but maybe some young readers were thinking, uh, guitarron sounds good.

[davebrownbass]

Oh, and did I mention it was fretless. http://www.guitartips.addr.com/tip65.html

 

I haven't played many ABG's, but I own a Charvel cheapy. I use it mainly for teaching, although I did take it to France with a bluegrass group I was playing in...they were doin' street ministry and needed something portable (meaning, evidently, something you could make a quick get-away with, but that's another story.)

 

It has several problems, the peizo is not consistent across all strings, the table is buckling, no way to set action or intonation. Strings are a constant problem, they don't feel right, seem to last about a set. Sounds pretty good amplified.

 

For pure acoustic work, a pick makes it louder.

[twbuckner]

I have been happy with my Tacoma fretless. It has a great sound unplugged and really keeps up the volume in a picking session. The problem is when I plug it in (feedback, plus an awfully tinny sound). The soundhole is odd-shaped, so I haven't been able to find anything to cover it. I'm thinking of investing in a mic for it if I knew what to get.

 

-ted

[SteveW]

I've actually got a fair amout of experience with ABG's, having owned Taylors for three years and used them in an electric 5 piece band, and a Rick Turner Renaissance 5 string, both fretless. First of all, IMHO you should go fretless if you're going acoustic. The Taylor ABGs are the best available (IMHO), and also the most expensive stock models- $2000 range new. You're paying for solid wood construction (no plywood), beautiful workmanship, accurate intonation, quality hardware, lifetime warranty to original owner, etc. I have very little problem with feedback, and fantastic, organic, woody, upright like tone. Tacomas are very popular with their owners, and are reported to be the loudest unplugged (the Earthwood might be louder, but are so rare that A/B'ing is impossible). They're in the $1000 range, available used faily easily for less. The Martin is in the same range, but I don't care for the sound or neck shape - YMMV. Most all of the other, cheaper makes that I have tried ( and I tried a great many when I was first considering the Taylor) are pretty pathetic - cheap plywood bodies, lousy intonation, flimsy hardware, inadequate pickups, and most of all, bad tone, more precisely weak, anemic, lacking body and resonance. Pretty much none of them, including my beloved Taylors, can be heard above a single guitar , or considerable background noise like traffic or a pounding surf. As was mentioned earlier, its physics, and you just can't overcome some laws.

The semi-acoustic models like the Rick Turner Renaissance or the Godin are more "acoustic" sounding than a solid body, especially when fretless, but don't have the full woodiness of the big body ABG's. But that's part of their special appeal - they don't have such an unwieldy body and they can sound more like a regular bass if you're not after a real "acoustic" sound on some songs.

I wholeheartedly encourage bassists to try ABG's - they can really add a wonderfull dimension to your sound pallet - but they're somewhat of a niche instrument, much better for some tunes and styles than others. I use mine on Jazz, folk and sort of rockabilly stuff - where you might imagine an URB. For rock and electric blues I use a Lakland 55-63 Dual-J 5 string. I bring the Lakland and one of the ABG's to every gig (bars mostly), and lately I've been favoring the Turner over the Taylor because its a 5 string and I'm getting paranoid that I'm puhing my luck with three years of that big old Taylor on small bar stages - I'm afraid of it being damaged in an accident or something.

My final advice is to save up for something good - a cheapo might turn you off to a very wonderful and rewarding class of basses. Hope this has been helpful.

Steve

[g.]

As I dug through my vinyl for "Mancini '67" to hear some classic expanded big band Ray Brown, I ran across my ACOUSTINAUTS' record, "Inhale Einstein" (on Pop Llama). The bassist I worked with that had a guitarron used it on that album.

 

I got to mess with it a couple times and did some sampling of it for our work (we used keyboard sampling sparingly as skeletal structure and "signposts" in our duo). Anyway, as I recall, he had done lots of work to make the action better, and to change the nut and bridge to accomodate a more conventional tuning. I do remember this: the sucker had a real BASS presence - low end and THUMP galore. As it rested against the torso you resonated with it - so much more gutsy than any ABG I've ever tried.

 

It was a real BASS. I wish ABG manufacturers would consider building large-bodied instruments like this, only with better necks. It would be such a gas to do the campfire/picnic thing with a beastie that could command some real attention instead of just sounding anemic and pasty-faced.

[davebrownbass]

Originally posted by greenboy:

As I dug through my vinyl for "Mancini '67" to hear some classic expanded big band Ray Brown, I ran across my ACOUSTINAUTS' record, "Inhale Einstein" (on Pop Llama). The bassist I worked with that had a guitarron used it on that album...

 

. Anyway, as I recall, he had done lots of work to make the action better, and to change the nut and bridge to accomodate a more conventional tuning. I do remember this: the sucker had a real BASS presence - low end and THUMP galore. As it rested against the torso you resonated with it - so much more gutsy than any ABG I've ever tried.

 

It was a real BASS. I wish ABG manufacturers would consider building large-bodied instruments like this, only with better necks. It would be such a gas to do the campfire/picnic thing with a beastie that could command some real attention instead of just sounding anemic and pasty-faced.

Yeah, you are correct sir. The guitarron, with all of it's foibles, has an incredible sound.

 

Here in Ft. Worth we have a pretty large mariachi program and a couple of years ago I mentioned to the director of it about such changes as you mentioned. He was less than happy about the concept...wanted to remain authentic and all that.

 

I think a builder might be tempted to try and adapt the body style to more modern tunings. Of course, because of the giant body the fingerboard is shorter, you might get the equivalent of 12 frets on it...that limited range might bother manufacturers who might not think there is a market.

 

I'd like to say that tone sells itself, but I haven't seen an enormous amount of playing on the Ashbory (although I want one).

 

It is an interesting idea, however. Theoretically, you should be able to get more sound, in some fasion, out of some kind of acoustic instrument.

[g.]

davebrownbass: Here in Ft. Worth we have a pretty large mariachi program and a couple of years ago I mentioned to the director of it about such changes as you mentioned. He was less than happy about the concept...wanted to remain authentic and all that.

I'm sure the tuning has influenced what has been played on the instrument in its home music. I'd make remarks about the ivory towers, but heck - I just want a boomin' puppy that can hang out with the doghouse. I'm not about to buck tradition face to face ; }

 

I think a builder might be tempted to try and adapt the body style to more modern tunings. Of course, because of the giant body the fingerboard is shorter, you might get the equivalent of 12 frets on it... that limited range might bother manufacturers who might not think there is a market.

But still... six strings. Six strings with wide spacing. So some range would be available - even without doing a braced cutaway. I'd thought that a molded back ala Ovation, only of a material and thickness easily excited by the particular tuning, and deeper and less rounded, would make the instrument less ungainly and still give a big chamber. In fact the neck could be narrower and more practical then as a 5-string tuned E-A-D-G-C.

 

I'd like to say that tone sells itself, but I haven't seen an enormous amount of playing on the Ashbory (although I want one).

The Ashbory has such a short scale that some might find it off-putting...

 

I think by and large the manufacturers are demographic cowards, just like the radio chain giants. Even electric bass gear has lagged so far behind the curve of the electric guitar...

 

Yet I think it's not that hard to sell the Field of Dreams these days, what with the magazines and the internet word-of-mouth and the general level of educated buyers. Dang, the illusion that some puny-assed little acoustic guitar with a slightly longer scale on it and fatter strings practically reeks of much work done for little benefit. The same amount of advertising and placement could be applied to a real deal.

 

But the demographic people have their minds made up what they will prove with any given data ; }

 

Theoretically, you should be able to get more sound, in some fasion, out of some kind of acoustic instrument.

You mean like the string bass or the cello? ; }

[davebrownbass]

Hmmmmm.......

[g.]

Maybe those aren't such efficient examples ; } - they can get amazing volume when excited with a well-rosined bow but don't transmit with such resonance when pizzed. In that regard a guitar family construction would be more apt : }