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Anybody good with grammar? (Songwriting question)


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The great thing about songwriting (or any creative writing for that matter) is that conventional grammar standards fly out of the window. If it works for your song and the singer can make it flow, then it is fine....

Yamaha (Motif XS7, Motif 6, TX81Z), Korg (R3, Triton-R), Roland (XP-30, D-50, Juno 6, P-330). Novation A Station, Arturia Analog Experience Factory 32

 

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[quote] The great thing about songwriting (or any creative writing for that matter) is that conventional grammar standards fly out of the window. If it works for your song and the singer can make it flow, then it is fine.... [/quote]Yeah! That IS the coolest part about creative writing/songwriting. I like it even better when we can make up our own words, like Steve Miller's "pompitus of love" or KRS*1 and "Dramatical" and "Unrational."

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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[quote]Originally posted by cg1155: [b]Since the question was about grammer the correct usage is "you and me" -casey[/b][/quote]Nope. "Is" calls for the nominative, which is "I", not "me". The Doors sported the most egregious example of fake good grammer. 'Til the stars fall from the sky...for you and I. 'For you and me' is correct in this case. Anyway, it's got a good ring to it, Duke. -CB
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[quote]Originally posted by Bobro: [b] [quote]Originally posted by cg1155: [b]Since the question was about grammer the correct usage is "you and me" -casey[/b][/quote]Nope. "Is" calls for the nominative, which is "I", not "me". The Doors sported the most egregious example of fake good grammer. 'Til the stars fall from the sky...for you and I. 'For you and me' is correct in this case. Anyway, it's got a good ring to it, Duke. -CB[/b][/quote]How do you figure this out? I mean, can I remove the words "you and" to try to figure out the proper pronoun of either "I" or "me"... and it would be: [i]But an even bigger win Is that I am your best friend[/i] In other words... [i]Is that me am your best friend[/i] ...is obviously incorrect.

> > > [ Live! ] < < <

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[quote]Originally posted by LiveMusic: [b] [quote]Originally posted by Bobro: [b] [quote]Originally posted by cg1155: [b]Since the question was about grammer the correct usage is "you and me" -casey[/b][/quote]Nope. "Is" calls for the nominative, which is "I", not "me". The Doors sported the most egregious example of fake good grammer. 'Til the stars fall from the sky...for you and I. 'For you and me' is correct in this case. Anyway, it's got a good ring to it, Duke. -CB[/b][/quote]How do you figure this out? I mean, can I remove the words "you and" to try to figure out the proper pronoun of either "I" or "me"... and it would be: [i]But an even bigger win Is that I am your best friend[/i] In other words... [i]Is that me am your best friend[/i] ...is obviously incorrect.[/b][/quote]Yeah that's the best way to check- in this case the best thing IS, so it would be "I am", not "me am". -CB
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[quote]Originally posted by LiveMusic: [b]A song I wrote months ago, I can't figure out which is correct... [i]But an even bigger win Is you and I, best friends[/i] Should the "I" be "me" or leave as is?[/b][/quote]Since "I/me" is an object in this case "me" would be the correct form. But even more importantly for my taste "me" has way more "vibe" and it rolls much better than "I" IMO.
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[quote]Originally posted by dino321: [b] [quote]Originally posted by LiveMusic: [b]A song I wrote months ago, I can't figure out which is correct... [i]But an even bigger win Is you and I, best friends[/i] Should the "I" be "me" or leave as is?[/b][/quote]Since "I/me" is an object in this case "me" would be the correct form. But even more importantly for my taste "me" has way more "vibe" and it rolls much better than "I" IMO.[/b][/quote]If it were "What's been won is you and me, best friends", this would be correct, but in this case the personal pronouns are not direct or indirect objects of anything. Put it this way: "You and I are the biggest win". Is Mr. John Magpel in the house? -CB
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"Let us go then, you and I, When the evening is spread out against the sky Like a patient etherised upon a table; Let us go, through certain half-deserted streets, The muttering retreats Of restless nights in one-night cheap hotels" I'm not going to argue with T S Eliot! :D
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." - Banky Edwards.
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Oh, boy, this is where language gets ugly. Normally, you can use the subject/object rule. "I" is a subject and "me" is an object. You and I like cats. Cats like you and me. Both of these sentences are correct, although in the United States, nine people out of ten will word the second sentences incorrectly: Cats like you and I. (God, that makes me cringe!) However, how many times have you telephoned a close friend and said, "Hi! It's me!"? This is incorrect. The grammatically correct form is, "It is I." The reason is as Cameron stated. This may sound clumsy, because the incorrect colloquial form is popular here in the States. Duke's original lyric is correct for the same reason. But if he'd worded it a little differently, he would have to change "I" to "me". - But the biggest gain is for you and me to become friends. (Just an example; I like Duke's version better.)

The Black Knight always triumphs!

 

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Very interesting topic, and a good way for those of us whose mother tongue is not English to learn from the real world. Actually, when I was learnign English in High School, our teacher insisted for us not to use the "you and I" form when used as an object complement, even if we could hear this in songs... But well, the real world has also its own rules in any language; we find it funny sometimes when we hear a non French native person speaking in a grammatically correct French, but inadequated to the situation, often very formal. But we like it also! .. ;) Hey , now what is your position about this one heard in John Lennon's "How do you Sleep" ;) _ ...Well they were right they they said, you WAS de_aaaa _ad....._ :D and shall I say : I are, or I is ? Grammaticaly yours, Alex
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I generally never worry about the use of grammar or slang in the context of songwriting but do have an almost uncurable tendancy to always write it down in proper form when I put it to paper.

William F. Turner

Songwriter

turnersongs

 

Sometimes the truth is rude...

tough shit... get used to it.

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[quote]Originally posted by Dan South: [b]However, how many times have you telephoned a close friend and said, "Hi! It's me!"? This is incorrect. The grammatically correct form is, "It is I."[/b][/quote]Exactly like the Todd Rundgren song "Hello, It Is I".
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