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OT - That Venus and Mars thing (woman troubles)...


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...is driving me nuts. Women. Sorry, kinda long, just back up if you don't want to read it all. I don't mean for this to be a woman-bashing thread. Conversely, I truly would like to know you guys' thoughts on this. The old remarks you've heard all your life that men say about women... today, I'm kinda believing there is more to it than I've ever admitted. I mean, certainly, I've always known that men and women think differently. Wired differently. But not THIS different. Kinda in a bum mood about it. I even think about my own mother and how my dad had "trouble" with her irrational behaviour over the years. And I think about my girl friends who are just platonic friends. And I think about the girls I know who are TRULY stable. I know they're out there. I had one one time. How different do you think women truly are from men? As you've matured, has your outlook changed? Mine has. I'm 48. Damn sure been around the block. I split up with a girl I was with for ten years eight years ago. Wow, I had NO idea how wonderfully stable this girl was. Man, I often wish I had her back. She was solid as a rock in the stability department. Very even keeled. What a dumbass I was in many ways to let her go. I have dated a LOT of women since she and I split. Still am. I've always treated women with respect. I mean, heck, I'm just like any other guy... one track mind and all that but I do treat women with respect. In fact, maybe too much, it sometimes seems. But damn it, I can't be an arrogant asshole to women; just not going to do it. But sure seems that's the ticket sometimes. I'm tired of being single. Disgusted with it, actually. Sure want someone special. The last five girls (since September) that have really caught my eye... Girl #1 - Went apeshit over this girl from the getgo. What an incredible personality. Warning: If a girl climbs in your lap on the first date and just goes apeshit over you, watch out. That means she does that with other guys; you're not so special, pal. She went nuts over me, called me two or three times a day all the time. Intense romance. Turned out to be a damn phycho. Wow, what a split personality. Since I dated her, I can't even count how many guys she has woo'ed. One after another. Everybody loves her. I mean, adults, kids, teenagers, guys, girls, dogs, cats, whatever. Because she's a charmer. But a friggin' psycho. I could tell you stories that would back that up but no need for that. Just trust me. Psycho. Girl # 2 - Probably went more nuts over this one. Toughed it out for three months. Built like a brick shithouse and absolutely gorgeous. Very intelligent. Perfect height for me. Every damn thing. Rich. Beautiful home. Nice kids. Treated her like a queen. Had a ball much of the time. But... psycho. Again, could tell you stories that'd back up my claim. Psycho. Since we dated, I've come across THREE guys who have told me, in essence, "Oh, I could've told you that... when you started dating... I knew what would happen." Yep, they got it, too. She's been married three times. Not that that's all bad but she told me one time she had trouble keeping men. Now I know why. You know what's weird about #1 and #2? They are as "normal" as can be in daylight hours. Everybody loves them. When the sun sets, man, watch out. Something happens. I mean, they're just normal girls. Then, phycho. #2, for sure, she's done shit before that makes me think she should be committed. VERY strange behaviour. SIDEBAR: #1 and #2 freak out on alcohol. Much of our problems had to do with alcohol. They totally change. Problem is, next day, it's like no difference. No remorse after acting like a TOTAL bitch. Girl #3 - Cute as can be. Seemed stable, mature, calm. But fun and could turn it up a notch when appropriate. Then, whammo. Jekkyl and Hyde thing one night. Totally went ballistic on me and hell, I didn't really do anything. It was a SILLY misunderstanding. I mean, SILLY. "Made up" her with later. Actually, I kinda kissed her ass. Instead of just telling her what a complete bitch she'd been, I just kinda told her in a real smooth way. Tried again. She freaked out again one night over NOTHING. Bye for good. First date, she told me THREE times that she was adopted. That's a sign. Bigtime chip on her shoulder. 4. Smart, pretty, great job. Beautiful kids. Great home. Witty. After two dates, still cold as a cucumber. I mean, NOTHING. But tells her friends how she wants to go out with me. But she thinks I'm coming back for that? Why should I? I get more warmth from a lady cop. Yikes! Bye. 5. This one is beautiful. Man, what a KNOCKOUT. I can't quite figure her out. She acts like she is very interested. Calls me. Have never been able to actually go out with her, after about five attempts. She's got one more chance. Hell, Miss American ain't worth chasing forever. Every weekend, something happens. But she calls me and emails me. Then I see her at a concert (she was with a girl friend) and it's like "Oh, hi." Like, "Gotta go, see you later on." Well, hell, what's the hurry? The concert hasn't even started. And just the night before, she called me and said how we've just GOT to go out. Can't chat for one minute at the concert? I dunno... scratching my head. What the hell do you really want? Every single one of these girls is divorced. I wonder if they have a sub-conscious (or conscious) man-hater disease? I've given all of this some thought, actually. People usually get married in their 20's. Most of them, many of them, anyway, do not truly know if it's the right thing to do or if they're ready. They just do it because of societal pressures or pregnancy or there's lots of reasons. Then they grow apart. You might even have a gal who is extremely stable. And then she sees (or feels that way) that her life has passed her by... with a guy she doesn't love anymore... she shouldn't have married him. I think it makes them crazy. I guess I could sum it up... with my perception of "me." I don't think I act very different from one day or one hour to the next. But these last five gals... I'm really scratching my head. Man, I hate dating. Not a helluva lot of choice, though. Maybe I'll buy me a bride from Russia. EDIT: Ahhhhh... Lee Flier on this forum... my dream girl. Edit: If you got a good woman, you better give her a big ol' hug tonight.

> > > [ Live! ] < < <

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Your signal is coming through, Live. Although my main problem is outright cowardice and feelings of awkwardness, I've had a few experiences with young women who had some "baggage" from previous relationships. I tend to find myself a lot more irritated with the men who treated those women poorly than I am with the women themselves. I'm not really going anywhere with dating at the moment, as, to paraphrase Odd Todd, being out of work, and shy, and not in Herculean shape really says something about a guy. (One word, five letters, starts with a capital "L.") The last little while has been a dark time indeed. :cry: (There is the occasional ray of light through the clouds, however.) Bottom line: I hear and understand you! -Danny

Grace, Peace, V, and Hz,

 

Danny

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I feel you too, Duke. Not to say that all ladies are psycho. I mean I know it's a lot of really good women out there. But where the hell are they hiding, because I have run into my fair share of psychos, phonies, and enigmatic pain in the ass(es). Namaste Jedi

"All conditioned things are impermanent. Work out your own salvation with diligence."

 

The Buddha's Last Words

 

R.I.P. RobT

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[b]Duke[/b], I do believe that the dating world gets tougher as you get older. If someone is single and over forty, it could be because they made a bad choice in a mate and got divorced, or it could be that they simply never found the right one to settle down with. On the other hand, it could be that [i]they[/i] were the wrong choice someone else made, that they were impossibly picky, or that they were, as you put it, "psycho." A lot of folks have a "type" they go for that is all wrong, but they keep choosing the same type over and over again. My wife and I know a woman like that. Are you one of those people? I have no idea. That's a question you have to answer for yourself. There are more than enough psychos out there. At least psycho women are less likely to kill than are psycho men. Count yourself lucky in that respect. Personally, I don't buy that women are less rational than are men. IMO we decide what rational is based on our values. Is it rational to jump up and down and scream at the television set? We men often do that while watching sports. There are plenty of behaviors both sexes engage in that may seem irrational to the other sex. It pays to open your mind in this regard. So much of how we view life is subjective. I advise looking in the mirror, examining the choices you've made, and using your conclusions and innate creativity to make new choices in new places. You're a good guy. You deserve to be happy. Best, Geoff (Over forty, and happily married for almost 12 years.)

Enthusiasm powers the world.

 

Craig Anderton's Archiving Article

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I used to think it was just my wife that was crazy or whatever you wanta call it-example: One time in a fit of rage she looked right at my son and myself and said " I'm not your mother!" Of course I was stupid enough to say "well, you are his mother". From talking to other guys, now I realize their all, in some form another crazy, plain and simple. Uh I guess there aren't any women on this forum? I hope our secrets don't get out.
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Duke, What are you looking for in a woman? Do the women you're attracted to match this picture? Where are you looking for this woman? When I met my wife,the thing that attracted me was how different she was from the women I had been dating. Sounds like you're ready for a change. later, Mike PS: #5 is jerkin' your chain.
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Duke, Why are you wasting your time with older women? At that age, all you'll get are the damaged goods. Scope out the 19-26 y/o demographic for awhile. Don't be self-conscious about your age, either. Lots of younger girls are fascinated with older guys: they're smart enough to know that we know more about sex, the world, how to treat a lady, etc. But, yes: they are all crazy. The experiences you listed looked quite familiar. I've found that it helps not to take them or the relationship too seriously. Have fun when things are cool, and make yourself (or them) scarce when the moon is full. You always have your music when you get lonely and bored, after all. By the way, this reminds me of a joke: when is a man smarter, a) before sex, b) during sex c) or after sex?

Eric Vincent (ASCAP)

www.curvedominant.com

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[quote]Originally posted by coolhouse: [b]Duke, What are you looking for in a woman? Do the women you're attracted to match this picture? Where are you looking for this woman?...[/b][/quote]What do I look for? Lots of things but first, slim and good looking. I've dated great looking women. And therein lies the rub. Lookers are a pain, it seems. I have dated some beautiful women and most of them turned out to be what I would deem "unstable." I've let a couple get by me that I have really regretted; as the years go by, still being friends, they seem to be just outstanding human beings. I'm talking about fantastic women who happen to be gorgeous. They do exist. You might find this to sound crazy but you wanna know why I have pursued music with such passion for the past year? Women. It all started when I told a buddy one day that I was going to find a young wife through music. I told him I was going to buy me some gear, learn to play well and get good enough to be a one-man party dude and if that didn't work, I'd form a band. Why? So I could play private parties. In HOMES. Not bars, HOMES. I mean, I'd play bars some maybe but I'd shoot for private parties. I don't know if it'll work or not. BUT... here's the deal. I want a wife. And I want kids. Gotta have a woman in child-bearing age. And I gotta get movin', being 48. I go out all the time. Two or three nights a week, at least, I'm out on the town at popular watering holes or concerts. Play a lot of golf tournaments, too and there are always parties. I've met a helluva lot of friends and almost all of the girls I've gone out with this way. I've asked friends to fix me up but that hasn't worked out so hot either. The girl I mentioned above who was actually stable as hell, we were together ten years, I met her in a bar. So, nice people do go to bars. When I complain about not having a serious relationship, everybody says "Well, you're meeting them in bars. What do you expect?" Many say, "Go to church." Well, that ain't happening. I don't go to church anymore and have no intention of going back. (Actually, I did go several times with Psycho #2 above, girl #2... to her Catholic church, first time I've been to church in 25 years.) Church is not for me. End of story. Gotta be somewhere else. So, where do you meet people? I am an independent contractor and work from home, so I can't meet them through work. Which is a great place to meet girls, back when I worked downtown in the fancy office building. I even thought about going back to college. I'm serious. Finally, I figured heck, gotta get in front of people in their homes. Private parties in middle class to upper middle class... to upper class... there will be girls of all ages at private parties. And I figured I could build an act with enough b.s. and fun to have a good time along the way. So, that's what I've planned to do with this music thing. Still getting there. The thing about these women I've described is the "irrational" behaviour. Damn, just play by the golden rule. And if you screw up, just admit it, apologize and go on. Seems so fucking simple. All I can tell you is this... from my perspective... all the shit you read about in the lyrics to all of the great love songs of all time... it don't work. It fucking don't work. They say they want it but they really don't. They do but they don't. What the fuck?

> > > [ Live! ] < < <

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Three small thoughts on a vast subject. (1) It's important to find someone who matches your ambitions and temperament as much as possible. Forget looks, figure, upbringing, personality, education, money, nice clothes, shared interests, etc. Any or all of those are assets but ONLY if she fits you like the most comfortable set of clothes you've every owned. If the comfort factor isn't there, forget everything else and look elsewhere. It's never going to work. (2) Zig Ziglar once said that every obnoxious act is a call for help. - Attention: Trolls, are you getting this? - If someone (man, woman, child, friend, neighbor, boss, co-worker, perfect stranger, etc.) acts out, it's because some basic need is not being met, and they're communicating to you that they need help. If you find that women routinely start acting crazy when you date them, perhaps they're expecting something from you that you're not giving them. I have no idea what that might be, but you have to figure it out. Ask friends. Ask clergymen (they know more that you think). Read some books or articles. Do something. Try to see the relationship from your partner's perspective. If you were she, would you be happy? What changes in the relationship would make you happier? (3) The best way to attract a good mate is to be happy with yourself. If you feel miserable or worthless because you don't already have a great relationship, you'll telegraph those feelings and end up attracting similarly miserable people. Think about the kind of person that you'd like to date. Is she self-confident or a basket case? Truly happy or chronically depressed? If you can lift yourself to a "higher level" where the lack of a relationship doesn't hinder your inner contentment, you'll be a lot more attractive to a worthy mate. - This is why it's always easier to find people when you're already IN a relationship. In fact, they find YOU. - Neediness and desperation go over like the plague. Delve into your music, career, family, volunteer work, church, community, education, other interests, etc. Try to get to the point where a relationship would add to your life, but the lack of one won't detract from it (much). This isn't easy, but the closer you can come to this ideal, the better things will work out for you. P.S. Don't worry, there are still some nice ladies out there.

The Black Knight always triumphs!

 

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Hmm, well... Kudos to coolhouse for being attracted to somebody "different". I think that's the thing: the kinds of people you date for fun are going to be different from "the one", in all likelihood. But if you aren't open to that, and keep going for the same "type", you end up with the same old psychos. And here's another secret that Duke seems to have figured out: yes, lookers tend to be a pain. The fact of the matter is that it takes a lot of WORK to look like the ideal of feminine beauty in our society. You have to spend a shitload of time and money on hair, makeup, clothes and stuff like that. Not too many very secure women can be bothered with all that (I certainly can't!), and anybody who IS willing to spend that much time and effort on her appearance has almost GOT to have a major self esteem problem which will come out at some point in ways you don't expect or want. I'm not saying there's no such thing as a naturally beautiful woman, but odds are pretty high that a really beautiful woman is used to being able to manipulate guys and you'll pay for that (and I've had the same experience with really great looking guys). YET... a lot of guys seem to go for looks first and ask other questions later. They also often need to have sex first in order to open up to a woman in other ways. So the stereotype formula is: guys sees hot looking girl in bar, buys her a drink, asks her out, hopefully sleeps with her after a couple of dates and then tries to find out from there whether they have anything else in common. Well you can see the problem: right away you're limiting your options severely. The right one for you may not be much to look at compared to some of the others you've dated, and/or she may not be open to having sex at first. Women who have their shit together tend to want to be friends first, find out if you can really TALK to each other and if you're willing to hang around long enough to get to know her. Like girl #4 that you described: you blew her off after two dates? What's up with that? It sounds like you liked her in many ways and she told other people she wanted to go out with you. How can you presume she's "cold"? Maybe she's just shy, and takes awhile to open up to people. If you can't show her any compassion or patience in that situation, it probably doesn't say a lot for you in her eyes, and that could be the reason she holds back at first. Which brings me to the next point. Girl #1. Yeah, you're right, if a girl throws herself at you it's almost a cinch that she's a psycho. But if you won't take the time to let a more demurre woman warm up to you, you're stuck with the psychos. Sure, hot looking psychos can be great fun if all you want to do is get laid. But it sounds like you're looking for "the one" and I'm telling ya, that dog won't hunt. My personal philosophy is: "dating" sucks. I meet guys through music usually - being at clubs, playing, being in the studio, hanging around the musicplayer forums. :D We usually end up hanging out regularly because of our common interests. If something then develops from there, great. If not, at least I've got a friend. This seems like a better approach to meeting people than "Hi, you're cute, wanna go out?" And most of the "quality" guys I've met have NOT been the first ones I noticed when I walked into a room. They've been the ones who take awhile to get to know. That said, I haven't found "the one" either. And ya know, a lot of times guys have ignored me because I'm not the best looking girl in the place or the most flamboyant. But you say I'm your "dream girl" :D ... well, I'm flattered but I bet you 20 bucks you wouldn't notice me in a bar unless I was playing. So what does that say? It says you gotta change your tune dude... the girl who's hiding a little bit in the shadows, who's just checking out the music because maybe she really loves music and doesn't NEED a man, but would still love to be swept off her feet, and can sweep you off yours too... she's there somewhere, just not where you're looking. --Lee
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Duke, Dan & Lee have both shot you some righteous outlook. We all start out just bein' kids y'know. Then we start adjusting to the gender template and pretty soon we look really different to each other. Sometimes :freak: . The lucky ones eventually dispense with the mold and end up bein' folks. Then they are free to find the really cool,good people that are life's genuine treasures. IMO Lee hit priority numero uno right on the head. Can you talk to each other? If you're lookin' for "the" one,you damn well better enjoy talking to her 'cause your gonna do [i]way[/i] more of that than anything else. Duke,I gotta be straight-up with you on this. Your reply to my questions sounds more like a guy who's looking for action than love. I'm not trying to dis you or embarrass you,it's just that if your mindset is not where you think it is you can overlook that which would make you happiest. BTW I wasn't suggesting you look for chicks in church. There are just as many psychos in the pews as the pubs. I met my wife in a bar. What got my attention was that she didn't fit in. :D There are plenty of good women out there. Good luck. later, Mike
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Duke, They're ALL crazy. Just in different ways. You want kids, that's all well & good. They're CRAZIER than the women who bear them. One bit of advice is, & I'm sure I'll get flamed really badly for this, Don't get involved with a women with someone else's kids. No matter what, you'll always be second fiddle. As Lees says, You're maybe looking in the wrong places & at the wrong women. Hell, you're 48? Lots of time but look for a SINGLE woman who's only baggage is her own. You'll then have the chance to REALLY grow together & not have to worry about fitting in to an existing family.

 

Our Joint

 

"When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it." The Duke...

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[quote][i]Originally posted by coolhouse:[/i] IMO Lee hit priority numero uno right on the head. Can you talk to each other? If you're lookin' for "the" one,you damn well better enjoy talking to her 'cause your gonna do [i]way[/i] more of that than anything else.[/quote]:idea: This is it in a nutshell! My wife is my best friend. When we met, we talked nightly until the sun came up. We still talk about everything. In fact, I shared this thread with her. The important things we have in common are interests, values, goals, outlook on life, and a desire to stare into each other's eyes. :love: BTW, I met my wife through work.

Enthusiasm powers the world.

 

Craig Anderton's Archiving Article

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Wow, Duke. This thread has produced some really good stuff. Dan and Lee incredibly insightful stuff. As I alluded to before, I am in no way an expert in this dating stuff. But in regards to life in general I think it was Dan who made a really great point. You can't need or look to a relationship to make you happy. Furthermore, if you come off like you really [b]got to have [/b] this relationship/family thing happen, you will attract the same dysfunctional psychos and repel well balanced positive woman. Your salvation is not in a relationship, or in a family, or in anything but this moment. Just be, and the joy of life will seep into your being. Needless to say, a needy man really wanting a relationship is about the most unattractive thing in the world, except to a needy woman. But two needy people trying to force a relationship into being, man you're talking about a definite nuclear war. You do seem like a nice fellow, and you really deserve to find a great companion. I think we all do. But I'll leave you with a word advice from Tai chi master Professor Cheng Man-ch'ing. Anytime a student would ask Professor Man-ch'ing a question about anything, for example, How do I throw my opponent? How do I feel the Chi in my arms? What do I do now that I'm out of work? How do I become successful in my occupation? How do I deal with psychos? How do I find the one?, his main reply would simply be Relax Hope this makes sense and helps in some way Jedi

"All conditioned things are impermanent. Work out your own salvation with diligence."

 

The Buddha's Last Words

 

R.I.P. RobT

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Some rad advice here. Personally, I think you're stressing waaay too hard and should, yeah, relax. You're meeting hella women who are digging you at some level, can't complain about that. [quote] 4. Smart, pretty, great job. Beautiful kids. Great home. Witty. After two dates, still cold as a cucumber. I mean, NOTHING. But tells her friends how she wants to go out with me. But she thinks I'm coming back for that? Why should I? I get more warmth from a lady cop. Yikes! Bye. [/quote]This lady. I think you're screwing up by not following up with this one. Do you just wanna get your *ick wet or are you looking for something substantial? I'm way more impressed and generally stoked on girls that aren't all over me right away, sticking their tongue in my mouth on the first kiss, etc. You gotta be thinking long-term, yo, 'cuz the rest of your life is a long time. With any luck and a sensible fitness plan. G. Ratte'
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I have a question for you Duke. Have you thought through the idea that maby you aren't cut out for one single relationship for the rest of your life. Just because it is the so called "Norm" to end up in a certain state of being (marrige or coupled) doesn't mean it is for everyone. There are other ways to view the time you have to live. You are a good person, it seems. If you are happy with who you are and are a benifit to society, you have no obligation to settle down. Look into the idea that maby it's not for you. And that is perfectly fine. Live on. It's your life to do what you choose with, make sure you are in touch with that. I only bring this up because you are 48 not 20. You may have figured out what you need already and not be aware of it. Maby you are more useful to society as a single person, but maby not. As Dan South so elegantly pointed out, it is important to feel ok about your life outside of any relationship. It is healthy advice to not focus on and try to force such an uncontrollable thing as finding a partner. The most control you can have is to live your life in a way that makes you really happy. Do things that you enjoy and shine at, or that make you shine because you enjoy them, and i promise you that the girls will be knockin at your door. Then all you have to do is follow Lee's wonderful advice and take some time getting to know them, and sit back and relax and decide who you want to spend your time with. Having a goal of getting into a relationship is bad, really bad. Have a goal of getting to know some women and learning about women, ask them to teach you about them, Tell them you are an ignorant man who wants to learn about women so he can make one happy one day, they will adore your humility and you will see a side of women that makes alot of sense, even to a man. Remember that a relationship should make both of you better people. In a general sense, you should both be elevated from your friendship with each other. It's a tough call and you have to know yourself pretty well to be able to, once into a relationship, step back every now and again ask yourself if you are growing or drowning. Mi too scents :)
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Hey Duke....don't try so hard. Righteous chicks will come around sooner or later. Almost every lady I pursued actively, didn't like it. The ones I liked but didn't act like I did, were around long as I wanted. You can take "not giving a damn" too far of course, but it does have its place. And you're at the age where you don't have to play up like some might want you to. Every older single lady I've seen was looking to hook up long term....I can't blame em. Whereas the younger ones are just looking to hook up, not necessarily forever. Thats awfully simplistic, but again its my cut on the subject, not the way of all single women. To me sexy isn't all about glamour girls, I can find sexiness in alot of different women........I just love women! I'm blonde, and for some reason I like dark haired and dark skinned women. Being honest and being a standup guy appeals to some women, and apparently being a bad boy appeals to others. Hey if the chick can cook, loves to hear you play music, thinks about jumping your bones all the time, has a career, doesn't want to move in, likes her independence, and looks like she'll still be hot at sixty......GO FOR IT! :) I never dated anybody with more problems than me!!!!! :)
Down like a dollar comin up against a yen, doin pretty good for the shape I'm in
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Wow, some great posts here. Good points all, though I do disagree with Dak about a woman with kids. My wife had two kids before we met, and she treats me like gold most of the time. Now, here is my slant on things: The thing that causes the major problems between men and women can be broken down very easily. Men are seriel(not cereal) devices, and women are parallel devices. Women, by their nature are able to do many things at once. My wife can talk on the phone, wipe a nose, type on the computer and watch a tv all at the same time. Men, can only do one thing at a time, and when asked to go beyond those limits fails miserably. Every know a guy that could watch the kids AND get some housework done? Nope. It doesn't happen. This point manifests itself in two very important ways, which is where the most friction comes from ... Women tend to stretch themselves to full proccessing power, making them much more likely to breakdown, or freak out. This can take the form of "being a bitch" or having a breakdown. That's why men think that women are crazy and over emotional. Men on the other hand, only able to do one thing at a time, tend to focus intently on one and only one thing. This tends to make them have attention deficit disorder(which I think is a fancy scientific term for being a man. I've never known a woman to have this disorder) Ever try to have a conversation with a man with a TV on in a room. You may think that we are involved in the conversation, but we are faking it. Our eyes will keep flicking over to the TV, no matter how many times we've seen the commercial. That's why women think men are self centered and unresponsive. The human race, therefore, would be hopelessly doomed, except for the fact that we have these insane sex drives that make us do things like have sex without protection, which results in more humans. All opinions above are solely those of the editor, and are wild speculation, having no basis in scientific fact. Jack
I really don't know what to put here.
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[quote]Originally posted by Sylver: [b]Wow, some great posts here. Good points all, though I do disagree with Dak about a woman with kids. My wife had two kids before we met, and she treats me like gold most of the time. Now, here is my slant on things: The thing that causes the major problems between men and women can be broken down very easily. Men are seriel(not cereal) devices, and women are parallel devices. Women, by their nature are able to do many things at once. My wife can talk on the phone, wipe a nose, type on the computer and watch a tv all at the same time. Men, can only do one thing at a time, and when asked to go beyond those limits fails miserably. Every know a guy that could watch the kids AND get some housework done? Nope. It doesn't happen. This point manifests itself in two very important ways, which is where the most friction comes from ... Women tend to stretch themselves to full proccessing power, making them much more likely to breakdown, or freak out. This can take the form of "being a bitch" or having a breakdown. That's why men think that women are crazy and over emotional. Men on the other hand, only able to do one thing at a time, tend to focus intently on one and only one thing. This tends to make them have attention deficit disorder(which I think is a fancy scientific term for being a man. I've never known a woman to have this disorder) Ever try to have a conversation with a man with a TV on in a room. You may think that we are involved in the conversation, but we are faking it. Our eyes will keep flicking over to the TV, no matter how many times we've seen the commercial. That's why women think men are self centered and unresponsive. The human race, therefore, would be hopelessly doomed, except for the fact that we have these insane sex drives that make us do things like have sex without protection, which results in more humans. All opinions above are solely those of the editor, and are wild speculation, having no basis in scientific fact. Jack[/b][/quote]Cool! :thu:
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First, Jack (Sylver), by golly, that is one of the most interesting posts I've ever seen. Cool. === Ya know, I was hesitant to keep posting on this because this is kinda personal and I figured it might be boring to you. And that if I really tell you the truth, it's going to be hard not to sound arrogant. But you guys have been so nice about it, I'll give this a shot at expanding on what I've said. If this bores you, just click back, cuz it's long. I started the thread out of frustration with women, for sure, BUT I truly was interested in your perception of the Venus-Mars thing. It's important to point out something here for those that are following this. I am not hard up for a woman. Not at all. What I want is someone to care about. First, a good relationship which, hopefully, means a wife. And hopefully, children. If no children, I'll deal with it. But I really, REALLY want a mate. But understand, I don't have any trouble whatsoever in attracting women and I'm not horny and overbearing. What I am is outgoing and hey, I dance well and that attracts 'em like flies. Finding the right one, that's the problem. I think I've got a lot to give. Heck, I'm passionate about everything and I damn sure enjoy myself. And when my dad died, whom I worshipped... and then five other people in two friggin' weeks died... that changed me forever. I am much more appreciative. Why I've had so much trouble with women, I honestly don't know. But a big problem here is how long it takes to get to know someone. Who they really are. You can't tell on the first date, nor the second, nor the first month. It takes some time. And I promise you, my innermost feelings and needs, the women I've been seeing, they don't know everything that's inside me because we don't get there. That takes time. What I mean is, it's not like I'm desperate and it shows. I don't think it does at all. I think I'm pretty calm. What I'm looking for is someone who I _can_ share passion (about everything) with. Someone I can trust. I am a VERY open person. Women LOVE that. Seem to, anyway. But my closest needs and hopes and dreams, they don't get all of that. [quote]Originally posted by coolhouse: [b]...Duke,I gotta be straight-up with you on this. Your reply to my questions sounds more like a guy who's looking for action than love. I'm not trying to dis you or embarrass you,it's just that if your mindset is not where you think it is you can overlook that which would make you happiest...[/b][/quote]Naw, not the case at all. You'll just have to believe me. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Hopefully, this won't come off as arrogant as I'm just going to be truthful. Let me enlighten you on something that surprised me. Eight years ago, when I entered the dating pool again, I was age 40. Lemme tell you something... I was FLABBERGASTED at how aggressive women are now. Man, I tell you what, I couldn't believe it. That has not changed in the past eight years. I don't know if it's that women are attracted to men in their 40's or they're just horny or what but it's darn sure like that. And women's agressiveness was revealed even BEFORE I was a dance machine. I'd just hang around, standing around, drinking my beer, as calm as can be and just smile a lot, listening to the live music. Every once in awhile, just break into that John Travolta dance stance with your index finger pointing up in the air... from Saturday Night Fever. That always gets 'em. Just kidding. You know I gotta have my live music. And just standing there, minding my own business, I can't tell you how many times women come up to me and come on. It's like their lives are so boring or crappy in some way, if a guy just smiles, it's a magnet. And talking with other people around you. Chatting, b.s.'ing, just having a good time. Smiles. That's the key. Smiles attract women. When I said I had a one track mind like any other guy, that might have been a poor choice of words because bedding a woman is not my goal. I just meant that it's damn sure on my mind from the getgo like it is any guy but my goal is exactly the OPPOSITE. At this age, I use caution. I am much wiser than I was 25 years ago! With someone who I want to get to know, I'm actually trying to throttle back. Sex only muddies up the water. Remember, I'm looking for someone to establish a long-term relationship with. I have been in a relationship before where I finally figured out I was addicted to her sex, not who she was. Not good for the long-term thing. I am speaking the truth... I turn down women often! Including lots of married ones. I'm not exaggerating. TWICE this week, I have had "trouble" with a married woman. First time was last Saturday night, I was out with two single girls (hell yes, both divorced) and one married girl and her husband. The married one, I couldn't believe she did this. Another Venus and Mars thing. Floors me. What on earth was she thinking? First let me say that this girl is very attractive. I don't mean beauty queen, just attractive and very appealing. Not a showboat, pretty calm and stuff but very appealing. Two gorgeous kids. I like her. But she's married. I like her husband. We're sitting at the bar. She pays me a compliment. Then says "Why don't you ever want to kiss me?" "Well, heck, I can't kiss you! You're married!" And her friggin' husband is RIGHT THERE. This bozo turns to her husband and says "John, do you care if Duke kisses me?" I damn near died. SHE is the one who started it. And I'm sure it looked to him like I wanted to kiss her. And this guy is a badass. I mean, very nice guy and a friend of mine but man, this guy is a badass. There aren't many guys who would want to tussle with this guy. I'm not sure what he said but he didn't come over and knock me out. Somehow, I got through that. Then she tells me how he's attracted to her sister. And she's attracted to me. Damn, back off! Somehow, I survived the night. By the way, alcohol was part of this equation. She was drunk. Can be bad stuff, can't it. Next thing was Monday night. I'm over at a friend's house and we're playing his keyboard. He and his wife have a friend staying with them. She's been there four days. Because her husband whooped up on her. She had a huge bruise on her arm. Before I know it, she's dancing all over me and stuff. Now understand that I've known this girl for years. She has a little boy who has spinal bifida. Her life is miserable. The child can't feed himself, is contantly sick and he has a colostomy bag and all kinds of problems. She does not have a normal life. And her husband is an idiot. Drug problem, I have heard. Anyway, I've known her for years. Maybe this is what did it -- I bought her son a bunny rabbit toy for Easter coming up. My mom sells Avon and she had this bunny rabbit thing that sings this song and hops at the chorus. It's really cool. She sold 20 in no time. So I bought one for this girl's son. I've never bought him anything. I just thought it would be a good thing to do... I mean, he's pretty pitiful and for some reason, when I saw that hoppity bunny, I thought of this little boy. After awhile, the girl disappears. I didn't think anything of it. I had no idea where she went. About 30 minutes later, she shows up again where we're playing and she looks different. I finally figured it out. She put makeup on! Then she turned it on again. I soon left. I damn sure don't need some crazy dope-crazed nut that beats up on his wife after me. Hell, that's how you get your ass shot. By the way, again, alcohol was part of this equation. She was drinking. Can be bad stuff, can't it. My personal opinion is that women don't handle alcohol very well. When women hit on you, it's no secret what they want... many times, they just tell you. I'm not saying I'm the ultimate gift to women; they come on to my friends, too. But for various personal reasons, I'm not going to hop in the sack with a different woman every night. I've done my share of that but no longer. I won't go into my private life but let's just say I'm not hurtin' in that department. Now, when I see a woman I am interested in pursuing, the first thing that attracts me is looks. She doesn't have to be a beauty queen but attractive. I definitely go for the beauty queens but it's not mandatory. Just attractive. And slim. Sorry, I'm into slim. Second is personality. Then I want to get to know her. Talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. Lots of talking. She needs to have a good heart. Hopefully, intelligent. Cuz I like to talk about lots of stuff. Courteous. Just a good person. And there's the problem. Lately, I get to know them and am greatly disappointed. She's not what I thought she was. I'm on a bad run lately. And in fact, two of the five above are out and out weirdos. And they have a lot of the world fooled cuz they seem so "normal." But they're not what I call normal. Here's another one. Couple of years ago, I dated another girl. Long story short, she ended up telling LOTS of people I stole from her. Friggin' wigged out on me. Man, I had a shitload of women in town that wouldn't even speak to me. I told them it was just lies because I didn't want a serious relationship with her (and I told her that from the getgo... I never led her on.) After I confronted her with her lying, she admitted it and thank goodness, she did tell some girls that she had lied and they spread the word, the truth. Then I was on good terms again with people again. Is that psycho or what? The older I get, the more interesting human behaviour becomes to me. Believe me, I have my demons. FOR SURE. Sometimes I wish I would have gone into psychology; it is SO interesting. As the Doors sang "People are strange." And in my own way, I assure you I include me in the department. But I do _try_ to treat others well. One thing I've noticed as I look back at the past eight years... is that the gals with the dynamic personalities, the charmers... I think that's a red flag. I know some charming women that are terrific women but I think you gotta watch out if they're that bubbly and outgoing. The two psychos I mentioned (plus the other one above who said I stole from her) are that way, too. I'd actually rather have someone more reserved. Just decency and courtesy. The thing is, girls like this that are dynamos are damn sure fun to be with. But hell, I'm tired of fun. I'll keep swinging the bat but something's got to change. And what has to change is I have to get into a pool of single women of child bearing age. A family is numbero uno with me now.

> > > [ Live! ] < < <

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These are some great posts. Dan, Lee, Soapbox, Jack! Great stuff and I agree with most all of the above. My wife happens to be very beautiful. I got very lucky. I agree with Lee that beautiful woman are a pain, generally. They tend to be very high maintenance. They know they're beautiful and value themselves as such and need to be acknowledged as such, often. I mean what happens when you have somebody who spends that much time puffing themselves up and puts so much value on that? My wife is my best friend, by far. She has a great job she loves and does not need me to define her value. She is far from psycho. She's one of the most sane people I know. I have a very low threshold for craziness. First and foremost we love being together and have been married 12 years and had been together two years prior to that. She was also 23 when we met and she's still gorgeous. Two boys. I think you need to decide what you want. A bar is not the best place to meet someone, but I met my wife in one, where I was playing, and I am having a hard time recalling any women I ever went out with, post high school, I didn't met in a bar. People in bars are on the make, and even when they SAY they're looking for Mr. Right/Ms Right, they are going on automatic lounge lizard mode to get laid. And it's hard to break out of that circuit. By the time you find someone that LOOKS right, they've had such a history of relationship fiascos that "trust" is no longer in the vocabulary. Sometimes "you" aren't "you" but are rather some odd, strange guy, or series of guys, that she's still doing some battle with from the past. Love is a Battlefield. Out with the party crowd gets you a power partier. A lot of fun but also a lot more headache/heartache. But the long haul requires a lot of work and dedication, because you have to reprogram those circuits, mainly your own. You reprogram yourself and you'll attract someone similar. Find out what you need; your goals, children, house, religion, all that stuff. Put it there. Guys are stupid about this stuff. I really, really do believe women are smarter than we are. Maybe I've always met women who were smarter than me. I think Rome was built by men trying to impress their girlfriends. They never knew they were being manipulated to build it.

All the best,

 

Henry Robinett

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Duke, I don't know you. I don't know your town, and I don't know where you hang out in your town, so this is a guess, but I think it's probably a good guess. You're missing an important point from the posts above. Agressive, horny, dolled-up bar vixens are NOT what you're looking for. A woman who likes you because you dance well is NOT what you're looking for. A woman who's unhappy enough in her own marriage to throw herself at a perfect stranger in a bar is NOT what you're looking for. I'll bet that there are two dozen nice girls that you're ignoring for every one of these hot tamales that snag your attention. You need to shift your focus. You know what they say: If you do what you've always done, you'll get what you've always gotten. Or: It doesn't help to keep swingin' your bat when you're standing in the wrong ball park.

The Black Knight always triumphs!

 

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The only practical advice I can give from experience is don't pick up women at a Joan Jett concert, even if they appear to be flirting with you. They'll just get back together with their girlfriend! :eek: :confused: :eek:
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[quote]Originally posted by Dan South: [b]...You're missing an important point from the posts above. Agressive, horny, dolled-up bar vixens are NOT what you're looking for. A woman who likes you because you dance well is NOT what you're looking for. A woman who's unhappy enough in her own marriage to throw herself at a perfect stranger in a bar is NOT what you're looking for...[/b][/quote]As always, thanks for you posts but you've missed out on what I've said. It is very difficult to convey in the written word what you (I) really mean. I _know_ those things you stated and said so above in my last post. I mainly wrote that to just give insight to my perspective about many women these days. I agree with you. I didn't say I go for women who think I dance good. I wrote that to show that I don't have any trouble getting women. It's far from that. But I "want" to find a quality woman. Just someone who can behave with general courtesy and no stupid games. And don't go psycho on me. But also, the two that I did fall for that turned out to be psycho, let me say again, any guy might initially fall for them, too. I don't think I'll fall for those types again but I don't know that for sure. I hope not. I don't mean these girls acted like sluts when I met them. Not at all. By golly, these girls are just powerful as hell. I've watched them operate since. They wrap men around 'em effortlessly. Women, too. My mother and sister-in-law think psycho #1 is wonderful. I've never told them much to the contrary, I just let it be. She is charming as hell. They got a power, you see. And they damn sure know how to use it. The girl #5 in the first post, now she's more my real type. Kinda quiet. Still can't figure her out, though. Actually, #4 could work, too. If she'd warm up a bit. But heck, if there is ZERO affection. I mean, nothing, it's damn hard to go back. No touch of the hand, no nothing. I dunno, I guess I'll call her again. Last three times I've called her, couldn't connect. By the way, I do think this -- any person who has found their ideal soul mate -- they are very fortunate and they should damn sure let their spouse know it. I think it's VERY hard to do. That's what I miss so much about the one I split with eight years ago. She and I were great friends. I screwed up. I never knew how much it meant to have her call me to say "I'm on my way home." Something as simple as that. Heck, went in one ear and out the other. Now I realize how much little things like that mean. Sounds mushy, but it's true. The older I get, the mushier I get.

> > > [ Live! ] < < <

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Duke, Sounds like you are in the process of figuring out what a lot of your needs really are, which a lot of times doesn't happen until you're older. I don't think anyone implied that you had trouble getting women. It's a particular quality of company that you're obviously looking for, and what everyone's point is, is that even if you are NOT just looking for "action", if you go about meeting women in the same way and the same type of women as if you WERE just looking for action, you probably won't meet anybody suitable. And it sounds like that's what you're doing. Just an observation based on what you've said: it sounds like you are not particularly willing to work at a relationship, or maybe I should say not in the way a woman would want. Sure you can dance, you're working hard on your music, you're outgoing which obviously helps you to "get chicks". But... once you actually get in a dating situation things sound a little dicey. Like Girl #4 - you say she's not been affectionate but have YOU tried to be affectionate with HER? Do you take HER hand? You say that when you dance, lots of women come up to you, but do you ever come off the dance floor and look around for women who might have been quietly watching you but would NOT approach you? And maybe just start talking with her? Sure you might get rejected, and then it might seem like more fun to go for the aggressive ones, but... ain't goona work. Also, I'll reiterate that if the first thing you go for is looks, and you ignore anybody who's not "up to your standard" in that department, you could be eliminating somebody who might make you very, very happy. Yes, you have to watch out for "charmers." Charmers appear to give you instant intimacy and it sounds like that's what you're going for (even if deep down you know it takes time to get to know someone). They give you the alluring fantasy of "love at first sight". But has it ever even occurred to you that someone can become more attractive because you gave them real love? I don't just mean that they become more attractive in your eyes because you become intimate with them - although that definitely happens too. But people can be remarkably changed by real love. Maybe an overweight girl would finally be motivated to diet and exercise and be healthier because somebody loves her. Maybe a girl who used to be a wallflower would blossom because your love gives her confidence she never had. You just DON'T KNOW if you won't even go out with a girl and find out whether you can really talk to each other, and laugh. Especially laugh. Sharing a sense of humor is a BIG deal. If you can't laugh at each other's jokes, you probably don't have much in common in other areas either. As for the Venus/Mars thing, well, I hate stereotypes both male and female. I am not a female stereotype and I'm not interested in male stereotypes. But there is one thing that I think is hardwired: women want a protector. That's what we look for in "the one". I don't mean necessarily a great big muscular he-man, I mean somebody that they can sense will look after them, will not be elsewhere if something goes wrong, is willing to be patient and work at problems and not dodge responsibilities. Women who want to get married and have kids, are looking for someone who can take care of a family, and there are a lot of biological instincts that kick in there. Heck, I don't even want kids and I'm the most independent low maintenance type around probably, but I still feel that way. I'm willing to be a protector too, a shoulder to cry on, baby a guy if he's sick or tired, etc., but it's gotta be a two way street and I'd really prefer not to initiate a relationship. If a woman pursues a man it's generally because she's either desperate, so insecure that she can't handle a real man, really hates men and wants to bust yer balls, or is just looking to get laid. When I was younger I sometimes would pursue a guy that I was interested in because I'd think maybe he was shy about broaching the subject with me. In all cases this didn't turn out well, because what I found was that a guy who couldn't pursue ME was also going to evade responsiblity for the relationship in other ways. Like I said, I tend to "date" guys I'm already friends with, so it's not as if a guy wouldn't know I liked him. If I like somebody I show it. But the thing is, I want to be pursued. I don't mean stalked or worshipped, or for somebody to buy me a bunch of expensive stuff. NOT EVEN! :D But it's the little things: like you say, calling just to say you're on your way, or making the arrangements for a fun night out, basically just wanting to be around and letting me know I can count on him. Spending quality time and really making it a priority to know me inside and out. I already KNOW I can take care of myself, and I've already been a freakin' babysitter for enough guys. I don't want a kid, I want a man. Get the idea? Don't go for the easy ones, the charmers, the ones who come after you. You'll have to work a bit more I'm afraid. But the good ones are worth it and will give you back AT LEAST as much as you give her. Good women are generous and appreciative of what you do for them, VERY appreciative if ya know what I mean! ;) Good luck. Lee
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