Sexual Harrassment On The "Boston Legal" TV Show

[Tedly Nightshade]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

Originally posted by Angelo Clematide:

And now, how are the charges when you face the judge; Chain Gang? 20 years prison? or what...

LOL... I don't think sexual harrassment is actually a "crime" that can get you jail time (unless a rape occurred of course, or the victim is a minor). It is just something you can sue for and receive monetary compensation from the offender.

This can kill a small business- if they get sued over such a thing, that can be the end of the business if they can't afford to pay and stay in business. That's one good reason to take all this seriously.

[Saint Johnny B]

No one wants to take a stab at answering my "ultra-sensitive person" hypothetical question posed above? Hmmm.

 

I was sort of hoping a little discussion could lead to a better and tighter definition of conduct that could apply across the board to everyone.

 

Should one be able to sign away or waive their rights under the right circumstances?

 

What if it's obvious that "sex" is part of the job? Maybe like a dancer or adult film star? Or what if it's not so blatant, but it still comes up as part of the job? Like in the editor or mix engineer example above? Maybe it's work in a comedy club that uses strong/offensive language?

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Also, above it was noted that buinesses with 15 or fewer employees are exempt, which exemption, I feel is wrong.

 

From what I'm reading here, I think we need a clear agreement on what is allowable and and what it not, and once there is an a agreement on the minimum standards, they ought to apply to everyone...

 

YMMV

[KenElevenShadows]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

Originally posted by Ken/Eleven Shadows:

I think Lee's approach is very sensible and reasonable. But as others have already pointed out, what she considers sexual harassment may differ from others. Some people, for instance, may be greatly offended by comments that have sexual innuendo, while others may think it's really funny and livens up the day.

Agreed, but the thing is... no one should be able to SUE for sexual harrassment because somebody told a dirty joke at work.

As you point out, the law is there to protect people, so suing someone for telling a dirty joke at work would be misuse of the law and would seem highly inappropriate to me.

 

While I think it would be ludicrous for someone to press charges against someone for telling a dirty joke at work, I'd also say that if someone keeps relentlessly telling dirty jokes to someone who keeps saying, "Stop doing that, get away from me, I'm really offended by that." that might merit further action.

 

One of the key words in sexual harrassment guidelines is the word *unwanted*. But of course, sexual harassment laws are admittedly vague and often open to interpretation, and that obviously makes it difficult sometimes.

[Franknputer]

Johnny, I think you're a bit off the mark with the editor thing. Forget that an ultra-sensitive person would most likely not work in such an environment if they had any choice - and if they did, then they chose to compromise their feelings for the sake of a job;

 

Assuming, of course, that a very prim & proper editor worked as 1/2 of the editing staff for a company that produces religious TV and hardcore porn videos...

 

Getting picked to edit "Pr0nfest 2000" because the other guy got hit by a bus is not harrassment - it's a distasteful assignment, like having to mix a rap music show in spite of hating it.

 

If this person refused, & was fired, then their case would be about wrongful termination, not sexual harrassment.

[Saint Johnny B]

You bring up a good point re: rap and hip hop lyrics...

 

I've been around certain women who strenuously object to being subjected to these kinds of lyrics.

 

So under some of the above definitions, if someone were playing this kind of entertainment in the workplace, the employer could be sued for sexual harrassment. How about a radio station that aired it?

 

It would seem there's now a collision between the 1st Amendment's free speech protections and ban on most forms of censorship, and a person's right to have a workplace that is free from sexual harrassment.

 

Now what?

[fantasticsound]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

If an employee is making another employee seriously uncomfortable for any reason, especially if it's deliberate, they should report it to a superior. I'm not saying it doesn't suck for somebody to do that, I'm saying that if workers are allowed to sue any time someone at work is verbally hostile toward them, we'd be bankrupted due to court costs. People who work together don't always get along (understatement) and that's why you have a hierarchy and people who are supposed to work such things out within the workplace. I don't think the law needs to get involved unless the person is really being threatened.

Therein lies the crux. Most workplace hierarchies are not in place to protect workers from one another. They are there to promote order and serve the company for efficiency. And realistically, if an enlightened person such as you doesn't see the potential for this to create a hostile workplace, how do you expect the typical supervisor to understand and react appropriately to the situation? They can't because their pre-disposition is that the offended party is over-reacting, when that may or may not be the case. This is exactly why these laws have become so well documented.

 

I still remember the case of a female worker who objected to the posting of calendars from vendors that featured the product and bikini or lingerie laden women placed in full view of everyone. Now you could argue these images are broadcast everywhere, but that isn't pertinent. This was a work area and she was made to feel as objectified by her co-workers. Management refused to remove the offending calendar and she sued and won. It was one of the first well known cases of sexual harrassment. Despite two decades or so of litigations and education about this subject, it is still a problem that management at many companies refuse to deal with until lawyers are involved. That's the reality. We wouldn't have most of these lawsuits if employers treated these situations objectively. Typically, from what I've seen, they don't.

 

Sure, there will always be people who do over-react or deliberately push an issue in search of monetary rewards, but I don't believe they make up the bulk of complaints that reach the courts.

[Lee Flier]

Neil,

 

I agree that bosses are not always understanding about these things, however, I guess I consider that in MOST cases the workplace is a hostile environment. If I were to start suing for everything that made me feel objectified and dehumanized in an office, nearly every corporation would be out of business.

 

Do I feel offended and objectified if somebody displays a calendar of bikini clad women in full view of everyone? Yes I do. Do I think it says something about the people who would display something like that in the office? Yes I do. Can I still do my job and advance in my career despite the presence of this calendar and the inevitable assholes in general who populate offices? Sure. Does it affect my health or safety? No it doesn't - the formaldehyde in the cubicle I work in is certainly more destructive to my well being than a freaking calendar and nobody talks about suing over that.

 

If somebody touches me, sexually threatens me or tells me I can't have a job or advance in my career without giving them sexual favors, that's when it's time to bring the law in. "Feeling objectified," ha. I feel objectified the minute I walk into an office and it has nothing to do with being female. Can I sue somebody?

[jlampson]

I don't understand why the company and the employees in any situation like this are unclear. The statutes govern this. There are required classes that must be attended and the information is always the same.

 

Sure, it is up to the employee to report it or accept discipline depending on their involvement, however the labor boards of the state love to side with the wronged employee versus the company. Some people, unfortunately, are protected in nearly any company, that is, they can do no wrong. This is very bad judgement and destroys morale quickly.

 

Well, that's all I have to say today.

 

John