OT: New subforum for beginners?

[Jose EB5AGV]

Hi all,

 

I have been a member of this forum for exactly 4 years (yesterday was my forum membership anniversary 😄) as I joined shortly after I began playing, from zero, back in February 2018. For me, it has been a wonderful resource and, as a sample, it was great the help I got when last July I was confronted to my first gig with my band. I received lots of advice and encouragement and it really made a difference. Thanks from heart 🤗

 

But I see most of the people here has decades of experience and, even if in my case I was not afraid to ask basic questions, may be a barrier for other people to participate on this wonderful forum.

 

So I had thought on the possibility of creating a sub-forum for newcomers to playing, as myself. That would help to isolate the main forum from beginners questions, to have them better categorised and easier to find, and also to encourage new membership from people getting into playing in a band or in public in general.

 

What do you think? 🤔

 

Thanks for your time!

 

Jose

[Coker]

I have from time to time enjoyed giving tips on instruments I have owned, but I don’t think I would frequent a beginners forum just to do that.  I suspect beginners benefit from interaction with “seasoned” players because they all use the same forum.  Just my 2 cents.

[Jose EB5AGV]

10 minutes ago, Coker said:

I have from time to time enjoyed giving tips on instruments I have owned, but I don’t think I would frequent a beginners forum just to do that.  I suspect beginners benefit from interaction with “seasoned” players because they all use the same forum.  Just my 2 cents.

 

Thanks for commenting.

 

The idea is to have something similar to the Adult Beginners Forum on PianoWorld (here the Adult part is not needed in the description, I guess), where there are plenty of beginners along other seasoned people who also participate.

 

Of course, a beginner will evolve over time and become a more experienced player, so not everyone has zero experience and people can interact with the newly arrived, having their beginning struggling fresh and so perhaps being more motivated to help others on a similar situation.

 

At least this is how I envision myself in one of those beginner forums, as an evolutionary process, helping and sharing on it.

 

Jose

[ProfD]

IMO, there is no need for a beginners sub-forum. 

 

As @Coker mentioned above, the seasoned folks around here usually do not have an issue with sharing knowledge and information with beginners. 

 

Granted, we may humor ourselves and give folks a hard time when asking certain questions without doing a topic search first but for the most part, we'll repeat the information too.😁

 

Beginner or intermediate or advanced...fire away.😎

[Jose EB5AGV]

I think we could run a simple poll, about how many years of playing experience each member who usually writes in the forum has (lurkers with no experience will just probe my point). My guess is that there would be very few people with less than 10 years, let alone 1-5 years. And this is my point: why is that happening?. Because there is no place to ask, as I would do, for example, about ways to comp pop/rock songs with the keyboard. That, for the current forum, would be a too-basic topic. This is where I see a gap. Because all of you, some time ago, were beginners. And, I guess, a friendly subforum to share with other beginners would have been great for your development. But, perhaps back then, these were just a distant future ahead 😅...

 

 I still think is a missed opportunity to naturally grow and to attract people by helping from the lower playing levels, but who am I, but a poor beginner 😬?

 

Jose

[Docbop]

I'm a beginner on piano, but really don't see a need for a separate forum.  I followed that Adult Beginner Forum that was on Piano World and thought it was a mess.   If someone is a beginner they should say so and members will adjust their answers to fit.  

[Al Quinn]

22 minutes ago, EB5AGV said:

Because there is no place to ask, as I would do, for example, about ways to comp pop/rock songs with the keyboard. That, for the current forum, would be a too-basic topic. This is where I see a gap. Because all of you, some time ago, were beginners.

 

I respectfully disagree that this is a too-basic topic for this forum. I think it's a great topic, a very important skill, and not as easy as it appears. I've seen "advanced" players struggle with this while the greats (e.g., Richard Tee and Billy Preston come to mind) knock it out of the park.

 

 

[Dave Bryce]

My first question would be this:

 

If there was such a forum, where will the advice the beginners seek come from?  Isn't it possible that a forum marked for beginners would not be read by the people who have the experience from which the beginners could benefit?

 

I'm inclined to agree with the other posts encouraging the OP to not worry about topics being too basic.  Al's post above is spot on - I've been playing for over 50 years, and I'd be happy to learn more about comping pop/rock...if for no other reason than to hear how others with different goals and expeeriences than I see/approach this topic.

 

One of the main things I've been lucky enough to learn over the years is that there's always room for more learning, especially at basic levels.  If nothing else, it's frequently useful to see the different approaches that folks take to get where they're going.  I believe in more cases than not, there's no such thing as a "right" or "wrong" approach - I think it's more a matter of circumstances and personal taste, style and goals.

 

dB

 

 

[Jose EB5AGV]

OK, I see nobody seems to think it is a good idea so, no problem, just toss it 👎

 

I will open a thread about comping, now that you have approved it, though 😆

 

Best regards,

 

Jose (who is just going to his weekly rehearsal with the band!)

[Adan]

IMO, no need for that.  Generally speaking, I don't see anyone on here who resents or has an attitude about responding to so-called beginner's questions (if that's really a thing -- as pointed out above, maybe it's not).  The point of a forum like this should be people who know stuff sharing with people who have questions regarding said stuff.  Condescension or snbbery should have no place on a forum like this.

 

A similar dynamic exists between "pros" and "amateurs," those terms in quotes because of the blurry line between them.  Arguably, the pros don't benefit as much as the amateurs from some dicussions, but I always get the feeling that the pros who are on here take some enjoyment from their mentoring role, and for the most part they are all good eggs who don't talk down to people.

 

Going back several years, there were certain individuals who spent a lot of time on this forum and were not as patient and welcoming to people they believed were below them on the totem pole.  Those people have mostly moved on and that subculture seems to have thankfully dissolved.

[Sean M. H.]

24 minutes ago, EB5AGV said:

OK, I see nobody seems to think it is a good idea so, no problem, just toss it 👎

 

I will open a thread about comping, now that you have approved it, though 😆

 

Best regards,

 

Jose (who is just going to his weekly rehearsal with the band!)

 

😁...lol.  Yeah, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the willingness/patience of the vet players around here in terms of answering "basic" questions (cant necessarily say the same about other forums).  Don't ever hesitate to ask!

[ProfD]

11 minutes ago, Adan said:

Going back several years, there were certain individuals who spent a lot of time on this forum and were not as patient and welcoming to people they believed were below them on the totem pole.  Those people have mostly moved on and that subculture seems to have thankfully dissolved.

Right.  The most condescending and snobbish folks will usually fade to black and take their business elsewhere.  The remaining folks are helpful and some have a sense of humor too. 😎

[Dave Bryce]

10 minutes ago, ProfD said:

Right.  The most condescending and snobbish folks will usually fade to black and take their business elsewhere.  The remaining folks are helpful and some have a sense of humor too. 😎

 😊

 

dB

[S_Gould]

Hey dB, how about a sticky thread titled "Beginners welcome; don't be afraid" (or something like that)? Let them know that there are no stupid questions, and the helpful posters (most of the 'regulars') will respond without condescending.

[Docbop]

One of the forums I used to hangout on I think it might of been a guitar forum had some checkbox that someone could indicated they were asked a beginner/novice type question.   Then in the listing there was some indicator that appear with the post title so that way people who didn't want to deal with noobs could just skips  those posts.   

 

Personally I hate it when experienced players make nasty posts to noobs. You're not required to post, don't like a basic question just move on to the next post you're interested in.   

[Bill H.]

As forums go, this is a relatively small community encompassing a wide range of genres and individual skills. And (once again as forums go) we all get along  pretty well! I don't want to splinter it up - keep it as a whole, and fire away with any questions you have Jose. 

[ajstan]

It seems to me that what Jose (@EB5AGV) may be looking for is a peer group.  Despite how helpful and kind most of you are, it can be understandably difficult for a new member (let alone a new musician) to feel like a contributing peer in an environment where many of you have relationships that go back a decade or more and have had impressive runs in the professional music world.

 

I don't have a solution to propose, but I will say that it feels good when I can occasionally contribute when the topic is a piece of gear with which I have some experience.  So, maybe with all of the equipment that Jose has acquired, I'd expect that he will be able to add value to future discussions.

[Morrissey]

36 minutes ago, ajstan said:

It seems to me that what Jose (@EB5AGV) may be looking for is a peer group.  Despite how helpful and kind most of you are, it can be understandably difficult for a new member (let alone a new musician) to feel like a contributing peer in an environment where many of you have relationships that go back a decade or more and have had impressive runs in the professional music world.

 

I don't have a solution to propose, but I will say that it feels good when I can occasionally contribute when the topic is a piece of gear with which I have some experience.  So, maybe with all of the equipment that Jose has acquired, I'd expect that he will be able to add value to future discussions.

 

I happen to agree on the specific issue at hand -- i.e., that we shouldn't have a beginner sub-forum -- but will add my testimony that, despite the many virtues of this community, it can be intimidating to join the discussion.  I lurked for many years before finding the courage to post.  And I don't consider myself a shy person.

[rgcm]

I'm still lurking. 😀

[Doerfler]

4 hours ago, ajstan said:

I don't have a solution to propose, but I will say that it feels good when I can occasionally contribute when the topic is a piece of gear with which I have some experience.  So, maybe with all of the equipment that Jose has acquired, I'd expect that he will be able to add value to future discussions.

Exactly. Never think that those of us who have been around for a minute can't learn from those who have not. 

In addition, new members are what keeps the forum strong.

Looking forward to all lurkers posting, and/or starting a new thread. 

[The Real MC]

I've been playing piano and synths for over 50 years, and I *STILL* learn something on occasion I did not know.

 

I'm always learning, so technically I'm a beginner.  No need for a subforum.

[nursers]

Also, there are plenty of semi-beginners! Although I've been a proud member here for 20+ years, if you did an assessment of playing ability I'd be in the bottom 10-20%  And yet have never felt silly asking a question.

[stillearning]

5 hours ago, The Real MC said:

I've been playing piano and synths for over 50 years, and I *STILL* learn something on occasion I did not know.

 

I'm always learning, so technically I'm a beginner.  No need for a subforum.

I am 68, been playing piano since age 4, and I am stillearning, hopefully another 30 yrs!

[Wrrtyuuiioop]

As most learners start off using a Yamaha or Casio then a brand specific forum related to their chosen keyboard would probably be a better place for beginners to reside.

 

Pro rata there seems very few posts here Beginner related and the resources are geared more for Pro and Semi Pro keyboardists.

 

Over on another forum there is a whole section just for beginners and plenty of resource links, sadly these are lacking here.

[Jose EB5AGV]

17 minutes ago, Biggles said:

As most learners start off using a Yamaha or Casio then a brand specific forum related to their chosen keyboard would probably be a better place for beginners to reside.

 

Pro rata there seems very few posts here Beginner related and the resources are geared more for Pro and Semi Pro keyboardists.

 

Over on another forum there is a whole section just for beginners and plenty of resource links, sadly these are lacking here.

 

Well, I should comment that I did not mean beginners in a sense that the problem is to know their instruments. That could be a sideline problem, but not the main one, and could be solved here, or just by RTFM or elsewhere 😃

 

I meant beginners as keyboardists playing in a band or wanting to do it, as it is my case (I am playing piano/keyboards for about 5 years but started with my band just 7 months ago)

 

Jose

[Adam Burgess]

Been playing (for money) for over 30 years, I love this forum. Some great advice on many levels for everyone.
It's definitely one of the most well-behaved forums! And, I'm sure that no question is too basic.

All the pros that got me to where I am today always passed their knowledge on, and gave me chances where they could. It's the same here.
Quite happy to converse with beginners (and, ALL of us that are still learners…), about musicianship, good practice regarding keeping a band together, tech, best way to put up with singers and crap sound guys etc etc haha…

Love reading all the stories that made some guys what they are today… I think this a great place. No such thing as a stupid question.

[stoken6]

14 hours ago, rgcm said:

I'm still lurking. 😀

Who said that?

[stoken6]

19 hours ago, Adan said:

Going back several years, there were certain individuals who spent a lot of time on this forum and were not as patient and welcoming to people they believed were below them on the totem pole.  Those people have mostly moved on and that subculture seems to have thankfully dissolved.

I've certainly noticed a reduction in the toxicity of this forum since those times. 

 

14 hours ago, Morrissey said:

despite the many virtues of this community, it can be intimidating to join the discussion.  I lurked for many years before finding the courage to post.

I have been advised that lurking is a good induction ceremony into any forum - just to get a feel for how the place runs. It's good to have you as part of the community here @Morrissey

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Tusker]

19 hours ago, EB5AGV said:

I will open a thread about comping, now that you have approved it, though 😆

 

About ten years ago, I started gigging intensively. Previously I had thought I was an advanced player. I began  to realize that good comping is an art and a subtle craft. I look forward to sharing and learning from others in the thread you open. It sounds very exciting.

[cphollis]

20 hours ago, EB5AGV said:

OK, I see nobody seems to think it is a good idea so, no problem, just toss it 👎

 

I will open a thread about comping, now that you have approved it, though 😆

 

Best regards,

 

Jose (who is just going to his weekly rehearsal with the band!)

Well, I might disagree with the masses.  When you said "beginners' forum", I wasn't thinking piano lessons.

 

I was thinking about helping people sort out things like "what keyboard or keyboards should I be thinking about?" and "how do I amplify my sound?" and "how do I connect all this stuff?".  +10db or -4db?  XLR vs TRS.  Mixers, effects -- how do they work?  What should I bring to a gig?  Etc.  A "safe space" where there are no stupid questions (just stupid answers) would have been helpful to me way back when.

 

While playing technique (and comping!) are quite important, so are the other bits.  I too look forward to the comping thread, as I think it's an art form as others have said here.