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Hammond vs Vox/Farfisa


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I'm relatively young (42) and have never been too much into Hammond and transistor organs. However I've listened to a lot of vintage recordings with those instruments and have always found the Vox/Farfisa sounds to sound appalling compared to Hammond. I'm actually a pretty huge fan of The Doors and think the Vox is cool there, creates this specific surrealistic feel but apart from it, these transistor organs just don't sound serious to me, my impressions is always about something cheap, old, grotesque, intentionally ugly 😀 Apart from vintage band tributes and covers, do any of you find usage of transistor organ emulations in their music?

 

BTW, I feel the same sickness when I hear (what I recently understood is) Mellotron patches and especially the so called flute... 🤮 But that's for yet another thread.

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My first keyboard was a transistor-kind of organ, by the maker Rheem.  I bought it, a 15" speaker and a sparkle red tuck-and-roll Fender head at a pawn shop in Boston MA. for $300 bucks.  I kept going to different music stores looking for a stomp-box pedal that would make it sound more like the cool organ tones I was hearing on Allman Bros. records, but nothing I tried did the trick. (lol)  I sometimes see those keyboards for sale on Reverb, and sometimes feel I should buy one for nostalgia's sake.

 

Flash forward a couple of years, and I bought a used Yamaha YC-45 dual manual transistor organ.  By this time, I had become somewhat hipper to organ sounds, and I ran it thru an old Leslie speaker I had modified to accept a 1/4" input.  That Yamaha sounded pretty good going thru the Leslie; almost like a Hammond.  I played that rig for a couple of years in a Grateful Dead clone band I was in.  That was one cool keyboard capable of a wide variety of sounds, but it is not a Hammond.

 

So my early keyboard years were spent using transistor organs and trying to get them to sound more like a Hammond/Leslie combo. 

 

Interestingly, my current organ set-up is a Hammond XK3 played thru a Motion Sound Pro 145, and with all that Hammond and Leslie goodness at my command, my favorite sound is organ with the Leslie stopped.  I heard this Ray Charles album where he plays a Hammond without a Leslie (IIRC, the recording is Genius + Soul = Jazz), and fell in love with that sound - which to me sounds yet more hipper than all the Hammond + Leslie in rock recordings I have listen to.

 

But I don't really like the sound of transistor organs.  That "96 Tears" thing always makes my ears wanna puke.

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Sound and Serious don't go together 😉.

All sound are serious if they're on their own historical and aesthetic content

 

Vox and farfisa (and the countless Italian transistor sub labels) have been really big on some genres (Surf, 60s, Italia music, some Mediterranean ethnic styles etc) and for a good reason: they cut through a mix better than a Hammond setting 

They're all relevant

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Be grateful for what you've got - a Nord, a laptop and two hands
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Music instrument tech for keyboards in particular has changed a lot over the last 70 years.   So what a keyboard can sound like today, and the ways we can shape the sounds to our desires is very different from the 60s.  The sounds of tone wheel and transistor organs are simply dated.  They sound best on the songs that used them successfully and songs that evoke that vibe.  Not that creative people can’t find new ways to make use.  But there’s more than ever to choose from as far as timbres.  

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Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Transistor Organs Rock.  Coolest thing about the Electro is they put time into decent transistor organ emulation.

 

haters GIF

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"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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Great timely thread and it’s a great day for all organ. Yes the transistors started as yuck but eventually came into their own…and the Hammond schlep is the stuff of legend as is the tonewheel sound…which is now pretty accurately available at the weight of an iPad, controller and decent set of speakers or headphones. But God bless the fact that the sears and roebuck chord organ sound never caught on. Talk about butt ugly! (I didn’t get a farfisa until years later.) I so hated that thing and fortunately only struggled with it at practice.

 

for some immediate relevance,I’ve just embarked upon a reface YC project specifically for “various” organs. Y’all are sooo lucky!!

l

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3 hours ago, JamPro said:

But I don't really like the sound of transistor organs.  That "96 Tears" thing always makes my ears wanna puke.

Yeah, I hate that one. I'm not sure how much of it is the sound and how much of it is the song. ;-) But I don't dismiss the whole category...

 

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

I'm actually a pretty huge fan of The Doors and think the Vox is cool there

Again, for me, it comes down to the specifics. I like the transistor organ on Light My Fire... but not Love Her Madly.

 

Ah, but I love mellotron!

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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I LOVE the sounds Garth Hudson got on his Lowrey organ in The Band. 

Likewise the tones on This Years Model and Armed Forces by Elvis Costello, I think it's a Farfisa and I know it was Steve Nieve playing keyboards. 

It's just good stuff.

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It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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So is this thread kind of a love for the Doors but not so much for transistor organs? Their sound was influenced by what was happening in the Bay area at the time with Grateful Dead and Country Joe and the Fish - along with the practical considerations of getting from gig to gig (something we all had to deal with).  And transistor organs did lend themselves well to trippy playing by keyboard players. 

 

As a side note, when I talk or interact with people much younger than myself the song they identify with the Doors the most is Riders On The Storm. 

 

Anyway I listen to a lot of new music, and I'm not hearing any Walkin' On The Suns out there. And good Lord that was 25 years ago... where's the time gone? 

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2 minutes ago, Bill H. said:

As a side note, when I talk or interact with people much younger than myself the song they identify with the Doors the most is Riders On The Storm. 

True! I can listen to it on repeat all day! But the reason is the Rhodes piano. I will chose Rhodes over any other instrument (bar acoustic piano) any day or night. Which is why it resonates with me the most. But Light my Fire and Break on Through are following close. Despite the transistor organ 😀 I’m wondering if Ray Manzarek would’ve used Hammond instead, if he had one (or if it was practical). And whether he would play differently. Or in other words, did he chose the transistor organ entirely out of practicality? Maybe not, because I doubt there wasn’t a Hammond in the studios where they recorded. Who knows, I’m not too familiar with their history as a band and equipment choices. 

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it helps to maintain a historical perspective when vintage gear comes up.

 

There were fewer KB instruments choices back in the 1950s-70s.  Musicians used the tools available to play and record their music.

 

There were fewer outlets for music back in those days.  Therefore, those recordings were played so much until the sounds were imprinted on the listeners.  The instruments became iconic.

 

Nostalgically, most musicians lean towards instruments and sounds that were used on the musical soundtrack of their lives while growing up. They automatically associate certain sounds with their favorite songs. 

 

Today, for better or worse, we can get a reasonable facsimile of every KB sound ever recorded under one hood. 

 

IMO, while we have access to better technology, what's missing in music recorded nowadays is the imagination and creativity that made those old instruments and sounds iconic.  😎

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PD

 

"The greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love and be loved in return."--E. Ahbez "Nature Boy"

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I own them all… and my favorite is the Gibson G101. It was made by Lowrey and had all the cool Lowrey features like repeat, sustain, percussion, and a great vibrato. Manzarek took advantage of all these to create spacy sounds along with a nice percussive harpsichord like sound. Love it .  
 

https://vintagerockkeyboards.com/2015/08/04/gibson-g101-combo-organ/

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'55 and '59 B3's; Leslies 147, 122, 21H; MODX 7+; NUMA Piano X 88; Motif XS7; Mellotrons M300 and M400’s; Wurlitzer 206; Gibson G101; Vox Continental; Mojo 61; Launchkey 88 Mk III; Korg Module; B3X; Model D6; Moog Model D

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Steve Nieve played an English Vox SuperContinental (2 manual) with EC.

I bought a Vox Continental in 1966, played it for a couple months, realized it wasn't the organ for me, and got my first B3. I kept the Vox, and it got some use during the New Wave days. Recently traded it to Robbie Krieger (!) for another piece of gear. 

Through the years, picked up a Yamaha YC30 & a YC45. Pretty dang cool, but they haven't gotten a lot of use since I got them. Anyone interested in them?

Anyway, transistor organs have their place. The right tool for the right job sort of thing.

 

btw... these days the best Vox organ sounds I have come from Arturia.

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8 minutes ago, skipeb3 said:

Steve Nieve played an English Vox SuperContinental (2 manual) with EC.

 

Thanks for that clarification, I didn't do my homework. 

Still, I like the way it sounded in the context of the songs on This Year's Model. 

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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I like transistor organs very much and I record Vox and farfisa sounds to my songs. I use Arturia plugins. I have bought reface yc and I love it!

Kurzweil K2661 + full options,iMac 27",Mac book white,Apogee Element 24 + Duet,Genelec 8030A,Strymon Lex + Flint,Hohner Pianet T,Radial Key-Largo,Kawai K5000W,Moog Minitaur,Yamaha Reface YC + CP, iPad 9th Gen, Arturia Beatstep + V Collection 9

 

https://antonisadelfidis.bandcamp.com

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The reason you like the transistor organ with the Doors, and nobody else, is because Ray Manzarek was an incredible player and artist. He used that Vox like no one else I've heard. The 96 Tears type of playing is just way less interesting and way less dynamic. When transistor organs aren't played with dynamics, they annoy the crap out of everybody.

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2 hours ago, CyberGene said:

I’m wondering if Ray Manzarek would’ve used Hammond instead, if he had one (or if it was practical).

 

IIRC, I once saw something where Ray said he selected the Vox because it had a flat top, on which he could conveniently place his Fender Rhodes Piano Bass.

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"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing."

- George Bernard Shaw

 

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Speaking of The Doors... Here is a short live concert for TV where Ray plays the G101... Great playing and closeups. 

 

 

 

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'55 and '59 B3's; Leslies 147, 122, 21H; MODX 7+; NUMA Piano X 88; Motif XS7; Mellotrons M300 and M400’s; Wurlitzer 206; Gibson G101; Vox Continental; Mojo 61; Launchkey 88 Mk III; Korg Module; B3X; Model D6; Moog Model D

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I've always been more into Alan Price. Every decade or so, someone brings the transistor sound back, so kudos to Steve Nieve and Blue Rodeo (not sure if that's brother Mike Buguski or earlier Steve Wiseman). 

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____________________________________
Rod

Here for the gear.

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1 hour ago, drawback said:

Every decade or so, someone brings the transistor sound back…


Here’s one I liked:

 

 

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"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing."

- George Bernard Shaw

 

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3 hours ago, drawback said:

 . . . Every decade or so, someone brings the transistor sound back, so kudos to Steve Nieve and Blue Rodeo (not sure if that's brother Mike Buguski or earlier Steve Wiseman). 

I think Bob Wiseman created Blue Rodeo's great retro organ sound.  He was with them from the beginning until 1992.  1993's brilliant "Hasn't Hit Me Yet" features a prominent organ transition with the classic Wiseman warble, but James Gray gets the performer credit.  Brother Boguski joined the band in 2008 and keeps Wiseman's legacy alive.

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“True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.”
― Kurt Vonnegut

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If you feel that passionately about Hammond vs. Vox/Farfisa, you can  play or record your own cover versions of those songs, replacing the sounds that bother you with the ones that you would rather hear instead.   It would be an opportunity to sharpen your skills in areas such as music production, ear training, etc.  Even the baddest mofos out there don't stop honing and refining skills.  Hardly any of them are thinking "I've made it!  Now I can spend all day doing nothing but sitting on my butt and chillin!"

 

It's hard to imagine "Strawberry Fields Forever" without that Mellotron flute.

 

I like the Farfisa usage here.  When this song was all over the radio in the early 80s, I had no idea they were going for 60s music aesthetics.

 

 

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love my philicorda. 

 

This one's our latest single, and the initial recording session (in a small wooden hut in Denmark) consisted of drums, bass, guitar, and my setup with a philicorda and a Wurli, both run into a KM-60 and a Space Echo. 
Recorded straight to tape onto six tracks of a Tascam 388.

The vibe wouldn't work with anything else. 

 

 

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"The Angels of Libra are in the European vanguard of the [retro soul] movement" (Bill Buckley, Soul and Jazz and Funk)

The Drawbars | off jazz organ trio

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47 minutes ago, analogika said:

The vibe wouldn't work with anything else.

It's an interesting music which has a certain vintage mood, so indeed the transistor sound is working well, although it's very withdrawn and well mixed with the other instruments and I wouldn't have noticed it's what it is if I didn't know. Glad you didn't make a solo with it though 😀

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