Kurzweil PC4 SE

[Mighty Motif Max]

Looks like there's a new member of the PC4 family. More like a scaled-down PC4 but with more features than the SP6. 1 less CC pedal input, only a single pair of audio outs, no audio inputs, 5 sliders, 5 knobs, 6 buttons. Modified/scaled down front panel with repurposed buttons for transport controls are changes I see offhand.

 

 

https://kurzweil.com/pc4se/

[pawelsz]

61 keys please

[AnotherScott]

No aftertouch.

 

5 zones instead of 16 (probably for both internal sounds and external MIDI).

 

Interesting... the 50 banks of Favorites only contain 5 items instead of 10, BUT it looks like they are nicely displayed with names directly over the buttons that select them, instead of having a list on the screen reference the more distant re-purposed keypad buttons.

 

With the recent price increase on the PC4 (greater than the increase on the SP6), I suppose there's more space in the line for something between the SP6 and the PC4.

[ElmerJFudd]

Interesting.

 

What do you all think about the current lineup?

Too much overlap?

There"s variations on the Forte, PC and SP spread over a lot of price points.

[AnotherScott]

I suspect that the Fortes will only be around as long as the existing inventory lasts. Without Forte, the line is pretty straight-forward.

[Mighty Motif Max]

Interesting.

 

What do you all think about the current lineup?

Too much overlap?

There"s variations on the Forte, PC and SP spread over a lot of price points.

 

Well, keep in mind that the previous generation Kurzweil lineup was the big overlap model they had for a while with the Forte->Forte SE->PC3K-8/7/6->PC3-A8/7/6->Artis->Artis SE->SP4-8/7.

[ElmerJFudd]

Interesting.

 

What do you all think about the current lineup?

Too much overlap?

There"s variations on the Forte, PC and SP spread over a lot of price points.

 

Well, keep in mind that the previous generation Kurzweil lineup was the big overlap model they had for a while with the Forte->Forte SE->PC3K-8/7/6->PC3-A8/7/6->Artis->Artis SE->SP4-8/7.

 

True.

[Tom Williams]

No aftertouch.

The deal breaker for me. Had there been AT I might have regretted ordering a PC4-7.

[johnchop]

Site down at the moment. Did anyone catch if the sample memory has been nerfed?

[JKS111]

The comparison chart says no sample memory.

[Jaspla]

They did it !! - Moved the VARIATION button to below the Master Volume slider.

 

I don't know how many times I've inadvertently changed the master volume on a gig with my PC4, while trying to punch in a Variation change....including last Friday's gig.

On one gig I accidentally slid the master volume almost completely off when doing this.....thought the board was dying

...by the way, the SP6 already has it's VARIATION button under the master volume (knob)

[Tom Williams]

Site down at the moment. Did anyone catch if the sample memory has been nerfed?

Yup. All gone. It kinda makes sense -- many folks won't care about user samples nor even downloadable patches.

 

I found it interesting that the number of preset patches was increased from 1000 to 1500, while pre-programmed Setups (multis) went from 50+ to 700+. (Put another way: 50 seems like an awfully small number of built-in multis for the regular PC4.) So, reduced options, no onboard editing, but Yuge polyphony. It sort of feels like it's there to port the Forte / PC4 architecture to stage pianos. Price will be interesting. I'll betcha it's under $1500 US (pending worldwide hyperinflation), and competes with the Casio PX-5S for the "fat" piano market.

[Fleer]

Specs comparison: https://kurzweil.com/2021/09/02/comparison-chart-workstations/

 

I"m soooooo happy I got my PC4 in time.

[Mighty Motif Max]

Now, if Kurz can just come up with some more useful drum kits instead of 80% bizarre ones we could be talking, seeing as that wouldn't actually require more sample data, just new programming. Maybe the SE has some better ones and they can be brought over to the regular PC4...

 

If they want to move forward into new sounds eventually they could use some better synth pads and electric basses, and a good nylon guitar. Right now I've had to use third-party samples to get better acoustic/nylon/electric guitars and basses; pads are a nightmare to program the way I like them with so many layers needed in VAST, so I haven't made much headway in that. I do think some other synth waveforms like what the Motif/Montage line has as the basis for pads could help. So all those would be areas for future improvement, particularly if they're going to try to get huge sales on the PC4 SE and similar without user sample memory.

[mojkarma]

Site down at the moment. Did anyone catch if the sample memory has been nerfed?

Yup. All gone. It kinda makes sense -- many folks won't care about user samples nor even downloadable patches.

 

Actually, it doesn't make any sense at all. We don't know who the "many folks" are, personally all my friends who play a Kurzweil, use samples. Besides that, Kurzweil sample based sounds are actually ancient and stemm back to the K2000. There were some additions in the string section, and lately in the piano section. But generally acoustic sounds are on the level of the nineties, mono and with just one velocity level. So, being able to load user samples is the only way to get better quality samples when needed. I have no idea who should be the potential buyer of this keyboard. It is something between a PC and SP. Kurzweil continues with to much variety and rehashing the very same product. There most certainly is a memory chip on the motherboard, it is just cut away thru the OS.

[felis]

Still waiting for the PC461 here.

[hipogrito]

Hi,

 

Few clarifications:

 

Anybody waiting for a 61 keys is probably going to be waiting for a very very long time.

 

The 2 GB "new" base ROM that is in SP6, Forte SE, PC4, PC4SE and the lower 2 GB of K2700 has all the PC3-family base ROM + Kore64 + German Grand plus a nice subset of samples taken from the Forte times.

 

The PC3 base ROM has lots from Kurzweil past (PC2/K2600/expansions) and I'm not sure if the strings bank was used before in its entirety or not (they are still great strings) but Kore64 samples are from 2012, the 2 guitars, drums, brasses...

Forte samples are from 2014. Forte has lots of great new samples, the 2 big acoustic pianos, the 3 electric pianos that are amazing, clav, harpsichord, bells, and many more.

 

K2700 has them all but the 2 big pianos that are in a reduced form (one of them is 1 GB) and perhaps some other minor things, but, in general, you can say that it has most of the Forte with somewhat reduced pianos.

 

So, if the perception is that it's all 90's samples, that is incorrect.

 

Also, synthesis keeps progressing. Having up to 8 FM layers in a program and being able to cascade them with VAST layer and adding our FXs is a MAJOR contribution to our soundware. The K2700 has a long number of pads and synths programs (LOTS of them!) that use FM layers that are amazing. Sometimes in the demos these programs get neglected because the demonstrator has limited time and has to go thru the meat and potatoes first, but, to me, the PADS are in a totally new level now.

 

But, on the other hand, I'm glad we can still have old samples in those keyboards as well, because you can reproduce the sounds of that era really well and anybody in a Pink Floyd tribute band knows what I am talking about.

 

And there will be more products to come and more samples to come, or at least we can hope, but, in the end, what really matters, is the music that you play with these instruments.

 

PC4SE will fit very well with some people that don't really do program editing on the board but still want workstation functionality (sequencer is full). Others will want the big brother or the K2700 and their budget will direct them towards one or another.

 

Regards,

Fran

[Jorf88]

The lack of Aftertouch on this makes me sad. I've never played the non-aftertouch medeli keyboard that Kurz uses (like in the KM88), but I've been told there's a night/day difference between the actions, because the actual (full blooded) PC4 feels pretty darn good.

 

I've been looking for a new weighted 88 key slab with sliders and pitch/mod to use as a MIDI controller, and I had hoped this might be a contender at a reasonable price, but I'm not sure now.

I wish I could get my hands on it (isn't this always the issue?).

[hipogrito]

The action is the same as the PC4 minus the aftertouch. Same keys, just no aftertouch strip. That makes it cheaper. Things like that or the lack of 2 GBs of user space make a noticeable difference in component costs that later get reflected in the whatever few hundred dollars difference between products.

 

Regards,

Fran

[felis]

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1663145-REG/kurzweil_pc4_se_performance_controller.html

 

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PC4SE--kurzweil-pc4-se-88-key-performance-controller-synth-workstation

 

$1699 pre-order

[felis]

Hi,

 

....Anybody waiting for a 61 keys is probably going to be waiting for a very very long time.....

 

Regards,

Fran

 

 

I can wait. While I'm alive, anyways.

[israzel]

Sorry, I duplicated the post. I'll keep the last one.

[israzel]

Hello.

 

I'm currently very interested in the Kurzweil PC4 SE because it has everything that I need.

 

However, I have noticed that it has lost the ability to change octaves directly. The PC4 and other Kurzweil keyboards have two dedicated soft buttons (octave +/octave -) for this task, and the PC4 SE doesn't have that kind of soft buttons associated with actions on the screen. Anyway, you can still change octaves in the different parts/splits of a multi by editing it.

 

I would like to know what you guys think about this. While I find that most keyboards have this option, I don't know if it's so relevant to change octaves directly when you have the full 88 key range.

 

Thanks!

[pawelsz]

I think it's not a big deal when you have "all" 88 keys. 

 

SP6 also does not have this both 88 key nor 76 key SP6-7. PC4-7 has, just like PC4. 

[Tom Williams]

One of the requests I've made to Kurzweil for the PC4 is to make octave changes more convenient in split mode.  I often need to raise the left side an octave or two.  If you're going to give me a dedicated soft button for splitting, you oughta give me one for one-side octave shift.  We'll see if they grant my request. 🙂