Stop the used gear pricing madness!!!

[ABECK]

In this episode of Used Gear Pricing Madness, we have a Siel DK80 Expander for the ...ahem...reasonably low cost of $3,200.00!!

IIRC they were about $350 new and even that was stretching it. Apparently anything older than 1995 is vintage and should be priced thusly. I want to get off the ride now!

 

Siel DK80 Expander

[jeffincltnc]

ABECK - for $25,000 I can get you a used Wiliiams Legato III, though.

[Docbop]

Same in guitar world even name brand guitar we deemed not good, give them ten or fifteen years and prices start to climb. They twenty years old and now are call vintage so prices start going crazy. Vintage crap is still crap. Old doesn't automatically mean better unless talking about me of course.

[jeffincltnc]

$64,000 USD for a Jupiter 8 - not a joke

Jupiter 8 on Reverb for $64,000 USD

[ABECK]

My perceived value is directly related to the most reasonable used prices I've encountered over my years of bargain hunting.

 

It looks something like this:

Juno 106 $350

Jupiter 8 $1500

Oberheim Expander $1500

Matrix 12 $3000

Minimoog $900

Fender Rhodes $300

DX5 - $500

DX7 - $250

[CEB]

Reverb is ignorant. Used current production gear on Reverb cost more than I can buy the same stuff

new local.

[lvercaut]

In this episode of Used Gear Pricing Madness, we have a Siel DK80 Expander for the ...ahem...reasonably low cost of $3,200.00!!

IIRC they were about $350 new and even that was stretching it. Apparently anything older than 1995 is vintage and should be priced thusly. I want to get off the ride now!

 

Siel DK80 Expander

 

Yes indeed, this madness has to stop right now !!!

[El Lobo]

Yes indeed, this madness has to stop right now !!!

We're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore! What are we going to do about?!

 

buy more gear ...

 

[ElmerJFudd]

As a kid l, there was a shop near me which is since long gone, that had the Siel DKs for sale. I wanted one badly, but this was around the time that Kurzweil released the K1000 - which was way more practical for me for most bread and butter sound needs. Then with the DX7 and D50, these synths were out of fashion and I didn"t think about it again for years. We are definitely in an analogue synth resurgence.

[KuruPrionz]

Bottom line, if it sells it was worth that to somebody.

 

Reality - somebody not too far from you is selling something really cool for a low price. They are not on Reverb, they might be on craigslist. Or it might be the local Starvation Army or even a pawn shop.

[ABECK]

Oh, I'm not one to stand in the way of capitalism. If it sells, then win, win. I ain't gonna bite though!

[ProfD]

The used gear pricing is absurb especially to those of us who've been around long enough to know the history.

 

Because I vividly remember folks dumping electromechanical KBs and analog synths for little or nothing in favor of the DX7, D50, M1 and other ROMplers, the current used gear pricing is laughable in most cases.

 

Sure enough, the used gear price gouge is worth it to someone with money to blow but that doesn't make that piece of gear more valuable especially from a feature and functionality perspective.

 

For a fraction of that used gear price, a brand new synth is a lot more powerful and sounds better. Nostalgia was a popular drink and it still is apparently.

[El Lobo]

For a fraction of that used gear price, a brand new synth is a lot more powerful and sounds better. Nostalgia was a popular drink and it still is apparently.

It ain't entirely nostalgia. I'd love to have my Wurly back that I walked away from in the divorce in '75. It did have a unique sound and character. At the same time though, the Wurly emulation in my Nord 5D is quite good and I also get a good drawbar organ with rotary speaker, a whole bunch of pretty darn good pianos, and a lot of other stuff that I hardly ever use ... well, strings on Stand By Me, choir on You Can't Always Get What You Want, maybe a couple of other tunes with special needs. And it only weighs a few pounds and I can carry it in one hand in a gig bag with a stand and cable bag in the other. Can't beat that with a stick. Of course some people want that true vintage sound in their studios, not for gigging.

 

Vintage saxes on the other hand ... Selmer Mark VIs from the 50's/60's selling for much more than new very high quality horns. Same for some 50's/60's guitars. New models of the saxes and guitars aren't necessarily better-sounding or more powerful. But then they're not electronic/digital or electromechanical instruments. They're not Commodore 64 computers so they can age very well, like wine, violins, and me.

[cjfox]

I have never bought from Reverb, I find the prices too high compared to local craigslist or other local used sites. I have noticed on local sites however that as soon as soon someone posts something with an outrageous price, others pop out of the woodwork "I've got one of those, it must be worth..." Grandma's magic finger organ for $1000.

[Baldwin Funster]

There has to be an ulterior motive for posting silly high prices. Maybe some tax write off or to inflate inventory values or?

[Marzzz]

There has to be an ulterior motive for posting silly high prices. Maybe some tax write off or to inflate inventory values or?

The ulterior motive for posting silly high prices is that someone may actually pay it. If someone does, well wow. But more likely it will sit for as long as the seller can stand it.

 

The price/value of something is what the market will bear. Your "perceived value" is irrelevant to the market unless they happen to coincide, one way or the other.

[allan_evett]

Oh, I'm not one to stand in the way of capitalism. If it sells, then win, win. I ain't gonna bite though!

 

The ad does state, "This seller is open to offers"... Maybe it's time for some fun with capitalism.

[Stokely]

I guess I'm lucky because I have not the slightest urge to buy anything "vintage".

 

Guitars, keyboards, cars, women...new is good. Or at least "recent". (Just kidding about that last one, I think)

[David Emm]

I had a casual swap/tryout deal with a friend who owned a few oddballs like the DK 80. The basic sound was not bad, but the build was so craptastic, it was like a synth you'd give someone you didn't like. Some are just modules with keys, for bad reasons. Perhaps he just got one that was built on a Monday, but it wound up as wall art.

[Doerfler]

The price/value of something is what the market will bear. Your "perceived value" is irrelevant to the market unless they happen to coincide, one way or the other.

 

 

Myself, I have done very well buying and selling on Reverb, even with the higher fees and mandatory sales taxes.

[Konnector]

About a month ago sold a bunch of old gear I was no longer using. I started thinking about selling all those items about 3 years ago, but I'm sure glad I waited. Got double the $$ on average compared to what I would've got 3 years ago. Yeehaw.

[wd8dky]

Why? It's a business like any other. Demand vs. supply.

[Al Coda]

Why? It's a business like any other. Demand vs. supply.

 

 

^^^^^^^

This !!

 

 

A.C.

[Doerfler]

Anyone who thinks music gear is expensive should check into the prices of lumber these days.

[Docbop]

Last four years the prices of everything has gone crazy even cost of music. I hate streaming music and would buy music to support artists, but prices of CD's forced me to signing up for steaming music. Most of what I listen to is for learning buy CD's and MP3 streaming is cheaper and buy CD's for artist I am big fan of. Only thing that hasn't seems to gone up is music lessons. In fact a lot of artists that didn't give lessons now are because of Covid.

[rod76]

Those SIEL polys have SSM filters... but not worth the obscene price.

 

btw, first synth I ever played was a SIEL Cruise

[KuruPrionz]

This is nothing new. 15 years ago on eBay there was a seller who had a guitar made of strike-anywhere wooden match sticks glued together. They went on at some length describing this unique masterpiece of art and music.

Asking price was $9,000 Buy It Now. It didn't sell, at least for the time I had it on my watch list out of amusement.

 

If I saw one in a yard sale just like it and thought it was really cool, I might have paid $15 for it.

 

I don't think they allow you to sell an Air Guitar that is nothing anymore but there are currently 321 listings that share one thing in common - they have no value at all. I checked completed listings long ago and quite a few Air Guitars were sold for decent money considering the seller did not have to do anything except take the money.

 

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2060353.m570.l1313&_nkw=air+guitar&_sacat=0

[The Real MC]

Before the internet, musicians bought and traded used gear in swap sheets and in music stores on consignment. With few exceptions (IE vintage guitar brokers) used gear never had ridiculous asking prices. If a music store asked too much, the market - namely musicians parading in the stores - laughed at the prices. That was the measure how gear was valued.

 

The internet changed all that with auction sites and classified sites. Today you rarely see vintage gear in music stores where you can touch and hear them in person. Yes there are many internet sales whose asking prices are ridiculous. What the internet has removed is the musicians laughing at the prices - no one hears them. Yes we are laughing at them in this discussion, but the sellers do not - or will not - hear us.

 

Yes there are stupid asking prices out there. All it takes is one sucker gullible enough to pay such prices, and that's the measure that gear is valued.

 

Prices haven't always been climbing... there were periods when even vintage 1959 Les Paul guitars leveled off due to external forces IE the mortgage meltdown of 2007-2008 was one of them.

[o0Ampy0o]

The price/value of something is what the market will bear. Your "perceived value" is irrelevant to the market unless they happen to coincide, one way or the other.

Perception is what drives the market thus godzillions are spent in advertising, promotions, brand building, :blah: ... As for "your perception" you only count if you are in the game. The game only requires two players: 1. a seller 2. a buyer. Those who are strictly observers don't matter. But strictly observers can always join in and become somebodys who matter in the game.

 

 

 

Prices haven't always been climbing... there were periods when even vintage 1959 Les Paul guitars leveled off due to external forces IE the mortgage meltdown of 2007-2008 was one of them.

This can mean prices pause in their ascent. In recent decades we have experienced seemingly unprecedented events encouraging people to fear the game has changed if not ended. But even the worst thing during this period has been shown to be temporary. Even if there is a dip like with the stock market a step back from the trees to glance at the forest would reveal an increase over time. For instance, when the 9/11 events took place Wall Street closed down. The masters were confident it would reopen and get back to a normal something like they had been familiar with during all their previous experiences and they took advantage of the opportunities to make a lot of money. But guitar players and guitar collectors are not comprised of so many stock market master minds. A guitar sold for a high price would have to be seen or the transaction publicized and circulated while the majority of these "guitarists" lacked confidence in the understanding of the game and stopped playing.

[ABECK]

Your "perceived value" is irrelevant to the market unless they happen to coincide, one way or the other.

If my perceived value determines whether or not I'd buy something, then that directly affects the market (assuming that's what you mean by coincide). That IS the market.