softsynth recommendations

[Steve Nathan]

I asked about usb ribbons and you folks responded with some real possibilities. In the meantime, part of what I've been chasing I thought I could get closer by assigning the pitch bend wheel to both pitch and filter cutoff simultaneously. I own a bunch of soft synths, but I'm not finding that to be achievable. Surely I'm just dotty and inept on my programming chops, but if a synth VI comes to mind that you know it's easy on, please let me know which one.

[Stokely]

Interesting. I could see this maybe being an issue if the synths figure "pitch wheel is for pitch!"

 

I'm more of a preset tweaker myself. I pulled up u-he Repro and right away I see that I can assign (in the Mod Matrix) pitch wheel to control two different things. unfortunately those appear to be LFO and Cutoff (1 out of 2!). I am moving stuff around and don't have my keyboard hooked up, but I think there's a good chance pitch bend will still control pitch even if I have it mapped in the matrix to other things.

 

Repro is my favorite softsynth and it's on a rare sale now . I'll try to verify that this actually works.

 

Edit: it does. Pitch bend controls pitch, LFO and cutoff on the patch I'm on.

[johnchop]

Which soft synths are you using?

 

Many have a mod matrix that can use pitchbend as a source, which can then control filter cutoff to the desired degree.

[Stokely]

Trying it my free version of Vital, the mod matrix here seems pretty extensive. I've mapped pitch to cutoff, not audible because I've not done something else correctly to map the filter to oscillator maybe. But it certainly seems possible in this one too.

[Steve Nathan]

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[johnchop]

Good list!

 

Omnisphere for sure can. Look at the Mod Matrix for that but let us know if you need more specific guidance.

 

I'm newish to Pigments 2 so can't recall offhand if pitch bend is a mod source.

 

Hybrid: on the filter section, click Mod tab, and see if you can use pitch bend as a mod source. Failing that, you can assign a Morph control to the filter, and then assign pitch bend to control the morph.

 

Hope this helps!

[ElmerJFudd]

Uhe Diva

 

I think your hosting these in Logic on your MacBook Pro?

 

If so, you can use MIDI learn to assign whatever controller you"d like to a function.

 

[video:youtube]

 

You can also setup controllers in MainStage.

 

[video:youtube]

[Steve Nathan]

I'm on DP. I'll keep trying to find happiness, but even on the ones with assignable mods, it just doesn't sound like much (if anything) is happening. FWIW: I'd like to base it off of something analog and warm sounding. I'll look at Omnisphere again, but I've never much liked Omnisphere and rarely use it at all.

[Reezekeys]

Pitch bend is not always treated as a "controller" that you can use for "midi learning." That function might expect control change messages only. Pitch bend is a separate category of midi message. Not saying it won't ever work â but I wouldn't expect it to always work.

 

I could easily assign PB to control any controllable parameter using Bidule, but that's an extra layer of tech to deal with.

[johnchop]

Here's an example with Arturia Mini V. Using the Advanced panel, set a modulation source to Pitch Bend and the destination to Cutoff, and set the modulation amount as appropriate e.g. turn dial to right to increase cutoff when bending up,

 

Note that pitch bend modulation here is not particularly clever, in that you can't set separate modulation for positive and negative pitch bend. For Mini V, down is less, up is more.

 

Screenshot

 

Some soft synths allow you to further control the amount of modulation with another source (e.g. pitchbend modulation is less intense as the note number increases).

[Mark Schmieder]

I never cared for Omni either due to the workflow and GUI. So much wasted real estate, as in East/West Play, and visual noise getting in the way of the basics. Others love it, but I sold mine for that reason. I don't like wasting time and also am not interested in taking a lot of time finding patches (even with the well-done search feature). But there are some nice sonic strengths for sure (especially choirs, and ambient stuff plus sound effects). Yet I don't miss it as I didn't get on with the GUI.

 

As a fellow DP user, I'd like to help you on the automation front, but I moved away from that approach many years ago so am not of much use. I think there are some good topics at MOTUnation forum that might be bookmarked at the top. A couple of people in particular have provided useful and concise summaries of some of that stuff over the years.

 

In terms of soft synth recs, you can't go wrong with the Arturia stuff, and it keeps getting better all the time, including GUI's and workflow. I find them some of the easiest ones to grow my own patches on in a short timespan without major frustrations. XILS-Lab stuff is incredible as well, and might be on sale right now. They're more narrowly focused but have great vocoders and quasi-tributes to some lesser-known vintage synths.

 

KORG Legacy Collection is outstanding as well. I personally find Mono/Poly to be the most versatile of the batch, and was actually able to replicate all of my custom MS2000 hardware patches on it, barely able to tell the difference (if at all). Maybe the same basic DSP code in both? The MS-20 is popular as is the PolySix but I have never found them as easy to make mix-friendly sounds vs. preferring my Moog Voyager in all cases.

 

My favourite soft synth is TimewARP2600, but it's on a lifeline so I can't recommend it, yet I can give you mine for just the iLok transfer fee if you like. The caveat is that only the VST works anymore, and I think I recall having to use the stereo instance and then mono-summing in DP (which as we all know is not ideal mono-summing for some reason). Everything else crashes, fails to authorize, etc.

[Mark Schmieder]

Also, as johnchop states correctly, pitch bend can be a bit tricky to map well to actual CC's. Interestingly, some soft synths implement pitch bend itself via a MIDI CC, or bizarrely use aftertouch as pitch bend!

[Markyboard]

 

 

My favourite soft synth is TimewARP2600, but it's on a lifeline so I can't recommend it, yet I can give you mine for just the iLok transfer fee if you like. The caveat is that only the VST works anymore, and I think I recall having to use the stereo instance and then mono-summing in DP (which as we all know is not ideal mono-summing for some reason). Everything else crashes, fails to authorize, etc.

 

I just purchased this through Akai for $9.99. No iLok. Sounds great but damn those graphics are small. Not sure how much I"ll be using this.

[Mark Schmieder]

How strange! I think you got the old version, as I seem to recall that Akai was briefly the distributor. Or maybe that changed recently? SONiVOX took over distribution for a few years and that pushed it to the iLok, but I can't keep track of all the music mergers. Are they all now part of the same inMusic group? If so, maybe products are being shuffled around to the "most appropriate vendor" based on what the product is.

[johnchop]

Off topic but the CA2600 from voltage modular is worth a look, and only $25 right now

 

Anyway, I'd still advocate using whatever a synth's mod matrix (or in the case of something like Hybrid, a morph/macro assignment) will allow, rather than deal with automation or MIDI learn.

 

Otherwise, if you can identify a specific synth you'd like to use, we might have some specific suggestions re: implementation.

[Mark Schmieder]

Yeah, I was going to mention CA2600 but had to rush to pick up a package. The sale might end today or tomorrow? I bought it a few days ago on the recommendation of someone else, but may find that I would have been just as happy to port my custom TimewARP2600 patches to Arturia's ARP2600 V.

 

I had ignored the CA2600 at first as I didn't realize it's standalone vs. a module for Cherry Modular (which I own but rarely use). I do think the audio demos sound a bit closer to TimewARP2600 than ARP2600 V does.

[RABid]

My favorite brand/programmer is U-He. The Zebra comes to mind as a simple synth that sounds great. I can get by with just U-He and Native Instruments.

[Al Coda]

My favorite brand/programmer is U-He. The Zebra comes to mind as a simple synth that sounds great. I can get by with just U-He and Native Instruments.

 

 

I agree.

 

Uhe Zebra kills.

When you are into programming softsynths, you can do almost anything with it.

 

But most users of softsynths are preset jockeys ...

 

A.C.

[Tusker]

 

Uhe Zebra kills.

When you are into programming softsynths, you can do almost anything with it.

 

 

Agree. The basic building blocks are of very good sonic quality. When you 'push' the parameters you get musical outcomes. For Zebra3, I"d like to see more flexibility in importing wavetables. The MSEGs are good but more varied mod sources would be welcome. They could steal some ideas from Massive"s Performer (lane switching) or Pigments" Turing generator. And steal some round robin ideas from Diva. Still, it"s easy to patch as you say, and the sound is reliably very good.

[Baggypants]

 

But most users of softsynths are preset jockeys ...

 

A.C.

 

Shame on you preset jockeys. Programming synth patches is the only way to true musical expression!

 

I like OB-Xd https://www.discodsp.com/obxd/ Free, simple to mess about with. (Lot's of presets )

[Tusker]

Shame on you preset jockeys. Programming synth patches is the only way to true musical expression!

 

 

LOL. I resemble that remark!

 

It's not my place to speak for Al but I heartily agreed with him, so if I could clarify what I read from what he said. It's not about whether we are preset surfers or tweakers or programmers. I am shamelessly all three. Sometimes you need a sound and somebody already made the preset for you. It's all good right? It's just that there are a lot of synths which can make the presets sound good but when you try to dig in, the synth engine craps out on you. Zebra meanwhile is like an ugly car with a great motor. It will not crap out on you easily even if you push it. Zebra often gets overlooked in favor of some flashier synths but it's solid under the hood.

 

That OBXD looks interesting! And free. With presets!! I am on it. Thanks!

[johnchop]

I prefer the term "preset connoisseur"

[Mark Schmieder]

Yeah presets vs. custom programming definitely affects our choices of soft synths (and even hardware). I sole my u-he stuff this year (I hadn't owned it long and mostly bought it due to peer pressure). It all started sounding same-same to me once I dug in deeper and started working on my own patches and comparing to my Moog Voyager. It's rare that a synth impresses me since buying the Moog.

[Steve Nathan]

Thanks for the mention of Vital, which has gotten me closer to the effect I'm after than anything else so far. I suspect Zebra will be a winner too.

[KuruPrionz]

 

But most users of softsynths are preset jockeys ...

 

A.C.

 

Shame on you preset jockeys. Programming synth patches is the only way to true musical expression!

 

 

So, pianos are out? They only have one preset, weak...

[Steve Nathan]

FWIW: I've always been an unapologetic preset tweaker. I don't see anything wrong with browsing through presets to get in the ballpark inspirationally and proceed from there. If I programmed every sound from scratch, I'd never have time to make the music. That said, I have heard some wonderful music performed by great players playing presets.

[ElmerJFudd]

FWIW: I've always been an unapologetic preset tweaker. I don't see anything wrong with browsing through presets to get in the ballpark inspirationally and proceed from there. If I programmed every sound from scratch, I'd never have time to make the music. That said, I have heard some wonderful music performed by great players playing presets.

 

Without a doubt. Sound design is a while different gig. If you happen to be good at both, just another revenue stream for a dedicated full time musicer.

[Melving]

Regarding the original question, hate to say this but I think it would be easy to do in Cantabile... Briefly checked the DP manual and didn't see much, though...

[Steve Nathan]

If memory serves, Cantabile is not a Mac program?

I'm having mixed results still, most likely due to my continued ineptness. Dled a demo of Zebra2, and it seems easy enough to assign PW to Filter cutoff, but the result is underwhelming. No visual feedback showing the cutoff moving, and aurally it's barely detectable. In Synthmaster, you see the cut off display move with the PW, but it's not scalable, so a full throw step down and a step up on the PW pulls the cutoff frequency to zero to wide open, and I don't see where that's scalable either. Omnisphere's result was underwhelming. In fact (other than Vital so far), everything's beed Beverly under whelming or overwhelming, wen what I'm chasing should be more subtle.

As I related in the ribbon controller thread, what I likes so in the Triton was that the ribbon had a center point and I could scoop from below to center and the effect was quite nice. I should be able to get the same effect with a PW.

[Melving]

Re mac;

 

Quoth Brad the developer (6/2019):

 

"I"m still working on it, but it"s not going well atm⦠I"ll get there one day."

 

Oh well.