M1 MacBook Pro, MacBook Air and Mac Mini

[ElmerJFudd]

M1 Mac Book Pro with M1 system on a chip. Runs cooler, up to 20 hours of battery life.

 

$1299, 13' base price

 

Apple M1 Chip with 8-Core CPU and 8-Core GPU

256GB Storage

Apple M1 chip with 8-core CPU, 8-core GPU, and 16-core Neural Engine

8GB unified memory

256GB SSD storage¹

13-inch Retina display with True Tone

Magic Keyboard

Touch Bar and Touch ID

Force Touch trackpad

Two Thunderbolt / USB 4 ports

 

$1699 with 16gb RAM and the 512gb SSD

 

M1 Mac Mini $699 base

 

Apple M1 Chip with 8-Core CPU and 8-Core GPU

256GB Storage

Apple M1 chip with 8-core CPU, 8-core GPU, and 16-core Neural Engine

8GB unified memory

256GB SSD storage¹

Gigabit Ethernet

 

M1 MacBook Air $999 base price

 

Apple M1 Chip with 8âCore CPU and 7âCore GPU

256GB Storage

Apple M1 chip with 8âcore CPU, 7âcore GPU, and 16âcore Neural Engine

8GB unified memory

256GB SSD storage¹

Retina display with True Tone

Magic Keyboard

Touch ID

Force Touch trackpad

Two Thunderbolt / USB 4 ports

 

https://www.apple.com/

[Mighty Motif Max]

Apparently there's a limit of two USB-C ports and 16GB memory with that chip currently.

 

It will be interesting to see what a third generation looks like, or even a second generation. I don't trust Apple to do anything right anymore for the first year of any launch, and that includes operating systems!

[David Emm]

Impressive, but I'm going to fold my arms and wait for the iMac version. I do feel drawn to the Mini, since I live productively in the Appleverse, but iMacs have been so good to me that I'm semi-superstitious. I'm spoiled by having a 1 TB drive- already small by some standards- but that 256 GB of SSD on the base Mini suits my Omnisphere daydreams. I get good service from the broadness of Logic's instruments and only use a few 3rd party plugs, so it could all fit, maybe. I know, I'll buy an iMac AND a Mini. Problems solved, except where that move multiplies them.

[KuruPrionz]

It sounds good but I will wait.

 

Eventually the newest ones will be so fabulous that somewhat older ones (that can run circles around my 2014 MacBook Pro 15" with 16 gb of RAM) will be affordable.

Then I will upgrade, same as I always do - wait and buy behind the curve.

 

At the cutting edge, there is pain.

[Iconoclast]

Do they not do graphics cards anymore? I ask because as a long time mainstage user I found that a previous generation of 13 inch MBPs with "integrated graphics" basically couldn't run mainstage with keyscape or some other demanding VSTs. I ended up having to buy the basically the same computer as a 16 inch with a graphics card and that computer runs multiple versions of keyscape simultaneously with no issues. So I'm very wary of that. (you can search for my screenname, I had many threads about my issues maybe 2 years ago. Many smart people chimed in but in the end, I think it was actually the graphics card that made all the difference...and you couldn't even get a graphics card in the 13 inch then)

[UnderGroundGr]

I have a 27inch 2019 imac with 40gb ram. It's a pleasure to work logic with this setup! I am happy if apple continue to support intel macs for years to come and i hope the new Logic will be release for both silicon and intel macs(i hope but i don't think so)...

But with the new chip sets i believe the future will be more interesting for apple users!

[AnotherScott]

Do they not do graphics cards anymore?

see https://techcrunch.com/2020/11/10/macs-with-the-m1-chip-do-not-support-egpus/

[mauriziodececco]

What it is really impressive is this is just the low end; they substitute the Mac Book Air, the low end Mac Book Pro and the 4 core Mini with the M1.

Yes, there are major limits in the I/O and RAM essentially, but these are compatible with the low end positioning; i am curious about what will follows.

 

About the graphics, do not assume that integrated graphics means less performance;

they claim 5x improvements with the respect to previous Intel integrated graphics, let's wait for benchmarks.

 

Maurizio

[Lady Gaia]

Do they not do graphics cards anymore? I ask because as a long time mainstage user I found that a previous generation of 13 inch MBPs with "integrated graphics" basically couldn't run mainstage with keyscape or some other demanding VSTs.

 

Intel's integrated graphics were notoriously problematic. Poor performers with lots of known hardware quirks that require drivers to do extra CPU work to produce accurate results. They've gotten better, but they were never a great match for Apple's graphics APIs. Discrete GPUs were an effective workaround at the cost of significant energy inefficiency. Apple's own home-grown integrated GPU should be great for everything except the most demanding 3D workloads.

 

I am happy if apple continue to support intel macs for years to come and i hope the new Logic will be release for both silicon and intel macs(i hope but i don't think so)...

 

I would expect Logic support for Intel to continue for years to come. Compiling for both Apple Silicon and Intel is trivial for developers, and the infrastructure to support both with a single "Universal" binary. During the transition from PowerPC to Intel, the first Intel Macs were introduced in 2006, and Logic Pro support continued until 2010.

[ElmerJFudd]

There are so many Intel Macs in use and still being sold. It will be supported for years. Not the first time Apple has been around the CPU rodeo.

[ElmerJFudd]

Microsoft beta build of Apple Silicon-compatible Office for Mac imminent

 

https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/11/11/microsoft-beta-build-of-apple-silicon-compatible-office-for-mac-imminent

[ElmerJFudd]

NI on Big Sur compatibility.

 

https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/360013515618-macOS-11-Big-Sur-Compatibility-News

[ElmerJFudd]

Parallels compatibility coming,

 

https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/11/11/parallels-confirms-apple-m1-support-amid-silence-from-other-virtualization-companies

[ElmerJFudd]

' The new Rosetta 2 Geekbench results uploaded show that the M1 chip running on a MacBook Air with 8GB of RAM has single-core and multi-core scores of 1,313 and 5,888 respectively. Since this version of Geekbench is running through Apple's translation layer Rosetta 2, an impact on performance is to be expected. Rosetta 2 running x86 code appears to be achieving 78%-79% of the performance of native Apple Silicon code.

 

Despite the impact on performance, the single-core Rosetta 2 score results still outperforms any other Intel Mac, including the 2020 27-inch iMac with Intel Core i9-10910 @ 3.6GHz.'

 

https://www.macrumors.com/2020/11/15/m1-chip-emulating-x86-benchmark/

[stoken6]

78-79% isn't bad, all things considered. Are there any compatibility limitations (especially for low-latency/real-time processing that might be relevant to us musicians).

 

Cheers, Mike.

[analogika]

78-79% isn't bad, all things considered.

"Isn't bad, all things considered" in this case means:

 

Even in emulation, the cheapest, most low-end Apple Silicon chip in its very first incarnation is still almost as fast as the current highest-end 16" laptop in multi-core performance.

 

In single-core performance, it's faster than any Intel chip ever sold. While EMULATING an Intel chip.

 

It's hard to overestimate what this means for the chips that will be going in the higher-end 13" and 16" MBP replacements. Let alone the next decade or so.

 

Are there any compatibility limitations (especially for low-latency/real-time processing that might be relevant to us musicians).

Too early to say.

[ElmerJFudd]

Nicely put together article from CDM.

https://www.musicradar.com/news/apples-m1-macs-and-macos-big-sur-heres-what-music-producers-need-to-know-about-daw-and-plugin-compatibility

 

Key take aways, "Until you have cast-iron confirmation that your DAW, plugins and audio hardware works and is supported in Big Sur, upgrading is not a good idea"\

 

" if you want to avoid an accidental Big Sur upgrade, you should make sure that the automatic update option in your Mac"s Software Update tool is turned off."

 

"If you"re thinking of buying an M1 Mac, there"s another consideration: not only does your software need to be compatible with Big Sur, but it also needs to be updated to 'Universal" status to run natively.

There is a potential workaround in the form of Rosetta, an Apple technology that enables Intel-only apps to run on M1 machines, but it remains to be seen what kind of implications this has on performance."

 

"we don't yet know how well these new Macs perform as music-making machines. "

 

"if you buy a new Intel Mac, as this will likely have Big Sur pre-installed. So, even if your music software is compatible with your Mac hardware, it might not run on your OS."

 

"few companies beyond Apple (Logic Pro and GarageBand) are fully up to speed. "

 

There's a list of statements from devs regarding their current compatibility and plans for updates.

[Stokely]

I never upgrade an OS until I have to--meaning, something isn't going to work, or there is some glaring security hole or something. I'm still on High Sierra iirc, it's been a while since I upgraded and I was forced to by Logic 10.4. Not going to upgrade anything until a project I'm in the middle of is done. For me an OS is a way to open my apps, I don't get excited by them....I never even see my desktop.

 

Even for low-end computers, the new mac mini is pretty exciting. Yes, I'd really like more than two usb c ports. As it is I'm on a 2016 pretty decked out macbook pro so it will be a while before I upgrade. One thing I don't like about it is that the fan can get pretty loud, though since I've started keeping it closed I haven't noticed it. I just use a single 32" 2k monitor hooked up via displayport and it's just great. Because I'm keeping it closed, and never move it, it's basically a big, flat mac mini

[ElmerJFudd]

The mini seems like a good way to get feet wet on the new hardware. You can do a lot with just Apple Logic/Mainstage with no third party plugins - especially if your sample libraries are in EXS124 format.

[Stokely]

That would certainly not be me, in fact I've been replacing (or adding to) many of the stock plugins as they go on sale Fortunately though, some of my most-used ones are by u-he and they are either already working on Big Sur or will be soon. The main one I'd worry about is Kontakt, which I'm guessing could be a while. No worries, I'll let the more enthusiastic early adopter bug catchers go to work for a couple years

 

Edit: One thing I've just started considering though is trying to stick with fewer different manufacturers if (ok, when) I get plugins. That way I have less different people that I have to count on to make changes. I'm also probably going to avoid any plugins that haven't changed in forever (even if they are good) unless I get a good feeling that the devs will be updating it.

[MoodyBluesKeys]

Posted on a local computer group forum, supposedly from Carbon Copy Cloner:

"With the announcement of macOS Big Sur, Apple has retired Mac OS X (10) and replaced it with macOS 11. As the numeric change would suggest, this is the biggest change to macOS since Apple introduced Mac OS X roughly 20 years ago. The system now resides on a cryptographically sealed "Signed System Volume" That seal can only be applied by Apple; ordinary copies of the System volume are non-bootable without Apple's seal. To create a functional copy of the macOS 11 System volume, we have to use an Apple tool to copy the system, or install macOS onto the backup.

 

Looks like even tighter control on the OS, although very likely removes some security holes. So, CCC and SuperDuper won't work with OS 11 Big Sur. Not in any hurry to change (not sure if my Macbook Air will even run it, know the 2011 Macbook Pro won't).

[ElmerJFudd]

Sure it"s related to both securing their IP, improving performance, controlling their destiny and road maps, developing new products, securing user data, locking out malware and viruses, increasing profit margin - all those things. the Hackintosh had a good run. and it likely will continue to with existing versions of OSX and developer"s software. But going forward, not so much.

[Joe Muscara]

" if you want to avoid an accidental Big Sur upgrade, you should make sure that the automatic update option in your Mac"s Software Update tool is turned off."

 

NOT TRUE.

 

You have to click that "Upgrade Now" button and it's there whether the Automatic Updates option is checked or not. All these people who don't know what they are talking about keeping people from getting their automatic updates

[ElmerJFudd]

Impressive

 

[video:youtube]

[Reezekeys]

I've seen a youtube showing Logic running while using non-optimized plugins running in Rosetta 2. I was wondering if that was even possible â looks like it is, although the one video I saw seemed to show a decent CPU and ram hit. From what I saw however, Native Instruments plugins don't seem to run at all in Rosetta 2 (at least Kontakt doesn't). My question would be: are companies going to update their products to at least allow them to run in emulation while they work on converting to M1-optimized code, or will they skip that step and have us wait until they are optimized?

 

The M1 Mac Mini still comported itself quite well, and those running Logic and M1-native plugins are gonna be very happy campers. If your plugs aren't Universal but run under emulation you can still get get a decent amount of work done.

[EscapeRocks]

. From what I saw however, Native Instruments plugins don't seem to run at all in Rosetta 2 (at least Kontakt doesn't). My question would be: are companies going to update their products to at least allow them to run in emulation while they work on converting to M1-optimized code, or will they skip that step and have us wait until they are optimized?

.

 

Native Instruments has a great explanation about this:

Basically, even as they are gaining more compatibility with Big Sur, that does not mean compatibility with the M1 Chip Macs. They are working on M1, but no time frame has been announced.

Various software and hardware has been deemed okay with Big Sur on Intel Macs. MAKE SURE TO CHECK.

 

As usual, Sweetwater's Compatibility Guide is collating all the data.

[ElmerJFudd]

For the Logic/MainStage people - we"ll be wanting to watch for both plug-in updates and driver updates if you use an interface other than the internal sound card.

 

I think Apple is showing here why they went this route and why we"ll be wanting their developer community to get on board ASAP.

[mauriziodececco]

There is some people making tests with Logic and other stuff, including NI, on the VI Control forum, this thread: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/macs-to-use-arm-chips-instead-of-intel.94433/

[zeronyne]

Jump ahead a while (they spend some time introducing themselves because of an influx of new subscribers), and also check out their other video running 990 plug ins in native Logic.

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

[Reezekeys]

There is some people making tests with Logic and other stuff, including NI, on the VI Control forum, this thread: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/macs-to-use-arm-chips-instead-of-intel.94433/

 

Thanks for that link. I was wrong about Kontakt running in emulation. Here's a quote from that thread:

 

"Now, on to what you all care about: Native Instruments. As suspected, everything basically runs, but (sadly) only in 30-minute Demo Mode, with no ability to activate via Native Access. In limited testing, I did experience one instance of Kontakt not properly resizing the window to accomodate an interface in Logic, but no issues using Kontakt standalone. Playing within Kontakt seems no different than on Intel, though I will have to fire up the i7 again to compare specifics on CPU usage. Komplete Kontrol works fine with my M32 controller - no major issues that I could find. I'm able to browse as normal, audition patches, etc, but again, only in Demo mode.

 

Overall, things look very promising - it doesn't appear that NI has a ton of work to do to get everything working via Rosetta (it appears it's mostly getting Native Access itself to work). How long it will be before we see Universal versions of the major applications is anyone's guess, but at least with Logic's ability to use Intel plugins, things are functional right now, and will only improve over time."

 

(Original post: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/macs-to-use-arm-chips-instead-of-intel.94433/page-45#post-4691427)