I Wish I Was A Negro

[big K]

Originally posted by skipclone 1:

Originally posted by DanS:

QUOTE]Its a good point, But what I am saing , how long do we have to pay for this. I was born in canada. As a person I think that gives me as much rights as teh "natives".

The general consensus of people who don't live near natives is that they scratch out a meager existence, after being fucked-over by the white devil and his fire-water. The indians near where I live don't pay any income taxes, get a new house every 12 years, and get free dough every month. I even know a guy who has a hum-vee, and a job as a "truck driver"

I think that 400 years is enough time to get your shit together. We're all in the same boat up here.

Oh, so you`re saying that after 400 years, everything`s back to normal, right? you`re saying

that the indians can go back and live their lives from the land, with the same natural abundance that their ancestors did, before Europeans came, without any worries about somebody else`s crap so they don`t need any help, right? or are you saying that any one of them can walk into a hiring office, or a loan office, and expect the same treatment you get?

As far as the guy with the Humvee-yeah I can see where that might be irritating-I don`t doubt that there are people looking at the payouts being given to 9/11 victims and grumbling things under their breath too. Look at it this way-would you sacrifice a member of your family to get a piece of that? would you conspire to help Saudi Arabia

invade you country, and stay there, so that you have to learn Arabic to go buy a pack of gum-if you got a really bitchin camel to ride around on out of the deal (yeah with all the options-CD player, navigation etc.)? a basic rule of economics is, things cost more than their price tag-something to keep in mind the next time you see that guy.[/QB]

 

Interesting ideas being presented here. I have some further thoughts on the matter.

 

Progress, - I don't think people have the right to hang on to there old ways, in favour of progress. That is a strong statement, I know. The whole world, even 3rd world contries, are consitatly changeing, evolveing. The world is dynamic, with new invertions the world changes, .. for example the internet, mass comunication of all forms for that matter. Car trucks, high rise building , high density houseing. I think that every nation, race what ever endevours to better them selfs, we are humans it is what we do. in as such this progress can not, and should not be held back. I think that there is no aguement that can be made for holding on to the old ways.

 

Also it was asked how much a life is worth.

 

Although I agree that human life is valueable, I think too that we must ask the right question here, as that implys someone we are close with.

 

First we need to establish who would get "paid " for the loss, .. I would say spouse, and maybe childern. They are the only ones I think that can really claim a true loss.

 

For example, if you found out tomorrow that in ww1 the german people had killed you great grand father, HOW much would that bother you... do you have a right to recieve some or of compensation?

 

I would think not.

 

I guess what I am saying is that the natives claim 2 things, first that all this land is theirs, and that the deaths of their ancestors means that I owe them.

 

I think both arguements are weak. even if it was your land in the first place, progress of society has make land in north america private. If the natives chose not to participate in that , it is their choice.

 

I think that I am not the cause of native deaths, and that even if I was, there is little case of typical natives have ligitimate claim for compensation.

 

BIgK

[Lee Flier]

Some of you guys are way off base about the Natives. The compensation they receive has nothing to do with whether you are responsible for what happened to them or whether you think their social system is antiquated. The various rights they have were given to them by legal treaty. This is really no different than inheritance on a large scale. Now if your grandfather died and left you 100 acres of land, nobody would resent you for it or question your right to have it, even if you were already rich and you built a mansion on that 100 acres and drove your SUV around on it. Or conversely if you just decided to quit your job, set up a tent and live off the land. That's your choice.

 

Likewise if your grandfather owned the water rights or fishing rights on someone else's land and he left you that deed when he died, no one would question your right to that. If you wanted to, you could sell those rights to someone else, but if you kept the deed, then anyone who used the water or caught fish on that land would have to pay you for it. And you would have the right to fish there or take the water for your own use even though you didn't own the land itself.

 

The U.S. and Canada have treaties with the various tribes which bestowed certain lands and certain rights on them and therefore, their heirs. I'm sure most of you know that the majority of the treaties that were made with Natives were broken, and the lands were stolen from them despite legal documents saying various pieces of land belonged to them. There are still a meager few treaties that are being honored by our governments, but some people apparently want to do away with even those. Come on... imagine if someone tried to force you to sell off your grandfather's 100 acres or water rights for a pittance, when you are his legal heir - just because they think you're a pain in the ass, or "you don't need it anyway," or "you're not doing anything to contribute back to society" or "I wasn't responsible for your grandfather's death so why should I have to pay you for a water lease?" Yeah, sure, that'd hold up in court.

[Nawledge]

that strange sudden sensation that you just got after reading Lees post, you know the one that felt like a mild throbbing in the frontal lobe,

that was clarity.

[Bunny Knutson]

Word.

[Base]

Kinda relatedish:

 

Internet\'s role in racism debated

[phaeton]

Kinda relatedish:

 

Internet's role in racism debated

 

Interesting article, Base. That said, i must say that in the hundreds or so of online ppl i know, very few of us know or question the racial background of each other, and prefer it that way. (This being IRC). In some cases it is unclear of a certain person's gender, and there are some that i know that prefer to personify a gender online different than what they physically are.

 

But hey, we're all just words on the screen, right? One of the things i love about the internet is that two or more brains can communicate together without any of that unimportant stuff such as skin colour or superstitions getting in the way.