Which Leslie to search for?

[dfcas]

I would cast a wide vintage net and see what leslie finds you. I would consider a 142, 122, 145, 147, and also the home cabinet models, which i-think- are 222 and 247. Tubes and wood.

[Outkaster]

222 and 247 models are rarer, and the 245. They never really took off as far as the techs told me. Your 122 and 142 Leslie's are rare and were really made for the 3 series organs.

[JohnSC]

My perspective on the bass in the 122 and the 3300w. I've owned all three -- 122, 3300p and the new plywood 3300w. The new 3300w is a much tighter, louder bass than my old 122, which was a late 60s version paired to 1969 B3. I never played my B3 through the 3300, but I've played the SK2, DMC-122 and A3/XK-5 with full pedals through it alongside the B3/122.

 

I seriously doubt you will need a subwoofer with the later 3300 models. The bass is prodigious.

 

The central issue on old Leslies is the condition of its speakers, amp, the caps and tubes, especially the original 6550. And the condition of the caps and tubes in the B3 preamp. New tubes are not as warm and rich sounding.

 

Because it has dramatically less power than the 300-watt 3300, the 60-watt 122 gets pushed wide open where it overdrives and distorts creating that distinctive crackle. Playing at home, I rarely played the 122 wide open. The new A3/XK-5 through the new 3300 can be tweaked and over-driven at a much lower volume. But, if I were moving a Leslie around by myself, it would be the 3300w without question. Smaller and lighter, far more reliable on the road, and you don't have to mike it to cut through in a mix.

 

The original speakers in the Leslies were quite inefficient and dull to minimize the native brightness of the original B3s. But those original speakers inside the Leslie are now more than 50 years old, often rode hard and put up wet. Many have been replaced with after-market speakers that are brighter and not as sweet-sounding as the originals. Check the horn baffle to see if someone stuffed it with cotton to mellow out a replacement horn. I've seen that myself. Also, some of the '70s 122s were not plywood but composite separating the horn and bass compartments. That also will reduce bass resonance.

 

Be prepared for regular maintenance to keep this stuff running properly. And qualified maintenance may be hundreds of miles away. That's why the churches have all but abandoned them and there are few dealers selling them today.

 

[JohnSC]

I've played both versions of the 3300 side by side with my A3. The plywood version is a significant improvement in bass response. Much louder and I sold my B1200. Certainly, anyone considering it should hear it before buying, and to make sure it is the plywood version.

 

3300s are a road Leslie. They are loud. The onboard overdrive is killer and the bass is absolutely massive using the built in sub out.

 

So is the bass of the 3300 alone equal to a 122 (when the 3300 is played at similar volume to the 122's capabilities)?

 

I really don't want to have to buy a subwoofer if I buy a 3300, to equal the bass performance of a 122/147/145/142.

 

Lou

No.

 

But I've heard the newer models with the plywood cabinetry may be better in the bass but I wouldn't expect a huge difference. I haven't heard the new 3300. I have an old 3300 and a 122.

[Outkaster]

John it's true everyone of these needs maintenance and if you start making the plunge into this type of gear be prepared to spend a lot of money. For one thing these consoles were never intended to me moved around a lot, same with the Leslie speakers.

[Lou_NC]

Just wanted to say thank you again to all who are posting here, this thread has been a wealth of information for me! Hearing first-hand experiences with folks familiar with these magic boxes is invaluable in my decision making. It really means a lot to me to have these insights.

 

BTW, I'm not at all intimidated about owning/maintaining a vintage Leslie for home use, should I decide to head down that path. I would only be interested in a quality specimen, and if you ever saw my garage/workshop, you'd know it would be kept in excellent working order, too. I'm a EE by trade, so any electrical repairs would never intimidate me, and I also have excellent mechanical skills as well. That said, I'm not 100% sure I want to undertake the ownership of a vintage unit, since having a 3300 brings some portability advantages with it (provided the sound is good).

 

One interesting point for me to consider is that I would definitely be driving my Leslie with a "modern" clonewheel, currently my XK-3 pro setup. I have no plans to own a vintage tonewheel organ, now or in the future. So, if I go down the path of the vintage 6-pin Leslie, I'd definitely need the 6-to-11 pin adapter "box" to go with it.

 

I'm definitely going to let all this information sink in a while. The good news is that there doesn't seem to be any BAD choices here, between the vintage and 3300.

 

Lou

[Outkaster]

Good if you can do repairs yourself that's great Lou. We have a couple engineers here on the forum. Good thing is that there is a lot of knowledge here and on the organ forum. A lot of us cross post over there.

[WesG]

What do you drive? If you can fit in a 145 on casters, there is very little difference between that an a 3300, in terms of portability.