The courage to record songs against the grain

[LiveMusic]

I have posted on this subject months ago. So, if you don't want to respond, okay. Maybe there's some fresh blood or fresh ideas on this forum.

 

I constantly fight this battle. I have a few protest songs. I live in an area that is largely pro-war and religious. I am neither. And I have songs that go against the grain. Do I play them and do I record them, that is the dillemma. It's a problem of "what's the point?"

 

I think of John Mellencamp. He has a song, "Poppy." I think that's the name of it. It's about a black man and a white woman. Or is it white man, black woman? Anyway, in the song is a refrain, "Don't call me nigger no more!"

 

I LOVE THIS SONG. First, I just love the song, period. I like the groove. But I also admire the message.

 

Now, I live in the deep south. I am not kidding, a helluva lot of my friends are racist. People on these forums will say stuff like "Well, what kind of friend is that?" Like you must discard them because they are racist. But it's not that simple. Racism dies hard. Someone can have some really good qualities and be racist.

 

I take pride in the fact that I have come a LONG way regarding racism. I worshipped my dad but I can truthfully say he was racist. He had a caring heart but he used the n-word. It was a way of life in their generation. My mother never would, though.

 

Almost all of my closest friends are racist. And I mean, it is really strong. Whites are superior. Well, actually, it's more like blacks are inferior. They have evolved zero during our lifetimes. And they raise an eyebrow at my abandonment of religion. Like I'm the bad guy. And then they spout hatred.

 

So, the point of this...

 

At a recent gig, I played (among many songs) these two protest songs (that I really do like!). I think I made some people uneasy. Is that good? Is that bad? Seriously, inner conflict.

 

I think of artists who never rock the boat. I don't know the answer but I really do wonder. In a previous thread, someone said protest songs really don't do any good. I don't know if that's true because, to me, a primary reason for writing them is it gives people with a similar viewpoint a song that they can identify with. But the point is, is it worth pissing off the rest of everybody?

 

And... I write tons of light-hearted stuff. I could NEVER record a protest song and still have PLENTY to record and play. Back to "what's the point?"

 

Reminds me of a couple of my favorite artists... Jerry Jeff Walker and Charlie Robison. I don't know of any of their songs that would piss people off.

[Prague]

Well, IMHO, the guitarist-cum-geopolitical-"expert" cliche is tired, boring, and annoying. It's been done to death and who cares if you play a guitar? As far as recording, it doesn't matter. Record whatever you like. Courage? Is this what courage is? It's takes little courage.

 

But, keep your venue and clientele in mind. Do you play hate/protest/angst songs at a wedding reception? No. Do you play Sugar, Sugar by the Archies at a biker rally? No.

 

If you want to make people uncomfortable, play at a gig where people want to be uncomfortable. In all likelyhood, you'll be preaching to the choir. So, I find it an exercise in futility to "challenge" your audiences' sensibilities (like some musician is going to pose much of a challenge anyway!).

 

Personally, I'd ignore you.

[hard truth]

Speaking out against injustice is always the right thing to do. Making people uncomfortable for supporting injustice is a good thing. The protest movment of the sixties did help change people's attitudes. But you will pay a price. You will lose gigs and friends. The more effective you are, the greater the price you will pay. Be prepared. If you can find a supportive community of friends who will support you it will be much easier. Preaching to the choir is easy, speaking out is hard. Good luck.

[skipclone 1]

Livemusic-

In this time it`s weird that it should even be an issue. Protest songs are nothimg new, in fact I have a great protest song against censorship that appears to have been rendered irrelevant by hip hop and some nu-metal. No you shouldn`t play it just to screw with peoples` heads, and you know what? if it really really works and people in large numbers start saying Livemusic`s right, racist shits are ruining civilization and we`re not gonna take it anymore, you know what? there`s a good chance that someone`s going to shoot you.

From what you said it may even be one of your friends. But every time someone says, `why are all these guys screaming? why can`t they just sing songs?`

or `why all this anger and rage and shit?` well you just gave a very good explanation. I write angry songs too, sometimes I just break things.

[theblue1]

Almost all of my closest friends are racist. And I mean, it is really strong. Whites are superior. Well, actually, it's more like blacks are inferior. They have evolved zero during our lifetimes. And they raise an eyebrow at my abandonment of religion.

 

I keep reading Jesus' teachings and thinking -- what is it about his message of love, charity, and compassion that is so hard for us to understand?

[LiveMusic]

Originally posted by theblue1:

Almost all of my closest friends are racist. And I mean, it is really strong. Whites are superior. Well, actually, it's more like blacks are inferior. They have evolved zero during our lifetimes. And they raise an eyebrow at my abandonment of religion.

 

I keep reading Jesus' teachings and thinking -- what is it that is it about his message of love, charity, and compassion that is so hard to understand?

I don't know if you are directing that towards my abandonment of religion or towards so-called Christians who are racist.

 

But if for me, my answer would be that Jesus isn't the problem. Great guy. My kind of guy. It's his dad. Or are they the same?

[Jokerelli]

Do it man,

 

I hate musicians that use their fame to forward their agendas but I have respect for music that has a message, even if I don't agree with it.

[LiveMusic]

Originally posted by Prague:

But, keep your venue and clientele in mind. Do you play hate/protest/angst songs at a wedding reception? No. Do you play Sugar, Sugar by the Archies at a biker rally? No.

I live in the south. Every state in the south is pretty much the same. If I should not play the songs at venues here, that means, nowhere. Unless I go a long way away. I am sure John Mellencamp does not play "Poppy" in the south. He may not even play it ANYwhere. I dunno. But I admire his doing that song. If he did it down here, somebody probably WOULD shoot him.

 

Maybe times are just too different now. In the 60s, protest songs were embraced. Now, I dunno. If I were slamming American policies that I detested in 1968, that's one thing but in 2004, maybe that won't work. I dunno.

 

Let me put it this way. I think George Bush is a disgrace. I think he is a liar. But a helluva lot of people do not agree. That's fine. One of us is right.

 

Now, I feel very strongly about this. My dad was a POW. I wrote a song blending all of the above. I've had many people say that it's a very good song. I've had some people that have thought it is sensational. I've watered it down several times now so that it's not so hard-hitting. But it's NOT pro-Bush. It questions.

 

So, you have the Toby Keith's of the world writing and singing "We're the good ol' USA and we'll stick a boot up your ass" or something to that effect. And I get angry. The people that surround me CHEER that song. I don't cheer. I am revolted.

 

So, do I _not_ write my song? That's the dillemma. I am, no doubt about it, countering Toby Keith's bullshit song with my own song. (Not that it's country, I guess it's more pop than country.)

 

And the other song of mine (which I like even better) is about all of the lies we've endured for decades now. Where will it end? It was another counter to the toby-keith syndrome.

[theblue1]

Lots of interracial couples out this way, Duke.

 

Change will come.

[Duddits]

Protest songs can be a really complex thing, and sometimes they make people uncomfortable for less obvious reasons. Like when some mild mannered regular guy suddenly gets all high and mighty and preachy, and sounds disengenuous and phony. Or maybe the message is great but the song plain out sucks, and you feel pressured into liking the song because of the message. I know this one guy who writes awful protest songs about stuff he doesn't know much about, and it puts the audience in the uncomfortable position of having to pretend they like them, or else they fear that others will judge them as bad people, that "the message" makes them uncomfortable when it's the song that sucks. It's as if the fact that the message is enshrined in a song enables the singer to co-opt credibility.

 

However, I don't mean to suggest that that has anything to do with you, just that there's more than meets the eye with a protest song. And there's nothing like a great protest song with a great message and a great tune.

 

As for the courage to write, perform, record, against the grain, as long as you're not exploiting some easy message to feign rebellion, go for it! Better to go against the grain then dissolve into a mushy porridge.

[phaeton]

Well...

 

For one, i am willing to bet that these "risque" songs you have weren't written to specifically piss someone off. They were written because you have a vested interest and belief in them and their message.

 

For two, I completely understand your dilemma about racist/highly religious friends. I'm surrounded by the same, and i'm the most tolerant atheistic heathen they've ever seen. We give each other a lot of crap, but they're still good folks.

 

About the only thing i can say is this-

 

Record your songs, and play your songs. Period. They're your songs, they are a part of you, and they mean something to you.

 

However, there is no shame in perhaps selecting your audience a bit. Mainly i'm referring to within 50 miles of your home.

 

Don't shit where you eat.

 

Tone it down a little bit for the more local shows. Go ahead and play the faraway gigs, and play your controversial songs there.

 

You might get stuff thrown at you in faraway places, but at least you won't wake up to crosses burning in your front yard.

 

That's what -I- would do. Doesn't mean it's the right thing though.

 

Last thing you should do is change your mind and beliefs just to 'fit in' though. But i'm sure you know that )

[fantasticsound]

That's a really tough call, Duke.

 

As previously mentioned, some people would rather have there ears crushed than hear another angst ridden cry about how we all live with few ethics while millions starve and corporate types steal (literally or figuratively) the money from other, less fortunate people's pockets.

 

Others like to live in that tension.

 

First, keep writing the songs. You never know how a particular song will play to the peeps. Just because you write a song doesn't mean you need to associate yourself with it. Sell the damn thing to someone who'll shout it from the treetops, if you wish. That goes for serious protest songs and fluffy pop songs alike.

 

Second, you DO have to decide what personae you wish to portray to the public. Like it or not, you can move them in different directions with different songs. Most artists either live with this and never fully expect to hit the big time or they hold it back until they've become successful enough to take more risks at the expense of their future career.

 

Ironically, Joan Baez was recently featured on CBS' Sunday Morning, and has come to a place in her life where social action is what she does offstage. Onstage she's a singer, and one who wishes to share her creative without offending those who otherwise would appreciate her vocal talent.

 

What do YOU want to share with your friends? Your public? The world?

[Dan South]

A lot depends on the gig. Song that would be accepted in a coffee house won't be appreciated at a wedding reception. You have to be true to yourself, but you have to balance that with the expectations of your audience. Don't force things down their throats.

[TeleCarlos]

Record everything!!!!!!!!

 

There are niche market for everything. By that I only mean somebody will sure enjoy it, even if its at the other end of the world.

[LiveMusic]

Originally posted by fantasticsound:

That's a really tough call, Duke...

 

Second, you DO have to decide what personae you wish to portray to the public...

Yes, it is tough and since I am new to all of this, I am dealing with it NOW. You and others gave good insight. But it's tough. I think of so many artists who do not ruffle any feathers and I dig 'em. Mellencamp is a rebel.

 

Alan Jackson. I _love_ Alan Jackson. He is by far my favorite traditional country artist. Never offends anyone. But I am just as infatuated with Steve Earle, a rebel in the first degree. Charlie Robison, other Texas music Americana guys. They write things that Nashville won't touch.

 

I like their music and I write a lot of stuff in that vein. That is something that I _won't_ change just because it might offend some very conservative types. Humorous songs that have some risque lines. They are just fun songs. Of course, if it's to my mom's woman's club, I won't play those.

 

The problem is with the protest songs. The couple of songs mentioned in this thread, I can't imagine anyone doing one of them, it's so personal. The other one, that I like even better, yep, if I could find the right artist, I guess there's a chance on that one. As far as protest songs, I think it's a pretty cool song. I love to play it. Of course, I believe in the message.

 

Let me ask you this, Neil. You are as good a person to ask as anyone and I have wondered about this. I've told you I write some country songs. And we all know that country music is pretty conservative. Seems that every single one is pro-Bush, pro-war, pro-USA, pro-whatever the establishment says. But do you think there are artists that will buck the system in Nashville?

 

For instance, the Dixie Chicks were hammered by Nashville. Do you think there are artists there that would take a stand?

 

For instance, I am thinking of this song that I've mentioned. My songwriter guru happens to actually AGREE with the song. He loves the song. But he's said "I have no idea who would cut this song. But you need to demo it because by golly, it's truth." Obviously, he likes it. And he was a staff writer for years.

[ani]

Duke,

 

As extremely opinionated as I can be on these forums about my personal beliefs, politics, and other issues; something that I have learned NOT to do is to express those feelings though artistry that I intend for public audiences. I make it a point to remain neutral on all issues, both in my song writing techniques, and in content that I allow on my web site. I don't engage in controversial issues as a part of my professional persona. Now... catch me in the right mood, I'll write a book of posts about my angst with ..... but never do I use the noteriety of my site to exploit personal beliefs of my own or will I allow others to express controversial issues "through" my site.

 

Although I have writte some hate songs to get the anquish off of my chest, those are songs that I don't push to polish or ever have any feelings of wanting to market them. I probably have a few hits that some folks think are awesome; but they served their purpose at the time..... and I'm through with them. I don't want to get caught up in being stereotyped as Hate Music, or Rebel, or what have you... I love expressing myself in philosophical ways with subliminal messages written about personal growth and getting in touch with your inner being; both soul searching songs and songs of healing.

 

You will find a much greater following if you lead the way gracefully and allow others to get in touch with their spirituality by showing your strength in being who you are... "PUSHING THEM" to see things your way, however, will cause rebellion, resentment, and if not careful, complete rejection.

[Philip OKeefe]

Courage? Is this what courage is? It's takes little courage.

 

But, keep your venue and clientele in mind. Do you play hate/protest/angst songs at a wedding reception? No. Do you play Sugar, Sugar by the Archies at a biker rally? No.

 

Playing Sugar, Sugar at a biker rally takes, if not courage, at least a large amount of guts... or incredible levels of stupidity and poor judgement.

[skipclone 1]

thee`s more than one way to handle protest songs too. One of my favorites in recent years is `Fruit of Many Roots` by LSK. it`s got that lush orchestral, Soul II Soul thing going but the lyrics make a very pointed statement against musical bigotry. If it`s pleasant to listen to it makes people more inclined to hear the message too, that`s a more subtle and cool approach than banging on the instruments and screaming about running out of cigarettes.

[fantasticsound]

Originally posted by LiveMusic:

I _love_ Alan Jackson. He is by far my favorite traditional country artist. Never offends anyone. But I am just as infatuated with Steve Earle, a rebel in the first degree. Charlie Robison, other Texas music Americana guys. They write things that Nashville won't touch...

 

...Let me ask you this, Neil. You are as good a person to ask as anyone and I have wondered about this. I've told you I write some country songs. And we all know that country music is pretty conservative. Seems that every single one is pro-Bush, pro-war, pro-USA, pro-whatever the establishment says. But do you think there are artists that will buck the system in Nashville?

 

For instance, the Dixie Chicks were hammered by Nashville. Do you think there are artists there that would take a stand?...

Duke, I should start by mentioning, Murder On Music Row. Alan Jackson, in his own words, "I'm just a singer of simple songs. I'm not a real political man." However, he not only recorded Murder On Music Row, he performed it on an awards show and it was recognized with an award and a big round of applause.

 

Country music has long been a place where a poignant protest song can make it, but there's no doubt they cut against the grain of the usual fare. Here's a short list of politically sensitive or outright political country songs. You be the judge of whether your protest songs fit in.

 

1. Skip A Rope - Don Williams (Talks about the not so innocent things kids repeat after seeing and hearing awful things from adults.)
   
2. Red Rag Top - Tim McGraw (A lament about a man, his first love, abortion and that love lost when the girl couldn't deal with what they did.)
   
3. Independence Day - Martina McBride (A young girl goes to 4th of July parade. Meanwhile, it's insinuated her abused mother lights up the house with not-so-dear-old-dad inside.)
   
4. Johnny Cash - The Ballad Of Ira Hayes (A Native American war hero returns to nothing on the reservation and dies drunk in poverty. Cash played this song at the White House for former president, Richard Nixon.)
   
5. The Man In Black - Johnny Cash (Cash sings that his black clothes are a symbol and statement that there is too much hate, violence and misery in this country, and he must use his celebrity to constantly remind us there are many in our society who need our assistance.)
   

There are plenty more where these came from. As for the Dixie Chicks, there is an organization of heavy hitters on music row that was born from the fact the Chicks took so much heat for their stance on the war in Iraq.

 

Country Music, and Music Row in particular, can be conservative. But there are definitely politically outspoken artists, writers, and record label executives who will support a good protest song if it speaks to them. Sometimes they end up as a hit in spite of status quo, country radio.

[songrytr]

It's a real shame you even have to consider whether or not to perform your songs. The national climate has certainly turned hostile to "dissenting" opinions and some of the "pro-America" stuff that's come out of the Country market is downright scary.

 

Creative people have to realize that there is a very real threat to our freedom of "voice." The FCC is staffed with a group of Bozos who feel it's their job to arbitrarily decide what is and isn't "indecent." Furthermore, Congress is literally days away from passing a bill that will fine an aritist up to $500,000 for saying something on the air that offends the FCC.

 

Please, record and perform your songs. But be reasonable and careful enough not to get beaten or shot.

 

Or fined.

[LiveMusic]

Originally posted by fantasticsound:

As for the Dixie Chicks, there is an organization of heavy hitters on music row that was born from the fact the Chicks took so much heat for their stance on the war in Iraq.

Can you tell me more what you mean by the above? I don't really comprehend what you said but I'm interested.

[fantasticsound]

I've read somewhere about several Nashville record execs who've connected as a group because they're liberal in a town where conservative is king. I'll see if I can find the write up. It said they began this group because of the overzealous backlash against Natalie Maines' remarks.

[LiveMusic]

Originally posted by fantasticsound:

I've read somewhere about several Nashville record execs who've connected as a group because they're liberal in a town where conservative is king. I'll see if I can find the write up. It said they began this group because of the overzealous backlash against Natalie Maines' remarks.

Thanks, I would appreciate knowing about it.