10 Years since Cobain's Death

[Rog]

Originally posted by ThatDrumnGroove:

i cant stand Nirvana, i get so sick of the scraming, and how basic they are. if Kurt wouldn't have killed himself im sure the band would not have been voted #1 on every greatest band show on MTV or smells like teen spirit voted as the best song ever written.

 

because of his suicide and that journal shit, people just thought of him as much more "deep" and he was and is still overrated.

 

My reaction to the "Its been ten years" is basically.....Get over it!, its been ten years!!!

Can you please start a thread about a dead artist you really like so I can post and it a trash him or her?

 

Please?

 

 

As my mother used to say, "if you haven't got anything nice to say, shut the fuck up."

[felix.]

I'm not a Nirvana fan, but it is undeniable that they had a significant impact on music at the time.

 

As innovative or fresh their sound was, it's unfortunate that Kurt's life was seemingly just a rehash of the tired old Rock 'n' Roll stereotype.

[skipclone 1]

Here`s my 1-2 cents worth-after a vodka and ginger ale, but whatever...

A certain forum member goes on a lot about `taste`, which I can appreciate-tasteful playing is timeless. Same goes for singing. That may be why some people get riled about screaming vocals too. But music does more than stand the test of time, it also captures moments in time-an incident, a movement, a generation. You can scoff at the significance of that, but music isn`t-thank goodness-about a predictable curve of more ability, better electronics, smarter lyrics. Why should it be? that`s not life folks. That`s why people like Cobain are important. If you value only esthetics to the exclusion of everything else, you know what you end up with? a bunch of effete twits nattering about heel joints while the house is burning down around them. No thanks. I`m not a Nirvana or Cobain fan but it sucks that he`s not around, I thought he had some real songwriting ability. And in our terminally jaded time I can understand why some music people feel they have to scream to get through to listeners. What a goddam shame.

[Rog]

Originally posted by sacdog:

Do you remember where were you when you heard the news?

 

Geez, it's like it was yesterday when I got the call from my Mom (of all people) when I was at work. She told me that "I just heard on the news that Kurt Cobain killed himself".

I was devistated. She called me and told me because she knew how much I liked Nirvana.

 

it was a sad day.

 

R.I.P. Kurt

I remember I was sat with my then girlfriend in her bedroom at her parent's house, I was 19 at the time. It was about seven PM when the news first came on the radio and we both sat there, stunned.

 

We had tix to see them play in Manchester in three weeks time, I'd never looked forward to a gig so much in my life

 

I liked Bleach, loved the songs on Nevermind but hated the neutered production on that album ... but would they have become so successful with a raw sounding album? In Utero was a step in the right direction and I still love Albini's production on that one, especially the drums which sound much bigger than the overly-compressed ones on Nevermind. I feel it was closer to what Kurt wanted.

 

I adore the live album too, I think it's pretty obvious from the last few bars of Where Did You Sleep Last Night? that Kurt was one of those people who couldn't hold back, like Janis Joplin. Makes for incredibly moving music but it's indicative that he wasn't meant to last.

[Wewus432]

I would like to ask EVERYONE to stop responding to Mr Nice Jazz Guitar Guy, in any way shape or form. His only intention here is to disrupt things.

 

At this point do you really think anything you say to him is going to have any affect on what he does. It's all bullshit. I don't think he even believes a lot of things he says. He just likes to fuck with people. This might have been an interesting, enjoyable, thread to read if I didn't have to sift through all his bullshit and people's replies to his bullshit.

 

Just cut him off, ya know? Then we can just scroll past it.

[Rog]

Can't one of the mods do some kind of IP lookup and find out who this/these people are?

 

If one person is using 400000 logins then ban 'em or at least post a list of all the names so we know.

[skipclone 1]

I read through this too, it`s not just him. Point taken however.

[Wewus432]

Originally posted by Rog:

Can't one of the mods do some kind of IP lookup and find out who this/these people are?

 

If one person is using 400000 logins then ban 'em or at least post a list of all the names so we know.

I was talking about this on another forum. Most people don't have a static IP. With all dialups, and all AOL users dial-up or broadband, the IP changes everytime you log onto the internet. Even with some other broadband users you have to request a static(non-changing) IP.

 

According to my uderstanding of the technology you can only ban someone with a static IP. Correct? Even if you do that..... the person who has been banned, can still bounce through another computer, or computers, to get back online, which may be what has already happened.

 

I think if the administrators could do anything about this asshole, they would have done it by now. It's up to us to cut this fucking troll off. I'm sick of even talking about this shit.

[Rog]

I see.

 

I'll be ignoring "it" then.

[Jazz Guitar]

Originally posted by TheWewus:

I would like to ask EVERYONE to stop responding to Mr Nice Jazz Guitar Guy, in any way shape or form. His only intention here is to disrupt things.

 

At this point do you really think anything you say to him is going to have any affect on what he does. It's all bullshit. I don't think he even believes a lot of things he says. He just likes to fuck with people. This might have been an interesting, enjoyable, thread to read if I didn't have to sift through all his bullshit and people's replies to his bullshit.

 

Just cut him off, ya know? Then we can just scroll past it.

Hi Wee-Pus. Sorry I didn't like Nirvana. Frankly I can't see how anyone with a brain in their head would have. THat's because Kurt NoBrain didn't have one.

 

I'm also amazed that anyone with any kind of "command" of a musical instrument would actually like Nirvana.

 

Some people still "indentify" with the lamentable music of their youth. Time to grow up folks.

[Jazz Guitar]

Originally posted by ThatDrumnGroove:

i cant stand Nirvana, i get so sick of the scraming, and how basic they are. if Kurt wouldn't have killed himself im sure the band would not have been voted #1 on every greatest band show on MTV or smells like teen spirit voted as the best song ever written.

 

because of his suicide and that journal shit, people just thought of him as much more "deep" and he was and is still overrated.

 

My reaction to the "Its been ten years" is basically.....Get over it!, its been ten years!!!

Yeah, someone else sees and hears the truth.

 

"A garage band, from Seattle"

[Jazz Guitar]

Originally posted by Aaron Carey:

Ushering in Pearl Garden Pilots was nothing to be proud of.

 

Thank you Kurt Cobain for giving me five minutes of euphoria. I hate for anyone to die, and I feel sorry for your daughter. I can understand fleeing from that wife of yours tho, but I have trouble shedding tears for another dead junkie.

 

Sorry if I offended any junkies out there

I like that alot, especially the "Pearl Garden Pilots" part!

[Jazz Guitar]

Originally posted by Dan South:

First, let me say that this thread is a sad commentary about the depths to which SSS has plunged. A year or two ago, some people might have said that they never got into Nirvana or that they didn't think that Cobain was all that talented, etc., but never with the kind of unrepentent bile that oozes from these pages today. If someone mocked Dizzy Gillespie or Duke Ellington on the anniversaries of their deaths, well, no one would have enough bad taste to do so.

Really? If Ornette Coleman died today, would that make his "music" more listenable? Judging by the late works of Coltrane, I guess so.

[Aaron Carey]

I think the confusion comes from believing the BS. I believed it too, till I could hear the lyrics.

 

What pisses me off, was that the band pretended to be some socially conscious something or another

 

it is a LIE

 

if its on the radio, you bet your ass 100% its just more top 40 pop for the system.

 

LITTLE bits slip in here and there, like John Lennon's stuff, but even there it was carefully watered down.

 

IF Cobain truly meant to say something, he wouldve said it. Not just pretending to be riding a certain wave in order to bring in people like me. The whole marketing scam of grunge was to pretend there was some new, independent force moving on. He said nothing

 

They even went so far as to call it alternative.

 

Alternative to what??? It was the only thing on the pop 40 radio, how was it alternative?

 

I can TRULY appreciate music that is poorly played, as long as there is attitude, or even better yet, GREAT or important lyrics. Check out Crass, or Conflict for example. Music that Jazz guitar guy would HATE, but I dont think he could put down the lyrics for " Big A, Little A, Bouncing B"

 

Likewise I can appreciate music with stupid or funny lyrics, where attitude is pouring off of it, like Sloppy Seconds - Destroyed, or anything from The Meatmen

 

I can appreciate things that are purely music, as long as it can take you on a journey, like most of Yngwie's FIRST album

 

Cobain was just one more pop 40 puppet, you might believe the hype, but then you wouldve probably believed " We dont have to take our clothes off, to have a good time" ten years earlier

 

Noone can deny the changes the machine that pushed Cobain into pop 40 made in the 90's, but hey, that same machine does that every few years

[Aaron Carey]

after all that, some strange timing, news has come that his half brother is gone as well. A really NICE guy who really really REALLY helped out the local scene.

 

We will miss you Rome

[skipclone 1]

I was cheking out a guitar shop shop today in my new town, they had some music playing that was the usual virtuoso type stuff you hear in a guitar store, then I heard the lyrics-

 

how`d we get to be

such hateful little people...

[Dan South]

I heard that Nevermind was recorded for about $650. I guess I can understand if the production isn't top notch. The music still conveys its message and its emotion, and that's what counts.

 

P.S. I love the Weird Al version of Teen Spirit (Mooo!)

[Alon]

I dont know much about nirvana, but no way in hell was the recording budget for nevermind $650.00.

 

3 rolls of 2" tape cost that practically. A typical album at that time would use shitloads of 2" tape, into the tens of thousands of dollars even.

 

Did they record in some studio at a rate of $ 0.50 an hour or something ?

 

What about butch vig the producer ? Did he not get paid or something ?

 

Maybe youre thinking about one of the early albums, but nevermind, nah, no way.

 

This is totally a guesstimate from my end, but im thinking more like at least a hundred grand or couple of hundred thousand, which is not a huge budget for a major label act.

 

alon

[Alon]

Actually, I found this on the net, so I guess my guesstimate was pretty much on the money.

 

"Their previous album, Bleach, was recorded in three days and cost $606.17 to make. Nevermind cost $120,000 which was twice its original budget."

 

alon

[Jedi]

Yeah, Cobain and company were courted by the Record labels. Bleach was done really cheap with Jack Endino I believe. Nevermind had a real budget and to my understanding they had to fight for Butch Vig to produce it. It's one of my favorite albums.

 

For me, Cobain's music was very pure. His melodies and guitar tone and songs were the heart of the band. It was a great mixture of angst and catchy punk melodies. On contrary to many folks opinion, he had a great voice. The tone of his voice was awesome. I always considered him as one of the best rock vocalists to grace the stage. But those melodies, that's where his brillance lied for me.

 

It is a shame to hear such negativity about the guy on a thread where Jeff seemed to be paying homage to the guy. You would think if folks wanted to talk about how they didn't dig him, they would make a thread about it. Instead of making waves with other forum members. Whatever happenned to the rituals of courtesy. The tone of Jeff's post was that of respect and reflection and just out of basic respect to Jeff I would think we would want to keep things somewhat along those lines. I understand how conversations deviate but post after post of trashing seems disrespectful to me.

 

Anyway, I remember when my cousin called to tell me Cobain had passed on. His son was just born and he called to name me godfather and tell me Kurt Cobain was gone. I tried to play it off like it really didn't bother me. I think I said something like, "Well they seemed like they were out of steam. Or something like "Drugs will do that to you." Real insensitive bullshit. As I looked back on my response I realized it was a typical way an eighteen year old would mourn over the maker of the music that truly touched and inspired me. R.I.P. Kurt Cobain, you are truly missed.

 

A Nirvana fan,

 

Lincoln Ross

Dead Black Jedis

[Super 8]

Originally posted by Aaron Carey:

What pisses me off, was that the band pretended to be some socially conscious something or another

 

it is a LIE

 

if its on the radio, you bet your ass 100% its just more top 40 pop for the system.

No offense, Aaron, but you don't know what you are talking about.

 

Nobody ever expected Nevermind to do so well -least of all Nirvana.

 

They never called it "Alternative"...they called it "Grunge". Alternative music had existed for years before Nirvana hit it big.....and it was already in the 'mainstream' too -bands like REM.

 

The music industry didn't latch onto Grunge... the public did. THEN the music industry latched on-see Alanis Morissette, among others. That's how it works.

 

The industry doesn't like taking chances, so it churns out the same stuff for as long as it can, until someone like Nirvana comes along from out of nowhere and steals the show. Next thing you know, the A&R people are scouring Seatle, looking ANYONE with that sound. Then they'll bleed that music until something new comes along, and the whole thing changes again.

 

The industry ONLY changes when it MUST. Trust me, if the Punk/New Wave movement hadn't killed off Disco, we'd still be listening to the Silver Convention and the Village People. The industry hates change.

[Aaron Carey]

"The music industry didn't latch onto Grunge... the public did."

 

WOO HOO!!!!

 

Tony Robbins has a cassette for you. Rudy has a bridge for you somewhere near brooklyn.

 

Not trying to be mean, but...it isnt going to get on the radio without approval signed sealed and delivered, and ESPECIALLY not MTV

[Super 8]

Oh, c'mon!

 

The only reason they got on the radio and Mtv was because of the buzz they made with the audience. The indrustry, at the time, was probably getting all set to release another Poison or Warrant album. Suddenly everything changed. It was the power of a fan base that changed music -it SURE AS HELL wasn't the industry.

[Aaron Carey]

so let me get this straight. Where was the first place YOU heard nirvana. Was it not one of the bought and paid for media channels?

 

Where are these "pits of consumer momentum" located that can change the bizz decisions. Are they somewhere in seattle or something? Funny a LOT of good underground stuff was coming out of seattle in the late 80's, but hardly anyone had heard of nirvana. Or did they play to select pools of people that happened to have a voice in the direction of the bizz?

 

What record label was Nevermind distributed by? Oh one of those independants right?

 

I dont want to sound like an ass, but the wool is thick over there, and Im so jaded anyhow who knows

[Robman2]

Hard to imagine dependency driving fame again, those who died at 27, him, JM, JJ, JH, BJ etc.

 

The timeline of the grunge thang' owes to the Smthereens etc and not just for the goatee.

 

I forget the name of that documentery on that genre but, Cobain was a late comer who was glombed onto, marginally talented, having copped from many better and more talented players.

 

Timeing was there and the rest is...smells like teen something.

 

The gist of grunge, explained in that movie, a slurred chord, from a 1/2 step above the tonic, versus punk which slurred from a 1/2 step down.

 

I assume had he lived, he would have been more proficient as an instrumentalist and writer but he chose drugs and self loathing and that particularly galls me because it's a manifest selfishness and pains those who are left behind.

 

What a prick, feeling entitled as many do from the baby boom on.

 

His legacy is a fraught dumb ass girlfriend and God hopes well for their kids. My co-dependant side says, I could straighten her out but???

 

Nonetheless charismatic now, because he's dead.

 

I do thank him for upping the value of my pre CBS Mustang however, so besides his craft legacy, he was good for something.

 

As for being in the top ten on the RS best ever guitarists, what a crock, alongside Hendrix, death allowed them a position they would not be in had they lived.

 

Here's to the light, may it have spanked their collective butts for being so ignorant.

 

Rob

[Sylver]

I was never a big Curt/Nirvana fan, but the guy obviously had something that people latched on to. He wrote some good songs, but his impact on music for good or ill is incalculable.

 

In a certain way, he really was a reflection of the emotional state of the youth of the country at the time. Considering how he ended his life, that's kinda scary, though maybe it was a wakeup call. I think a lot of people realized what a waste his death was, and it shocked people out of feeling sorry for themselves. Maybe.

 

And, anyone who can say that Curt and Jimi were "made" by thier deaths just isn't paying attention.

 

Both were HUGE icons at the time. I can't tell you how many stories I've heard about the first time someone heard or saw Hendrix, how people were mesmerized, astonished and moved. The LOOK on the faces of people in the crowd at the Montery Pop festival.

 

Curt wasn't nearly at the same level, but he truly affected (and effected, too )and moved people, which is a whole lot more than any of his detractors on this thread can say.

[shniggens]

Originally posted by Robman2:

Timeing was there and the rest is...smells like teen something.

 

Rob

[Jazz Guitar]

Originally posted by shniggens:

Originally posted by Robman2:

[qb]

Timeing was there and the rest is...smells like teen dog crap.

[Dan South]

Originally posted by Robman2:

The gist of grunge, explained in that movie, a slurred chord, from a 1/2 step above the tonic, versus punk which slurred from a 1/2 step down.

 

That's like saying that the gist of Mozart is somebody playing up and down major scales over a three chord accompaniment.

 

I'd venture that there's more to grunge than this conveniently oversimplified movie synopsis. Spend a few days listening to STP's "Purple" CD, one of the best of the genre, or The RHCP's "Blood Sugar Sex Magik" disc. There's a LOT of stuff happening in there.

[antimatter]

My thoughts:

 

Good, no, Very Good songwriter.

The anti-hero's hero.

Flannel and denim replace spandex and leather.

Shitty parent.

A death should never be a joke.

I like Eddie Vedder better.

I prefer Metal Babes over Grunge Babes.

Ms. Love is very grungy.

People taking drugs and battling stardom should NOT have kids.

10 years is not as long as it used to be.