Three Stereo Keyboards

[Delaware Dave]

Rolls MX28. Perfect for your situation

 

link

[ElmerJFudd]

- just opinion. I'm not a fan of the rolls stuff, the models I've used are noisy (although I'm sure you wouldn't recommend the MX28 if that was your experience). The MX28 requires DC power, doesn't provide multiple outs for local monitoring & send to PA nor balanced outs - so you still need a decently featured DI box in addition if you want control of your own monitor rather than have FOH stick you in the vocal monitors (which I can't deal with, can be an awful situation). YMMV

[CEB]

Yes but that Rolls stuff does what he asks for. Personally I would do things a little differently but it calls for two sets of parallel stereo output for the main bus which the Samson SM10 has or my old Yamaha had ...... But this isn't what he asked for. A lot depends on how well the patches from the 3 boards are volume balanced.

[George88]

KeyLargo is an interesting product. But even it doesn't have real transformer based balanced output. Hence if a real DI is looked for, it wont do.

Please elaborate as to why Key Largo doesn't eliminate the need for a DI. I learned from the Key Largo NAMM 2016 YouTube video that Key Largo has balanced transformer isolated outputs to connect to a PA. Sounds like a DI replacement to me. What am I missing?

 

I second. This looks like a great solution.

[stoken6]

To the OP: definitely submix the keys and DI the submixed output. How you do that...there are options.

 

The Radial Key Largo is tailor-made for this application, and would be perfect. But it's "medium-priced". For a budget application, get a mixer (I like the look of that Nady that Reezekeys posted, btw) and a DI box (Radial are great, Samson are adequate, avoid eBay specials) and you'll be fine.

 

On the "Rolls are noisy" question, didn't someone post recently that it was the supplied PSU making it noisy? And a third-party PSU solved the problem?

 

Cheers, Mike.

[timwat]

I'm starting to really dislike those guys at Radial.

 

Always building stuff I end up having to buy.

[Al Quinn]

I have a Rolls MX28. I bought it with the intent of using it for gigs but found that it slightly degrades the sound of my keyboards and, therefore, only use it at home.

 

I also have a Yamaha MG82CX with sounds great. I've used it on gigs. I was hoping the Rolls MX28 would be a good way to slim down but it wasn't good enough (for me).

 

I've got a Radial Key Largo in my future. When looking at the higher cost of the Key Largo I think it's important to factor in that the Key Largo includes a DI.

 

So, if you can afford $400 Key Largo looks great. To spend less and still have high quality I don't think you'll save much. For example, a Radial Stereo DI ($150) and Yamaha AG06 ($200) will setup you back $350. Of course you can spend less but my recent experience spending less (i.e., Rolls MX28 for $65) didn't turn out well.

[GDP]

Yup, the Key Largo appears to be a winner....but it won't work for me. I don't need more pedals at my feet and a lot of lose cabling.

 

The Ashly 308 mixer is rack mounted with the cable harness all ready to roll out and plug in and sits face up at my side so I can control levels easily even while I play if needed.

[Reezekeys]

So, if you can afford $400 Key Largo looks great. To spend less and still have high quality I don't think you'll save much. For example, a Radial Stereo DI ($150) and Yamaha AG06 ($200) will setup you back $350. Of course you can spend less but my recent experience spending less (i.e., Rolls MX28 for $65) didn't turn out well.

If you look you see some fairly inexpensive ways to do what the OP wants. Besides the $30 mini-mixer I mentioned earlier in this thread, I just found this stereo DI box at a pretty ridiculous price here. Anyone have experience with this brand? The reviews are mixed. I was gonna recommend my Samson S-direct plus stereo active DI as a nice lower-cost alternative as I remember paying around $40 for it but I was surprised to see that the price has doubled since I bought it.

 

Are these pieces built like tanks, with components like Jensen transformers? Of course not, but I submit they may be appropriate for the individual musician that is somewhat careful in the handling of their tools and playing typical gigs in typical settings IOW, not making records in a studio or touring with Béyonce. I've had my Samson DI for years and it's worked just fine any time I needed it. A pro sound company that tosses DIs around like casino chips obviously needs them to be tanks. I'm just saying there are other alternatives worth looking at that don't have to break the bank.

[ElmerJFudd]

I remember Pyle

http://www.pyleaudio.com/AboutPyle

 

But the only area they ever hit the mark on was replacement speakers, especially for car audio, but for guitar amps as well. I've no idea about this DI box.

 

Years ago, before I got my hands on Radial products we used to use Whirlwind for these sorts of tasks. Also inexpensive, http://whirlwindusa.com/catalog/black-boxes-effects-and-dis/direct-boxes/director

Basic DI box is like $67.

[jyrkik]

 

Hi,

 

If Keylargo really has transformer isolated balanced outputs it sounds to be a real replacementf for a DI box. I had apparently missed that info.

 

Jyrki

[fjzingo]

Is the key largo available in the stores yet?

[ElmerJFudd]

I'm only seeing it pre-order at Vintage Audio King. Nothing up at Sweetwater and Kraft yet.

[Al Quinn]

Is the key largo available in the stores yet?

It's for sale at B&H

[ElmerJFudd]

http://cdn.laboitenoiredumusicien.com/pub/produits/produits/radial/SRA-KEY-LARGO-3-B.png

[ShadowMan]

-The MX28 requires DC power, doesn't provide multiple outs for local monitoring & send to PA nor balanced outs - so you still need a decently featured DI box in addition if you want control of your own monitor rather than have FOH stick you in the vocal monitors (which I can't deal with, can be an awful situation). YMMV

 

Actually, with the separate headphone out you can run a second local monitor feed. I have a stereo 1/4-to-two mono 1/4 cables that I feed my dual monitor wedges with, and can ride gain via the phones knob. It works very well. (At times I will just send the main stereo out to a Stereo Radial DI and just use the loop out to a pair of daisy chained mono wedges.)

 

To another poster's comments, the newer power supplies Rolls ships absolutely do suck, as they are very noisy. I have the original wall wart and a similar one from Radio Shack. Much, much quieter.

 

I've used a velcro-ed MX28 on the top left of every keyboard rig I have had for about 15 years -and no complaints. Best $65 pieces of gear I have.

[fjzingo]

Sadly only shipping to US

 

Fred

Is the key largo available in the stores yet?

It's for sale at B&H

[mate stubb]

The B&H Largo page has the look of a placeholder. Guessing it's not quite shipping yet.

[roygBiv]

I've been waiting to buy this since I first heard about it, very intrigued!

 

From looking at this most recent video, I think in the final version they have got rid of the middle switch. Check it out at around the 18 s mark:

 

http://www.soundonsound.com/video/radial-key-largo-aes-2016

 

The two things I aim waiting to hear final answers on:

 

1. Is the USB connection class compliant so you can use it with an iPad? If so, that would be soooooooooooo cool and fab! Imagine if you could go into the MIDI input of this pedal, have the info sent by USB to an iPad running Module or whatever, then the audio routed back to the Key-Largo - that would make it so easy to integrate an iPad or iPhone into your system as a sound module!

 

Unfortunately, if you look at the back in the above video, at the 1:23s mark, its says "requires active drivers" - hopefully that is just for Windows machines.

 

2. Also, int the above view of the back - it says "Volume pedal" - does that mean you can control the overall output volume of the unit with an external volume pedal? That would be so great and handyl!! (I think Busch first noted that in a previous thread - cool observation!)

 

Anyway, whoever gets one please post a review - I've been holding out for this thing for some time, unfortunately its just about $100-150 more than my "impulse buy threshold" to just take a gamble on it.

 

Anyway, Key-Largo could be a game changer, methinks.

 

 

[Tom Williams]

For the price of a Key Largo, you could buy a Behringer XR-12 plus an android tablet to control it. (I just got a lovely XR-18 myself.)

[Mike Kent]

I might consider the Radial Keylargo in the future. I like the idea of the USB connection if I start using Mainstage, something I am considering.

 

I'm very happy with my Yamaha MG06X. I can mix 3 keyboards in stereo or 2 stereo plus 2 mono. Basic reverb or delay for when I take something analog like my Pro-One or Jupiter-8 or if I use a Mic. Balanced XLR outputs for feed to FOH and I have a pair of 1/4" outputs for my own monitors.

 

It's a great mixer with sound quality well beyond the low price.

 

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/images/items/750/MG06X-large.jpg

[Al Quinn]

The MX06X looks like a nice mixer, especially for $125. Do you know if the XLR outs are isolated? Should a DI be used when connecting the MX06X to a PA?

[CEB]

I use a MG06X to mix my IEMs in with Monitor feed.

 

I cheaped out and bought it because it was only $100. If I had it do over again I would have got the AG06. The MG uses a flimsy looking wall wart. I worry the power lead will go bad. The AG uses USB power.

[The Real MC]

The MG uses a flimsy looking wall wart. I worry the power lead will go bad.

 

You were right to worry, as I quickly discovered that the stock wall wart is underpowered. I replaced it with a beefier one.

[mate stubb]

The MX06X looks like a nice mixer, especially for $125. Do you know if the XLR outs are isolated? Should a DI be used when connecting the MX06X to a PA?

 

I use a MX06X, and still use a DI. Unless the box provides a ground lift switch, it's not isolated (the Key Largo DOES provide this)

[mynameisdanno]

I'm a fan of the ART PowerMix III for a cheap-ish but clean and quiet, non-rack form factor, 3 channel stereo line mixer. I have it mounted to a PedalTrain nano, along with a Radial JDI Stereo (the Stereo, not the larger Duplex - it's a newer model that provides two channels in the smaller standard Radial DI form factor by eliminating some of the Duplex's less-often-needed features). There's also a Mini Vent with Ashby's remote footswitch mod, which is connected to the 3rd channel on the mixer. The whole thing goes on the floor next to me.

 

The only bad thing about the ART is problems with internal clipping if any of the channel volumes or output volumes (headphone or main) get above about 12 o'clock. You get a bit more headroom with a beefier power supply (see below for details), but it's not really that big of an issue - just keep everything under that level and you're fine. It's always been plenty of output signal to feed FOH through the JDI, and plenty to drive my QSC K10 through the headphone out (I use an insert cable so I can just feed the right side only to the K10).

 

For those Ventilator users playing along at home - I use a single Zozo 36W 5-15V power supply taped to the underside of the board. Set output voltage for 12v. I use a "Godlyke Power-All C-Y Electric Guitar Cable-Y Splitter Cable" to split the output, and a "Godlyke Power-All C-R/R Electric Guitar Right Angle Reverse Polarity Jumper" to reverse polarity on the output that goes to the ART mixer. A less lazy person than me might have gotten ambitious with some zip ties but I Just gaff-taped the whole mess up under the board and called it a day. Working great so far.

 

Having said all that, I am eager to give Radial some of my hard-earned money for that Key Largo the next time I have an excuse. Looks like a beautiful solution.

 

 

 

http://slorg.org/kc/ptnano1.jpg

 

http://slorg.org/kc/ptnano2.jpg

 

http://slorg.org/kc/ptnano3.jpg

[mate stubb]

http://slorg.org/kc/ptnano3.jpg

 

Nice and minimalist. Get some cable ties!

[ElmerJFudd]

side topic:

 

http://www.presonus.com/products/StudioLive-AR8-USB

$399.95

 

Records 96k to SD as well.

 

http://www-media-presonus.netdna-ssl.com/uploads/products/media/images/StudioLive_AR8_USB-02.png

 

Channels and Buses

8-channel mixer

2 mono and 2 stereo channels, each with:

Level knob

Pan

Mute

PFL solo

1 stereo Super Channel (Ch. 7/8)

1 monitor bus with PFL solo

1 stereo effects bus

1 stereo effects return with:

Level knob

Dedicated monitor sends

Effects bypass footswitch jack

 

Inputs and Outputs

2 instrument inputs

8 balanced line inputs

4 balanced mic inputs with:

Class A microphone preamp

Global 48V phantom power

Stereo Super Channel with:

Stereo RCA inputs

1/8-inch stereo input

Switchable SD/USB stereo playback

Bluetooth 4.1 input

L/R XLR main outputs

1 Balanced TRS monitor output

1 Balanced TRS effects output

L/R Control Room outputs with level control

Headphone output with level control

 

Signal Processing

Highpass filter on every channel

3-band semi-parametric EQ (Channels 1-6)

Stereo effects processor with 16 presets

 

Recording Options

8x4 24-bit/96 kHz, USB 2.0 audio recording interface

Record every channel plus the main mix

2x2 SD recorder

Record main mix

Supports SD and SDHD formats up to 32 GB

 

Integrated Software

Capture recording software

Studio One ® 3 Artist recording and production software (DAW)

 

Power

Internal power supply

Standard IEC power connector

 

Physical

Sturdy metal construction

Rackmount kit optional

[MorayM]

I'm late to the party but ou can get an 8-channel DI for a good deal less that $400.

 

I'm planning on pairing mine with an RX1202, giving me a frankly ludicrous level of routing flexibility in a 3U rack case. I can send 8 channels to the PA and mix independently for my ears, or downmix to stereo for smaller venues and even patch in returns from FoH if I've done my channel counts right. The big advantage is that the 1202 has inserts on the 8 mono channels which opens up a whole world of possibilities.

[synthizen2]

I never want to put my keyboard submix in the hands of someone else.

 

If I trust the person running sound, I prefer to send separate lines to FOH for each keyboard in my 2-board rig. Because the balance that I hear coming out of my monitor may not be the same as the balance being heard by the audience. Sometimes my monitor makes the organ sound louder than the piano... while the FOH sound balance is perfectly OK.

 

I use a Behringer powered monitor with separate inputs for each keyboard... so I can create my own monitor balance while the FOH can have 2 separate sliders to balance between the 2 boards, independent of what I'm doing on the monitor controls.