Rhodes amplification options

[JWhllr]

Hey guys,

 

So I'm about to receive a tasty Rhodes (1977 Stage 73 MkI) and I'm thinking about amplification. Tossing up a few options. At the moment, I'll run it through a little fender rumble bass combo until I find something better. Options I'm looking at:

 

A) Classic Fender Twin if I can find one. Purchase would be a while off. Just bought a Kronos and a Rhodes. Wallet needs some tine to recover...

 

B) Vintage JC120. Same circumstances as above.

 

C) A 2x12 bass cab (probably something like a GK CX212) paired with my Little Mark Blackline 250 head.

 

D) Rack mounted tube preamp into my monitor wedge (likely presonus studio channel).

 

E) smaller amp like a new JC40, Blues Junior etc

 

Options C/D/E I could move on soon. Uses for home use and recording, perhaps some occasional gigs that are worth the schlep for authenticity and vibe.

 

I like a real warm and full Rhodes tone and will be running some pedals.

 

Thoughts? Suggestions? Advice?

 

Cheers!

James

[Phil Aiken]

A good Twin with full range speakers is, in my opinion, your best bet, as you seem to know. But that said - there are cheaper options that will serve you well, and will hold their value when you are ready to resell. Also - one slightly cheaper option that might be better.

 

1. A less desirable Twin for guitarists, but fantastic for your needs are the late '70s, so called Ultralinear series. These have higher wattage, and the reason guitarists don't seem to love them is they do not break up as readily. But they still get a nice tasty crunch on Rhodes, especially if you boost the signal a bit and hit it slightly hot. Pedal steel players love these. I love these. You can find them much cheaper than early Silverface or Blackface Twins. They might just say 1978 or 1979 Silverface in the ad.

2. Music Man 2x12 amps can be had for much cheaper than a Twin and were attempts to emulate Twins. Probably about half the price on the used market.

3. If for recording - there are any number of low wattage amps that will suit your needs. Sadly, real Fender Princetons have recently exceeded Twins in price, but if you don't need a ton of low end, these are awesome for recording. But there are low wattage Gibsons and other brands to be found. You don't need to be loud to record, and there is no need to crank to full guitar distortion levels.

4. You could use an amp emulator, or tube pre and powered speaker as you suggest. Less noticeable on Rhodes than guitar, especially when used for subtle amp tone, and will give you a variety of tones. The digital option here all not hold its value for resale as well.

[Brad Kaenel]

Wallet needs some tine to recover...

 

Pun intended.

 

Beethree gave you the gospel on classic Rhodes amps. Fender is a guitar company; the Rhodes was built to sound good through Fender guitar amps. The Fender Bassmaster amps are acceptable options, too.

[BEMcCut]

Back in the day I used a Kasino U200 with a 2x15 cabinet. I am sure you could find something better now days.

 

[mate stubb]

Get you some rolled and tucked naugahyde. It will sound like crap and be ridiculously heavy, but will make you look suitably vintage.

 

 

http://www.gantamps.com/images/New%20Kus.jpg

[Gary75]

If your wallet is recovering why don't you try running it into the Kronos and using the amp sim/eq/fx in there for a while?

 

I run mine through a preamp/eq (albeit Peterson retrofit) into an fx loop which is also located on the rail, into a Buddha Chakra compressor/Small Stone and then the outs into a reverb pedal.

 

Of course if your wanting guitar amp tones then that won't be for you.

 

Also I bought a Mojo Mojo Overdrive pedal and it sounds really nice like a tube amp but is inexpensive. Gets good reviews.

[linwood]

Warm and full....run stereo w/ 15's and horns and a lot of power. A twin won't do it. That's old school. I remember one set up I had in the 70's for my 88 suitcase was a pair of cerwin-vegas with 18's, horn, and tweeters with a P2200 and a Tapco graphic eq. Sounded nice 'n warm ping pongin' side to side.

[Baldwin Funster]

Fender Twin with the JBLs. Heavy and will probably be a grand or more but perfect for a Rhodes. Youll get tired of the other stuff after awhile but the twin will always be good for Rhodes, Wurli, and Organ especially with a Vent. Dont waste money on anything else. Yeah it wont do the low notes with 88 keys but how many old EPs had 88 keys?

[linwood]

I always like 15's for rhodes ( and organ), even with a 73. I gigged an 88 suitcase for a decade or more and then got a dyno my stage and used that for a few years. I owned a pre-cbs twin with jbls at that time, too. I still have a wurlie 200, rhodes, and a re-issue twin now. It's sitting just to my left and I use it for guitar. Different strokes.

[Doerfler]

skip option B

[Ulf]

Congratulations to your Rhodes - I still miss the MkII I sold (cheap!) many years ago. But you already know the answer; you need a Twin.

I used an old Roland Jazz Chorus, which was not bad but _not_ as good as a Fender Twin.

[ITGITC]

 

I used a Fender Bandmaster Reverb head.

 

When I bought the RMI Electra-Piano, I also purchased their amp. The cabinet had two 15" JBL woofers and two Allen organ speakers for mids/highs. It was a nice combination, although it looked a bit funny since the amp was wider than the cabinet.

 

 

[linwood]

Us old guys that use to have to carry gear..man, I had to carry a 145 and a 147 and two of those yamaha cabs with 15's and horn just for the organ and rhodes. To think I could have just used a twin. lol Sure can't do that anymore. Out here they'd be telling you to turn the twin down, not to mention no one wants to move that stuff. We had to do it until the dx7 hit. A lot of the rooms here you might have to play through something like a wedge with a 12" in it. That twin I have in here, I can't turn it up past 3 to record guitar. That thing is loud.

[Doerfler]

That twin I have in here, I can't turn it up past 3 to record guitar. That thing is loud.

Yes it is, Linwood.

[linwood]

I'd been recording the guitar direct for the last few years using a couple different pedal boards into a pair of 1272's and had the twin sitting out in the garage this whole time. I brought it in a few weeks ago and man, does it sound good. A 57 in front of it and bingo.

[Doerfler]

had the twin sitting out in the garage this whole time. I brought it in a few weeks ago and man, does it sound good. A 57 in front of it and bingo.

Bingo for sure.

[cedar]

I remember being advised in the late 1970s that a good option was to use a bass amp. I don't know if that was good advice at the time (or now), but I went with it back then.

[CEB]

This is mine. It actually looks nicer now. It cleaned up decently after I took it out of storage. I had it rebuilt last year. This is a picture I took when I dropped it off with my amp guy. Storage unit was damp and moisture had got to the amp. I was sick when I took it out of storage and saw what it looked like. But it cleaned up pretty good..... $600 later. Part of that was new speaker, the stock Jensens were already long gone when I got the amp in 80s. But the rebuild was cheaper than a new $2000 Mesa Lonestar Twin. I was looking at the Lonestar and my amp guy was like .... "Why don't you have me rebuild your old 65 Twin" I forgot all about the old amp. It sounds killer now. I couldn't believe my amp guy remembered I had it. He even remembered it was a May 1965 Twin. He loves amps.

 

When I started playing Boogie in 1991 I put the Twin away. By 91 the Twin still sounded great on 8.... but I had to run it on 8. After the rebuild there is no way in heck I can run it on 8. It needed work when I retired it. I had a Blackface Super Reverb I liked better but a guy kept offering me stupid money for it and one day I relented.

 

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y70/CEB2/Twin1_zps9ba922ef.jpg

[The Real MC]

Having grown up with a guitar playing brother, I look at what guitar players are using. Now I am using a Tubeworks BlueTube preamp (rackmount, not the floor pedal) with a Tubeworks MosValve power amp.

 

I like tube amps with Rhodes pianos, they impart a color that you can't get from EQ. The BlueTube is a tube preamp that was originally designed for bass guitar so it overdrives a lot more mildly than guitar preamps. This happens to work nicely with Rhodes. I put any stereo processing on it then push the stereo signal with the MosValve amp. The MosValve is 80w per side which has plenty of clean power. It is actually designed to emulate the sound of a vacuum tube power amp, again a guitar device that happens to work well with Rhodes.

 

From there, choice of speaker colors the sound greatly. And again, I look at what guitar players use. My favorite is the Celestion alnico "blue" speaker but they are only 15w per speaker and double the price of a ceramic speaker. I tried to fit a quartet of 15 inch Celestions in the suitcase cabinet (two in front, two in back) but there isn't room so I settled for a quartet of Celestion 75w speakers. I may build satellite cabinets in the future to house the 15 inch speakers. Don't ever use the Celestion 70w speakers, they don't sound good on ANYTHING.

[Al Coda]

I always like 15's for rhodes ( and organ), even with a 73. I gigged an 88 suitcase for a decade or more and then got a dyno my stage and used that for a few years. I owned a pre-cbs twin with jbls at that time, too. I still have a wurlie 200, rhodes, and a re-issue twin now. It's sitting just to my left and I use it for guitar. Different strokes.

 

I waded thru lots of amplification for the (combo-)organ, the Rhodes & Clav, string ensembles and vintage synths.

Sound City (pre Hiwatt) and Fender Dual Showman Reverb Amp heads, a large Dynacord cab w/ 18" Goodmans speaker, Marshall and Ampeg 4x12 cabs, smaller cream tolex pre CBS Fender 2x10" Jensen Alnico cabs, Princeton amp (in the studio),- and in the end I ditched ´em all and then early 80s, I bought 2 EV S15/3 cabs, Tapco/EV powered mixer and a TC Electronics 1140 parametric EQ/preamp,- the EQ/preamp just only for the Rhodes.

I also started using a rack w/ FX and never looked back.

The Rhodes sound was definitely best w/ those EV 3-way cabs, solid state powered and w/ the TC EQ/Preamp.

The power amps were "only" 100W RMS and that was what the cabs handled too,- but it was full, loud and clear, no distortion,- and it handled a multi keyboard rig much better than any guitar amplification.

I also ditched all the stomp boxes I used before, spring reverb too.

The only vintage analog FX I still own and use are rackmount chorus/flanger, 6-tap stereo chorus and a tube driver.

DBX compressors and USAudio/ValleyPeople gates/expanders too.

 

I sold the EV S-15/3 cabs when I got endorsed otherwise for touring mid 80s but I really miss ´em.

The EVM 15L speaker, the midrange speaker and the horn tweeter combo sounded soooo good !

 

A.C.

 

 

[linwood]

I used those EV cabs, too. Those were nice because they sounded great and they packed up nice 'n neat in the van. I used them with a phase linear 400. I was playing caesars at the time and in the showroom they were replacing the power amps and one of the sound techs gave me 2 of them. That amp sounded great.

[timwat]

For me a cheaper alternative to the Twin Reverb was a Fender Bassman (head and cab) I picked it up for a song, and it really sang.

 

Previous owner had worked on it. Only problem was an unresolved grounding issue - you'd get straight 120v if you touched the metal strips on the top of the head while it was on. Big fun that was!

 

Nevertheless, it sounded glorious.

[MAJUSCULE]

A 1977 Stage Mk I 73, hmm? Amplification on a budget, hmm? Oh, and pedals may be involved, hmm?

 

http://cdn.emgn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/celeb-cameos-emgn-10.gif

 

(I have a 1976 Stage Mk I 73 that I've both gigged and recorded, often with pedals. Oh, and I'm in the fifth-year of my B.Mus, working primarily as a freelance musician, so I'm not about to be dropping a couple grand on a vintage Twin or a new boutique tube amp.)

 

I play through my Hot Rod Deluxe 95% of the time. I got it for $400 CDN from a friend about six years ago, and it's been great. The light has never worked and the input is a little dirty, but it works great, is plenty loud, and has a fuller range than many PA speakers with the same size cone. (Subjective anecdotal evidence, of course.) It sounds great with my pedals. I've actually had it longer than the Rhodes. I originally bought it to liven up the Electro Rhodes.

 

Sure, not as loud or as full as a Twin, but it gets you close.

 

So yeah, you can get one of those new for under 1K, I think. Used, probably under $500. Sounds pretty good to my ears.

 

Also, I agree with Dave about option B.

[MikeT156]

Rhodes tested their pianos before they left the factory with a Fender Twin Reverb.

 

The other thing to consider is how big are the rooms you will be playing and if you are in a band with the LOUD (read: DEAF) guitar player.

 

If you are going to be playing in medium to large Clubs that are noisy and you are in a LOUD band you will need a PA cabinet with at least one horn and LOTS of watts of power. If the guitar player is extremely loud, turn your speaker cabinet up and point it right at him! Wear hearing protection.

 

Small room, no band? Twin Reverb will work fine.

 

 

Mike T.

[Hoochie]

For me a cheaper alternative to the Twin Reverb was a Fender Bassman (head and cab) I picked it up for a song, and it really sang.

 

Previous owner had worked on it. Only problem was an unresolved grounding issue - you'd get straight 120v if you touched the metal strips on the top of the head while it was on. Big fun that was!

 

Nevertheless, it sounded glorious.

 

Wow Tim,

 

That really takes me back. I had a suitcase but let the magic

smoke out twice trying to keep up with the band.

This was in the 70's so everything was loud.

 

Out pops not one, but two fender Bassmans to save the day.

They belonged to one of the dads.

Tilt back legs. The head hooks in to the bottom with those knurled things.

One was an older blond in perfect order.

The other was a slightly newer black.

 

In stereo with the tremolo. Good Lordy was that something.

I put a Mutron phaser on one side and had a moment of grace.

That blond Bassman is probably worth a fortune now.

 

 

John

[sagetunes]

I like the Roland Jazz chorus, both the JC120 and the JC90.

In fact I prefer the JC90---it's two tens instead of two twelves. It's punchier. The OP mentioned that he uses pedals, so a loud clean combo might do the trick.

[hazerkeys]

Fender Twin Reverb was what I used on mine some years ago - was great

[Aussie_Chicago]

I was using a reissue 65 blackface twin reverb with my 72' stage at gigs , plenty loud enough although it had to be miked for bigger gigs. Sounds great but lugging a Rhodes and a twin got old quick. I now use a rackmount speakeasy stereo pre , and a joe meek compressor , into a supatrem stereo tremolo , magic !! These days I'm using my sv1 mostly.

[zxcvbnm098]

In the mid-70's Peavey made an amp they called "The Classic" that was a tube 50 watt 2-12" Twin clone that sounded great with Rhodes. I never had one myself but I remember seeing a guy playing one at a dance I went to back in the day and being very impressed. They changed the model around 1980 to something different, but those 70's versions can be had for pretty cheap.....