Sam Mullins Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I bought a Kronos 61 recently and of course have been forewarned about using a UPS for live shows in case of power glitches (because of the Kronos boot time of two minutes.) I already use a SurgeX 1810 for surge protection and power conditioning on all my equipment. However, that doesn't really solve the problem of a complete brief power outage. So I'm thinking about just buying a cheap UPS and using it in serial with the SurgeX. The question is what order should I put them in: Should I: a) Insert the UPS between the power outlet and the Surge X. All my equipment would still be attached to the SurgeX. b) Insert the UPS between the SurgeX and the Kronos (and potentially the other equipment). My guess is that a) is more desirable because you want to keep the power conditioning as close to equipment as possible. Presumably if I'm buying a cheap UPS, it might have it's own problems and it would be good to buffer those with the SurgeX. But perhaps there are other issues I'm not considering. Any opinions are welcome. Yamaha CK88, Arturia Keylab 61 MkII, Moog Sub 37, Yamaha U1 Upright, Casio CT-S500, Mac Logic/Mainstage, iPad Camelot, Spacestation V.3, QSC K10.2, JBL EON One Compact www.stickmanor.com There's a thin white line between fear and fury - Stickman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losendoskeys Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Buy a good UPS which should have power conditioning built in - cheap means you get what you pay for Yamaha CP70B;Roland XP30/AXSynth/Fantom/FA76/XR;Hammond XK3C SK2; Korg Kronos 73;ProSoloist Rack+; ARP ProSoloist; Mellotron M4000D; GEM Promega2; Hohner Pianet N, Roland V-Grand,Voyager XL, RMI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 2 things never to go cheap on: Power Cases David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Mullins Posted June 30, 2016 Author Share Posted June 30, 2016 Buy a good UPS which should have power conditioning built in - cheap means you get what you pay for Thanks for the reply. I guess I should have been clearer on my reason for saying a cheap UPS. I already paid $400 for a high-end power conditioner (SurgeX 1810) and don't really want to spend that kind of money twice. So I'm just looking to buy a couple minutes of power continuity to avoid the Kronos reboot time. If the power is out for any longer, then the whole gig is at a standstill anyway (other people having equipment that isn't on UPS.) I'm not too stringent on "cheap" ...if someone is suggesting I spend $100 instead of $50, that's fine. But I don't want to spend another $400 to duplicate functionality I already have. Yamaha CK88, Arturia Keylab 61 MkII, Moog Sub 37, Yamaha U1 Upright, Casio CT-S500, Mac Logic/Mainstage, iPad Camelot, Spacestation V.3, QSC K10.2, JBL EON One Compact www.stickmanor.com There's a thin white line between fear and fury - Stickman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesG Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 If I was you, I would probably buy a $50 APC UPS and put it between the wall and the power conditioner. The UPS will be a total passthrough except when the power is out anyhow. I would expect the Back UPS ES 350 to run a Kronos6 for 15 or 20 minutes. Wes Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3 Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9 Roland: VR-09, RD-800 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Mullins Posted June 30, 2016 Author Share Posted June 30, 2016 Thanks Wes. Kind of what I was thinking. Yamaha CK88, Arturia Keylab 61 MkII, Moog Sub 37, Yamaha U1 Upright, Casio CT-S500, Mac Logic/Mainstage, iPad Camelot, Spacestation V.3, QSC K10.2, JBL EON One Compact www.stickmanor.com There's a thin white line between fear and fury - Stickman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Sam, I just got a Tripplite 1u rack mount UPS/Power conditioner. Among other things it Maintains regulated 120V nominal output without using battery power during brownouts as low as 90V. During festival season, we can get some funky power that messes with my boards, making me not happy. I spent about $150 on it. Good insurance for surges and brownouts, plus it maintains 120V, as I quoted above. David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canoehead Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Although I do not fully understand the technical reasons, I do believe that the UPS should be a true sine wave UPS and not simulated sine wave. Maybe check with Korg USA to see what they say. I erred on the side of caution and got a true sine wave UPS from Cyberpower. Cheers, Gord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEB Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I'm not using true sine power. I use a TrippLite and it has worked great for about a year. Works fine for servers and I figured the Kronos is a Linux box. Not sure why it is called Lite. The thing weighs a ton. "It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne "A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!! So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoodyBluesKeys Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Depends on just what you are running with the Power Conditioner. I would expect it to be able to sustain a higher load than a small UPS. (Like being able to run not only the Kronos but a power amp and other devices). If this is so, definitely run the Conditioner first, then the UPS, with the UPS only feeding stuff within its rating. APC in my opinion is the top UPS (at least among consumer units). I have over a dozen APC units, most running computers, although one runs the big HDTV and cable box (which takes 6 min to reboot). For my shop keyboards, I'm using one with 650 va output. For travel, I picked up a small one that is only about 300va (220 watts or so), it is enough to run both keyboards in the event that I carry both. Any of the smaller APC units should be available from office supply places as well as computer places, and be $100 or less. "Lite" Most UPS contain, among other things, a transformer with iron core, and one or more SLA batteries, with lead. Why it is not light. Howard Grand|Hamm SK1-73|Kurz PC2|PC2X|PC3|PC3X|PC361; QSC K10's HP DAW|Epi Les Paul & LP 5-str bass|iPad mini2 "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesG Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I'm big APC fan, but we have some CyberPower stuff and TrippLite stuff at work also. TrippLite is the parent brand of IsoBar if you remember those. Wes Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3 Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9 Roland: VR-09, RD-800 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthaholic Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I bought a Kronos 61 recently and of course have been forewarned about using a UPS for live shows in case of power glitches (because of the Kronos boot time of two minutes.) I already use a SurgeX 1810 for surge protection and power conditioning on all my equipment. However, that doesn't really solve the problem of a complete brief power outage. So I'm thinking about just buying a cheap UPS and using it in serial with the SurgeX. The question is what order should I put them in: Should I: a) Insert the UPS between the power outlet and the Surge X. All my equipment would still be attached to the SurgeX. b) Insert the UPS between the SurgeX and the Kronos (and potentially the other equipment). My guess is that a) is more desirable because you want to keep the power conditioning as close to equipment as possible. Presumably if I'm buying a cheap UPS, it might have it's own problems and it would be good to buffer those with the SurgeX. But perhaps there are other issues I'm not considering. Any opinions are welcome. You may want to check out this thread: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2696998/Tripp_Lite_LC1200_UPS_is_a_no_#Post2696998 The fact there's a Highway To Hell and only a Stairway To Heaven says a lot about anticipated traffic numbers People only say "It's a free country" when they're doing something shitty-Demetri Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldwin Funster Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 If the power is out for you, it is out for the PA too. Your not going to play a song on UPS power. So if you just want it so your board doesn't reboot just put the board and other boot ables on it. The battery will last longer if needed for some reason. FunMachine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Mullins Posted June 30, 2016 Author Share Posted June 30, 2016 Thanks everyone. After reading Synthaholic's link..I'm thinking the best approach is if we have a brief power outage, we will just play a piano only song using the Nord Stage while the Kronos reboots Yamaha CK88, Arturia Keylab 61 MkII, Moog Sub 37, Yamaha U1 Upright, Casio CT-S500, Mac Logic/Mainstage, iPad Camelot, Spacestation V.3, QSC K10.2, JBL EON One Compact www.stickmanor.com There's a thin white line between fear and fury - Stickman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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