Poll: New D or Vintage D

[Bill H.]

Although it's impossible to know for sure, let's assume that Moog has got this right - and at least subjectively these new Minimoogs sound just like the rev2 sounded when new. If you could only own one Minimoog, which would you want?

 

I know where I am with this - new all the way. But am I in the minority thinking like this? I'm curious what you guys have to say.

[CEB]

The additional LFO functionality.

[burningbusch]

Look, here's a mint Minimoog on Reverb. It's going for $7,349, down from $12,500. I really doubt you're going to find one in nicer shape so given that, and assuming it's 100% functional, that price doesn't seem out of line at all to me. I'd like to see more pictures out of the box to see all sides plus more info from the tech who went through it. But it's beauty and rare to find one that hasn't been gigged to death (this one supposedly has 20 hours of use).

 

https://reverb.com/item/1893804-moog-model-d-1978-clean-bill-of-health-mint

 

If I had my original Mini from 1972 I probably wouldn't be that interested in the new one, but I don't so I am.

 

Busch.

[Muad’Dib]

Well, since I can not afford either one. I'm Out!

[RABid]

With the vintage, something as simple as warn contacts and a warped contact bar can be a major pain in the butt. Give me new and reliable.

[brenner13]

New...with a warranty.

[Tonysounds]

I'll take whatever you're giving.

[HammondDave]

I owned and gigged with one for many years. If I had my choice of the same one I gigged with and the new one, I would choose the new one. No second thoughts at all... Why?

 

Additional LFO... Frees up the thrid oscillator. A whole new instrument.

 

Better Keyboard. have you seen a typical classic Mini Moog keyboard? Looks worse than a Britt's teeth! (no offense to my British friends)

 

Hopefully, more stable oscillators

 

Like mentioned above, a new warranty

 

[Doerfler]

I voted new. Looks like that is the trend so far.

[HammondDave]

By the way... My original Moog had non-ribbed pitch/bend wheels... was that a feature of the earlier ones?

[jimkost2002]

New

[timwat]

Yes and yes, please.

 

Otherwise, how will I be able to fairly compare them?

 

And yes, I voted already.

[Gary75]

I hope Moog see this and maybe think about some kind of lengthy production run, and by lengthy production run I mean long enough for me to find some spare cash!

[Aidan]

I'll stick with my Sub 37. a) because I really can't justify/afford a new D and b) preset memories.

[Markyboard]

I voted for the new Moog-Suzuki model D ( hi Dave ). Since I already have the vintage one and it's been near trouble free it's a no decision. But if someone were offering a trade with who knows how much additional money, then maybe.

[burningbusch]

By the way... My original Moog had non-ribbed pitch/bend wheels... was that a feature of the earlier ones?

 

They are in order, I believe

 

FIRST (My first Minimoog looked exactly like this one)

http://www.purgatorycreek.com/DL2/minimoog1.png

 

SECOND

http://www.purgatorycreek.com/DL2/minimoog2.png

 

LAST

http://www.purgatorycreek.com/DL2/minimoog3.png

 

Busch.

[Al Coda]

I own a vintage Minimoog D, so I don´t need the new one urgently.

My old one plays fine even it will need some service in future,- and it´s keyboard doesn´t look like the "typical vintage Minimoog D keyboard" mentioned above by Hammond Dave.

 

Well, I could sell it and buy a new one,- but before I wanna hear and play that thing.

 

Reliable components is a relative term.

What´s reliable today might fail in 5-10 years,- much earlier than the old components did and do.

I had almost no repairs on my Minimoog D within 4 decades.

There was a blown uA726 in the 80s and 2 month ago a DC fuse holder replacement.

All the other were modifications, additional Pitch-CV (w/ CV offset) and +5V Gate I/Os, dedicated modulation CV-In and Pitchbend-Wheel center "dead zone".

It´s now years ago I did the last calibration and it stays well in tune once warmed up.

 

According to the new Minimmog D, architecture wise, I´m a bit irritated though ...

 

Now, we´re able to use the filter envelope as a modifier in the OSC section,- but why in the world does it miss hard sync then.

Also, there´s the additional LFO w/ speed control in the left hand controller section,- well ...

Why not Pulse Width modulation on at least ONE OSC and a general "LFO2 modulation amount control", active only, when OSC #3 isn´t set to "Lo" Freq position ?

 

It´s true, when using all 3 OSCs for audio, that´s a FAT sound and the LFO2 amount is been controlled by the mod wheel,- but many Minimoog D patches I play w/ just only 1 OSC and most I play w/ 2 OSCs in use,- so independent modulation,- p.ex OSC #3 w/ constant slow sweep on p.ex. VCF cutoff or PWM with individual amount,- and LFO2 for vibrato being controlled by mod-wheel would make it ice on the cake for me.

 

Even w/ the features above realized in the new Minimoog D, the Voyager keeps a different beast,- at least for the crowd needing preset memory.

 

The new velocity sensitive keyboard w/ AT is nice for sure, but the synth as it is now, isn´t enough "new synth" for me to pull the trigger for that price because I´m able to play my vintage Minimoog D very dynamic using 2 CV-pedals on VCF and VCA.

I´d also miss the "glide" momentary ft-switch connector on the new one.

 

Old Minis are easy to repair, not many rare parts and we all have a service manual.

 

When my old one would be a hopeless case,- I´d buy the new one in a heartbeat though.

 

A.C.

[Doc Tonewheel]

Non ribbed wheel were the earlier ones. Mine is a later version, and the oscillators are very stable. RetroLinear redid the bushings, and contacts, and the keyboard is as straight as an arrow. I just love mine! Won't pass judgement until I hear the new one.

[joegerardi]

By the way... My original Moog had non-ribbed pitch/bend wheels... was that a feature of the earlier ones?

 

Where have you been?

 

They were "ribbed for her pleasure."

 

You misogynist you!

 

 

New one any day. Healthy components, keys not pounded and weakened, pots firm and responsive, springs all strong. If you gig with it, you need only 1, not 1 and a spare in case it gets blowed up one night.

 

..Joe

[MalH]

Um...I thought this thread was about Steinways.

[Synthoid]

Look, here's a mint Minimoog on Reverb. It's going for $7,349, down from $12,500.

 

Let's jump right on it.

[Markyboard]

What, you just saved yourself over 5K, enough to buy a new Mini as well with plenty o' spare change. I call that a bargain

[The Real MC]

By the way... My original Moog had non-ribbed pitch/bend wheels... was that a feature of the earlier ones?

 

Yes

[Synthoid]

What, you just saved yourself over 5K, enough to buy a new Mini as well with plenty o' spare change. I call that a bargain

 

Yeah, I'll get a cup of coffee and celebrate.

[The Real MC]

I own a vintage Minimoog D, so I don´t need the new one urgently.

 

Same here. Own a Voyager too.

 

Reliable components is a relative term.

What´s reliable today might fail in 5-10 years,- much earlier than the old components did and do.

 

I'm an EE and I approve of this post

 

Why not Pulse Width modulation on at least ONE OSC

 

The Crowminius has it. Two independent LFOs reserved for PWM.

 

but why in the world does it miss hard sync then.

 

The Crowminius doesn't has it. Bummer.

 

Old Minis are easy to repair, not many rare parts and we all have a service manual.

 

One reason why their value is so high. They are easy to keep running. Try that on any non-analog synth made after 1985.

 

When my old one would be a hopeless case,- I´d buy the new one in a heartbeat though.

 

We're living in a great age today.

[Threadslayer]

 

Why not Pulse Width modulation on at least ONE OSC

 

The Crowminius has it. Two independent LFOs reserved for PWM.

 

Yeah, but are they gonna make it? Still only halfway to their funding goal with 8 days left...

[GovernorSilver]

Wow, it's a blowout win for New so far, 43-5!

[Al Coda]

Wow, it's a blowout win for New so far, 43-5!

 

I guess the 43 don´t own a vintage Minimoog D and/or don´t have the connection, knowledge/skills to get it repaired/serviced for cheap.

The other 5 have EVERYTHING mentioned above.

 

The 43 probably don´t care about a 2nd LFO which lacks independent depth control or simply don´t know what it´s good for and/or think THE Minimoog sound is 3 OSCs on sawtooth, same footage, all detuned against each other, VCF cutoff @12:00h to make it MOST FAT.

 

In fact and when it comes to Minimoog sound examples on youtube, I always hear relatively bright and detuned sounds, but my favourite sounds are more dull, flutey or reedy with almost no attack or release time, sustain on about "6" to make the key contact click audible and usage of very narrow detuning of two OSCs, or using just only ONE OSC.

The sounds you´re able to PLAY almost any musical phrasing and motif imaginable,- WHEN you have a good playing technique.

Reminder: Minimoog D is single-trigger mode always!

 

I hope we can do this w/ the new Minimoog D for about 40 years+ too and for the money.

 

A.C.

 

 

 

 

 

[Al Coda]

Same here. Own a Voyager too.

 

Agree to most and ...

 

IMO, the Voyager was and IS the new Minimoog already.

It sounds somewhat different to the basic Minimoog D tone,- but who cares ?

 

I´m a Minimoog D owner, in fact I owned 3 in the past ...

All three sounded slightly different.

 

I don´t own a Voyager, didn´t need it urgently like it actually is w/ the new Minimoog D.

But I think, WHEN I owned a Voyager,- it won´t held me back from playing anything I play on my vintage Minimoog D,- as long as any, for me up to know unexperienced, keyboard action and LH controller unit prevents that.

The Voyager sounds great as the Minimoog D did in the past, but slightly different,- but I doubt that´s audible at all in any band context or playback.

 

All the nitpick comes from people doing side-by-side audio comparisons on youtube.

I hate youtube for this.

It´s a podium for people not really being connected to music, instead for sound only, while believing that´s music.

Soundcloud and others too ...

 

I listen to "beats" and "tracks".

What the hell is that ?

Songs ?

No !

It´s less than we called a "playback" in the past,- not worth a copyright.

 

No melody/theme, bad timing, no skills, cannot read music and so on,- but nitpick about sound of gear even they will never have the chance to play in bands where exactly those skills are the BASICS.

 

SEQUENCER "musicians", not being able to put out any pro-music w/o a machine organizing and correcting their "input".

 

MOOG and most other companies now rely on exactly THOSE customers.

We´re living in the age of programmers, not musicians.

Pro-programmers, ALL mastering the software they bought and use to replace playing skills, NEED differentiation from other programmers by SOUND ...

 

The companies have to survive ...

 

We, being used to differentiation by musical skills,- need to survive too !

So, make your wise decisions.

 

The new MOOG Minimoog D is more or less a marketing trick as is the KARP Odyssey as well as the DSI Sequential Prophet-6 and DSI OB-6.

 

It´s the "new wave" of analog synths and the companies try out how much customers are willing to pay for and how much.

 

Doesn´t mean the instruments doesn´t sound or work good, but I recognize the companies do the same they did in the past,- give you p.ex. a Oberheim w/ 6 voices 1st before deciding for 8 voices and offer just only one LFO before offering a 2nd one and 8 voices w/ the upcoming model.

MOOG does the same, offering some CV-outs (extremely cheapo mod b.t.w.) and a 2nd LFO and ENV-1 OSC #? modulation, then leaves potential buyers in the dust w/ the routing expected to get best results in the sense "buy a Voyager if you want more".

Well, for the money, we already CAN buy a Voyager.

 

They simply rely on the "lack of knowledge" youngsters even the developers come from our era.

 

The whole game I knew from the beginning of the appearence of synths starts all new.

 

It also did the same way when CDs were the king of the hill and record companies were able to sell their, formerly vinyl, catalog all new,- then the DVD came ...

Now vinyl is back and hip again.

I also recognized compact cassettes are hip again at youngsters ...

 

New innovations ? Not really !

New market ? YES !

 

A.C.

[Al Coda]

 

The Crowminius doesn't has it. Bummer.

 

Well, it isn´t urgently necessary ...

 

As an owner of a vintage one, I´m able to play w/ it´s features as they are.

It´s hard to explain how much money I made w/ the old US analogues in the past and while my main job was studio session artist.

 

The combo of MOOG Minimoog D, Prophet-5, OB-8, DX-7 and MOOG Taurus-I in addition to my Fender Rhodes Mk-1 and Clavinet-D6 was a money machine late 70s ´til end of 80s.

Some gear came in addition during that time,- TX-816 and MKS-20 p.ex..

OB-8 got replaced by OB Xpander in 1987 or 88 IIRC.

 

BUT,- WHEN you get any ENV generator modulating any OSC,- getting OSC-sync is quite logical to me, even it makes sense modulating the OSC(s) w/ an ENV for some patches w/o having sync in mind.

 

I agree on "bummer" Crowminus lacks it.

 

Well, that makes sure the MOOG Minimoog Voyager IS the way to go when improvement over a standard Minimoog D is the target.

 

A.C.