Best 88 key action with aftertouch and wheels.

[Bachus]

Which keyboards have the best 88 key action, with aftertouch and wheels (and preferably a ribbon, but thats not a must). I am not gigging with the board, but it needs to be movable inside my room. Half pedal support is also a pre.

 

I am going to use it in combination with Nektar panorama P1 and ableton push to controll my software set (DAW)

 

I will be mostly playing piano/epiano, but the keybed also needs to be fit to play synth and organ.

[Bobadohshe]

Which keyboards have the best 88 key action.............I will be mostly playing piano/epiano, but the keybed also needs to be fit to play synth and organ.

 

To many, these 2 qualifications are mutually exclusive. Many would define the best 88 key action as one that feels the most natural for piano. This would be quite unnatural for synth and organ though.

 

What's more important to you, that it feels great for piano/epiano, or that it feels okay for everything?

 

If it's the latter, then I daresay this is something you'll have to figure out for yourself by trying many of them.

[Al Coda]

Some companies investigated and it seems, Fatar TP40/L is the one doing the balancing act between piano and synth action w/ MIDI channel AT best.

You´ll find Fatar TP40/L in Kurzweil PC3K8 and the (Viscount) Physis Piano K4 masterkeyboard controller,- both w/ Aftertouch & wheels.

Kurzweil offers a ribbon as an option.

 

A.C.

[Bachus]

Which keyboards have the best 88 key action.............I will be mostly playing piano/epiano, but the keybed also needs to be fit to play synth and organ.

 

To many, these 2 qualifications are mutually exclusive. Many would define the best 88 key action as one that feels the most natural for piano. This would be quite unnatural for synth and organ though.

 

What's more important to you, that it feels great for piano/epiano, or that it feels okay for everything?

 

If it's the latter, then I daresay this is something you'll have to figure out for yourself by trying many of them.

 

The Kawai MP7 Feels ery good for piano action, and its still Possible to play synths and organs when you adjust the setting( but no aftertouch) I think thats what i am looking for in the trade off, as good as possible piano action while still being able to play synth and organ sounds...

 

In my home town there is no professional piano/keyboard shop, so i need to travel to playtest some, i want to use this post and some others in other places to narrow down the selection.

[mate stubb]

There is no "best". That is entirely subjective.

[CEB]

The Yamaha balanced action in the S90XS and Motif XF8 is my favorite. I like the balanced because I arrange splits by dexertity requirements and not pitch. I want a fast action for synth leads. The S90XS is really fast. Both have AT. The S90XS only has 4 on deck zone control sliders. The Motif has more control options.

 

I would strongly look into the Physis and find out if that action would be adequate. It looks like the most powerful controller on the market right now. But I cannot speak to the action.

 

PS AC has spoken to the action. I put a lot of weight into what Coda says. He has helped me tremendously upon occasions.

 

 

[Bachus]

The Yamaha balanced action in the S90XS and Motif XF8 is my favorite. I like the balanced because I arrange splits by dexertity requirements and not pitch. I want a fast action for synth leads. The S90XS is really fast. Both have AT. The S90XS only has 4 on deck zone control sliders. The Motif has more control options.

 

I would strongly look into the Physis and find out if that action would be adequate. It looks like the best controller on the market right now.

 

Do you think that ballanced action is a requirement for playing organs and synths, or would a graded action also do that job if one took the time to get used to that?

[CEB]

It depends on the player and the material. I am now converting the graded action on the Kronos. For my Pop band it will be fine. For my 10 piece horn band it wouldn't work for organ. I carry a Hammond in that band. For synth leads the Kronos is working well enough. I put the lead zones on the right where the action is lightest anyway. It is not so much whether it is graded or balance but how slow the board gets in the bass. For piano and EPs I like a little bit of fight.

 

PS - I would never use the S90XS for organ in the 10 piece either. Even a light balanced action is not conducive to organ playing.

[Al Coda]

PS AC has spoken to the action. I put a lot of weight into what Coda says. He has helped me tremendously upon occasions.

 

Thank you !

B.t.w., I didn´t mention all the other options because it requires to make a final decision for the tone generator engine which comes w/ the keyboard action.

I didn´t mention the Kawai MP7 because it has no channel AT!

 

In regards on the Kurz PC3K8, I just only mentioned it as an example where to find the action for a try.

 

Same rules for the Physis K4,- but in opposite to the PC3K8,- the Physis K4 might be the better option for a component system where you can choose the sound engines in a 2nd step.

The OP also talked about a combo w/ Nektar Panorama and the target driving his software rig,- in that case the Physis K4 wins over the PC3K8 because the PC3K8 deals w/ 16 MIDI channels only and always, while the Physis K4 comes w/ endless connectivity for additional external keyboards as well as multi-channel MIDI modules, computer/laptop based rigs and/or MUSE Receptor and similar gear,- all simultaneously if you want.

And,- the Physis K4 has the Fatar TP40/L w/ AT action,- the K5 hasn´t!!!

When you like playing the Kurz PC3X or PC3K8, you´ll be fine w/ the Physis K4 too.

 

Graded hammer actions,- finally ...

It´s cool for piano when you are a trained classical piano player,- but in a multi keyboard rig when dealing w/ "zones" where hi-transposed parts can also be in the left hand department, I prefer the same weight across the keyboard action and Aftertouch is more or less a must when both your hands are busy and you cannot operate wheels, knobs, sliders and/or a ribbon all the time.

 

A.C.

[StickMan393]

I have an original Roland A80 with the aftertouch resistor mod. I like it because it has both Pitch+Mod wheels, *and* a pitch bend stick.

 

The action is perfectly fine although "best hammer action" probably doesn't apply. Weighs a ton.

 

I'm in on the New VAX kickstarter, so maybe in 12 months I'll put the A80 on craigslist or something.

[JFP]

There is only one at this moment:

 

Physis Piano K4GW;

 

K4GW TP40W Wood, Ivory finish , Graded, 3 sensor , Specialized for Viscount, Aftertouch, 27kg Streetprice in Netherlands/ Germany around 1800 incl VAT en and shipping. Only on custom order , so delivery time is around 4 weeks.

 

Believe me - at this moment there is no other board combining controller functionality AND three sensor technology AND aftertouch + weighted keybed and grading ALL in one unit. IMHO the 1800 is quite fair for what it delivers. Only drawback: 27kg. Is that still 'portable' for a gig (without personal roadies ) ? Guess not...

[JFP]

Sorry Bachus , missed the synth / organ part. Guess graded hammer is not the best suitable for that. O well, can't have it all , can we ?!

[Delaware Dave]

There is no "best". That is entirely subjective.

+1

 

Define 'best'. Light action, is that the best? Heavy action, is that the best? Quick response? sluggish response? Provide your definition of characteristics that you consider to be the best characteristics, and this group can probably recommend a brand of keyboard that has that similar keybed action, otherwise this subject is pure conjecture.

[John64]

I will be mostly playing piano/epiano, but the keybed also needs to be fit to play synth and organ.

That way you end up with a compromise because there really isn't 'one size which fits all'.

Personally I'd go for a dedicated piano controller/stage piano plus a good feeling waterfall style keybed for the organ/synths.

[Bachus]

There is no "best". That is entirely subjective.

+1

 

Define 'best'. Light action, is that the best? Heavy action, is that the best? Quick response? sluggish response? Provide your definition of characteristics that you consider to be the best characteristics, and this group can probably recommend a brand of keyboard that has that similar keybed action, otherwise this subject is pure conjecture.

.

Action should not be to light, i prefer a bit heavier... But definately with a quick response, i dont like slugish action....i prefer it to feel Very fresh. Almost like pulling the trigger of a gun and being startled by the bang.. Also the faster a key returns to top position after release the better...

[AnotherScott]

The only weighted 88 piano-actions I've played that I have found at least passable for organ are Kawai MP7 (no aftertouch), the TP40 Nord Stage (any of the 88 key Stage models), and the TP40L Kurzweils (PC3X, PC3K8, PC3A8, PC3LE8, Forte, which, AFAIK, should all feel the same). I haven't played all the Studiologic/Numa controllers, any of theirs that use a TP40 should be fine too.

[JFP]

Just confirmed; new Studiologic SL88 master keyboard features:

- weighted keys, three sensors, Ivory touch AND aftertouch.

 

And if it's like the Numa Concert, it will be < 20kg (versus 27 of the K4GW).

 

I have no idea of price and delivery time yet...

[Bachus]

I started making a list with all the 88 keybeds that have aftertouch and can be used as a mastercontroller both on stage and in the studio.

 

Akai MPK88 Akai fully Weighted hammer action

 

Arturia Keylab 88 Fatar TP100LR

 

CME VX8 unknown brand 88 key graded hammer action

CME UX8 unknown brand 88 key graded hammer action

 

Doepfer LMK2+ - Fatar TP40GH

Doepfer LMK4+ - Fatar DP40Gh

 

Korg Kronos - Korg GH3

 

Kurzweil Forte - Fatar TP40L

Kurzweil PC3k8 - Fatar TP40L

Kurzweil PC3LE8 - Fatar TP40L

Kurzweil PC3A8 Fatar TP40L

 

Nord Stage 2EX Fatar TP40 (inhouse tweaked by Nord)

 

Roland (none)

 

Studiologic Acuna 88 Fatar TP100

Studiologic VMK188 Plus - Fatar TP40GH

Studiologic VMK88 Plus - Fatar TP9PIANO

Studiologic Numa Nero - Fatar TP40Wood

Studiologic Numa Nano - Fatar TP100LR

 

Viscount Physis K4 (Ex) Fatar TP40L

Viscount Physis K4GW Fatar TP40Wood (triple sensor and ivory feel)

Viscount Physis K5 (EX) Fatar TP100LR

 

Yamaha Motif XF8 - Yamaha BHE

Yamaha S90XS - Yamaha BHE

 

This is pretty much the complete list of them, I was hoping that people owning one of these could give me import about the strengths and weaknesses of every single one of these keybeds..

 

I plan on making a whole complete list comparing all features of these keyboards and posting it

 

If you know any keyboards that did not make the list and are still for sale, feel free to tell me and i will add them...

 

[JFP]

You forgot the new Numa SL88 I mentioned ;-)

 

And I think CME 88 boards are no longer manufactured. CME seems to focus on small iPad keyboards and such. I assume your list only consists of current boards, so Fantom G8 etc is out of the question. Indeed Roland offering is than zero. Must say something...

[dongna]

Yamaha S90XS should be added to that list.

[Bachus]

You forgot the new Numa SL88 I mentioned ;-)

 

And I think CME 88 boards are no longer manufactured. CME seems to focus on small iPad keyboards and such. I assume your list only consists of current boards, so Fantom G8 etc is out of the question. Indeed Roland offering is than zero. Must say something...

 

As soon as i know which Fatar keys are in the SL88 i will add it, is it the TP40GH?

 

I found 2 websites of cme, one with only the new smaller keys, and cme-pro.com which still lists the bigger ons. I played one of them some years ago, and they felt kinda clunkcy, i would noboddy advise to buy them, so it might be wiser to remove them from the list

 

And about Roland, i recently ordered an A-88 masterkey from them, its the same action and ivory touch of the RD-800, and thoman listed it as having aftertouch. So it seemed a perfect masterkey for me.. Sadly Thomann was wrong and there was no aftertouch on it.

 

I dont think we will see a top of the line masrkey with aftertouch any time soon from Roland, but then, who knows, the new management might actually realise that aftertouch.

 

 

Yamaha S90XS should be added to that list.

 

Overhere in europe, Yamaha does not list them anymore, i only have current models in my list.

[MoodyBluesKeys]

In the used area - I have both a Kurzweil PC2X and PC3X. The PC2X is a fairly good MIDI controller, but limited in how many sliders. The PC3X is an excellent MIDI controller - and I like the playing action on it (some people don't). It is the same action as the PC3K8 and the PC3A8 action.

 

The action is quite even from top to bottom, well suited for fine nuances. I've used it with Romantic era music (Chopin and others), and actually prefer the action to that on my Baldwin Howard 5-8 grand piano. After-touch does work smoothly. In use as a controller, I've used it with my DAW running EWQL's Pianos Gold, and with my iPad mini2 running Korg Module with Ivory pianos.

 

It has three switch pedal inputs (which do not half-pedal) and two continuous controller inputs (I use for expression on organ sounds, but should be possible to use with external sound generators for half-pedaling, the internal pianos do not support half-pedaling).

 

I posted this although not a current model, because two current models do have very similar action and sounds.

 

[allan_evett]

 

Yamaha S90XS should be added to that list.

 

Overhere in europe, Yamaha does not list them anymore, i only have current models in my list.

 

Double check the Yamaha EU site: Just like here in North America, the S90XS is very much current. It's listed in the synthesizer category under 'other instruments'.

[JFP]

SL88 is same action as on Numa Concert, but with aftertouch and calibrated per unit. FYI

[Marzzz]

I have an original Roland A80 with the aftertouch resistor mod. I like it because it has both Pitch+Mod wheels, *and* a pitch bend stick.

 

The action is perfectly fine although "best hammer action" probably doesn't apply. Weighs a ton.

 

I'm in on the New VAX kickstarter, so maybe in 12 months I'll put the A80 on craigslist or something.

I also had an A80, even with the aftertouch mod it played like concrete (but had a great piano touch). The 2nd generation Kurzweil MIDIBoard was the best, but weighed even more than the A-80. Right now I really love my VAX77, and I am also on the Kickstarter for the New VAX. I may eventually sell my VAX77 because i don't use the folding feature.

[hardware]

Physis K4.

It's what they're using on the big jobs I hear.

[Bachus]

 

Yamaha S90XS should be added to that list.

 

Overhere in europe, Yamaha does not list them anymore, i only have current models in my list.

 

Double check the Yamaha EU site: Just like here in North America, the S90XS is very much current. It's listed in the synthesizer category under 'other instruments'.

 

You are right, its there, quite well hidden i must say, i added it to the list.

 

Thanks for pointing out

[Bachus]

The Next VAx keyboard

 

Got me wondering if the successor of the Vax keyboard could be a gamechanger, just look the video on the kickstarter. And it has polyphonic aftertouch and incredible action.

 

But then, who wants to assemble his own Keyboard?

[Doerfler]

Got me wondering if the successor of the Vax keyboard could be a gamechanger, just look the video on the kickstarter. And it has polyphonic aftertouch and incredible action.

 

But then, who wants to assemble his own Keyboard?

 

$ 1050 for 8 octaves assembled and shipped to the EU.

However you won't get it for almost a year.

[hardware]

I am watching the VAX like a Hawk.

1050 USD is nothing for something like that.