OT Too introverted, can I be trained to overcome this?

[SteveCoscia]

Behaviors can change. As a career service manager, solving problems and serving others was my strength. Never had to sell.

 

Self-employment necessitated that I learn sales disciplines. Wasn't easy, but sales behaviors did improve with learning, practice and application. And I am still learning.

[HammondDave]

It's all in the performance. My musical career prepared me for when I started to teach college lecture classes, I love it because it's a performance, and usually improvised, like jazz or blues.

 

 

[ITGITC]

I'm an "ESPN" personality type.

 

Now THAT's funny!

 

Tom

 

PS Are coffee stains hard to remove from silk boxers?

 

 

[Threadslayer]

CLONK

 

The link is to the Myers Briggs web site where it gives definitions and explanations of the various personality types. They charge you to take the online assessment, but there are other sites where you can do a smaller version of it for free.

 

here's one.

Mine was INTJ with the I being for Introverted.

 

I was INTP, though other subsequent times were INTJ, but the P/J scale was always kind of in the middle.

Ha. Interesting. I didn't mention it but I was on the cusp of P/J also.

[Threadslayer]

Why would one want to cure introversion?

I prefer to think of it as introspection.

[Aidan]

I agree that you can learn to act (though it's important that you do it in a 'natural' way). I'm naturally quite shy but when I was bumped up to management at a newspaper, I found I had to very quickly develop the ability to interact with lots of people, some of whom were under my control; give speeches and presentations and generally be a lot more 'on the ball' and confident than I really felt. Then I remembered a comment from Sting where he talked about teaching being akin to acting in many ways, and a penny kind of dropped.

[minimax]

I will add to this discussion some of my thoughts which you may find helpful. Be patient with me, as it is not something, which can be explained in just a few words.

 

It is possible to change a lot of things, that we like, or do not like about ourselves. Eeveryone can do it. There is no need for a shrink, as many of them will make a bigger mess out of us, and drain our wallets. How do I now that ? From experience. I had many health problems: colon cancer, gallstones, severe panic attack for years, and with exception of cancer which was removed at the hospital the rest I fixed myself at home. It was not a pleasant ride, but it forced me to look for answers. I found them, used them and can share them with others. Knowledge, which is not complicated, that I will share with you does not come from me, but was found and proven correct by me. You have to do the same, as it cannot work on just belief. It requires a few simple things: open mind (no judgments), logical thinking, quiet time, while reading and pondering information - so one can get good understanding of basics. Later just practice and patience, as some things may need some time, to be visible to us.

 

Here we go.

 

When you get to now yourself as I do now know myself, you will realize that these words by Billy Meier are priceless, because they point the essence of the problem: Pay attention to your thoughts, for they become feelings. Pay attention to your feelings, for these quickly become words, and these become actions as well as deeds. Deeds and actions however become habits, which form themselves quite quickly to the character, with which, through all these things, determines your destiny.

 

If you want to change yourself, you ONLY need to change your thoughts !!!! This is not a joke on my part, it is true. It is so simple that seams ridiculous. It took me years to do other things, as I just could not believe, that remedy is so simple. We are so brainwashed, that we do not trust ourselves anymore.

 

Lets go deeper. (Just essence to get you started)

 

Thoughts and feelings are electromagnetic energy, which you feel always, all the time. This is what really drives us to action. Look at your changing moods - this is just it. That energy accumulates in our bodies, as emotions and contracts our bodies. What you feel as relaxed state is not really relaxed you have to trust me on this until you can see it inside. Depending on our thinking, we activate certain fields (fear, grief, anger) and that is what we feel. If it wasn't for the existing emotions, we would be in a state of interior peace, and we could change our feeling in a few seconds by simply changing thoughts. That accumulated energy brings us unwanted thoughts (chatter in the head). When we give them attention, we increase energy field which gave us that garbage. All depression, panic attacks, compulsive behavior is just from this garbage field, which you feel as pain, heaviness. And that garbage field is your memories and experiences your upbringing and programing by society. All of that can be dumped!!! It requires time, but it works and is soooo... freeing - that you cannot comprehend it.

 

According to Lester Levenson thoughts accumulate in feelings. There are 9 basic ones apathy, grief, fear, lust, anger, pride, courageousness, acceptance and peace. They accumulate in 5 programs/wants wanting approval, control, security, separation and oneness. You would need a few lifetimes to dump all the thoughts, but when you can get to feelings and later programs - you can let them go them within months, years - depending on your involvement and determination.

 

When I started the practical part 2.5 years ago, I had just info from the internet and nobody to ask questions. There was so much fear in me, that all this process was slow. I did not know what I could do and what I should avoid. Now it is fairly easy. I am not done totally yet, but what I can do now inside of me, compering to beginning, is mind boggling.

 

So what exactly I do? I am observing my thoughts like a hawk. When I see something coming, I ask myself what feeling started it?. Then what program it uses. When I feel that painful energy and see where it is located in my body, I concentrate on it. When it starts swinging (like a magnetic wave) inside of my body, by simple decision of my will (a thought) I let it go and I can feel it leaving my body, through soles of my feet. Simple, isn't it?

 

Every one of you can do it and change your life. This is not a BS story. What I have written should be taken as an appetizer to get you started. I will gladly share more, if asked.

 

Books/audio that will get you started:

 

Lester Levenson/ Sedona Method (http://www.sedona.com/Home.asp)

listed below can be found on the net for checking.

 

The Ultimate Goal in MP3 form

The Ultimate Truth in pdf form.

 

Eckhart Tolle

 

The New Earth - (pain body ego - how it works)

Power of Now - (beginning most important - as he describes what is our natural state, compering to a zombi state, as I call it, of most of us.

 

Billy Meier - Spiritual teachings (I value this source the most it took me years to research what is in english, but requires self work and lots of it)

The Psyche (book) - You can buy it at Theyfly.com

Might of Thoughts - same as above

 

Regards,

 

Andrew

[solpincus]

there is nothing wrong with being an introvert . A lot of 'great' men are little more than a puff of smoke : they are successful because they often have a mate who, living in the shadows , gives them the quiet support that these ' great' people seem to need.

Many 'extroverts' thrive behind a mask of affability that is fake , and without substance. Introverts, loners by nature , are often great thinkers who have WAY more behind the surface than the loud, obnoxious extroverts bring to the table.

Finally, accepting yourself as you really are can help you go a long way. It just takes a few moments of courage to make that big step here and there. The so-called go-getters, on the other hand, take a great deal of credit for things that they did not even bring to light.

How many obnoxious introverts do you find, as apposed to the blathering loud mouths you come across ?

[minimax]

We miss so much from life by not knowing what moves us, and how to overcome it. Take for example shyness, which is a lighter shade of fear. I was in love (first one) in late years of elementary school, I did everything to let her now that I liked her a lot, but I was too afraid to really go for it. And I blew it. I bet many of you had similar experiences. They teach us something. But when negatives compound we tend to withdraw inside.

[I-missRichardTee]

You members are so nice and helpful. May I say I am a cross between an extro and an introvert... aka an ambivert... I lean slightly towards introvert, but others may see it differently.

Thank you very much.

[I-missRichardTee]

Introversion has a down and an up side. Ditto for extroversion. Whatever type we are, I assume some of us want to minimize the down side. Anyone of these terms we are using, could probably fill a few volumes. Take shyness.. that sounds like a bad thing, but modesty is easily confused with shyness. Shyness could also be a lack of confidence or self consciousness.. neither of which are desirable.

Introspection is another good or bad deal. Depends, doesn't it?

I am not sure if true extroverts do much introspection.

Minimax, nice, and deep too -)

 

[minimax]

Introspection is another good or bad deal. Depends, doesn't it?

 

Everything is relative. I would say if we are oblivious of our true nature, our core being (which is always happiness, freedom, love and harmony) and identify only with our EGO (our self image), introspection, for a lot of us brings harm - as we tend to put ourselves down (read - blame for making mistakes). If we condemn ourselves life will reflect that for us, by giving us more crap to experience. If, on the other hand, we understand, that as a human being, we are here to learn and evolve by making mistakes - we do not condemn ourselves and others. Then introspection is a useful tool to bring to our awareness what really limits us (our believes which are thoughts and feelings) - so we can let them go. Then more of our happiness is reflected in our daily experiences.

[KenElevenShadows]

Just for clarification, an introverted person is not necessarily a shy person.

[I-missRichardTee]

Just for clarification, an introverted person is not necessarily a shy person.

 

I have not studied clinical psychology.. put it this way - are shyness and extroversion, mutually exclusive? If anyone is shy, they are more likely introverted; just a hunch. But yes, I agree, just because one is introverted does not mean shyness.

[bluzeyone]

I just want to touch on a point that I noticed that may be helpful. Many persons here are introverted but can work through that without a hitch. I really think your issues are from anxiety. That would definetly make this introverted thing seem like a monster. Something to consider.

[KenElevenShadows]

http://psychology.about.com/od/trait-theories-personality/f/introversion.htm

 

"People who are introverted tend to be inward turning, or focused more on internal thoughts, feelings and moods rather than seeking out external stimulation.

 

Introversion is marked by a number of different sub-traits:

 

Very self-aware

Thoughtful

Enjoys understanding details

Interested in self-knowledge and self-understanding

Tends to keep emotions private

Quiet and reserved in large groups or around unfamiliar people

More sociable and gregarious around people they know well

Learns well through observation"

 

Someone like this is more likely to be shy than those who tend to be more extroverted, sure, but they are not the same. I just wanted to throw it out there that introversion and shyness are not one and the same.

 

This same link goes on to say:

"It is important to note that introversion does not necessarily equate with shyness. In their book, The Development of Shyness and Social Withdrawal, authors Schmidt and Buss write, "Sociability refers to the motive, strong or weak, of wanting to be with others, whereas shyness refers to behavior when with others, inhibited or uninhibited, as well as feelings of tension and discomfort." Shyness indicates a fear of people or social situations. Introverts, on the other hand, simply do not like to spend lots of time interacting with other people. However, they do appreciate being around people to whom they are close. They find engaging in "small talk" tedious, but do enjoy having deep, meaningful conversations."

 

I am introverted. However, I am not shy. I do not fear talking to people or feel tension or discomfort. I love talking to people. I love getting to know people.

[I-missRichardTee]

This forum is a treasure of educated and helpful people.

Bluzeyone Yes, anxiety is an issue for me. So far maybe 3 ( presumed to be panic attacks, I really do not know ) panic attacks over one lifetime.. but anxiety about making a living is a biggie for Tee; thank you.

[minimax]

Another example from my life. A few years ago, when I ran a construction company with a partner, we worked on two properties. On one of them (an old house) a roof collapsed. Building department decided to level the property down. At almost the same time I was informed, by the other property owner, that my business partner somehow embezzled approx. $70,000.00 and lied to me about value of the contract. He contracted the job for a rehab of the house, with addition and a detached 3 car brick garage for 175,000 (the owner gave me a copy of a contract) but he was telling me about 350,000.00 job. To add to it, through my friend, at insurance agency, I got to know that my partner with our company money had bought a Silverado truck, although he had another one he drove. In few days my buddy was gone and left me with all this crap on my had. In next few weeks came insurance company determination, that they will not pay for the accident (I will spare you details) and my corporation will have to fork $254,000, which was nowhere to be found. My insurance agency friend said that there was nothing I could do to change it. Now tell me about having an anxiety about living.

What I waned to tell you about is how I dealt with the insurance company. From my studies I new that what we keep in our mind we create. We will not get financial security, as we do not want it, because we keep thoughts connected with fear and fear we get. So I decided to gamble, as I have never tried this before, to put that knowledge to use. I disregarded all my negative thoughts, I looked through them and did not let them stick. It took little over two years and a court case, but my Insurance had to pay. Against all adds I build a new house for people that lost their house. That allowed me to pay partially the other debt. Was it just what I did that made the difference? How can I prove it? I cannot. I just know that all the coincidences, serendipity that transpired over that time, which I cannot explain, helped me fix most of it. Later I got a hard prove that I really live out my thoughts and feelings.

So what is the point of it? It is never too late to try new things.

[I-missRichardTee]

Goodness, My first Reptilian ( gorilla brain maybe ) reaction would be to bash your treacherous partners skull in. Bible suggests loving your old partner. You seem to have made an unusually heroic series of choices. Duly noted!

[Theo Verelst]

Maybe some people are introverted because in the environment they reside in, everything that contribute that isn't of a zombie character gets fired down, and they don't have a surplus of intelligence and craft to overcome their environment.

 

It's like having feelings of inferiority, not speaking from any psychological official training, but simply practically thinking: some people (Hitler, Mussolini, etc.) probably deserve to feel inferior compared to average human specimen. Introversion might be another thing that can be deservedly so, it's hardly a crime, to be introverted, isn't it, so why bother.

 

Probably it's something else, like powerlessness or coming across like a simple minded nerd that gets people to think like "I should change something". Possibly a higher education could bring change, but hey, that isn't the way life works for most people, so that may not be the answer.

 

T.

[minimax]

For people that will not want to read reference material I gave, but may be curious, I will define what I mean by natural and zombie state of a human.

 

Natural state (this I give not from my experience as I am still removing garbage obscuring it, but I had glimpses of it)Is not a state that we need to acquire, it is a dimension in us, that is always there, but covered up with garbage thoughts and emotions. For illustration (an not the best one) imagine breathing in a clear mountain air. Think of easiness and good feeling that comes with it. Now imagine that in the same air is a smoke from a burning forest, and you breath that in. Depending of how much of it is in that air you are choking more or less. If feels not natural.

In this state which we experience as youngsters, body is in total peace (bible quotes it as peace surpassing all understanding), as there are no deposit of emotions in it yet. Our body senses work on 100%. Everything seems so beautiful. There is an enormous feeling of love, happiness and oneness. We fell whole. Whatever we need in life (do not confuse that with the mind wanting) comes with no effort. We are always in the NOW of things in reality.

 

Zombie state (my label for it) We are a prisoner of the mind which all the time works to secure our body survival. It is never in the NOW but always in the future or past. There is always a matrix of possibilities given to us to acquire things, or to avoid some situations. We are scared of the future, even if we think that we are not (you have to trust me on that as you only now it when you go deep inside). We judge not only ourselves but others. The worst thing is that we take our thoughts as real and important. We identify with them. If someone criticizes us or our favorite football team, we feel hurt. Everything happening is personal to us. We push all those unwanted thoughts and connected feeling into unconscious as they are painful states. With passing time they accumulate inside like in a pressure cooker but we do not want to feel it and we deny their existence. They come out with our emotional outbursts. The bigger the pressure inside the greater our explosion. Body senses are thwarted, as that garbage energy impacts our nervous system (look at people whose hands or head shake). We are always in the wanting mode with an enormous need to be loved. Everything we do starts from that. But as we do not give it out unconditionally (all what we give is underlined by wanting to get something in return) we do not get it back. If a detachment from mind does not come - we are living dead and do not know it. It is closer to bible hell, but we take that way of living as normal.

 

 

 

P.S. Sorry to go more off topic.

[minimax]

I will stop my rumbling after this post, but I think you may appreciate this more as musicians. You are in your natural state, to a degree, when you create music. When there is a partial or total lack of body consciousness and thoughts, you are the most productive and what you create is best quality. Creative ideas flow and are expressed through the instrument that you think you are (the body hence ego) Am I right on that?

[I-missRichardTee]

I sent you a PM... I agree in the general tone of your words, though your methods are likely unique to you and others outside this forum. I would say though, that merely playing music, does not put one permanently ( or even impermanently ) outside the realm of tormenting thoughts - maybe to a tiny degree !

[KenElevenShadows]

Maybe some people are introverted because in the environment they reside in, everything that contribute that isn't of a zombie character gets fired down, and they don't have a surplus of intelligence and craft to overcome their environment.

 

It's like having feelings of inferiority, not speaking from any psychological official training, but simply practically thinking: some people (Hitler, Mussolini, etc.) probably deserve to feel inferior compared to average human specimen. Introversion might be another thing that can be deservedly so, it's hardly a crime, to be introverted, isn't it, so why bother.

 

Probably it's something else, like powerlessness or coming across like a simple minded nerd that gets people to think like "I should change something". Possibly a higher education could bring change, but hey, that isn't the way life works for most people, so that may not be the answer.

 

T.

 

I don't know if this is some sort of troll ("they don't have a surplus of intelligence and craft to overcome their environment?" "powerlessness?" Wait, what?), but in the event it's not, what you're describing is not introversion.

 

"People who are introverted tend to be inward turning, or focused more on internal thoughts, feelings and moods rather than seeking out external stimulation.

 

Introversion is marked by a number of different sub-traits:

 

Very self-aware

Thoughtful

Enjoys understanding details

Interested in self-knowledge and self-understanding

Tends to keep emotions private

Quiet and reserved in large groups or around unfamiliar people

More sociable and gregarious around people they know well

Learns well through observation"

[I-missRichardTee]

There is the generality and on the other end, the specifics. Let me move to specifics:

Meeting the customers in audience is scary because I feel they can read my vibe... my vibe is, I am really not all that interested in small talk. It's the reading of my face, that concerns me. People read people, we all live in glass houses. a truism. So before I can get to live out Joe Muscara's idea to discuss music itself.. I have to deal with the "first impressions, are lasting and powerful", idea.

That's a start with specifics.