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OT Too introverted, can I be trained to overcome this?


I-missRichardTee

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As regards the big smilers- I've long been envious of people that burn like a flame...

 

Me too! I wish I could paste a big smile on my face when performing - sadly, it ain't in me. Although I'm reasonably animated for a seated keyboard player - my facial expression is at best described as "vapid" ... and at worst, downright as "angry" or "disgusted". I've seen a few of the pics and it ain't pretty. I can be having the time of my life - yet, I still have this blank / angry stare thing going on. If I could just nudge it into a consistent look of "intense concentration" - it would be an improvement!

The SpaceNorman :freak:
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Yep ... I'm not an introvert, I'm comfortable talking to pretty much anybody - especially strangers.

 

That doesn't mean you're not an introvert. Introverts tend to need a couple very close personal relationships to be happy, where as an Extrovert is happy with a lot of more casual relationships. That's why introverts will tend to stick with small groups where extroverts like to be the life of the party. But it doesn't mean introverts can't be comfortable talking to people, just that the conversation will be casual and will not fulfill their need for closer personal relationships.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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That Susan Cain book is good--my work has switched to an "open, collaborative" style that has made me hate coming to work, or at least it would if I ever bowed to pressure and actually sat at my desk :D. I feel like I'm in the middle of the monkey exhibit, I can get nothing done with all the jibber-jabber and movement around me.

 

Makes sense to me. :thu:

 

I know this controller of a tech company. Senior (CEO and HR arm-twisted the rest) management had him redo his building to put everybody out in the open. Four conference rooms in four corners of each floor became very backlogged overnight.

 

Of course he snagged one of the conference rooms for himself. His "offical" office was out in the middle of the bull-pen, but if I ever needed to find him, he was in "his" conference room, usually having a meeting with himself and a laptop to get some work done.

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CLONK

 

The link is to the Myers Briggs web site where it gives definitions and explanations of the various personality types. They charge you to take the online assessment, but there are other sites where you can do a smaller version of it for free.

 

here's one.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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Thank you all. I was counseled as to my type, but with typology called the Enneagram. Check it out.

I recall Briggs Stratton ( just kidding see I can be silly ) thing involved Judging perception feeling thinking. I have no clue what those terms mean. so thank you JDan and all this was a pleasant surprise.

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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The Lone Ranger seemed to do all the talking, but alot of people like Tonto just fine. That said I've spent my whole life stepping out of my comfort zone and guess what? It's still uncomfortable. Easier...maybe, but still hard for me to do. My best advice is don't think about it, just do it. ~BOB
I'm practicing so that people can maybe go "wow" at an imaginary gig I'll never play. -Nadroj
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The Lone Ranger seemed to do all the talking, but alot of people like Tonto just fine. That said I've spent my whole life stepping out of my comfort zone and guess what? It's still uncomfortable. Easier...maybe, but still hard for me to do. My best advice is don't think about it, just do it. ~BOB

 

True, however, Tonto did speak up when Masked Man crossed the line. You will recall when surrounded by Injuns, Lone Ranger's macho chauvinist veneer "cracked" when he said to Tonto we're surrounded by Indians!!.. Tonto straightened him out, you will recall with these immortal words, "What you mean We, paleface?"

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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The Lone Ranger seemed to do all the talking, but alot of people like Tonto just fine. That said I've spent my whole life stepping out of my comfort zone and guess what? It's still uncomfortable. Easier...maybe, but still hard for me to do. My best advice is don't think about it, just do it. ~BOB

 

True, however, Tonto did speak up when Masked Man crossed the line. You will recall when surrounded by Injuns, Lone Ranger's macho chauvinist veneer "cracked" when he said to Tonto we're surrounded by Indians!!.. Tonto straightened him out, you will recall with these immortal words, "What you mean We, paleface?"

 

:laugh: Made me think of this, a classic Lyle Lovett verse:

 

"The mystery masked man was smart. He got himself a tonto;

'cause tonto did the dirty work for free.

But tonto he was smarter. And one day said: 'Kemo sabe,

kiss my ass I bought a boat, I'm going out to sea' "

'Someday, we'll look back on these days and laugh; likely a maniacal laugh from our padded cells, but a laugh nonetheless' - Mr. Boffo.

 

We need a barfing cat emoticon!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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CLONK

 

The link is to the Myers Briggs web site where it gives definitions and explanations of the various personality types. They charge you to take the online assessment, but there are other sites where you can do a smaller version of it for free.

 

here's one.

I was about to mention Myers- Briggs. I'm not a big fan of this kind of thing, but I took the test two different times - sponsored by two different employers - with different sets of questions - and the results were identical. Their premise is that an individual's results will Always be the same. That we are just built one way or the other. I'm not sure I buy into that, but it is pretty interesting. Mine was INTJ with the I being for Introverted.

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.

-Mark Twain

 

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Learn how to fake it.

 

It's ACTING!

 

When I was gigging a lot, I was a beast. I had a MiniMoog I modded with a remote keyboard. I roamed the stage, annoyed the guitar players, got out into the audience, climbed on tables, PA stacks, stood on top of my B3, kept a cheap combo organ in the setup that I could do the Keith Emerson bit with - rolled on the floor with the thing, played it backwards, tore parts off ...

 

The second a break started, while the rest of the band was lining up whom they were going to get laid with after the gig ... I was too shy to talk to anybody, quickly vanished and hid from folks that approached me, and usually ended up in my van alone with a ginger ale listening to Bach or Mozart until the next set started.

 

The audience thought I was a speed demon crazy hyper musician freak. Nope. Not so much.

 

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IB9BjH9z59I/TzbLngpyjdI/AAAAAAAAAQ4/0XDmj_jc3Js/s320/Jon%2BLovitz%2B500.jpg

 

Les Mizzell

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In my dotcom days a bunch of us took a class called "Understanding the Power Of Your Communication Style" or some such thing. But the basic idea was that everybody takes a test that I think is similar to Meyers-Briggs. There were two sections to the test, you answer one set of questions for how you are at work, and another set for how you are at home. The class was very, very well-presented and I got a lot out of it. The point was not that these things are set in stone, but in fact that we flex our natural styles already. And there's no right answer, just that people are motivated by different things, and it's useful to be mindful of that.

 

One big thing I learned: some people find making a plan and sticking to it very comforting and reassuring, while others find having a set plan very stressful. The spontaneous people like frequent change, which the planners find stressful. This was a common source of friction between marketing types and engineering types. It's not something I'd ever really given a lot of thought to before. I just figured the marketing types were nuts. :P They had another axis where some people find dealing with other people very energizing, while others find it draining and prefer to work alone. But of course in most workplaces, everyone works in a group at times and alone at times.

 

Anyway, as others have noted already: you are who you are and that's not likely to change. However, you can gain some skills to get better at the things you're not good at, or find draining, or whatever. If the conversation is going nowhere, asking somebody their opinion on something they've expressed interest in is a good way to keep things rolling. However, if the person is a crashing bore, and you feel the urge to flee, that can be difficult! You're not going to like everyone you meet, that's just the reality.

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Well tee one thing I definetly like about you is your not afraid to talk about what alot of us feel but remain quite about. I can say I honestly can relate to tones better than words and that is why I gravitated towards music. I think alot of us can say that here.

I devolped crippling anxiety through the years. Its crazy that I manage playing live. I don't know about therapy but I do know your Doc can give you a little blue pill that really does work. I'm not making light of it or making a joke. It really does help..and doesn't stone ya to hard. O.k. that part was a joke. :laugh:

All seriousness, I didn't always have this anxiety thing. It devolped as I got older. My advice..Talk to Doc about it. It really helped me.

"A good mix is subjective to one's cilia." http://hitnmiss.yolasite.com
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CLONK

 

The link is to the Myers Briggs web site where it gives definitions and explanations of the various personality types. They charge you to take the online assessment, but there are other sites where you can do a smaller version of it for free.

 

here's one.

I was about to mention Myers- Briggs. I'm not a big fan of this kind of thing, but I took the test two different times - sponsored by two different employers - with different sets of questions - and the results were identical. Their premise is that an individual's results will Always be the same. That we are just built one way or the other. I'm not sure I buy into that, but it is pretty interesting. Mine was INTJ with the I being for Introverted.

 

I first took it back in college, partially due to a stressful relationship, also evaluating my academic direction. I was INTP, though other subsequent times were INTJ, but the P/J scale was always kind of in the middle.

 

I'd say over the years it's helped me understand myself and be less upset with people who are just wired different, because I understand them too, and what makes us different.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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I don't think there is a cure for introvertism (is that even a word?) But it's no big deal really. Many famous stand-up comics have been famous introverts too.

 

Improve your mic skills and gain self confidence on stage? That you absolutely can improve. Just like improving your keyboard chops, all it takes is practice.

 

My suggestion? Host a weeknight karaoke show for a couple of years. Name recognition, eye contact, off the cuff remarks, even humorous asides... you'll learn it all while making money at the same time.

 

This is a serious suggestion btw. I've hosted weeknight karaoke shows for almost ten years now, and it's done wonders for my stage presence.

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Why would one want to cure introversion?

 

I agree, in fact, that tone throughout has kind of tapped one of my pet peeves...that being an Introvert is a flaw that needs to be cured. It's a personality type shared by half the population that has lots of strengths. Embrace who you are and learn how to leverage your strengths.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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A general discussion about introversion:

 

Introversion is one of the major personality traits identified in many theories of personality. People who are introverted tend to be inward turning, or focused more on internal thoughts, feelings and moods rather than seeking out external stimulation. Introversion is generally viewed as existing as part of a continuum along with extraversion. Introversion indicates one end of the scale, while extraversion represents the other end.

 

The terms introversion and extraversion were popularized through the work of Carl Jung and later became central parts of other prominent theories including the big 5 theory of personality. The introversion-extraversion dimension is also one of the four areas identified by the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI). According to many theories of personality, everyone has some degree of both introversion and extraversion. However, people often tend to lean one way or the other.

 

Introverts tend to be more quiet, reserved and introspective. Unlike extraverts who gain energy from social interaction, introverts have to expend energy in social situations. After attending a party or spending time in a large group of people, introverts often feel a need to "recharge" by spending a period of time alone.

 

Common Introversion Traits

 

Introversion is marked by a number of different sub-traits:

 

Very self-aware

Thoughtful

Enjoys understanding details

Interested in self-knowledge and self-understanding

Tends to keep emotions private

Quiet and reserved in large groups or around unfamiliar people

More sociable and gregarious around people they know well

Learns well through observation

Introversion and Behavior

 

How does introversion impact behavior? Researchers have found that people high in this trait tend to have a smaller group of friends. While extraverts generally have a wide circle of friends and acquaintances, introverts typically choose their friends much more carefully. Their closest relationships tend to be profound and significant. They also prefer to interact with people on a one-on-one basis rather than in a large group setting.

 

It is important to note that introversion does not necessarily equate with shyness. In their book, The Development of Shyness and Social Withdrawal, authors Schmidt and Buss write, "Sociability refers to the motive, strong or weak, of wanting to be with others, whereas shyness refers to behavior when with others, inhibited or uninhibited, as well as feelings of tension and discomfort." Shyness indicates a fear of people or social situations. Introverts, on the other hand, simply do not like to spend lots of time interacting with other people. However, they do appreciate being around people to whom they are close. They find engaging in "small talk" tedious, but do enjoy having deep, meaningful conversations.

 

Introverts tend to think about things before talking. They want to have a full understanding of a concept before they voice an opinion or try to offer an explanation. While extraverts typically learning through trial and error, introverts learn best through observation.

 

http://psychology.about.com/od/trait-theories-personality/f/introversion.htm

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Yeah I'm good with mine too. But I don't let the fact that I'm an introvert translate into making me a shrinking violet onstage.

 

To MissRichardTee stage confidence doesn't require anything except practice. No therapy please :) (something you brought up). Just do it somehow - and do it a lot.

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Is it possible with therapy or whatever, to develop a friendly personality?

 

I'm a salesman by profession. I generally like talking to people and engaging with them. I'm by no means an extrovert, but I do enjoy even casual interaction with people that cross my path on a daily basis (bank teller, waitress, cashier, etc.)

 

There are often times that I don't want to talk to anyone and just want to hole up somewhere. I enjoy my time to myself (and my music/gear) and don't really ever feel bored or lonely.

 

I don't see myself as the life of the party, but I do know how to make people laugh and often enjoy doing it.

 

Sorry for the lengthy setup, but context is important as I reply. As part of my job, I'll often go to a strange city, rent a car, sleep in a hotel and meet strangers for days in a row. This is not something that I would do if I wasn't working, but since it is part of my job, I decide to make the best of it (finding joy in the journey).

 

Travel is stressful and meeting new people can be too. I always try to find a common ground with people I meet. I look for ways and ask questions and listen for subtle clues that will help me find these things.

 

Any common ground you can find with someone is a bridge to building a relationship with that person. It might be sports, cars, politics, family, places to go on vacation, etc. When I do find these things, I ask them questions that engage them about these things. I do this for several reasons. It helps me get to know them better and it allows them to talk about themselves. The one way to normally engage people is to get them to talk about themselves (their favorite subject)!!

 

Since I'm there to try to sell them something, you might accuse me of being insincere or with selfish motives. What I've found to be true for me, is that in those situations I do really care about what they're saying and finding the common ground. That's part of finding joy in the journey. When I do this, it's much easier for the sales stuff to become part of the interaction and it somewhat takes care of itself.

 

So I'm not really trying to use people or manipulate them or their emotions. I'm just trying to connect with them.

 

If you compare what I'm doing professionally in my sales job to what you're asking about, I think you'll find they have quite similar objectives.

 

I'm not about using people. It's certainly more pleasant to do business with people that I like, that like me and those that share common interests.

 

Greg

Kurzweil Forte, Yamaha Motif ES7, Muse Receptor 2 Pro Max, Neo Ventilator
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Some random thoughts:

 

I used to be *very* shy as a boy, and that made all my endeavors and relationships more difficult than necessary. In my case, the single thing that has helped most (at least in the musical field) was to feel the responsability of doing things. Writing my own music, explaining it to others, organizing reharsals, searching for gigs (aarrgghh), and above all, being on stage. Not only playing; after the first moments of terror, I found that I *liked* talking to people! Today I *love* to talk to people, and that's one of the reasons why I can stand teaching so much. :freak:

I've found that knowing people's stories and personalities is one of the things I enjoy the most in life. It's the same kind of reactivity that makes you sensitive about the audience's response to your music... it's just being interested in the others, to feel part of the group so to speak.

 

Another element which helped the smoothness of my attitude was to play rock. Seriously! Just to feel the energy, and to feel how that energy comes back to you from the audince times ten, is simply something else. Even if it's not the most complex or profund feeling, and even if it's not your favorite music, it's a liberation from every block one could have in communicating with others. OF COURSE I'm talking about an era when rock was music made by humans.... today's rock is... well, let's leave this discussion for another time.

 

As I said, just random thought about my own experience. Your mileage may vary quite a lot.

 

 

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Greg, being in sales myself, I completely get where you are coming from. In fact, I think it makes me more thoughtful and helpful to them to really get to know them and understand their needs without just spitting out some sales pitch.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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Greg, being in sales myself, I completely get where you are coming from. In fact, I think it makes me more thoughtful and helpful to them to really get to know them and understand their needs without just spitting out some sales pitch.

 

:thu::thu:

Kurzweil Forte, Yamaha Motif ES7, Muse Receptor 2 Pro Max, Neo Ventilator
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I am quite animated with people if I think we have similar interests, but talking sincerely with audiences esp off stage, is difficult, because most people are not interested in the things I am interested in.
I didn't get a chance to read this entire thread, so maybe someone else has said this. Also, some posts I did read touched on it but didn't say what I'm about to say explicitly.

 

You say, "most people are not interested in the things I am interested in." But I can think of one thing that someone in your audience should be interested in that I would think that you are as well - music! Why not talk about that? You don't have to talk about your music, especially if that makes you uncomfortable, but you can ask them what they like, what else they listen to, did they enjoy the opening act, etc. Not only will this be something that might engage them, but it would help you put your finger on the pulse of your audience. If you're playing in a cover band, maybe there are artists they will tell you about you can add to the set. Or maybe you'll just find out about someone you haven't heard and might like.

 

I think this alone will give you a lot and cause you to want to talk to audience members more.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

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I was about to mention Myers- Briggs. I'm not a big fan of this kind of thing, but I took the test two different times - sponsored by two different employers - with different sets of questions - and the results were identical. Mine was INTJ with the I being for Introverted.

 

I first took it back in college, partially due to a stressful relationship, also evaluating my academic direction. I was INTP, though other subsequent times were INTJ, but the P/J scale was always kind of in the middle.

INTJ here also, and curious why a subtype that is the least common of all (5% overall) seems to be curiously overrepresented among keyboard players. Most lead guitarists I know are not INTJ types!

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