Roland V-Combo VR-09

[AnotherScott]

What ipad app would u use for selecting registration patches??

Probably Set List Maker. There's also Set List Organizer, and I've seen references to some others.

[Pete Nalda]

Ok, I've had a bit of time to play with this thing at my local GC. I'm pretty impressed with the wildness of some of the effects like the tape delay, the semi real drawbars, built in drum machine, looper, etc, etc. I'm impressed to the degree I might even let my original 2008 era nord stage compact go on sale to buy this. I know I'd loose the more realistic farfisa emulation (where as the VR-09 is more of a Vox style emulation, but I really like the wacky character this boards effects have. I also love the added portability due to it's size and weight. My problem here lies in this, I don't even know what to ask for my old stage. It is missing a screw on one side as well. I know I might be crazy to do this, but I think that since I use my little korg microX for a lot of pad sounds these days, using the piano/organ split layer on the Roland would serve me just as well. So, if I'm crazy, feel free to let me know. I will say, that I agree with Keyboards' review of the VR-09, that the organ section might not be as realistic as the Stage, but it has pretty good character for sure.

[niacin]

You should be aware that in split mode both sides are affected by the expression pedal, and the left side of the split is dry (no effects). Some of us are hoping that the former issue will be addressed in an O.S. update. You can select the damper pedal to affect only one side, but the setting for whether it sustains a sound or switches the leslie speed is in the global menu so it's one or the other regardless of the preset or registration you choose.

 

Ok, I've had a bit of time to play with this thing at my local GC. I'm pretty impressed with the wildness of some of the effects like the tape delay, the semi real drawbars, built in drum machine, looper, etc, etc. I'm impressed to the degree I might even let my original 2008 era nord stage compact go on sale to buy this. I know I'd loose the more realistic farfisa emulation (where as the VR-09 is more of a Vox style emulation, but I really like the wacky character this boards effects have. I also love the added portability due to it's size and weight. My problem here lies in this, I don't even know what to ask for my old stage. It is missing a screw on one side as well. I know I might be crazy to do this, but I think that since I use my little korg microX for a lot of pad sounds these days, using the piano/organ split layer on the Roland would serve me just as well. So, if I'm crazy, feel free to let me know. I will say, that I agree with Keyboards' review of the VR-09, that the organ section might not be as realistic as the Stage, but it has pretty good character for sure.

[Kevmo]

U have 'PM

[Pete Nalda]

You should be aware that in split mode both sides are affected by the expression pedal, and the left side of the split is dry (no effects). Some of us are hoping that the former issue will be addressed in an O.S. update. You can select the damper pedal to affect only one side, but the setting for whether it sustains a sound or switches the leslie speed is in the global menu so it's one or the other regardless of the preset or registration you choose.

 

This all is a tiny bit bothersome, I'd have to say that I can work around the expression pedal thing, and the rotar speed pedal issue, as with the expression thing I can just drop level on the organ by hand, and I find I don't use a pedal with rotor speed that much anyway, as my right foot is always on the sustain or volume, and I play standing, so it's hard to do anything with my left foot. Sitting is a different matter, considering I don't have to have a foot to hold my balance. Bottom line, is this is all very thought provoking, as I'm now wondering if I should put this side by side with the Hammond SK-1, as that one has a dedicated Farfisa waveform combo organ sound. as I might could pick up one of those for the money I make selling my 2008 Stage Compact, Just wouldn't get the portability or fun stuff the VR-09 has. Bottom line is, I'm way more happier with real drawbars, as the draw buttons are very hard to use when you have daytime gigs, and never will be as tactile.

 

[AnotherScott]

Pete, you can also add drawbars to your Nord Stage, with this:

 

http://www.oceanbeachdigital.com

[brenner13]

Ooh, just noticed those DB's work with JP80...hmmmm...weighs a bit more than 12 lbs though...still...

[To B3]

Not with the JP-50?

[Pete Nalda]

Pete, you can also add drawbars to your Nord Stage, with this:

 

http://www.oceanbeachdigital.com

 

I didn't think the ocean beach worked with Stage compacts. It didn't as of the last keyboard mag review.

[AnotherScott]

Check the review, it works with the Compacts, the issue was that there is not a large enough clear surface to simply sit it there, so you'd have to be creative in where/how to mount it. Check here for some ideas...

https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2509471/NS2_stick_wheel_removal

[Pete Nalda]

Check the review, it works with the Compacts, the issue was that there is not a large enough clear surface to simply sit it there, so you'd have to be creative in where/how to mount it. Check here for some ideas...

https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2509471/NS2_stick_wheel_removal

 

Oh, man! I don't know if I'd want to remove my wheel or stick. Maybe I could just plop it on top of the draw buttons? ;p

 

[Pete Nalda]

U have 'PM

Can you embellish what you mean by "PM"?

[AnotherScott]

Oh, man! I don't know if I'd want to remove my wheel or stick. Maybe I could just plop it on top of the draw buttons? ;p

Yeah, nobody liked the idea of removing the wheel or stick! But if you read the rest of the thread, people came up with other ideas. And actually, yeah, maybe you could come up with some way to put them over the drawbuttons, the size is right... the problem is that you'd also be blocking access to the percussion, C/V, and VX/Farf/B3 mode buttons... you could still call up the settings you want via stored presets, but if you like to manipulate those controls in real time, that would be an issue. There is actually an optional mounting plate you can buy for the NS2-73 that places the drawbars to the left of the pitch/mod controls, but I don't know if it works on the Stage Classic.

[Pete Nalda]

Did read the DB-1 stage issue thread, and yeah it might could be done. Still, a lot of thinking is involved, as I'd really like to slim down my rig size (I have to share rides with other musicians, as I don't drive a car, since I'm legally blind. Getting back to the VR-09 question, has anyone figured out a way to use the effects section or editing to give the Hammond or combo organ sounds some sustain on the release, thus making it sound like an old Elka, Lowerey, or Gibson organ?

[AnotherScott]

Oh, man! I don't know if I'd want to remove my wheel or stick.

Of course, if you go with the alternate plan of an SK1, you won't have a wheel or stick there either. ;-)

 

If budget isn't an issue, the SK1 does seem like the stronger organ, if that's your focus. Besides the sound, there's the action, the dedicated controls (without having to use an iPad), the transistor organ sounds, the better pedal arrangement. You'd be losing those pitch/mod controls, the wider variety of sounds, the VA synth functionality, the ability to split/layer two non-organ sounds. But if you're keeping the MicroX, most of that can be addressed, and the MIDI zoning capability of the SK1 makes it pretty easy to integrate the MicroX sounds into your main programs. Of course, the combination of an SK1+MicroX is not as compact and light as a VR-09...

[Joe Muscara]

U have 'PM

Can you embellish what you mean by "PM"?

He means Private Message. Scroll to the top of any page here, in the menu you'll see "Forum List" "My Stuff" and some others. You can either click on My Stuff and then Messages, or you can click on the flashing envelope icon next to My Stuff. That flashing icon will appear anytime you have unread messages.

[Pete Nalda]

U have 'PM

Can you embellish what you mean by "PM"?

He means Private Message. Scroll to the top of any page here, in the menu you'll see "Forum List" "My Stuff" and some others. You can either click on My Stuff and then Messages, or you can click on the flashing envelope icon next to My Stuff. That flashing icon will appear anytime you have unread messages.

 

Ok. That wasn't meant for me then. I have no messages.

[Pete Nalda]

Oh, man! I don't know if I'd want to remove my wheel or stick.

Of course, if you go with the alternate plan of an SK1, you won't have a wheel or stick there either. ;-)

 

If budget isn't an issue, the SK1 does seem like the stronger organ, if that's your focus. Besides the sound, there's the action, the dedicated controls (without having to use an iPad), the transistor organ sounds, the better pedal arrangement. You'd be losing those pitch/mod controls, the wider variety of sounds, the VA synth functionality, the ability to split/layer two non-organ sounds. But if you're keeping the MicroX, most of that can be addressed, and the MIDI zoning capability of the SK1 makes it pretty easy to integrate the MicroX sounds into your main programs. Of course, the combination of an SK1+MicroX is not as compact and light as a VR-09...

Well the microX always gets to come alog anyway. It has some orchestral sounds and sequences I use in interludes.

[knewdood]

Can someone tell me how I could get a bagpipe sound from this keyboard? Besides getting a different keyboard.

[brenner13]

Can someone tell me how I could get a bagpipe sound from this keyboard? Besides getting a different keyboard.

 

Requires an iPad and the app but there is a bagpipe waveform to work with. Got practice tonight, but will try to work on it Thursday or Friday evening if no one else has responded by then.

 

One might start with one of the accordion sounds and layer it with oboe or clarinet tweaking the filter and cutoff to taste?

[brenner13]

Wow! Bagpipes are not easy to emulate. Accordion layered with oboe is obviously a bad suggestion.

 

An hour of tweaking with the iPad app, got something close. My programming skills are only slightly past beginner, possibly novice. Wave number 116 is bagpipe, and I used all three partials. Gave each of them a fast and slight envelope pitch slide. Detuned one up, one down, and one center. Same for panning. Spent the longest time with the filter cutoff and resonance on all three...got lots more to do there.

 

MFX set to pitch shifter and dialed to about 9:30, DELAY is set to 3tap pan for now and dialed to about 8:30. REVERB is on hall dialed to 11.

 

Managed a decent top lead tone, but the low drone sounds very synthetic. May need to program two different patches and split them. Oh, that way the top could be set to unison/mono to provide some nice trill action and an even thicker sound. T'would love to do lots more but am getting tired after a hellish week.

 

I hope Roland is still working on another update so we can load individual registrations soon. I'd love to share some of the ones I've come up with and hear what others are doing with the deep capabilities of this synth.

[WesG]

In my experience, bagpipe emulation doesn't require pitch slide so much as it requires correct articulation from the player...which is not often easy!

 

If you are doing drones, two of the drones one octave below the lowest note on the chanter, and the bass drone is tuned an octave below that. The drone note never changes.

 

Another difficulty with replicating bagpipes is that the scale is not anywhere close to even-tempered, and the low/high G and A notes are not exactly an octave apart! This requires microtuning capabilities which the VR-09 doesn't have -- if you are trying to replicate highland pipe tunes an experienced listener will know it's "wrong" right away.

 

A final observation is that one bagpipe doesn't usually sound right..you need at least two! So detuning and doubling is definitely called for IMO.

 

For fun and to see what I mean -- try this. Load this Youtube video in two tabs, and click play in one tab a few seconds after the tab. All of a sudden the tone of the instrument takes on a whole new life.

 

 

Wes

 

PS: I agree w.r.t. Roland needing to make individual registrations exchangeable!!! Or at least document the file format of the saved image!

[Laurence]

Overall I love the VR-09, but it does have some issues. Here is my list so far:

 

1 - when editing deeper level of sound programming with the iPad app, only one variation per editable synth patch is allowed. This can be saved in a registration but while if you directly access the synth patch directly you get the original, any attempt to use it in a new registration will give you the edited version saved in the earlier registration. If you try to edit it again it will also change any earlier registrations which refer to it.

 

2 - when the batteries start to die, you will get a "CHANGE BATTERIES" message that lasts for a few seconds. The trouble is it mutes the audio during this message. Roland tells me that most customers prefer it this way.

 

3 - audio DSP effects aside from reverb and Leslie have no subtle level settings. The lowest distortion is already pretty strong and all the delay effects aside from the triple tap delay have a level equal to what you are delaying which makes them all but useless.

 

4: The Leslie effect will also be applied to anything layered with it unless you use "Atelier mode". Unfortunately "Atelier mode" also turns all the DSP aside from reverb completely off the non organ sounds and it is a global setting that is not saved per registration.

 

5: Organ percussion has the chorus vibrato setting applied to it.

 

Feel free to add to my list. I'm not slamming this keyboard because I really do like it. I just want to submit a list to their engineers of what us users would like to see fixed in a firmware update.

 

Some of it would be quite simple to implement. For instance making Atelier mode a registration programmable setting would make a huge difference on registrations where an organ is layered with something else. Getting rid of the audio mute with low batter message would be easy.

 

Some things like how chorus vibrato is handled may not be fixable with the way the audio is routed in the design.

 

The way the iPad edited synth sounds is currently handled is almost completely useless. If there isn't memory allocated for all the deep parameters to be saved per registration, something as simple as having subsequent registrations use the original factory settings and giving an error message should you try to do a second edit on that sound.

 

The levels of the echoes and distortion effects are ridiculous. Distortion kicks in at a higher level than I usually use and everything past about 11 o'clock is unusable. If the delays have to be set at one level, something like half as loud as the source could be actually used. A delay as loud as the source is way too much for every single use I can think of.

[garnermike]

Been a while since I've posted on this thread, and forgive me for recapping posts of many months ago. I was an early buyer of the VR-09. I had owned a VR-760 previously (loved it, but, loading-wise, could not deal with its size/weight), so although I have used an SK1 exclusively for two years now (238 gigs), I preferred the greater control I had with the rotary sim FAST speed on a Roland than I did with the SK1.

 

I loved the VR-09 organ tone, and loved its size/weight. Given what and how I play with my band, however, I needed to play in transposed keys and be able to switch personally-tailored voices mid-song and remain in that transposed key. VR-09 could not do that. Secondarily, I needed to be able to limit the rotary effect to the base organ layer (without its dual voice also being "rotaried"). VR-09 could not do that either. I'll guess that there may have been work-arounds to these problems, but it always came down to being able to make quick, one-handed, 1 or 2 button-pushes-at-most changes mid-song, and the workarounds that were suggested/tried weren't that simple. I returned the VR-09. Short of Roland addressing these two pet peeves in an update or next-gen VR-09 or (lighter) next-gen VR-700, am still waiting for my "ideal" organ/keyboard to come to market. Yes, it looks like the Nord Electro 4D might do the trick, but "ideal" in my eyes also does not mean another $2K purchase.

For what it's worth, I now used the Strymon Lex rotary pedal with the SK1. Found it more to my liking than the Ventilator, which I bought/tried/returned, and much better sounding at FAST rotary speed that the SK1's internal rotary sim.

Yes, yes, I know. My needs/druthers/personal tastes on the SK1 and Lex vs. Vent rotary effects, and also on global transposing may strike many readers as weird. But that's just me, and I gotta follow my ear, the limitations on my keyboard playing abilities, and my band's needs.

[Kevmo]

The transpose on other rolands could be tweeked with 1 rt hand . Now you must stop playing and use both

 

[Kevmo]

Its odd how the same company that made Fantom efx could get the vr so wacked

 

[To B3]

On ther downloadable manual, the "transpose button settings" are on the "settings that can be saved on registrations... on page 59 of the new OS manual...

 

Can't you save your transposed sounds all in one or two banks and use them from there? Looks like it might do the trick, no? Sorry if I misunderstood your issue...

 

[Kevmo]

The transpose on other rolands could be tweeked with 1 rt hand . Now you must stop playing and use both

 

[AnotherScott]

I needed to play in transposed keys and be able to switch personally-tailored voices mid-song and remain in that transposed key. VR-09 could not do that. Secondarily, I needed to be able to limit the rotary effect to the base organ layer (without its dual voice also being "rotaried"). VR-09 could not do that either. I'll guess that there may have been work-arounds to these problems, but it always came down to being able to make quick, one-handed, 1 or 2 button-pushes-at-most changes mid-song, and the workarounds that were suggested/tried weren't that simple.

... it looks like the Nord Electro 4D might do the trick, but "ideal" in my eyes also does not mean another $2K purchase.

Nord E4D won't solve your problems either. You can't split/layer one sound through the rotary without putting a second sound through the rotary, because you can't split/layer at all. And you might not be that happy with the transpose function, as it is not a quick one-hand 1-2 button press, it's in a menu. I think your SK1 is probably the best choice for you, all things considered.

 

I'm actually not sure how the SK1 fails to meet your ideal. What VR-09 function(s) do you really wish it had? I guess getting a fast rotary speed you like without having to add a pedal? Anything else?

[brenner13]

Transpose is still a one handed function and can be saved per registration.

 

I hate that the audio cuts out every thirty seconds or so as the batteries near depletion with no warning! Live performing artists would never prefer this over flashing an alternating black/white screen. Get a clue, Roland.

 

Agreed, the effects are quite limited however, I make great use of them. For more detailed control, get some pedals or an effects rack.