Korg SV-1: from GAS to pass?

[tylert]

I definitely think the Factory Presets are lame, but some have managed to get them to sound alright through the different sound packs and editor. Does anyone know for sure if korg is releasing the sequel? I'm tempted to buy the black one and see what I can do with it for a couple weeks. Worst case scenario.. I return it. I can't imagine the sv2 being any less than $2500

[Dave Ferris]

From my dealer info, who got this from the rep-there won't be an SV2 till at least next year. Which to me means- like the SV1, they could announce it around Nov or Dec, preview it at NAMM and then like Sven said-expect it, Near Around Mid May..

 

My advice is to find a used P120 on CL.. Seriously. After going round and round with all this stuff, I couda been just as happy and no worse off with a CP33 or just keeping my P120.

[The Real MC]

My advice is to find a used P120 on CL.. Seriously. After going round and round with all this stuff, I couda been just as happy and no worse off with a CP33 or just keeping my P120.

 

Have to agree.

 

I was VERY tempted to grab one of those reverse color SV-1, but 1) I would lose the great pianos on my P-90 2) who the devil is gonna see that reverse color keyboard on stage anyway?!?

 

Tried at least two SV-1s in separate stores - excellent EPs but weak acoustic pianos.

[Pale]

Hey dude, your avatar is so cool, though I must admit I've seen it somewhere!

[Aidan]

My advice is to find a used P120 on CL.. Seriously. After going round and round with all this stuff, I couda been just as happy and no worse off with a CP33 or just keeping my P120.

 

The voice of experience. But Dave, think of all the fun of spending all that money you'd have missed out on!

[Seannn]

There are a wealth of digital pianos available on Kijiji. My friends owns a P-140 and though I like the piano sound, I'm not a huge fan of the action (it's heavy). Same thing with the P-155. The P-155 new is running around $1000, and for a few hundred extra (sure, it's an expense, but for me it's extra days at work or the sale of some old gear), I can get the SV-1, which I think packs a lot more punch in terms of available sounds and tweakability. It won't allow me to reproduce the emotion and gorgeous dynamics of Chopin, but from what I heard through good headphones, it definitely works for my playing. Regarding the SV-2, I'm not surprised we'll only hear about it around next year--we've already been waiting a heck of a long time. I'm surprised though that we didn't get an SV-2 closer to the Kronos release, and was bummed that nothing was announced at the last NAMM. The keyboard is turning three years old, and we haven't seen many updates, or official word from Korg that a new version is in the works. I think an SV-2 will have huge potential, especially if the action is fixed.

[tylert]

I actually wanted a P120 awhile back good pianos and passable rhodes? I was turned off by all the broken key reports though. I bought a Kurzweil sp4-8, decent action on it. The rhodes sounded great in the mid and bass sections, but the upper keys were horrendous. Organs were surprising playable, but the leslie was basically vibrato. The pianos were shockingly bad.. never heard pianos sound this bad in all my life. The whole thing felt like it was designed to make people long for the Pc3x. Returned it.. and now I'm back living vicariously on these forums. Anybody got experience with the Motif xs rack mount? Are the sounds dated?

[Dave Ferris]

If the Rhodes is your main concern, you won't be happy at all with the P120 although the rhodes was surprisingly good for what it was. It was almost like an oversight from Yamaha to the point of---oops what are we doing putting something that sounds this good in a more home/school piano like the P120. Get that off there and be sure not to include it on future models ...P140, 155, 85, 90 CP33 etc.

 

However just for the EPs, the SV1 will smoke the P120 hands down. Which probably goes without saying at this point.

 

I do think the new Black ones feel different then the old ones. Different meaning better...fwiw.

 

[tylert]

 

 

I wish there were more performance videos of the sv1 like this. Can't find any videos of the reworked Rhodes sounds from sound pack 2 in a band setting. To me thats the ultimate sales pitch right there.. how it sounds with a band. Any good Rhodes emulation on its own, is gonna sound lush and warm with great detail. You mix it in with the band and its either barking up a storm trying to compete, or just mushy sounding. I'm definitely not into the dyno rhodes from the original set. Thats usually the sound I step over to get to the good ones. I can't understand why they only made the one sample?? I'm starting to get interested in the nord E3 hp, i.e. the video. Anyone tried it? Guitar Centers in CT don't carry any of these specialty boards, so I have to pinpoint online.

[resigned]

To me thats the ultimate sales pitch right there... how it sounds with a band. Any good Rhodes emulation on its own, is gonna sound lush and warm with great detail. You mix it in with the band and its either barking up a storm trying to compete, or just mushy sounding.

 

Which is why it's strange to me that the one feature of the SV-1 that is the least talked about is it's tube preamp because that's what gives it so much more presence and balls over Nords, Kurzweil and yes even Yamahas. It's not as noticeable in a quiet room through headphones but you hook the SV-1 up to a good amp at a live gig and you get it instantly. The EP's jump out and are fuller and warmer than anything you can get by watching a YouTube video. It turns heads.

 

I suppose you can get that effect from a Nord something or another and a tube preamp from another source but the built-in tube preamp of the SV-1 shows that Korg got it right. It's because of the way the SV-1 sounds live that I own one.

[Gary75]

I don't believe the tube does anything in the SV-1, backlit with a plastic display cover, I think it's purely cosmetic for those who believe tubes work in every context. Same as the XK3 I had.

[FedzKeyz]

The tube does do something, as anyone can attest whose tube has blown. When the tube has blown the amp sims don't work.

Whether it does anything useful is harder to determine...

[resigned]

There's plenty of info available online about what the SV-1 tube does, but if you can't be bothered with Google then here's some info taken from a review by Gearwire :

 

"Likewise, you cant overlook the visual appeal of the glowing 12AX7 tube at the far left of the controls, but it adds significantly to the sound of the instrument. The tube couples with a virtual output transformer and a modeled dummy speaker, simulating the circuitry and signal flow of a tube amp. The resulting grit and warmth is very satisfying, particularly when you play dense clusters or spank the low end of the electric-piano patches."

[The Real MC]

I don't believe the tube does anything in the SV-1, backlit with a plastic display cover, I think it's purely cosmetic for those who believe tubes work in every context. Same as the XK3 I had.

 

The problem wasn't your XK3 as the tube most definitely DOES function as expected in my XK3.

[Gary75]

When the words 'virtual', and 'simulating' are used, I'll stick to my first hand experience of it. It sounds no 'grittier'' than the Nord I exchanged it for in my opinion. I agree it's in the signal path and it won't make a sound because of that, but I found the amp sims awful as was noticed by many.

 

 

[Charleston]

Yep, you have to hand it to Korg on the whole tube circuitry thing. Not just the pre-amp, but the power amp also gives it that phenomenal tone.

 

But isn't the "valve reactor circuitry" one of the primary reasons that acoustic piano may not ever sound as expected on an SV-1?

 

From the SV-1 manual:

The Valve Reactor circuitry in the SV-1 has been tuned-up especially for live performance.

Since conventional modeling effects for line recording are not used

directly with a speaker, they do not include a power amp circuit, output transformer,

or speaker. In other words, they only have a preamp circuit.

A real valve amp sound, however, is produced not just by the preamp, but also by

the tone and distortion of the power amp, and by the constant changes in

impedance that are created by the power amp driving the speakers. The SV-1

contains an actual low-wattage valve power amp circuit, a virtual output transformer

that uses solid-state components to simulate an output transformer, and

a dummy speaker circuit that simulates the varying impedance of a real speaker.

This means that although its low-power, the SV-1 has the same circuit structure

of an actual all-valve amp.

This is great when playing live, because the sound arriving to the main mixer is

the same of a real analogue amp captured by high-quality mics.

[tylert]

The tube does do something, as anyone can attest whose tube has blown. When the tube has blown the amp sims don't work.

Whether it does anything useful is harder to determine...

 

People have already blow tubes?? I would say 86 the Tube for the sv2, if thats the case. Is it really worth having to potentially ship it off to a service center every couple of years. Sounds like a money pit if you ask me. The new color schemes are just desperate attempts to get the price back up.

 

The real keyboard game changer would be to have a high end sound module built into a keyboard, with optional action. No company will ever built it, because you'd never have to buy another. The lates and greatest vst's would be all you'd have to pay for. The only way I could see it ever happening, is if they had control over the sounds.

[Charleston]

How often does the tube need replacing in general? What are the experiences from users here?

 

I found some threads about the tube blowing frequently. Is this still the case? If so, are there ways to avoid this?

 

I read that the tube isn't user-servicable (voids warranty), and isn't easy to get to anyway. Is this still the case, or did Korg make some changes?

[MikeT156]

It sounds like a money pit.

 

 

Mike T.

[Seannn]

The black SV-1 is selling for a price that's much lower than either the 73 or 88-key red models...

I think Korg just wanted to give the keyboard a final push since clearly the SV-2 is taking a while.

[hoggernick]

How often does the tube need replacing in general? What are the experiences from users here?

 

I found some threads about the tube blowing frequently. Is this still the case? If so, are there ways to avoid this?

 

I read that the tube isn't user-servicable (voids warranty), and isn't easy to get to anyway. Is this still the case, or did Korg make some changes?

I owned one for about a year and a half, gigged with it almost every weekend, and never had any trouble with the tube. It's supposedly just a 12AX7, which is a very common preamp tube. Any guitar shop ought to have 12AX7s. It sure looks like it would be easy to replace, four phillips screws to remove the window in front of it. I never tried to take it out though.

[Charleston]

I owned one for about a year and a half, gigged with it almost every weekend, and never had any trouble with the tube. It's supposedly just a 12AX7, which is a very common preamp tube. Any guitar shop ought to have 12AX7s. It sure looks like it would be easy to replace, four phillips screws to remove the window in front of it. I never tried to take it out though.

 

I've read that the SV-1 case has to be opened to access the tubes, and the glass cover is purely cosmetic (and for protection). After tube is replaced, there is an "alignment procedure" necessary to match levels of regular vs amp modeler. Anything other than a Korg authorized service center would void the warranty. But even post-warranty it seems that DIY may not be doable for some considering the "alignment procedure"?

[RahZee]

I tried the SV-1 in the music store. Didn't like it. Haven't used headphones for that, maybe it was the amp...

[MojoGuyPan]

All this worrying about the tube in the SV-1 is ridiculous. It is a commonly available preamp tube that is inexpensive. In addition these tubes will easily last ten years or more, it's not a power tube. Even a power tube will last 2000 to 4000 hours, Which would be five or six years of heavy use.

 

The 12ax7 should give 10 to 12 years of service minimum. At that point you wouldn't have a warranty to worry about voiding and you could just replace the tube yourself. Get a multimeter and bias it yourself via the trimpot, if needed. Not a big deal.

 

The real question is whether you'll still want to play the Korg a decade from now when the SV1's succesors will probably have better acoustic pianos and hammond modelling with drawbars. By then, the SV-4 will have been announced at NAMM.

[AnotherScott]

All this worrying about the tube in the SV-1 is ridiculous. It is a commonly available preamp tube that is inexpensive. In addition these tubes will easily last ten years or more, it's not a power tube. Even a power tube will last 2000 to 4000 hours, Which would be five or six years of heavy use.

 

The 12ax7 should give 10 to 12 years of service minimum. At that point you wouldn't have a warranty to worry about voiding and you could just replace the tube yourself. Get a multimeter and bias it yourself via the trimpot, if needed. Not a big deal.

 

The real question is whether you'll still want to play the Korg a decade from now when the SV1's succesors will probably have better acoustic pianos and hammond modelling with drawbars. By then, the SV-4 will have been announced at NAMM.

 

Meanwhile, how many of us are using iPhones and iPads (and now even the Macbooks) with non user-replacable batteries...

[tylert]

I'm thinking about keeping the Sp4-8. There was a problem with the shipping so they sent it back to me. I have the option to send it back with a new routing #, but does anyone have any advice for playing in stereo. The piano samples may be passable in that way. My only concern is the low volumes. Why is that? In mono its hot as hell, but the pianos sound like complete ass. The kurzweil rep. suggested two balanced cables.. but I can't imagine it getting to the mono levels. There are aspects of this board that I really like.. price included.

[MojoGuyPan]

TylerT,

 

Using balanced cables on the Kurzweil for stereon will make a huge difference in volume. When I first got mine, a PC3LE7, and used regular TS cables my volume was really low, about half of what my Moog was putting out. I didn't have any problem with any other keyboards. Dave W. suggested using balanced cables, I did and now it's output matches all of my other boards. I was skeptical but he was right. I'm sure the SP-4 is the same way.

 

To bring it back on topic, I'd like to see what Korg does with the next Iteration of the SV-1. I love the way it looks and the Rhodes patches. If the acoustic pianos were better and there was a better selecton of B3 registrations it might be a keeper. I was excited about the SV-1 when announced but it only made it to the warning track

[tylert]

Thanks for that Marsalone. Will any balanced cables do? is there any specific brand or type? For instance.. I just looked up one that said mono balanced cables. A bit confusing. thanks.

[Dave Ferris]

.

[MojoGuyPan]

Tyler, I'm just using the Hosa CSS-20x dual balanced cables. It has both cables glued together with 1/4" TRS plugs all around.

 

I have no idea why it makes a difference in volume but it does. On my Kawai stage piano, the outputs will accept balanced or unbalanced if you use TS cables but there is no difference in output levels.

 

The only thing I can think of is that in the Kurzweil manual it specifically states to use balanced cables so maybe it isn't designed as a combination output like my Kawai.