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Bored with current boards


zephonic

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I finally got to spend some quality time with the Jupiter 80 and Korg Kronos, as well as the Nord Stage something and am mucho unimpressed. I've used software pretty much exclusively over the last two years or so, and now these boards just sound uninteresting to me. There are some sounds that give me the feeling, but for the kind of money you have to put down to get with this, it needs to be better.

 

Am I just blase or is anyone else feeling the same way?

 

 

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Practice more. Get on an acoustic piano and get away from the gear for awhile.
This. Though a real Hammond is cool, too, if you're into that. :)

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

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For me, all the "gear" is (for the most part) simply a means to an end.

 

It's not that I don't get excited over the odd new piece occasionally, but there hasn't been anything that has come out over the years that enhances my creativity, furthers my execution or allows me to become a better player.

 

There are certain pieces I better "connect" with than others (which is why i buy one thing over another), but that's more personal choice than advances in the "new gear." I certainly don't connect with ANY of my newer digital gear the way I do with my Hammond, Rhodes, Minimoog or AP, but some gear gets me closer than others.

 

From a function/feature/sound perspective, good hardware has never been cheaper, but as a guy that started playing in the 70's and remember what I had to pay for my new Prophet 5, a new Kronos seems like a bargain, and a used Motif ES is almost free by comparison.

 

I love the wide array of high quality sounds available from a Kronos or Motif, but I don't connect with playing either one of them the way I do my "dedicated" instruments, but I do occasionally need the arsenal of sounds they have, so I keep one around. I love a high quality/low weight Hammond clone and digital stage piano, because of the practical side of being an actively gigging musician. I love the advances in recording technology that has made with plugins, soft instruments and lower cost hardware that allows VERY good results, for a fraction of the cost of what was available 20 years ago.

 

All stuff above is great, but none of it will make me a better player. It just gets me closer to being able to replicate my beloved instruments that I can't put in the back of my car and take to my local gigs, and make a better recording of same.

 

I also think that "soft instruments" represent the future in some ways. Certainly if you're in a studio or home environment and you have lots of processing power at your disposal, your choices are only limited by the market and its all far more affordable than the hardware counterpart. However, for the average gigging musician that NEEDS that machine to fire up, each and every time, not ever crash or hang, hardware currently better represents that solution. The software hosting solutions are getting better and at some point, will likely replace hardware, just not today (but tomorrow's looking better).

 

When I compose, arrange or play for pleasure or crawl into the woodshed, it's always (ALWAYS) at the grand, first and foremost (unless I'm working on some Hammond stuff, and then I'm at the B or C).

 

Everything else is only a tool.

 

 

 

 

Yamaha C7 Grand, My Hammonds: '57 B3, '54 C2, '42 BC, '40 D, '05 XK3 Pro System, Kawai MP9000, Fender Rhodes Mk I 73, Yamaha CP33, Motif ES6, Nord Electro 2, Minimoog Voyager & Model D, Korg MS10
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Everything else is only a tool.

 

:thu::thu::thu::thu::thu:

 

A.C.

 

What Meisenhower said. Perfectly.

 

I just scored a Korg Kronos and am blown away by it's features and useability. I think the Korg is a great addition to my studio/live control, and can select any sound I want from a variety of sources. These include softsynths, and if I were so inclined, modular synths (Which I do not have.) Reading these new technology boards bore someone seems strange to me.

 

Step away from your boards! ;)

Steve Force,

Durham, North Carolina

--------

My Professional Websites

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Software is the way to go if sounds are your interest. You can diversify and create about anything without having to depend on the accompanying hardware. Get into software. Do it yourself rather than counting on a manufacturer, waiting for the next big thing.
"Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown."
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Practice more. Get on an acoustic piano and get away from the gear for awhile.

 

Most definitely.

 

Try working on Confirmation in Gb, There will never be another you in B, Blues in Ab, Rhythm changes in A, Cherokee in D.

 

Take a Bach Invention and just work the LH alone.

 

This kind of stuff wIll make one a better player, not gear.

https://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

 

 NY Steinway D

Yamaha  AvantGrand N3X, P-515

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Depends on what you're going for, Zaephonic. IIRC you do music production professionally and your playing is mostly (perhaps all) in the studio, right? Well, for that application, of course software is going to smoke any one board designed for live performance. Compromises are made for weight, cost, and usability on the fly (to varying degrees based on what the board is for). Software, I would hope, is much more flexible and powerful, but you gotta dig around a bit.

 

For me nothing beats a well-maintained grand piano. And no gigging board for that purpose comes close. If your tool of choice is software, probably no hard- wired board will come close.

Original Latin Jazz

CD Baby

 

"I am not certain how original my contribution to music is as I am obviously an amateur." Patti Smith

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I think people are kind of missing the point with the "practice more" comments. While practicing more is almost always a good suggestion in general, it seems to me what the OP is talking about is hardware being eclipsed by software. This is not surprising and really the industry has been leading up to this point for some time.

 

Yes, if you play live in the traditional sense, hardware is usually a more practical option. But if you're a modern electronic musician or studio only, hardware, with exceptions of course, is getting to be passé.

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Yes, if you play live in the traditional sense, hardware is usually a more practical option. But if you're a modern electronic musician or studio only, hardware, with exceptions of course, is getting to be passé.

 

Yeah that''s my take on it too. My lust for hardware keyboards is directly proportional to how much I'm playing live. If it's not much, then I really have no interest whatsoever in what's new in hardware keyboards.

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That's the whole thing. I'm looking around for a new gig axe but I can't see why I would wanna spend 3K+ for one of these. Not that they are bad or anything, it just seems a lot of money for what you get.

 

Right now I'm leaning more towards a (pre-owned?) Motif XS as it could still adequately cover the sort of stuff I mostly do.

 

 

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Right now I'm leaning more towards a (pre-owned?) Motif XS as it could still adequately cover the sort of stuff I mostly do.

 

Right now I'm leaning more towards a pre-owned CP5. I don't see paying $2500 for one, but $1500 - maybe.

 

I still so play live some - but I'm thinking the same way you are. These hardware boards are awfully expensive when you can achieve the same or better quality in software for a fraction of the cost.

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For what you get AND for what I personally would use. ( I probably would never do my own sampling and I never mess with sequencers, just never have had to.) I would probably get a $2400 S90XS before spending $3k+ on the latest and greatest flagship boards. Controllers functionality, good set of sounds, and 88 keys. It depends on how the action and I get along if I ever make the drive to St. Louis or Chicago to test drive one. The last weighted after touch board I owned almost crippled me.

 

I'm a hardware guy ... in real life I used to build client/server based financial systems and I am a Sybase DBA but when it comes to music I am pretty computer ignorant.

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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But if you're a modern electronic musician or studio only, hardware, with exceptions of course, is getting to be passé.

 

Not the whole story IMO.

There are real players being electronic musicians, but coming from the traditional sense of live gigging and studio session work.

If these want the ideal haptics, regardless of the sound, they want quality and ergonomic designed hardware.

 

In the computer based composition, arrangement and recording environment, the software satisfies soundwise in most cases, depending on the power of the rig and resulting latency etc..

But the controllers are necessary and that´s a matter of keybed -, physical controllers - and overall build quality too.

 

It´s also hard to differenciate hardware from software today because most modern keyboards process software (VA or whatever engine) anyway and it also doesn´t matter if samples are in a ROM, on a hardrive or SSD w/ the exception of file sizes and loading speed.

 

To me, it´s questionable whether a keyboard w/ controller haptics in a shell, offering a processor to run algorhythmic "engines", is a hardware instrument or not because the computer does the same,- except offering the haptics.

Both don´t deliver sound themselves unless an algorhythm, running on a processor, generates the sound.

So, the the software is tone generator and not the shell, looking like a real hardware instrument.

 

Now, if I look at a grand piano, an electromechanical instrument or a pure analog synth built from discrete electronics,- that´s a hardware instrument.

 

For me, the result is, if I plan to buy a new keyboard and investigate, I look for the best haptics, keyboard action and MIDI functionality I can get and eventually live w/ the mediocre sound for the advantage to get a good controller for studio usage and (occasional) gigging.

 

Most sounds work for live anyway, especially for the common keyboardist being mixed in the background.

If the gig needs 1st class sounds,- I bring the software in addition, DSP, VST, whatever is available, sounds good and works reliable.

 

I´m aware all this doesn´t rule for the purists, but I also wonder how much users would buy a Kronos or a Mojo if exactly these software engines would be available for their computers.

 

A.C.

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That's the whole thing. I'm looking around for a new gig axe but I can't see why I would wanna spend 3K+ for one of these. Not that they are bad or anything, it just seems a lot of money for what you get.

Z, I feel ya mayne. If I were to buy a gig rig today, it would be a Yamaha CP33 and a synth. The whole package would cost less than $3k brand new. :cool:

PD

 

"The greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love and be loved in return."--E. Ahbez "Nature Boy"

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Right now I'm leaning more towards a pre-owned CP5. I don't see paying $2500 for one, but $1500 - maybe.

 

I think Dave Ferris has one up for sale? I have been eyeing it myself.

 

Off the market.... plays and sounds too good. I just need to suck it up and go the gym more frequently. :):cool:

 

I have a connect that will split the difference between the the two prices mentioned by Bill.

https://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

 

 NY Steinway D

Yamaha  AvantGrand N3X, P-515

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I finally got to spend some quality time with the Jupiter 80 and Korg Kronos, as well as the Nord Stage something and am mucho unimpressed. I've used software pretty much exclusively over the last two years or so, and now these boards just sound uninteresting to me. There are some sounds that give me the feeling, but for the kind of money you have to put down to get with this, it needs to be better.

 

Am I just blase or is anyone else feeling the same way?

 

 

I feel the same way. Most new boards bore the piss out of me. I like the Moog Voyager, the Arturia Mini Brute (despite the stupid name that is taken from Polytone), and it starts falling away after that. The Poly Evolver's sort of interesting. The Nords and that Korg vintage Rhodes thing does some decent replications of old electro-acoustical keyboards, so those are okay.

 

After that, YAWWWWWWWWN. If there's another interesting board out there, I don't know about it. Especially for how expensive they are. Why am I going to want to drop $3k on a board that is dreadfully dull?

 

At this point anyway, don't most of us have keyboards or setups that already do what we want them to do? Or no?

 

 

 

 

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I don't know if it counts as a keyboard or software but the Arturia Origin looks like a really cool idea to me. But unless I win Powerball I won't spend $3,000 on it.

 

I just don't need it but it looks like fun.

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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If there's another interesting board out there, I don't know about it. Especially for how expensive they are. Why am I going to want to drop $3k on a board that is dreadfully dull?

 

To find out, we now need a new forum and magazine.

The "Keybored Player Mag"

 

A.C.

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Hmmm... I love the Kronos. I find it really inspiring.

 

I've just had a friend around my house and he was blown away by the sound quality. Its a seriously great machine. I haven't had a workstation in years and I'm really impressed at what Korg have done... there are some amazing patches in the machine. I have a little session on Saturday where I will show a new singer some of my material and this seems like the perfect way to do it.

 

In contrast I have found the endless Roland and Yamaha workstations a bit long in the tooth... although I am sure they can also create excellent sounds.

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I have a brand new Kronos and I love it too.. it's quite inspiring to play. At one time or another all of us get tired with our instruments, whether it's a Hammond B3, a sophisticated synth workstation, an acoustic guitar, a flute, or a piano... The fact is that you can get bored with having to much or having too little...!!

 

Sometimes you need to step away from your instrument, whatever that is, and that may mean digging yourself out of the technology, and instead just go play the bongos... or pick up an acoustic guitar... on the other hand, sometimes a new keyboard is exactly what the doctor ordered.

 

At this time, the new Kronos is very inspiring, however, I have to say that of all the available sounds, it's the acoustic piano that's really got my juices flowing right now!

Craig MacDonald

Hammond BV, Franken-B (A100 in a BV cabinet), Leslies 122/147/44W, Crumar Mojo, HX3 module, Korg Kronos, VR-09, Roland GAIA, Burn, Ventilator

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