Personal IEM mixes.

[CEB]

How do you do personal IEM monitor mixes when there are more band members than monitor sends on the main board? The 5 piece band I play in is going to IEMs and the board has 4 monitor sends and we are supposed to get our own mix and but I am having trouble picturing how this will work. Without someone sharing a mix.

 

I know part of the upgrade is to buy a digital board, maybe the new board had 6 sends.

 

YouTube so far has been no help. Thanks.

[Skinny]

Are there any direct outs on the current board?

[J. Dan]

I'm sure Skinny's going to suggest running the direct outs to a second mixer or more monitor mixes. If you're going to buy another mixer, for $999 the A&H mix wizard is the only mixer in that price range with 6 simultaneous sends. We are also a 5-pc and use that mixer fir our IEM's.

 

Otherwise, 2 people are going to have to agree on, and share, an IEM mix. I would think that the most likely combination would be bass and drums.

[CEB]

Thanks. Our current board has Insert I/O jacks on each channel but I didn't think using the loop would be a real hot idea.

 

I think part of the upgrade may be some sort of digital board. I know this is all predicated on the band leader selling his PA system for about $6000. It is going to be a big chunk of change. I'm not sure if the numbers will make sense but he wants to do it. I'm looking forward to it because some of monitor mixes at gigs get louder than **** sometimes.

 

Thanks again.

 

 

[Ken Beaumont]

Otherwise, 2 people are going to have to agree on, and share, an IEM mix. I would think that the most likely combination would be bass and drums.

 

+1 The only band using IEM I know of that doesn't do that is one where the bass player is the main vocalist.

[Adan]

Bass and drums should share, like others said. In my 14-piece band, we are sharing some mixes, and I am stuck sharing a mix with one of the guitar players. It's not working out well for me. The whole IEM thing has been good for the band, but not so much for me. I greatly miss hearing the bass response from my keyboard monitor, and I'm in a perpetual volume war with the guitar player who shares my mix. Sometimes I bring my monitor just to supplement my mix. You will probably have better luck, but by all means you should have your own mix.

[RedKey]

I've only had experience with the Shure systems, but they have both a stereo mode and a mix mode. Mix mode allows you to blend the two inputs. You could have a single aux send with a balance of the entire mix on one input and your direct out on another (this only works if you are using one channel). Then you can turn yourself up or down in relation to an overall mix.

 

If you are using multiple channels, something like the Shure P4M mixer ($339 new & I've seen them around $200 on the bay) would give you 4 splitter channels + a stereo input to feed your IEM mix. Example: you could run your mic and a couple keyboard sends through it and on to you main mixer. You could use a single aux (with a general mix) from the mixer to the forth input. Then you could personally blend your mix as you wish.

 

These are more ideas than direct suggestions.

 

I've never been able to get an entire band on IEM's, so I went a more proactive route. My IEM's have ambient mics built in with an adjustable attenuator. I can bring the stage volume down to a pleasant level. I use my keyboard sub-mixer to feed my IEMs' giving me control to dial me up to an appropriate volume.

 

Re: your PA. You can get a lot for 6k: My portable PA now consists of a Presonus 16.4.2 (6 aux sends), Powered QSC mains (K10's) and QSC subs(HPR151i's), & 3 QSC powered monitors (K10 & two K8's) for those not using IEM's. System is loud, clean, fits in my Murano (seats folded down), and was under 6k.

[HAMEGZ]

I dont know if this would help, but there is a product by PosseAudio that is a stationary IEM. It offers you "more me, more my instrument" and the monitor mix, plus ambient mic mix,

When we do a small gig we have only one monitor mix, but only four pieces. We et the moni mix for a blend balance similar to the foh sound, and use the individual station controls for our vocal and instrument levels. You can tie in the wireless pieces for true mobility, but it gets to be a logistical issue with placement of the Posse and wireless and cabling.

My band is moving from wireless IEMs to these, but we dont have a stage show where we move out of a cords lenght.

[CEB]

What is for sale are 6 Yamaha monitor, 24 channel Yamaha board a bunch of Crown amps. There are 4 subs and I THINK 4 tops I don't know what brand the main speakers are but I was pleasantly surprise that they are not as heavy as they looked. There is also a big snake and there is some other stuff.

 

He is 55 and I am around 50 and we were they guys doing the load ins while the 20 and 30 year olds would show up about an hour before showtime and plug in their guitars and and set up their drums and play so we started contracting out sound duties. I think the price may be right but I don't know how many guys would want to buy a system this big these days.

 

I've recently stopped using a leslie just because when we go in ear I want to be ampless anyway. I sort of miss it but I guess it needs to go. Playing it at it's sweet spot made the leslie the loudest thing on stage.

 

 

[RedKey]

Playing it at it's sweet spot made the leslie the loudest thing on stage.

[CEB]

Well I heard we just bought 5 IEM systems. I guess We will see how it goes.

 

It was the right time because we are off a couple of weeks while one of our members recovers from surgery.

[JeffLearman]

Having two share a feed is the simplest solution. If that doesn't work and you do decide to daisy-chain to another monitor mixer, you can definitely use the insert jacks if they're not taken for another purpose.

 

What you'd want is what I call a "recording insert snake", but nobody makes it last I checked. But it's simple to make, using TRS 1/4" to RCA adaptor plugs and a RCA-to-TS 1/4 snake (or two).

 

The TRS 1/4" to RCA adaptor shorts the tip to ring on the insert jack, so the signal doesn't have to go down the snake and back up.

 

If you already have 1/4" snakes, you can get a bunch of these 1/4" TRS to 1/4" TS Female adaptors, but they're $16 each:

 

http://hosatech.com/products/339956/4_in_TSF

 

 

[Steve Force]

Well I heard we just bought 5 IEM systems. I guess We will see how it goes.

 

It was the right time because we are off a couple of weeks while one of our members recovers from surgery.

 

I scored a used Shure PSM-200 IEM off of eBay and I have to say--it was one of the best investments I have ever made.

 

Getting older, I worry about my hearing, since I have permanently lost certain frequencies due to my lifestyle (fast cars, fast women, fast food. ) and the IEM are tailor-made for me.

 

[mcgoo]

You mentioned going to a digital board. This may well be out of the price range, but some digital boards have card slots to drive the Aviom IEM system. In that scenerio everyone gets their own 16 channel mix (along with their own personal mixer). Pretty sweet, but not cheap.

[CEB]

That sounds really cool. But they already got the board. I haven't seen it yet but I think it is another Yamaha. The bass player was on board with sharing a mix but the drummer wants seperate mixes and thinks he can do it. He is engineer and he is pretty good at jerry rigging stuff to do what he wants.

 

I thought we were all going to go ampless except the guitar player but I guess the guitar is going to use his Marshall for creating a direct signal and not use the speaker. I trust he knows that the amp has to be under a load.

 

I guess the only things actually making noise on the stage will be the drums, acoustic guitar and my beast of a melodica. I hope this stuff all works. But I'm just the piano player. It should make things nicer with the bass going completely direct. The bass guitar player tends to get that biamped monster rig cranked up too high.

[J. Dan]

Now if you can just convince your drummer to go with electrics, you'll have no stage volume.

 

It's sort of good or bad depending on the sound guy. In the hands of a good sound guy, he can mix you like a CD with no competition from the stage. If he's bad, though...the audience hears what he mixes, nothing else. Some sound guys have trouble because they are used to just mixing vocals to go with the stage volume. When they really have to mix, they're lost. Overall, we've been fortunate to have mostly really good sound guys who appreciate no stage volume and no monitors.

[mcgoo]

That sounds really cool. But they already got the board. I haven't seen it yet but I think it is another Yamaha.

 

Yamaha makes digital cards for some of their boards specifically for the Aviom system.

[J. Dan]

I've never really considered those Aviom systems to be a viable option for gigging. I've mostly seen them at churches. For one thing, they're really expensive. Next, unless I'm mistaken, they use Ethernet cable - I can't imagine stringing the stage with Ethernet cable night after night and have it hold up. 3rd, it's a wired system - you're tethered to your personal mixer and can't move around. You could spring for a wireless IEM from the personal mixer, but then you have to have a rack or something at each location and you're buying a wireless IEM system anyway. Finally, do you really need a personal mixer within arm's reach all night? Sometimes I don't touch my IEM mixx all night. At most, a couple minor adjustments, mostly within the first couple songs. We put the monitor mixer in the middle of the stage and it's rather easy to reach over when needed - especially since we're wireless.

[Jaime Chimuelo]

I have 6 x seperate IEMs using JHAudio Pro 6 ways.

We use the Sonnicore XITE-1 and 2 x A16U Converters.

Haven't used wedges or a Power Amp based PA for years.

Not only can each member adjust their own mix, but there are 4 inserts for effects.

Bass and Drum sharing would be an OK work around but once you have made your own mix at a gig, there's no turning back.

They are so easy to use. The biggest troubles we had was back in 2000 when we first started using the UE IEM's was interferrance with the signals, as these Casinos have some serious communications for security and police bands were a hassle too.

But for the last 7 years I have actually saved my ears by proper mixing, and custom solutions.

Someday people will also realize the one size fits all headphones are so passe. Maybe if they stepped into this century and went wireless the one size fits all approach might live a few more years, but once you get IEM's you'll feel free at last.

I can take my iPad into the can and mixdown while I take a dump if I want, not that I do that, but the options are quite numerous.