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Left wrist/forearm pain


p90jr

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Okay, for some reason I'm having some pain and discomfort in my left wrist/forearm.

 

not when I play, but when it's in a normal position as opposed to n upturned playing position... and especially when I play keys.

 

I've dealt with the onset of carpal tunnel syndrome from bad fingering habits and corrected them. This is something else, in a different place.

 

Can I have played the guitar and bass too much? My day job is design and artwork but the right hand does the vast majority of that... everything but typing (but even most of that, really).

 

I've had some bike wrecks and falls over the years but instinctively put the right hand out when that happens (figuring I could probably fingerpick even if wrist motion were limited) or have moved them both out of the way and taken the brunt on shoulders...

 

I don't know... I'm careful about these things, use a dolly/cart to move gear so I'm not straining anything that way... am careful about how I do repetitive things to avoid problems...

 

All I can think is that I roll over and sleep on it a lot...

 

Anybody else have any similar problems?

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All I can think is that I roll over and sleep on it a lot...

Anybody else have any similar problems?

 

Yeah, like non-stop all day long pain, & it's often worst after a supposedly restful night of sleep, & sufficiently bad to make getting up a difficult process. More about shoulders, neck & upper arms in my case. Are you mid-late fifty-ish? A lot of this kind of stuff just comes with age, not any specific thing we've done. Could be tendonitis or any of the related soft tissue things which spring from general inflammation. I've not found a cure or any real relief yet. Let me know if something you try works.

 

Scott Fraser
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How long has it been going on? Most things like this, if they are transient, will go away in 2 or 3 weeks time. If it persists beyond that, then it's probably time to start trying to figure out what's going on...with a doctor. I've never even played one on TV, so I probably can't help you much beyond that little advice....which is absolutely worth every penny you paid for it.

"And so I definitely, when I have a daughter, I have a lot of good advice for her."

~Paris Hilton

 

BWAAAHAAAHAAHAAA!!!

 

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All I can think is that I roll over and sleep on it a lot...

Anybody else have any similar problems?

 

Yeah, like non-stop all day long pain, & it's often worst after a supposedly restful night of sleep, & sufficiently bad to make getting up a difficult process. More about shoulders, neck & upper arms in my case. Are you mid-late fifty-ish? A lot of this kind of stuff just comes with age, not any specific thing we've done. Could be tendonitis or any of the related soft tissue things which spring from general inflammation. I've not found a cure or any real relief yet. Let me know if something you try works.

 

 

early 40s. just noticed it a few days ago. Just the left forearm and lower wrist joint. I'm paying attention to everything. It might've been a day of weedeating and edging using that hand to hold the weight of the machine, plus some raking last week that did it, now that I think about it.

 

Do you ever get massages? My previous girlfriend was a massage therapist and luckily my wife now is a firm believer in them so she schedules them for us regularly. Besides just stress and fatigue there's toxins and stuff that build up in your tissue and muscles. A good massage, a warm whiripool bath afterwards and I like to have sushi for the next meal after that... feel like a new man. We also have some cheaper version of the Chuck Norris exercise thing that stretches you out as you exercise, and that does wonders for neck and shoulder stuff.

 

You say you travel a lot. Just having that many different mattresses and pillows to adjust to (not to mention flying a lot and the psychologically fatiguing hours in airports) could just add up.

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How long has it been going on? Most things like this, if they are transient, will go away in 2 or 3 weeks time. If it persists beyond that, then it's probably time to start trying to figure out what's going on...with a doctor. I've never even played one on TV, so I probably can't help you much beyond that little advice....which is absolutely worth every penny you paid for it.

 

You know, it's never liked playing keyboards (maybe it can hear my keyboard playing... ;P )but I figured it just needed to get used to it.

 

I just thought it strange that it doesn't mind guitar playing position but aches at the moment when palm down. I guess that's better than the other way around for me.

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Hand/arm relaxation practices may be in order, along with other things such as gradual strengthening exercises but, of course, it's hard to know what the cause or best solutions might be just from descriptions offered to us non-medicos...
d=halfnote
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It's really not as odd as it might seem. Depending upon the rotation and orientation of your forearm, you are using different groups of muscles. Using your fingers with the palms facing upward utilizes different forearm muscles than with the palm facing downward.

"And so I definitely, when I have a daughter, I have a lot of good advice for her."

~Paris Hilton

 

BWAAAHAAAHAAHAAA!!!

 

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I just thought it strange that it doesn't mind guitar playing position but aches at the moment when palm down. I guess that's better than the other way around for me.

 

I've read a lot of medical journal stuff concerning soft tissue injuries for musicians, & keyboard playing position is an unnatural state for the arms. The natural position at rest for the forearms is palms facing each other. Palms down stresses the tendons in the forearms, & the simple act of lifting a finger in that position exerts a lot of stress on tendons near the elbow. The old notion of working through the pain is a way to insure permanent disability. If it hurts, your body is telling you to stop doing something. It's important to not continue to inflame those tendons with continued stressful activity. I'd chill on keyboard practice until the inflammation recedes. Anti-inflammatory drugs can help a bit, ice packs and/or heat can help a bit, rest can help a lot. Good luck with it.

Scott Fraser
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I just thought it strange that it doesn't mind guitar playing position but aches at the moment when palm down. I guess that's better than the other way around for me.

 

I've read a lot of medical journal stuff concerning soft tissue injuries for musicians, & keyboard playing position is an unnatural state for the arms. The natural position at rest for the forearms is palms facing each other. Palms down stresses the tendons in the forearms, & the simple act of lifting a finger in that position exerts a lot of stress on tendons near the elbow. The old notion of working through the pain is a way to insure permanent disability. If it hurts, your body is telling you to stop doing something. It's important to not continue to inflame those tendons with continued stressful activity. I'd chill on keyboard practice until the inflammation recedes. Anti-inflammatory drugs can help a bit, ice packs and/or heat can help a bit, rest can help a lot. Good luck with it.

 

 

This is all very good, solid advice.

"And so I definitely, when I have a daughter, I have a lot of good advice for her."

~Paris Hilton

 

BWAAAHAAAHAAHAAA!!!

 

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I endorse most of what Scott F wrote above except that I'm not sure the palms down position is so outta line.

It seems very natural when yer hands are on yer knees & the apes at the zoo I watched last weekend rest that way all the time.

 

There are problems associated with how we stress our hands & arms, though, when we do work, esp. when we don't warm up, don't compensate by relaxing the muscles periodically & adopt techniques which may be unnatural, even harmful.

d=halfnote
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I endorse most of what Scott F wrote above except that I'm not sure the palms down position is so outta line.

It seems very natural when yer hands are on yer knees & the apes at the zoo I watched last weekend rest that way all the time.

 

This is coming from MDs, & I'm just repeating what I've read. This is all from a medical journal specializing in soft tissue injuries, with a certain amount of focus on athletes & to a lesser extent, musicians. A harpist client of mine, who had to stop playing for several years due to repetitive stress injuries, laid a bunch of issues of the mag on me when I first starting having arm problems 10 or 15 years back. They stress that the palms down position is a rotation away from the position of least stretch on the tendons. And it's not just that the position is harmful, but that pianists stress the tendons with continual lifting & pushing of the fingers while in that position. Apparently several ounces of force at the fingertip is multiplied many times at the point the tendon is attached near the elbow. They say it's important for pianists to rest their arms palms inward regularly. I used to spend a lot of time on the road with my hands outstretched on a mixer, fingers tensed over the faders, within the fairly stressful environment of mixing complex shows in concert halls. When I trained myself to keep my hands folded in my lap except when I actually needed to move a fader, a lot of my wrist & forearm tendonitis went away. I've got a lot of other upper arm & shoulder stuff going on now, but I still mix with minimal tension in my fingers, keeping my palms aiming sideways until I have to stretch several fingers over faders at a time, & everything from elbows down has been good for a lot of years, even as the stress level & profile of the gigs, as well as technical demands have risen exponentially.

 

I'm pretty sure apes can do a lot of shit that humans can't do as regards dexterity & flexibility, so we can't really base too much on them.

Scott Fraser
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I read some medical texts occaisionally, too; usually from this...

http://www.sciandmed.com/mppa/journalviewer.aspx?issue=1132&article=1338

 

...but let's be real here, Scott---doctors are regularly in disagreement with one another as well as the indisputable fact that much exists outside "conventional wisdom" and I'm more inclined to depend on what I've personally encountered than what I read, esp if there's some uncertainty.

 

As far as the diffs between apes & people, let's remember that people ARE apes, both in their evolution & the present reality.

 

All one has to do is rest your arms on your legs or a table in front of you to realize that the palm down position for hands is hardly unnatural.

What's better than that empirical proof ?

It may be a bit less relaxed than the palms facing pose but it's still quite comfortable.

Further, people can, if they follow good practices to develop & relax their bodies, do amazing things.

Having studied various exercises & yoga from a young age I'm quite convinced that the problems people deveop in regard to their bodies are more fronm bad ideas of how to do things or rushing ahead without enough supportive development than poor design.

 

The real problem is not that position but that people often adopt unnatural methods of movement, no matter how natural the basic pose they're in.

For instance, many keyboard players are/were taught to hold their hands near the board & arch their fingers, which puts all the effort into the fingers.

In reality it's much more efficient to use fingers as levers, held out straight & tapping the keys somewhat like John Entwistle's bass playing technique.

Your own description of working mixing desk "with fingers tensed" & subsequently neccesitated efforts to consciously relax are a good example of what I mean.

 

We may continue to disagree abt how unnatural, if at all, the basic pose is but I think we all can agree that poor or misguided technique is the major problem---think how often one still hears "No pain; no gain" !

d=halfnote
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sounds to me like tendonitis, bro...sometimes, a tennis elbow or golpher's elbow brace can work wonders...it's like a capo for your arm.

 

another thing...watch wide-stretched chords, or trying to pick up a case with fingers wide stretched from the top.

 

i was diagnosed with tennis and golpher elbow, brought on by some severe wankin' on the whammy bar...going to three springs...and a lot of physical therapy...helped. good luck, and hang in there!!!

;)

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...golpher's elbow...

 

Is that something you get from snagging yer arm in a hole tryna retrieve golf balls...or tryna catch those chipmunk-like critters ?

It's a gtr forum so I'm just axing...

d=halfnote
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You been typing on a phone keyboard, BB or smart phone, with your thumbs?

I've had seven operations on my hands and still playing, it's getting harder!

Been doing regular concerts since 1965. That's a lot of wear and tear, sometimes literally.

Larry

 

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