Johnny Costa... The jazz pianist for Mr. Rogers Neighborhood

[Sundown]

 

I was in a conversation with friends recently and somehow Mr. Rogers Neighborhood came up. I grew up on that show, and I knew even back then that the music was special. So today I Svengled it and it turns out that Johnny Costa was the piano wizard behind the great jazz music. And according to Wikipedia, it was all played live as the shows were being taped.

 

He died in 1996, but needless to say, that guy could rip...

[gryphon]

Fred Rogers could play, too, and for some reason I always thought he played and recorded that music for the show.

 

He wasn't on when I was a kid. Neither was Sesame Street.

[frogmonkey]

Yeah man that guy was awesome. What a gig, right?

[RichieP_MechE]

He died in 1996, but needless to say, that guy could rip...

 

Indeed he could!

 

[video:youtube]

 

 

Skip ahead to ~3 min on this one

 

[video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsMl4nQRRYc

[Sundown]

 

I love that "blues" bit in the second clip... I've never heard blues like that. Needless to say, he can rip...

[moj]

Johnny Costa was one of the best. His solo recordings on the Chiaroscuro label are great. He plays an amazing arrangement of "Holiday for Strings".

http://www.chiaroscurojazz.com/albuminfo.php4?albumid=33

[EscapeRocks]

Thanks for this thread, Sundown.

 

Mr. Roger's Neighborhood was a deceptively sophisticated show.

 

He didn't patronize or talk down to his target audience. He simply presented real life things in a manner that children could understand and pay attention to.

 

Having been borb in '62, I grew up watching the show, and the music Fred Rogers exposed us to was a great basis for exploring all types. (although we didn't know it at the time).

 

Seeing now how Fred Costa incorporated the music and didn't dumb it down is really cool. Looking back on all of it, I'm glad he and Rogers knew the kids could handle it and appreciate it...again, even if we didn't know it at the time.

 

[Steve LeBlanc]

I grew up watching the show and always loved the piano playing.

 

On a subconscious level, he probably introduced me to my love of jazz more than any other musician.

 

"Kids shows" need better music these days, it's a real problem.

[RABid]

I never got to watch the show as a kid. We lived in the hills and only got one channe. I do remember watching a PBS special about the show a few years ago that revealed how much he did for the music on 'Neighborhood.

[Phred]

I grew up watching the show and always loved the piano playing.

 

On a subconscious level, he probably introduced me to my love of jazz more than any other musician.

 

"Kids shows" need better music these days, it's a real problem.

 

While I agree with you, that many kids shows have terrible music, there are some out there that I quite enjoy...

 

I actually posted about it 2 or so years ago; that some pretty innovative music is coming from Kids shows. Granted it is not like Johnny Costa (WOW that's awesome), but clever songs of various genres seem to be cropping up quite a bit on shows that my kids watch.

 

For example: Phineas and Ferb - Showcases at least one, and often several new songs per episode. They like to delve into different musica styles, and sometimes several in one song. [video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iovl13T59hk

 

[zaj58]

Has the chops and swing of the great Oscar Peterson.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SK]

Yeah, Costa had great technique and imagination. He was similar to Tatum with his own devised pyrotechnical tricks. I used to try to catch the end of the show - I liked how he always played the outro differently.

 

Have to admit, I did a poor impression of him on our KC "TV Theme" CD. I played the Mr. Rogers songs from memory, but I forgot that Costa fills every single hole!

 

[Joe Muscara]

Costa fills every single hole!

I noticed this in that video with Wynton. So I have a stupid question - why is he considered great and not just overplaying?

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't think he overplayed, but I could see how some might say he did. I'm just looking for some insight and opinion on why it worked for him.

[SK]

Costa fills every single hole!

I noticed this in that video with Wynton. So I have a stupid question - why is he considered great and not just overplaying?

... because he loved playing that way and had the technical facility to pull it off. Some musicians are known more for their virtuosic playing than the actual music they made. I also think in Costa's case, he had x number of minutes on the show to take advantage.

 

And that's not a knock on Costa. As I said, he was a phenomenal player in the standout mode like Tatum. Musically, I wouldn't attempt a comment.

[kanker.]

Costa fills every single hole!

I noticed this in that video with Wynton. So I have a stupid question - why is he considered great and not just overplaying?

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't think he overplayed, but I could see how some might say he did. I'm just looking for some insight and opinion on why it worked for him.

I would look at the things he did in a trio setting and being different than the Wynton thing. He was creating a setting that worked for what he was doing brilliantly. I would look at what he was doing with Wynton to be inappropriate, and that you could tell that he was trying to impress, like that really, severely messed up stuff he was playing on the second chorus of the blues that he followed by looking at Wynton for approval or whatever. It just wasn't musical.

[Mike Davis]

Costa fills every single hole!

I noticed this in that video with Wynton. So I have a stupid question - why is he considered great and not just overplaying?

... because he loved playing that way and had the technical facility to pull it off. Some musicians are known more for their virtuosic playing than the actual music they made. I also think in Costa's case, he had x number of minutes on the show to take advantage.

 

And that's not a knock on Costa. As I said, he was a phenomenal player in the standout mode like Tatum. Musically, I wouldn't attempt a comment.

 

It just seems natural and authentic with him.

[VLH]

Costa was great. And so was Fred Rogers. I had the same experience watching the show, loving the band. Once I got into jazz, early in highschool, at a time when most guys would have been embarrassed to do it, I would tune in most days to listen to Costa play. I was amazed at how he could pick up on Roger's semi-tonal singing and back him, and the way he could play solos that were interesting and appealing to the audience. Really a pro. I was equally impressed that Rogers would pick this form as his backup music. Given what was going on in most TV shows, it was a real statement of support for art.

 

As an aside, a friend of mine actually grew up in "Mr. Rogers" neighborhood. The guy was the real deal. The neighborhood kids were always welcomed by Fred Rogers and his wife, who also were great patrons of the art. Her childhood memories were special. And given her age (and mine) I suspect she was a child there before his show got started. He was just an amazing person and he gathered good and talented people around him--Costa being one top notch example.

[SK]

I was amazed at how he could pick up on Roger's semi-tonal singing and back him

I remember that. He had "good ears".

 

Another honorable mention for childrens' show music (although I wasn't a viewer) : the clever songs singer Bob Dorough wrote for Sesame Street, "Multiplication Rock", etc.

 

[Dave Ferris]

I just watched that vid with WM & JC. Yeah I agree with Kanker where he was doing more "piano flashy" type things to impress rather then just play some cool, groovin' lines on the blues ala Wynton Kelly. Notice how when WM comes back in for a chorus, he does a flashy high "trumpet thing" almost to answer, yeah I can do that kinda stuff too.

 

Also I think with JC it was more a generational thing where older guys were used to filling every space. I've heard a lot of guys from Teddy Wilson to early Hank Jones play behind singers and other soloists like that before. In fact check this out, to me he could have left more space.

[video:youtube]

 

All that said, I thought Johnny Costa was brilliant and a perfect choice for the show. Can you imagine something like that show being popular today.

 

[kanker.]

All that said, I thought Johnny Costa was brilliant and a perfect choice for the show.

Yeah, I'm nitpicking about a few minutes of a show that he absolutely killed on for decades, and that point needs to be stressed.

[SK]

Not to disagree, but a different take on this:

 

While we can imagine what would have been more musical, it's hard to judge players by a different era's musical standards. Costa (like Tatum) didn't come from the era of cool, groovin' lines or using space to enhance a song. Flash and chops were a part of their era, like the cutting sessions in bebop.

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think Costa was intentionally trying to upstage Wynton. I just think that's the way he played. I've known a few older players who play that way - part of their musical expectation is to 'show what you can do'.

 

But Oscar should have laid back behind Nat. He probably felt he had to 'show his stuff' in front of Coleman Hawkins.

[moj]

Johnny "Flying Fingers" Costa's life time goal was to play like Tatum. I've got all of his solo piano recordings from the Chiaroscuro label. On all except, "Dream -Johnny Costa plays Johnny Mercer", he has "Jazz Speak" interviews which are gems of knowledge. Great insights on Tatum, his playing and the "Neighborhood". Costa was highly regarded as player in the 50's-60's before his "Neighborhood" gig. Keyboard magazine had an interview with Fred Rogers and Costa in one of their feature cover stories on Mr. Rogers Neighborhood circa 1985. To me his style is "Money". I know this older musician who plays in the Tatum-style who earns $1500 for a 10 hrs per week cruise line gig. I wanna gig like that, (in my dreams).

 

LISTEN: Classic Costa

 

Johnny Costa Bio http://www.johnnycosta.com/Neighborhood.htm

 

Most big cities claim one, I guess. Toledo had Art Tatum, Memphis has had Phineas Newborn, Boston 's had Dave McKenna. Sometimes they escape city limits to gain national prominence. Many times they're known only to musicians and a handful of fans. Pittsburgh 's Johnny Costa is somewhere in between.

 

Pittsburgh has surely contributed its share of grand pianists: Earl Hines, Mary Lou Williams, Billy Strayhorn, Erroll Garner, Dodo Marmarosa, Ahmad Jamal, Sonny Clark, Horace Parlan, and others less familiar. For just over thirty years, Johnny Costa has been at the edges of greater fame but unable to cross that border. But just because you don't recognize the name doesn't mean he can't do it. Ask anyone who's heard him play. Johnny Costa is the real thing.

 

Costa has been musical director for Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood since its inception in 1965. Fred Rogers is a very private, very focused person, some say difficult, but the two have been good friends and collaborators since the mid-50s. They're as gifted and productive a team as Ellington and Strayhorn. Rogers, a pianist himself and holder of a BA in music, supplies the lyrics and the basic melodies. Costa then fills them out, arranges them, and performs the music live on the show.

 

Mister Rogers' Neighborhood has become a national institution and treasure. Costa, who performs unseen, deserves far greater credit than he admits to. Unless you're listening to the show, it's easy to overlook him. But not to Fred Rogers. Rogers told Keyboard Magazine in 1985 that nobody . . . could just step in and take Johnny's place. It would be just as hard for somebody to step in and take my place."

 

Costa has even arranged several of Rogers ' works for symphony orchestra and has conducted special concerts in Boston, Buffalo, Chicago, Denver, Orlando, Seattle and elsewhere. Together he and Rogers have made three appearances on The Tonight Show and one on Late Night with David Letterman. But Mister Rogers' Neighborhood is only one reason why Costa has remained in the Pittsburgh neighborhood. There have been opportunities, and a few close calls over the years.

 

After a stint as an Army medic, Costa returned home and earned two BA degrees from Carnegie Technow Carnegie-Mellon Universityone in music composi­tion, the other in education (just in case I was a flop in music). He got his first jobs as a soloist during those summers, playing near Asbury Park , NJ at Paul's Edgewater Club in Wanamassa. In 1951 he was called by WDTV, of the old Dumont Network. WDTV became KDKA-TV and Costa became its musical director until 1965. At one point he even hosted his own program. During this time he and Fred and Josie Carey worked together on a short-lived Sunday kids show.

 

He can't remember who it was, but someone called him early in 1955 and set up a recording date for him at Savoy. I knew that Savoy was who Erroll Garner had recorded Laura for, so that impressed me. I thought I was going to record in this big fancy studio. When I got there, it turned out to be somebody's living room! But what a beautiful piano he had there. I liked that piano very much.

 

The living room belonged to Rudy Van Gelder's pa rents, with whom he was still living in Hackensack. And he had just bought a new Steinway which was, indeed, placed in their living room where Rudy setup his recordings. It might not have been NBC, but he made some marvelous and historic recordings there. Nothing like hearth and the home to inspire, I guess.

 

Savoy issued a 10 EP Introducing Johnny Costa and later a 12 LP called The Amazing Johnny Costa from this single session. Bob Theile was sufficiently impressed upon hearing the record that he got Johnny a twice-a-year gig at the Embers Room in NYC which lasted for about seven years. Theile also got Johnny an appearance on Steve Allen's Tonight Show. And later recorded him on three Coral LPs, the third one as part of the Modern Piano Quartet with Hank Jones, Dick Marx and Eddie Costa (no relation).

 

In the early-60s he recorded two LPs for Sonny Lester at Dot Records with Milt DeLugg. There were two 45s done for J. Arthur Rank, one of which was the theme for the movie Conspiracy of Hearts (unfortunately the movie did nothing, so the record did nothing). Some years later there was a privately released album, then nothing until a 1986 album Johnny Costa Plays Mister Rogers' Neighborhood. It's a straight jazz LP, but composed of songs written for the show.

 

Though based in Pittsburgh, Costa played some of the best piano spots around in the early 60s: Chicago 's London House, Wexler's Theatrical Bar in Cleveland, Baker's in Detroit, Miami 's Eden Rock and others. With records, TV, and niteclub appearances, it looked as if his star was on the rise. Getting that close to it however meant being too far away from what really moved him. I just grew tired of not being with my family, he says quite frankly.

 

Two other unrelated but significant situations also conspired against Costa's rise. By the mid-60s that grand piano sound was passé to the record companies. And in 1965 Fred Rogers invited him to help start the Neighborhood. Recalling it, Costa looks you straight­in-the-eye and says firmly "I believed in Fred's work. Forget your money, your fame, your career' and do something good, really good. Even more confidently he adds, with pride and I really made a good choice.

 

Some of Johnny's admirers have included Peter Nero (still Bernie Neiro when he subbed for Johnny back at the Embers), Victor Borge, Buddy Rich, Jack Teagarden, Tommy Dorsey, Nathan Davis, Mike Douglas (Johnny turned down an offer to be Douglas' music director). After jamming together at a birthday party for Teagarden, Tommy Dorsey was impressed enough to promise that he'd help me get some more work. But not with TD's band, "He told me you're too good for that.' Several weeks later Dorsey was dead.

 

The recording you're holding (or maybe listening to already) was really the beginning for Costa. It came about quickly though and there was little preparation. Although Kenny Clarke was also a Pittsburgher, Johnny had never met him. Neither did he know Gene Ramey. But bass and drums are very secondary here and only appear on four pieces. Everyone was prepared for something, but no one seemed to know just what. I was so arrangement-conscious then (on piano), everybody was. But I wish I'd have played more jazz, like on Honeysuckle Rose.' Some of these (tunes) still sound pretty good, he admits, but I'd sure like the chance to do the rest over again. I play so much better now.

 

If you like piano that's exciting, jazzy and swinging, you'll love half of this recording. If you like piano more ornate, sentimental and sophisticated, you'll love the other half. Some will sound dated. Some timeless. Tea For Two actually was the first take of the session (all tunes were single takes) and is turned into a stunning and elaborate Tatum-esque suite. A masterful performance. Caravan begins in the sleepy, early dawn and hits its stride' in a rush hour ride through midtown. For favorites, I'll take Manhattan for sheer delights. Costa's favorite, Honeysuckle Rose, is another minor masterpiece. He has great fun with it harmonically and rhythmically. It's a joy to listen to. It was also the last take of the actual session. The album closes with Johnny's romp through Begin the Beguine. Here he displays an irresistible urban urgency with an unrelenting left hand.

 

Costa still lives within a few miles of his boyhood home. He remains happily married to his high school sweetheart. They have two children and four grandchildren, any one of whom puts a smile on his face and a twinkle in eye. But so does the mention of getting busier with jazz piano again. It looks good for him: an appearance on Marian McPartland's Piano Jazz, his performance on the Queen Elizabeth II, and the re-issue of this, his first album.

 

Is he ready for more now? He lights up oh yesooh yes. I'm ready now. You name it! Looks like it's up to you, the listener, to decide what's in store next for this truly grand pianist.

 

David Jaye

Jazz NOW/WDUQ Radio, Pittsburgh

[Phred]

I actually like the WM blues clip. I agree about the over playing, but this that everyone in that clips is guilty of it, not just Costa.

[Joe Muscara]

I appreciate the insights here. I now have some perspective on him that I did not have before.

 

It makes me wish I had watched that show more as a kid. For some reason, my family didn't like Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood so I did not watch it very much.

[Sundown]

 

It's been a long, long time since I've seen the show, so I only have memory to go by. I don't recall much overplaying, but as a kid, I wouldn't have known the difference. And only as an adult do I have the sensibility (or sensitivity) to leaving space. Emerson, Wakeman, and Oscar Peterson made a lot of sense to me 15 or 20 years ago, but both are too much for me now (despite being very different genres and artists).