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Sustain pedal question for tech freaks


vihreamies

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I have Yamaha sustain pedal, and it's so called "closed at the rest" pedal, where the tip and sleeve are connected when not pressed. For example Fatar VFP1 is the same.

 

Well, I have Doepfer MKE, and that can be made with slight adjustments to circuit to work with such pedals as above mentioned, but what are the pedals that don't work like that, and can someone explain how they works? They can't be just opposite right?

 

I hope there are some freaks out there :)

 

best,

-Vm

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They can't be just opposite right?

 

Yes, they can. :thu:

 

The other type is the so called continuous sustain pedal which is a pot instead of a switch.

Moe

---

"I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker

http://www.hotrodmotm.com

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The Yamaha sustain pedals use "normally closed" switches. Kurzweil and Casio use "normally open" switches. For some reason, although it is not technically correct, the general name for the difference has come to be called "polarity." Some of the accessory sustain type pedals on the market have an additional slide switch (usually mounted on side or bottom) that can change the pedal (which uses a three connection switch that can be connected either way). Normally closed - makes a completed circult until depressed. Normally open - only makes a completed circuit when it is depressed. So, they are "opposite" in that sense.

 

Kurzweils generally sense the pedal on bootup and auto-configure. Nord Electro 3 can be set for either type.

 

The other type of pedal that Moe is referring to that uses a potentiometer is technically called a "Continuous Control" pedal. It is typically used for Volume or Expression control, or "wah" type effects. Those pedals usually have three connections instead of two, the connection arrangement varies by manufacturer and type, the resistive value of the pot varies, and the "taper" of the pot may be either linear or logarithmic.

 

Howard Grand|Hamm SK1-73|Kurz PC2|PC2X|PC3|PC3X|PC361; QSC K10's

HP DAW|Epi Les Paul & LP 5-str bass|iPad mini2

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

Jim

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Actually I was referring to the new class of pianos that can do partial pedalling based on in between values of the sustain CC - so they have a pot, but are sustain type pedals instead of volume type pedals.

Moe

---

"I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker

http://www.hotrodmotm.com

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I hope there are some freaks out there :)

 

Am I alone in finding it unsettling that knowledge of how sustain pedals function is classified as "tech freak" knowledge? :freak::facepalm:

 

 

You are not alone.... I was wondering about that too.

'Someday, we'll look back on these days and laugh; likely a maniacal laugh from our padded cells, but a laugh nonetheless' - Mr. Boffo.

 

We need a barfing cat emoticon!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I hope there are some freaks out there :)

 

Am I alone in finding it unsettling that knowledge of how sustain pedals function is classified as "tech freak" knowledge? :freak::facepalm:

 

 

Well, this is my kind of humor, what can I say. I consider myself as DIY man, and bit as a freak too. I was not experienced in sustain pedals and wanted to ask here, since I know there's people who can help me.

 

best,

-Vm

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Nord Electro 3 can be set for either type.
True, but when you configure the NE2 in the non-default (normally open) mode, the software switch debouncing doesn't work well for the leslie speed control. At least, that's what mine does. Pressing the pedal is often seen as hitting it twice, leaving the rotor at the same speed. As you might imagine, it's not consistent: sometimes it seems to work fine.

 

It's possible they fixed this on NE3.

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I have a bunch of KurZweil (normally open) pedals, and use with my NE3 - have not had any problem with getting two hits when depressing the pedal, so my assumption is that the NE3 does fix that issue.

 

Howard Grand|Hamm SK1-73|Kurz PC2|PC2X|PC3|PC3X|PC361; QSC K10's

HP DAW|Epi Les Paul & LP 5-str bass|iPad mini2

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

Jim

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The Yamaha sustain pedals use "normally closed" switches. Kurzweil and Casio use "normally open" switches. For some reason, although it is not technically correct, the general name for the difference has come to be called "polarity."

I think that, if you have the "wrong" kind, you can re-wire it and get it to work by switching the two wires that go to the 1/4" connector... what in another context you would call switching the positive and the ground, or, switching polarity.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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Actually I was referring to the new class of pianos that can do partial pedalling based on in between values of the sustain CC - so they have a pot, but are sustain type pedals instead of volume type pedals.

While they are using the shape of a sustain pedal, I believe they are still, internally, the same kind of CC pedal that MoodyBluesKeys described, so you're actually talking about the same thing. Except the sustain-pedal shaped ones spring back.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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I think that, if you have the "wrong" kind, you can re-wire it and get it to work by switching the two wires that go to the 1/4" connector... what in another context you would call switching the positive and the ground, or, switching polarity.
Some you can, some you can't. It depends on whether the switch inside has both NO and NC taps.
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Yes Fatar makes CC sustain pedals in various single and multi configurations. GEM used their pedals for the PRO series stage pianos over 15 years ago. When you depress the pedal it engages a simple linkage that is attached to the wiper of a

potentiometer (I forget what the resistance is) and the leads of that potentiometer are terminated at a 1/4 TRS connection. I have mine plugged into my midi time piece so I can dial it in and send it where ever. Works for the RPX module since GEM only put the contact jack on it for some reason.

Triton Extreme 76, Kawai ES3, GEM-RPX, HX3/Drawbar control, MSI Z97

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